Why Islam is not a religion of peace.

"Truth" with exception of perhaps one system of belief in the world of ours (and one only) all systems of belief profess disdain, mistrust and also all out hatred for the ideals of other cultures. Your point is not a point based on this fact.

The issue is more one of the fundamentalist ethic which in that part of the world is still in control. Those individuals who claim affiliation with the Moslem faith and practice hostility against others are no different. Than the mentality which exist in Europe by those who support the Nazi Party and in the United States by the same group as well as the KKK. Its just that those groups do not have the type of control in Europe or the USA that they have in the Arab world.

While there are instances of fanaticism such as Nazis and such...I would like to state that it is my BELIEF! that muslims are by far the most suceptable to this way of insanity than those of other denominations.

I haven't though determined whether it is isolated more to those who belong to the beddouin values as well...I think those MOST suceptable are the ones who are beddouin with their beliefs of course being muslim, but any muslim, except it would seem "westernized" ones, still are possible of falling victim to this extremism...look at that John Walker Lind...now of course there are always exceptions to the rules.

That's my way of thinking though...that they are all very prone to extremism compared to say an average american, or european. They are probably the most prone to violence "for" their religion, type of people on the planet right now...replacing the Christians....maybe the jews surpass them, we'll just have to wait and see if israel nukes half the middle east.

But notice I put for in quotations...that is because it's FOR their religion, not because of their religion...no one can for sure say that they are prone to violence because of their religion...there are many factors over there such as our foriegn policy.

Sincerely,
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Originally posted by FreeMason

" The Roman empire persecuted christians because the Christians would not recognize rome's gods. "

It's not true.They were persecuted cuz they didn't want to reconize Caesar like a God. For them, only God and his son Christ were possibles and Caesar was just a man. And for the Roman gods , how do you want to believe in them when you already have a God ?

Originally posted by FreeMason

" it is a shame Rome didn't finish them when it had the chance, because of Christianity Rome fell... "

It's sound to much nazi for me !

Originally posted by FreeMason

" As for the pagans, I'm sorry but I feel that the Norse Religions held more decency than does Christianity, it taught through epics morality, honor, bravery...everything that was noble in man...then christianity comes along and eventually twists the Norse men into its belief. "

The firsts who tryed to knock them on their knees were the Roman Legions, and not the Christians.

Originally posted by FreeMason

" God isn't just...he's vengful, and he'll be forgotten because of it...the Church knows this (hence their blaming of scapegoats)....there is no room for vengeful gods anymore."

I believe in the Christians God, but I don't believe in a vengful God. The Christian God is pure love and mercy.A vengeful God would not sacrifice His own Son for us. But He did it, so, He's NOT vengeful.

[Edited on 11-11-2002 by ultra_phoenix]

Originally posted by ultra_phoenix
It's not true.They were persecuted cuz they didn't want to reconize Caesar like a God. For them, only God and his son Christ were possibles and Caesar was just a man. And for the Roman gods , how do you want to believe in them when you already have a God ?

While we may agree on many things I will stalwartly defend that quote...Ceasar never tried to become a god, that was not the problem it WAS the fact that christians wouldn't respect another god...for one...that was a sin...look at what god did to judah

Now...as for the other stuff...
1) I'm usually hot headed when looking back on what christians DID not currently doing, hence the Rome shoulda finished them thing...
2)Recently I revised my thoughts on "vengeful" god thing...that title goes to muslims now...after all the christian's god WAS vengeful but became a loving god...where as it is the other way around with Islam.
And that should cover it...for now

Sincerely,
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Originally posted by FreeMason

" While we may agree on many things I will stalwartly defend that quote...Ceasar never tried to become a god, that was not the problem it WAS the fact that christians wouldn't respect another god...for one...that was a sin...look at what god did to judah "

When you have a God ( Jesus, Allah, Boudah or another one ), you can't believe in another one.The Christians weren't believing the Romans Gods, but the Romans weren't believing the Christians God !

Originally posted by FreeMason

Now...as for the other stuff...

" 2) Recently I revised my thoughts on "vengeful" god thing...that title goes to muslims now...after all the christian's god WAS vengeful but became a loving god...where as it is the other way around with Islam.
And that should cover it...for now "

No no no no no no..... He didn't became a loving God. He was already a loving God. Otherwise, how to believe in a God who's cool one day, and will throw you in Hell the next 1 ?

I don't know man...god says quite clearly he hates people who don't worship ONLY him...so how can he always have been loving?

Sincerely,
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Originally posted by FreeMason
I don't know man...god says quite clearly he hates people who don't worship ONLY him...so how can he always have been loving?

This the difference between the Torah and the Bible. Jesus is only pure Love.

Of course, His Father is looking a little bit less accomodating.

Originally posted by FreeMason But I now sort of see maybe the hidden truth, from the distance I've been sent...that we are all "searching" for god...in nature, in science, in everything, that great cosmic order that we can not explain.

Sometimes, you find that you've got to take a step back & look around before you can go forward any further...

I think you've just stumbled on the right track back to God. He *is* everything, all people, all planets, all stars, all time, all mass & all energy. Everything that *is* came from God & we are all a *part* of that, a part of The Whole. Our sciences, our technology, everything we learn & experience is also a part of Him. It is unfortunate that mankind, as a whole, has always sought to anthropomorphisize that which he forms a religion around...But that's not what God actually *is*.

Even the technology that the Truth disdains as the works of Satan is merely a method to seek His wonder. Remember, even Satan came from God. God is not a singular entity, but the Source of All That Exists.

The evil that we see in the world, all of the violence, hatred, terrorism, oppression, supression, etc. is caused by those who have lost their way to God...Lost their realization that they too are a part of The Whole & seek to gain for themselves what they cannot have. The fanatic Muslims seek to bind all other religions to themselves & kill to enforce it...Politicians seek to bind us all to *themselves* & obedience, but have given up on God & given up their place in The Whole. These are the types of people that seek to twist God's works for their own greed, but isn't it Satan's way to always be grasping for that which is beyond his reach? These are the AnitChrists that you've no doubt heard of...By definition, an AntiChrist is one who seeks to go against God & the teachings of Christ. Certain prophecies have predicted the coming of one AntiChrist *in particular* who is to gain power & influence on Earth, but even *that* will ultimately fall beyond his reach.

If they were to find their path back to the Wonders of God & the Whole Creation, they will come to realize that they *already had everything* that God gave us & would give up the greed for things that will remain forever beyond their reach.


[Edited on 11-11-2002 by MidnightDStroyer]

Originally posted by MidnightDStroyer
I think you've just stumbled on the right track back to God.

Hmm I don't like the way that sounds I may have acknowledged that there is a creator, and organizer of this universe...something that gives it purpose...but I still believe existance is all that matters...this creator is apart of that existance too...how it is all related...I have no clue

Sincerely,
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From your response, FM, I'm not certain that I expressed my reply clearly...At least to where you understoood my *meaning*.

You yourself have expressed a belief that this universe was *created*...Well, that Creation came from God...Not as some anthropomorphisized being or singular entity, in any sense of those words themselves, but as the One Who Created All.

Mankind has *always* turned something intangible & given it a man-like form...You've seen that tendency all throughout history.

Yeah that sounds about right...I've never agreed with the "man on the throne" kinda god , never have, and probably never will...

Sincerely,
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Sigh...

The above arguments are why I have left all Judeo-Christian religions. Too many inconsistancies.

However, the idea that Arab Muslims are the crux of the problem seems quite appropriate. Hey, even Iran was a pretty cool country until the clerics took over and the words "shah mat" were proclaimed throughout Iran.

I'm curious...Precisely which "arguments" are you referring to that caused you to leave your Church?

Originally posted by ~iluv2act~
Sigh...

The above arguments are why I have left all Judeo-Christian religions. Too many inconsistancies.

However, the idea that Arab Muslims are the crux of the problem seems quite appropriate. Hey, even Iran was a pretty cool country until the clerics took over and the words "shah mat" were proclaimed throughout Iran.

Under the Shah regime, Iranians were not living a cool life. The Shah was a dictator. After him, it was another tyran ( Khomeini The Great Bastard, may his soul burn in Hell 4 ever ) who slaughtered his peoples. I remember these poors kids & teenagers who was fighting against Irak.

I hate, definitively, tyrans & dictators !!!
And the Shah was " just " another tyrans like the others tyrans !!!

Originally posted by FreeMason
LoL all you can do is discredit, you are as bad as those "anti-christian" websites...which by the way I only visit Anti-masonry websites to see what drivel they have out this week.

As for the "not all being Beddouin" this is very true, if you'd use a little thinking, you'd know that that explains the "vengeful" properties embeded into the koran...now the koran is the primary driving force behind perpetuating the violence, because in Islamic nations exposed to fighting...and there are plenty, the koran is telling them that fighting is the right thing to do...they use it as their justification because of course...everyone must justify their cause.

But unlike Christianity where the Bible goes from Hate and kill to the new testament which is Love and peace, the Koran goes from the first half which is somewhat Love and peace, to Hate kill and avenge the lord...see the difference TC???

Sincerely,
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I am well aware of the difference in timelines of Muhammed's writings, and I am well aware that when Christ came and left that the church age began.
I also know that this doesn't mean anything other than the "convert or die" message from Muhammed was his last directives, and that is what is the mission of the Islamic belief. If they are not attempting to achieve this goal, they aren't doing their job.
Remember, it isn't "Here is your chance of salvation and if you don't take, it's your freedom of choice" as with Christianity or the other religions out there.

Originally posted by FreeMason
LoL all you can do is discredit, you are as bad as those "anti-christian" websites...which by the way I only visit Anti-masonry websites to see what drivel they have out this week.

As for the "not all being Beddouin" this is very true, if you'd use a little thinking, you'd know that that explains the "vengeful" properties embeded into the koran...now the koran is the primary driving force behind perpetuating the violence, because in Islamic nations exposed to fighting...and there are plenty, the koran is telling them that fighting is the right thing to do...they use it as their justification because of course...everyone must justify their cause.

But unlike Christianity where the Bible goes from Hate and kill to the new testament which is Love and peace, the Koran goes from the first half which is somewhat Love and peace, to Hate kill and avenge the lord...see the difference TC???

Sincerely,
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And, by the way, when it comes to "little thinking" you should know about that. Whether you go and review anti-Masonic sites is no concern of mine, your concern is the fact that you are a disgrace to the decent Masons out there. I seriously doubt you are one, the more I read your hate-filled garbage.

Whether or not the Bedouin's vengeful mentality is due to Islam is not something that I am convinced of, nor can you persuade or prove. Again, I find it to be an assumption based on a partial observation.
"Jumbo jets fly, therefore they must have feathers" trains of thought proves nothing. Whether or not a culture is nomadic or settled, it seems to adopt an aggressive attitude toward it's non-Muslim neighbors.

I'm curious...Precisely which "arguments" are you referring to that caused you to leave your Church?

Well, I left the Catholic Church because of the efforts it has made throughout the ages to involve itself in government, specifically its ruling in 1861 (I think at the first Baltimore council but don't quot me ) that the separation of truth and state was a bad thing. I cannot believe that God wants theocracy.

As to Judaism, I find the Hebrew god to be excessively violent, and Protestant religion makes no sense to me, as it has little in common with the Jewish faith from which Christianity was spawned. I would as soon become a Muslim as slit my own throat.

And that, in brief, is my reasoning against Judeo-Christian religion. If you want to hear more, just ask!

Son't give up on Faith simply because of problems with the scriptures they use. All religions began as *one* religion back in pre-history; Therefore, they all still contain some seeds of truth that are common among them. The main problem is that the Churches have changed & altered their scriptures at various times throughout their histories...

...The way to find the *common* truths that they still share is to do some research on them all & trace them back through history to see what changes were made, when they were made & perahpas even learn *why* they were made. As you trace the histories of these religions, you'll begin to find more & more common points.

A person's relationship with God (whichever god) is & should be a personal thing...Don't depend on other people (Priests, rabbis, etc.) to be able to tell you the truth, because they'll *always* be putting their *own* interpretations in what they tell you; They'll also be using whatever version of scripture that *they* believe in. Many do this without realizing it; Some will do it intentionally for whatever reason they have. This is why you can't depend on anyone but yourself in your search for understanding God.

Which is why I practice Wicca. Dont' worry, MD, I'm not an atheist!

Look, Islam is peaceful, like how Catholic is, it the extremist who make it violent.

Catholic extremist assasinate doctors, blow up hospitals, and more. Does that mean all Catholics that way? No, just some.