How Can There Not Be A God

That is always a good point dna is something that is so fragile and can be messed up our changed very easily, but God cannot He is perfect. Why would you want to give so much credit to something so fragile

Ok zanzibar, so somehow, if u believe in the big bang, a massive explosion ensued that created the universe, ya it did...not. Only way and explosion can happen if it has oxygen, i think, but still there was none, Y DONT WE freaking nuke the universe and make another. I believe there is a god, if you dont good for you. And science can never prove if there is a god, beacuse he made it

that was a good post and God Bless you

Originally posted by nastalgik
Ok zanzibar, so somehow, if u believe in the big bang, a massive explosion ensued that created the universe, ya it did...not. Only way and explosion can happen if it has oxygen, i think, but still there was none, Y DONT WE freaking nuke the universe and make another. I believe there is a god, if you dont good for you. And science can never prove if there is a god, beacuse he made it

www.umich.edu...

From this link

About 15 billion years ago a tremendous explosion started the expansion of the universe. This explosion is known as the Big Bang. At the point of this event all of the matter and energy of space was contained at one point. What exisisted prior to this event is completely unknown and is a matter of pure speculation. This occurance was not a conventional explosion but rather an event filling all of space with all of the particles of the embryonic universe rushing away from each other. The Big Bang actually consisted of an explosion of space within itself unlike an explosion of a bomb were fragments are thrown outward. The galaxies were not all clumped together, but rather the Big Bang lay the foundations for the universe.

As you can see the Big Bang was not the usual kind of explosion. Oxygen is needed to create an explosion with conventional explosives. Read about the big bang before making such comments.

As i recall you do not need oxygen to set of a nuclear weapon. You need the oxygen to have fire but if it was set off in an enviroment with say argon gas, you would still get a destructive shockwave and lots of light, along with the EMP pulse. You could class that as a kind of explosion.

I believe there is a god, if you dont good for you. And science can never prove if there is a god, beacuse he made it

God didn't invent science, humans simply worked out a way to look at the world. If god invented science then he/she/it invented the way we look a things. If he/she/it did that then he/she/it caused us not to believe in him/her/it lol. Humans invented scientific method, if god can force us to believe something then god is interferring with free will. If god can do that then why doesn't god make us believe?

Who is to say god would even invent the universe? If god exists then maybe the universe simple came along and god thought he would take a look. Maybe god found that he/she/it could influence things and thought it would be fun, maybe god thought he could help, who knows.

[edit on 27-5-2006 by ImaginaryReality1984]

[edit on 27-5-2006 by ImaginaryReality1984]

What do you feel about Jesus? And od gives the choice for wether we believe and love him Satan also had a choice and God made Him too so your statement really doesnt say much.

Why put your complete trust in something Man invented then. Are we perfect why depend on something that is not perfect.

We came from aliens. The "God" program is nothing but a device to keep humanity under the thumbscrews of the Illuminati. The truth is somewhere between Rael and David Icke - a collective spirituality exists, but it's nothing like humans in their flesh-and-blood 5-sense prison can comprehend.

Therefore, all this talk about believing in a religion..and evolution...is equally as daft as eachother imo. Well maybe not daft (as it is only natural to question the mystery of our existence) ..but nevertheless redundant.

We didn't come from aliens, for even the aliens came from God, the absolute, existing literally within everything.

He is beyond the cause and effect of the material world, the absolute, one without a second, the origin of existence, the ultimate truth, the essential reality, all rests upon him, like beads strung on string, there is nothing existing but him.

Conversations like this have been discussed thousands upon thousands of times throughout our history.

The fact is this: there exists in this reality forces which we cannot comprehend. Forces which religion and science struggle to define.

Evolution is real. Science is true, though always partly flawed, it is always improving.

There is nothing in the teaching of science that says a supernatural force does not exist, in fact science has proved that there are supernatural things that we cannot experiance without instruments and mediums.

We are nothing but rocks scattered along an open field. Just as rocks cannot comprehend the sky above them, we cannot comprehend the forces surrounding us. Through bias perception and interpretation, we struggle with the desperate assumption that "someone, or something is tending the light at the end of the tunnel."

Originally posted by elijah777
no.......you wouldnt be right, you just didnt try hard enogh.

Do you realise how dumb you sound?

There are 10 foot purple pixies down at the bottom of my garden but only those you seek to find him will see them, if you don't see them, you're not trying hard enough.

That is all your argument is because my example is exactly the same. Its just a way by the church to try and make it impossible to disprove something and theres the same amount of proof of god as there is of 10 foot purple pixies.

As much as you Christians excalim that the Universe just couldn't have created itself, you all seem to be blissfully unaware that the same statement applies to god. By your own arguement you have said that God can't exist because something cannot come from nothing. If you are saying that it can , then you must also accept that the Universe could have been created randomly, which also equates to the lack of a God.

Using your own arguement again, if god does exist he would need a creator right? Which means that something more powerful than god would have been first, which would detract from your views of him being omnipotent/scient/present.

Also, IMO if god did exist why would he need to be worshipped? Why would he need us to build temples for him and lay our lives at his feet? He wouldn't.
If god is indeed real, then he is the Creator. He has made things which our minds cannot even comprehend. So if he wanted a temple for himself, wouldn't he make one? If he wanted everyone to be Christian, wouldn't he just blink and make everyone?

The whole idea of god is nothing but a social construct which is fueled by humanity's need to have someone to answer to.

Originally posted by JackofBlades
As much as you Christians excalim that the Universe just couldn't have created itself, you all seem to be blissfully unaware that the same statement applies to god. By your own arguement you have said that God can't exist because something cannot come from nothing. If you are saying that it can , then you must also accept that the Universe could have been created randomly, which also equates to the lack of a God.

My argument for you is that most of the things that exist make sence and function as a mecanism.
How many things makes sence to you? , how many mecanisms are there? from the universe to the earth.
Take the stars , take the galaxys, they all make a mecanism, take what is on earth, how do you funciton? you got lungs , hart , liver , brain, hands that can operate things.
Take other things that have a mecanism here on erth and that are made by nature, take the smallest thing and put it under a microscope, science will explain it, it will explain how it works , but it will not explain why it works, your argument would be , it hapend by random? okay, let's see , take the universe and everithing that is in it as a mecanism that funcitons and then count them , can you do that?
let's see with what number you come up with?12871827182322323434247187813728 and so on, things that work and hapend by random?
Now number the things that dont make sence and does not come in to a mecanism and list them here to me, things that dont make use or cant make anithing out of them.

There has to be a creative force, it may be in the form of energy for all I know but all I know and I am sure is that it does exist, something aware that glues things.
after you count the things in the universe take the math book and see what are the ods of numbers like that hapening by random, not in this life time? ohh yes thats why we dont even understand it, we dont have time to get the whole picture, but we can see part of the puzzle , it's clear that it an arhitectual asebly the way things work, even science says they make sence as a mecansim, that's why science exists , to explain to us how they work as a whole wheel .
It may not be like we cristians say it is, it may not be like others say, but one thing I can tell you , there is a god out there, soon we will get a buzz from the land lord, probaly he will tell us in a way to stop being so F stupid, and that it's time to evolve, evoution is part of god, it's a god thing to evolve , evolution is a positive thing, regresion always tends to negativity, creativiti is evolution, creation represents a blue print, behind a blue print there is always a creator, a planer , to say so many things hapen by random would be ignorant , milion things that work trilions I have no idea how many they are, one life time is not enough to count them.


[edit on 27-5-2006 by pepsi78]

masterp,

Be sure to quote other posters correctly by including their nic!

Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Astronomers and scientists have found from their observations and equations that the Universe is not infinite as many believed, just extremely large. Which points to its Creator not having been omnipotent, just extremely powerful.

Originally posted by masterp
Aha! that's a great observation. In fact we could just be a simulation.

You mean like the matrix movies?

I have yet to come across any evidence of this.

Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Moreover, mathematical probability points to the Universe being manifested through design and not by accident.

Originally posted by masterp
Nope. It is the exact opposite. The universe is so big that the propability of life created accidentally is almost 1.

Read my quote again. There first has to be a Universe before there can be corporeal life to eventually emerge within it

As a number of people have stated or alluded to in this thread, something cannot emerge from nothingness in a void of space.

That's true.

However, there is more to it than that. Just labeling the original cause "God" is an oversimplification.

The physical spectrum of energy is not the only one in existence. There is the much broader World of Spirit as well

Across the board of all religions, there are millions who have had Near Death Experiences (NDE's) and/or Out Of Body Experiences (OOBE's). Many of these have indicated that there is a spectrum of energy that is independent of and transcends the physical space-time continuum. This transcending energy which operates off of a completely different set of principles than the energy on This Side is The Light Of The God Force.

The energy of Spirit or The Light preceded the physical universe and will outlast the end of First Genesis. Souls consist of that energy as well. For example, suppose that the Zetan-aliens (who routinely kidnap many Terrans and use them as laboratory animals and slaves - according to thousands of abductee testimonials) decided to destroy this world and moon with their Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD). Their antimatter weapons are much more powerful than our conventional (and less advanced) nuclear variations. After Terra and its moon were destroyed, all the people who read this and all who live on and around this planet would survive in the discarnate dimensions. The reason for that is because the soul consists of a form of energy that transcends all physically-based weapons. We are made up of the same Light that existed prior to The Big Bang, which is why our consciousness cannot be destroyed by any high-tech devices.

Shaken up and traumatized?

Sure.

Obliterated?

No way.

The Light on the Other Side is the missing component to the argument that something cannot come about from nothingness. Rarefied discarnate consciousness, i.e., The Original Creator, used The Light to manifest The Big Bang.

The next logical question is...

Where did The Light come from?

The Light represents the only way that reality can manifest itself and consciousness can emerge and evolve. Without The Light there can be no planets, stars, souls or even an Original Creator to start a Big Bang. The Light is nonliving and infinite and is governed by Universal Law which cannot be altered one iota. The more evolved the soul, the greater its ability to Ascend into The Light after leaving matter. When a soul can expand its consciousness in The Light to the point of being able to create matter at will on an individual basis, it becomes a Co-Creator, i.e., a less evolved version of The Original Creator or major God who manifested First Genesis.

In my opinion? No God. I'm not going to be like some of these others and make fun of you one way or the other, but as I see it? None.

Science, logic and reason. That's why I don't believe. There is an infinate amount of proof that he does not exist and a total lack of proof that he does.

I really think that people who claim to believe in god do not really do so. They just wish to believe in god. They somehow feel that their lives are meaningless without god, so they choose to close their eyes to evidence against the existence of god.

The Christian view is well expressed by then Cardinal, and now Pope Benedict XVI, Joseph Ratzinger:

Religious liberty can not justify freedom for divergence. This freedom does not aim at any freedom relative truth, but concerns the free descicion for a person to, according to his moral inclinations accept the truth.

As a species, we have worked miracles to keep the violent world at our gate. Sometimes those miracles are baffled, because the universe is like that. Against exploding stars, earthquakes as we have had today and the tempers of men, we can only do so much to defend ourselves.

Ok you say God was invented but so was science,math and everything else so how can you say science is the key because if man made it then they made it so they could understand the world in their own way. I can say the color red is the color green, and if I was the first to come up with this then it would be right. Or I could have invented math a say that 1+1=7 and then that could be true. Man can make things true for themselves doesnt mean its right.

Originally posted by Bripe Klmun

Science, logic and reason. That's why I don't believe. There is an infinate amount of proof that he does not exist and a total lack of proof that he does.

A qestion for you, who was first man or logic? ,who invented logic? was it man or was it already there composed?

I really think that people who claim to believe in god do not really do so. They just wish to believe in god. They somehow feel that their lives are meaningless without god, so they choose to close their eyes to evidence against the existence of god.

If you see god as a white hair dude old age of course that is not it, I dont picture how god looks and who does that is just wasting time, but logic and science makes god exists, try for example to make a tree from nothing with no seeds.
Argument what nature created by random event man can easy recreate with conscient tought, he has the science refrence to the tree, he has the refrence to the seed, but can he create it with out the seed? can we create something natural with out using nature?NO we depend on nature?that hapend on random event to create other things? and it sounds so conviniant that everything we need is here by random event, we have the science behind it too, so why not create a tree with out a seed if everything hapend random, we cant even create a single plant with out taking something from nature, we have the sceince we know how the seed works but yet we cant recreate the seed

Religious liberty can not justify freedom for divergence. This freedom does not aim at any freedom relative truth, but concerns the free descicion for a person to, according to his moral inclinations accept the truth.

Religion, I agree with you it's all crap, I dont think god is a religios entity.
Some things are so complex that it's out of our reach, and it's mad by nature on random event some will sustain that forever, things of such compexity that are natural are imposible to be made by man.

[edit on 27-5-2006 by pepsi78]

Originally posted by pepsi78
There has to be a creative force, it may be in the form of energy for all I know but all I know and I am sure is that it does exist, something aware that glues things.

I never debated the question of a creative energy. In fact I myself believe that something similar to what you described is responsible for most of what is. However, we are debating God and that's what I was referring to. I believe the Universe was independant, random. However, after Creation, I believe that something 'shaped' everything.

Originally posted by JackofBlades

Originally posted by pepsi78
There has to be a creative force, it may be in the form of energy for all I know but all I know and I am sure is that it does exist, something aware that glues things.

I never debated the question of a creative energy. In fact I myself believe that something similar to what you described is responsible for most of what is. However, we are debating God and that's what I was referring to. I believe the Universe was independant, random. However, after Creation, I believe that something 'shaped' everything.

Okay I dont agree with you on the universe creation because simple factors.
The atom it's self is responsible for the matter for anithing that exists, when we look at it looks like a little device, it's complex, it yet has unexplainable things, I'm not talking about nuclear reactions or what power it can relise, the atom it's self give's colors , it makes water, it makes earth , it makes space, if you take for example an atom from water and one from earth they would look the same under the microscope, it you take it from the water it wont look colored blue and it wont be wet, it's the same everywhere, what I find most strange is that atoms are tuned to a specific frequncy , can you imagine ininite atoms tuned to the same frequncy? and then sustain it's random?also if the freqncy were to be just a bit lower the universe would go in non existance, it's so complex it's beiond our reach for now, we just get power out of it for now but dont fully understand it.
I belive in a biger higher being not because of the curch, but because what I learn and what I see around me.
also 1 is a very important number, everything comes from 1, even in the universe is the same thing many planets form 1 solar sistems many solar sistems form 1 galaxy many galaxys form 1 universe.
the divine number is 1 all that is around is based on 1, the universe also was formed by number 1, that means something was there to form it, also 1 can not be reproduced with other numbers , creating is adding not substracting , so the point is that you cant create 1 from nothing it's imposible you can create 2 out of the 1 but you need another 1, this tells us that everything in this universe is unique made by unlimited numbers of 1, the basic start is number 1.

1+2=3
which in fact is 1+1+1 because number 2 is made out of 1 and 1.
you can create 2,3,4,5 from 1 as they exist because of number 1, but how do you create number 1 in the first place?

I also do not believe in God because of the church, but form what God has shown to me over my life.