OP/ED: Cracks in the Facade

grover, I just wanted to say that in my searches regarding another thread, I came across this article out of the Baltimore Chronicle-Sentinel. I am going to post three passages and let people read it for themselves to see that this "phenomenon" actually has been discussed. The analysis is by Paul Levy. He calls Mr. Bush a "malignant egophrenic". The people who support him are aiding and abetting his "egophrenia":

The Madness of George W. Bush: A Reflection of Our Collective Psychosis

Bush, like all of us, is both a manifestation of this deeper field and simultaneously an agent effecting this field. He’s become so fully taken over by the disease, all the while not suspecting a thing, that he’s become a "carrier" for this deadly disease, thus infecting the field around him. He’s become a portal through which the field around him "warps" in such a way as to feed and support his pathogenic process. A non-local, reciprocally co-arising and interdependent field of unconscious denial and cover-up gets constellated around Bush to enable and protect his pathology. People who support Bush are actually complicit with and enabling Bush’s madness in a co-dependent, self-reinforcing feedback loop that is ‘closed,’ which is to say it is insular and not open to any feedback from the ‘real’ world.

Bush supporters are not merely disinterested in seeing that they are in denial of reality; on the contrary, they actively don’t want to look at this, which is to say they resist self-reflection at all costs. Bush and his supporters perversely interpret any feedback from the real world which reflects back their unconsciousness as itself evidence that proves the rightness of their viewpoint. All of Bush’s supporters mutually reinforce each other’s unconscious resistance to such a degree that a collective, interdependent field of impenetrability gets collectively conjured up by them that literally resists consciousness.

This is the most telling statement of the entire article. I hope people read it well and critically analyze the state of things when discussing the problems concerning the country:

The situation is very analogous to when seemingly good, normal, loving Germans supported Hitler, believing he was a good leader trying to help them. The German people didn't realize that the virulent pathogen malignant egophrenia had taken possession of Hitler and was incarnating itself through him. By not seeing this and supporting Hitler, they became agents used by this non-local, deadly disease to propagate itself. This was a collective psychosis, and this is what is taking place in our country right now.

Originally submitted by ceci2006
...............

People who support Bush are actually complicit with and enabling Bush’s madness in a co-dependent, self-reinforcing feedback loop that is ‘closed,’ which is to say it is insular and not open to any feedback from the ‘real’ world.

Bush supporters are not merely disinterested in seeing that they are in denial of reality; on the contrary, they actively don’t want to look at this, which is to say they resist self-reflection at all costs. Bush and his supporters perversely interpret any feedback from the real world which reflects back their unconsciousness as itself evidence that proves the rightness of their viewpoint. All of Bush’s supporters mutually reinforce each other’s unconscious resistance to such a degree that a collective, interdependent field of impenetrability gets collectively conjured up by them that literally resists consciousness.

This is the most telling statement of the entire article. I hope people read it well and critically analyze the state of things when discussing the problems concerning the country:


External Source


The situation is very analogous to when seemingly good, normal, loving Germans supported Hitler, believing he was a good leader trying to help them. The German people didn't realize that the virulent pathogen malignant egophrenia had taken possession of Hitler and was incarnating itself through him. By not seeing this and supporting Hitler, they became agents used by this non-local, deadly disease to propagate itself. This was a collective psychosis, and this is what is taking place in our country right now.

Humm...so what are you going to do now intrepid?.... Is Ceci not trying to slam the Republican side with that article she quoted?... or should i quote articles which pretty much resort to the same tactics against those who don't support the war?....

Really Ceci, you have proven nothing, except to corroborate that this entire thread is just for political bickering name calling and insulting those who don't agree with your viewpoint, by giving a link, and quotes, which resort to name calling and labelling of Republicans and any other person who doesn't agree with you...

[edit on 14-5-2006 by Muaddib]

Ceci, Thank you for your post! What an in-depth analysis, brilliantly put.

Muaddib, the same thing happened with Castro, remember? Those are the very people stuck in the island starving to death today and their children.

Sorry i've been away so long.

Too bad I run a business or I would have more time to answer all the HATRED here.

Don't worry I'll be back.

Ceci,

Thank you for your contribution. Of course, the infamous baltimore cronicle piece. I was waiting for this. This is offered up as proof of what?

What this piece really is, Lets get some one - a fellow liberal who hates bush with -pyschological credentials and get him to write a statement for us. Any real scientists knows he cannot make a "blanket statement" like has been done in this article.

Sorry Ceci, I have read some of your threads and find you to be a reasonable person. You always have something to back up your statements. I just don't see were your going with this.

Grover, The arkansas project? this is a new one.

Lets just look at SEVERAL things. MONICA LEWINSKY, RON BROWN, VINCE FOSTER, MARY MAHONEY.

Wanna see more boys and girls?

. Victor Raiser II - & - Montgomery Raiser: Major players in the Clinton fund raising organization died in a private plane crash in July 1992.

Paul Tulley - Democratic National Committee Political Director found dead in a hotel room in Little Rock, September 1992. Described by Clinton as a "Dear friend and trusted advisor".

Ed Willey - Clinton fund raiser, found dead November 1993 deep in the woods in Virginia of a gunshot wound to the head. Ruled a suicide. Ed Willey died on the same day his wife Kathleen Willey claimed Bill Clinton groped her in the oval office in the White House. Ed Willey was involved in several Clinton fund raising events.

Jerry Parks - Head of Clinton's gubernatorial security team in Little Rock. Gunned down in his car at a deserted intersection outside Little Rock. Park's son said his father was building a dossier on Clinton. He allegedly threatened to reveal this information. After he died the files were mysteriously removed from his house.

James Bunch - Died from a gunshot suicide. It was reported that he had a "Black Book" of people containing names of influential people who visited prostitutes in Texas and Arkansas.

James Wilson - Was found dead in May 1993 from an aparent hanging suicide. He was reported to have ties to Whitewater.

Kathy Ferguson - Ex-wife of Arkansas Trooper Danny Ferguson died in May 1994 was found dead in her living roon with a gunshot to her head. It was ruled a suicide even though there were several packed suitcases, as if she was going somewhere. Danny Ferguson was a co-defendant along with Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones lawsuit. Kathy Ferguson was a possible corroborating witness for Paula Jones.

Bill Shelton - Arkansas state Trooper and fiancee of Kathy Ferguson. Critical of the suicide ruling of his fiancee, he was found dead in June, 1994 of a gunshot wound also ruled a suicide at the gravesite of his fiancee.

Gandy Baugh - Attorney for Clinton friend Dan Lassater died by jumping out a window of a tall building January, 1994. His client was a convicted drug distributor.

Florence Martin - Accountant - Sub-contractor for the CIA related to the Barry Seal Mena Airport drug smuggling case. Died of three gunshot wounds.

Suzanne Coleman - Reportedly had an affair with Clinton when he was Arkansas Attorney General. Died of a gunshot wound to the back of the head, ruled a suicide. Was pregnant at the time of her death.

Paula Grober - Clinton's speech interpreter for the deaf from 1978 until her death December 9, 1992. She died in a one car accident.

Danny Casolaro - Investigative reporter. Investigating Mena Airport and Arkansas Development Finance Authority. He slit his wrists, apparent suicide in the middle of his investigation.

Paul Wilcher - Attorney investigating corruption at Mena Airport with Casolaro and the 1980 "October Surprise" was found dead on a toilet June 22, 1993 in his Washington DC apartment. Had delivered a report to Janet Reno 3 weeks before his death.

Jon Parnell Walker - Whitewater investigator for Resolution Trust Corp. Jumped to his death from his Arlington, Virginia apartment balcony August 15,1993 Was investigating Morgan Guarantee scandal.

Barbara Wise - Commerce Department staffer. Worked closely with Ron Brown and John Huang. Cause of death unknown. Died November 29, 1996. Her bruised nude body was found locked in her office at the Department of Commerce.

Charles Meissner - Assistant Secretary of Commerce who gave John Huang special security clearance, died shortly thereafter in a small plane crash.

Dr. Stanley Heard - Chairman of the National Chiropractic Health Care Advisory Committee died with his attorney Steve Dickson in a small plane crash. Dr. Heard, in addition to serving on Clinton's advisory council personally treated Clinton's mother, stepfather and brother.

Barry Seal - Drug running pilot out of Mena Arkansas, Death was no accident.

Johnny Lawhorn Jr. - Mechanic, found a check made out to Clinton in the trunk of a car left in his repair shop. Died when his car hit a utility pole.

Stanley Huggins - Suicide. Investigated Madison Guarantee. His report was never released.

Hershell Friday - Attorney and Clinton fund raiser died March 1, 1994 when his plane exploded.

Kevin Ives & Don Henry - Known as "The boys on the track" case. Reports say the boys may have stumbled upon the Mena arkansas airport drug operation. Controversal case where initial report of death was due to falling asleep on railroad track. Later reports claim the 2 boys had been slain before being placed on the tracks. Many linked to the case died before their testimony could come before a Grand Jury.

Toadmund,

Why did it take you so long to admit your a BIG LIBERAL? Don't you feel better? You will be able to sleep nights now that the world knows your a big lib.

Now that you are a lib, you can fight for the things liberals want most. Go find out what liberals believe, but see my last post on Howard Dean - does he know what liberals stand for?

This is the problem with your generation. They can't pick a side. You have to be on a side. I'm not saying you have to be a lib or a conservative, but, pick a side and stand for something. Have convictions, they will give you direction in life.

Grover,

Here is an answer to your post about "all the people you know with businesses" that have failed.

www.businessweek.com...

Business is not easy. I've been in business for 14 years, 26 employees. Every day is a battle, a struggle to provide new products, marketing, teaching and learning process not only for us but also for the people who purchase our products.

I know people who have gone out of business too. 3 of them work for me now. No one said business is easy.

Double digit unemployment? Where did you get this number? Do I really have to list the statistics from the department of labor? = 4.7%

come on, give me something i can use!!!

you are an idiot if you really think that all that stuff you claim about Clinton is true. Use your head for something other than a hat rack...do you really think if they had all that stuff on Clinton, they would have impreached him for lying about a blowjob given by a consenting adult? Give me a break. You know damned good and well all thats bogus. If Gingrich could have removed him from office, locked him up on something serious and totally ruined the man, don't you think he would have? As it is he had to use charges that he should have known the majority of people, including politicans could sympthize with, invasion of privacy, something he could never win with. Gingrich didn't ruin Clinton, Gingrich made a fool of himself. Grow up tommy.

Southside virginia has double digit unemployment as does southside north carolina, both for the same reasons jobs shipped overseas.

dgtempe,

So, you claim that you are not a liberal? Hmmm. Then why is your post the typical liberal Whine? The typical liberal dribble?

PICK A SIDE. Thats the problem with your generation. You can't pick a side.

Don't be a liberal in disguse. You'll sleep better at night.

Personally, I don't care, be a liberal, be a conservative. BE SOMETHING.

PICK A SIDE AND STAND UP FOR SOMETHING.

I call you liberal because, from your posts, thats the side you defend.

That's what's wrong with MY generation? What generation would that be, Tommy?

I wasnt going to post here on this thread again, but your antagonizing brought me back.
I know which side of the fence i stand on, thank you.
I dont want to play anymore.

Grover,

So, the stuff about bush is real and the stuff about clinton is bogus. wow!!

I guess I gotta do it...

See, see the liberal, can't produce anything so what does he do....goes back to his insults.."use your head for something other that a hat rack"

See, the liberal in his natural habitat.

See, the big liberal dgtempe cut and run... he doesn't want to play anymore.
no stomach for it. cut and run.....dgtempe...you really can't compete with facts, see,



Grover, you may want to go read the link about businesses. You keep switching your story.

Is it friends of yours who have lost businesses, or is it businesses shipping jobs overseas. And, refreah my memory, how is it the fault of this administration? Because thats who you want to blame isn't it?

You know how much this or any administration ever effected my business, not at all, nothing, nothing the government does affects my business.

You gotta get something else to complain about.

Thank you dgtempe, for your compliment. Muaddib, all I can say is that I have not called anyone names. I just presented an article that describes the "phenomena" that grover wrote about his piece. I refuse to be pushed into a flame war with you over what I posted.

Tommy, I am a reasonable person. I am just puzzled after all the evidence has come to light why there are a group of people who continue to blindly follow Mr. Bush without considering the evidence about his administration. I have asked this question many times on the board. I have yet to see a good answer. So, until I get a thoughtful answer to why one blindly supports the POTUS, the only resort I have left to investigate the "phenomenon" as it is.

Notice I did not call anyone out. I just asked if people would read the analysis and make up their minds for themselves. Which is the same thing I am going to do now.

Drew Johnston wrote this interesting piece on Election Eve 2004. It is quite telling to the lengths that some supporters will go not to see Kerry in office.

Robert Parry wrote this piece in 2004 about the phenomenon of why people follow Mr. Bush:

Bush's Terror Hysteria
So to Bush, the "war on terror" is a fight to the finish. Eliminate everyone who would or might engage in terrorism before they destroy civilization and impose slavery on the rest of us. To Bush’s supporters, this black-and-white analysis represents “moral clarity.” To others around the world, it is taking on the look of madness.
[...]
In other words, Bush's strategy is not about a practical means to reduce tensions, resolve political differences and gradually ease the hardliners to the sidelines. It's about the opposite, elevating a low-intensity conflict into a full-scale war with a goal of not simply prevailing over a foe but of eradicating evil itself. It is an undertaking that reeks of hubris and totalitarianism. If the United States were a healthy democracy, Bush’s speech would have been cause for alarm, possibly outrage, certainly a fierce debate.

But Bush’s grim vision has been greeted with remarkably little debate in the United States even though it could have calamitous real-life consequences: generations of young Americans dying in a worldwide version of a Hundred Years War; the U.S. national treasury drained; and the Founding Fathers’ grand experiment of a democratic Republic ended.

Robert Jensen terms it as "Narcissistic personality Disorder":

Diagnosing the U.S. ‘national character’: Narcissistic Personality Disorder

Can a nation have a coherent character? If we take the question seriously -- investigating reality rather than merely asserting nobility -- we see in the U.S. national character signs of pathology and decay as well as health and vigor. What if, for purposes of analysis, we treated the nation as a person? Scan the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the American Psychiatric Association (the bible of mental-health professionals, now in its fourth edition) and one category jumps out: Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
[...]
Narcissistic tendencies to self-aggrandize are not unique to the United States, of course. But given the predominance of U.S. power in the world, we should worry most about the consequences of such narcissism here.
[...]
The narcissism of the whole society also is evident in the widespread “sense of entitlement,” defined as “unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations.” This is difficult to confront, precisely because it takes root to some degree in all of us and can’t be so easily displaced onto only the most overtly pathological. The vast majority of the U.S. public -- by comparison to the rest of the world -- lives an extravagant lifestyle that we show few signs of being willing to give up.

Until there are some well-thought out answers to why people continually support Bush or unless someone takes the time to write an op/ed piece in order to refute grover's work, I will continue to think there is a pathology overtaking our society. On my part, I will continue to post more work examining this "cultural phenomenon" taking place in America.

This is not the time for laundry lists of who did what. I ask that people stop pussy-footing around the issue and answer the inquiry why Bush ought to be supported.









[edit on 14-5-2006 by ceci2006]

And here is more food for thought.

Chris Floyd, writing in the Moscow Times, was quoted in Professor Gary Alan Scott's piece about the threat of fascism in America:

The Rise of Fascism in America

Fascism in America won’t come with jackboots, book burnings, mass rallies, and fevered harangues, nor will it come with black helicopters or tanks on the street. It won’t come like a storm—but as a break in the weather, that sudden change of season you might feel when the wind shifts on an October evening: Everything is the same, but everything has changed. Something has gone, departed from the world, and a new reality will have taken its place. All the old forms will still be there: legislatures, elections, campaigns—plenty of bread and circuses. But “consent of the governed” will no longer apply; actual control of the state will have passed to a small and privileged group who rule for the benefit of their wealthy peers and corporate patrons.

To be sure, there will be factional conflicts among the elite, and a degree of debate will be permitted; but no one outside the privileged circle will be allowed to influence state policy. Dissidents will be marginalized—usually by “the people” themselves. Deprived of historical knowledge by a thoroughly impoverished educational system designed to produce complacent consumers, left ignorant of current events by a corporate media devoted solely to profit, many will internalize the force-fed values of the ruling elite, and act accordingly. There will be little need for overt methods of control.

I think what he neglected to say is that the "control" over the masses will be exerted by those who use the propaganda fed to us as a cover over the wrongdoings in government. That propaganda filtered down will be "parroted" as arguments to silence dissenters. But I digress. I will go on.

A. John Rasdan's closing remarks in his Jurist piece concerning the legality of the wiretapping program gives one pause:

The Secret Government

I am not against all secrets. Keeping some of them is necessary to our diplomacy, our military policy, and our intelligence activities. But a secret government, segregated from reasonable checks and balances, is contrary to the principles many Americans have nobly sacrificed to protect.

This is of more than academic interest to me.If we are unfortunate enough to be attacked again on American soil, Bush's next step may be to round up more people. Citizens and aliens alike, Ali, Ahmed, and one author who hides behind a middle name, may be off to secret camps after secret trials. As a patriot, I hope these nightmares are false. As a realist, I fear for the truth. There are just too many people, politicians and their apologists, who try to deceive us without any twitch of shame.

And, in an insightful analysis of American current events and its parallel's in Orwell's 1984, Ryan Blethen's remarks in the Seattle Times should also give people pause:

Orwell wrote Bush's script

This strategy works only if the electorate is fearful that a hostile world is ready to overrun America. Bush's fear-mongering resembles a version of INGSOC's Two Minutes (of) Hate, in which party members watch a video of legions of the enemy army marching behind a bleating political enemy.

American democracy has buckled under the weight of Americans voting scared, a weak press diluted because of consolidation by mega-public companies, and no real political alternative.

These are all useful examples to consider when thinking about what is wrong with a portion of our population and the pathology of our nation at large. Americans need to step back and reconsider where the soul of our country lies.

I am 50 and in the 30 some odd years of watching politics I have noticed one very clear trend, and one not so obvious one. The very clear one first surfaced on the radar in the late 70's and most notibly with the Reagan campaign of 1980, and that was the demonization of liberals and Democrats by the hard right when such terms as bleeding heart liberal and knee jerk liberal entered the national political vocabulary. For most of the Reagan years it remained ever present but in the background. It was'nt until Bush the 1st campaign with the late Lee Atwater at the helm that it really began nasty. The rise of talk radio made it much worse. The vast majority of what is passed on as news on such shows is slander, gossip, inunendo and character assiassianation, and oh yes out and out lies. Mush Loosebowels is the most obvious and Micheal Savage and Ann Coulter the nastiest, but the whol lot of them are pretty bad. I listen regularly as my stomach will allow and they embrace what is honestly the worst in conservative politcs and the American character. The fact that people actually consider these people as reputable is really sad and pathetic. They have done more to poison the political life in this country than any other group. The hard right preachers such as Pat Robertson and Jerry Foulwell are right behind them. Foulwell went so far as to sell a video on his Old Time Gospel Hour in the 90's accusing Clinton of many of the things Tommy listed with the slimmest colaborations. That should have been enough to strip him of his tax exempt status but it didn't happen.

The other trend was that the Democrats let this happen without much of attempt to stand up and defend themselves. I would have loved to have seen Kerry (whom I personally wasn't especially fond of) stand up and told Bush, "Yeah I am a liberal, What of it? Now lets discuss the real issues" but what happened in both the Gore and Kerry campaigns was typical of their either look the other way or an American voters are smarter than that (despite repeated proofs to the contrary) attitude that allowed themselves to be trashed without defending themselves. It didn't help matters that both were adept at shooting themselves in the foot. The other part of that trend has been for such groups as the Democratic Leadership Council to try and either refashion themselves as moderate conservative lite politicans or to attempt to reach an understanding with the hard right, both of which were and are doomed to failure becaues (1) it plays into the hard rights hands as a weak party and (2) they simply don't understand that these people are playing for keeps. They have no interest in negoiation with the Democrats, and have repeatedly stated as Phil Gramm so famously said "plan to go after Democrats until we are hunting them down with dogs. " Now the Democrats are flirting with the possiblity of running Hillery Clinton and if they do, for the first time in 32 years of voting, I swear I will sit it out. To run her would be political sucide...every right wing nut job would come out the wood work to take pot shots at her and it would be a political bloodbath...an attempt on her life wouldn't be out of the question. This is what happens when one side consistantly demonizes the other, the Nazi's did it in Germany and we all know the results. I am not suggesting that Republicans and conservatives are nazi wannabes, because for the most part they are not, but there is most definately an authoritian streak in their party today which is a real pity. I miss the days when we could disagree yet still respect each other.

Oh i see... so posting excerpts from links which only insults, belittles and plays the blame game is not political bickering?.... You are just trying to "enlighten people"...

Riiiight... how can I be so blind?..... After all the insults and belittling comments I must change my mind immediately....

BTW...where are the "red flags aflying"..... Oh wait, Republicans are not the ones doing it, so I guess is fine...

[edit on 14-5-2006 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by dgtempe
...................
Muaddib, the same thing happened with Castro, remember? Those are the very people stuck in the island starving to death today and their children.

Please DG, don't come around telling me about what happened with castro when you have taken up the same agenda that castro has had since the revolution....

Let me show you what I mean...which i have tried to do before...

The theme of this seminar is "The strategy and tactics of the struggle against global U.S. imperialist war." Well the heroes and heroines of Falluja and Najaf are on the front lines of that struggle. U.S. imperialism may open another massive military assault. It can still cause much suffering. But Washington's policies have already been exposed as politically bankrupt.

I'm sure others here at the seminar will discuss in more detail events in Iraq and developments within the resistance and its political leadership. We will restrict ourselves to just a few comments. As communists organizing within the United States, we must take the question of self-determination of oppressed nations seriously. With regard to Iraq, this means that our responsibility is to do our best to get U.S. imperialism out of Iraq and off the backs of the Iraqis. We will attempt to mobilize the working class and youth of the U.S., including the troops, to end the occupation. We will mobilize with the same intensity regardless which political force leads Iraq's national liberation struggle. Our best intervention as communists in the United States will be to show that communists wage the most resolute and the most effective battle in solidarity with those fighting to drive the imperialists out of their country.

www.wpb.be...

Humm...where have I heard that before?.... castro and every other Communist who has or is in power now and oppressing people, and now the liberals, democrats/socialists, the liberal media etc have taken the same agenda for a while now.... So please, spare me the "this is what castro did", because you were too small to remember and you have obviously fallen once again in the trap...

Hey, we have had even moderators in these forums claim "there was never a Communist threat"..."or what castro did in Cuba is good and the dissidents who speak against castro are all paid by the U.S. govenrment to say these things"....

Do you really think it is I who has fallen once again to the Communist agenda, or any sort of dictatorship?... I really think not...

The liberal agenda is exactly the same as the Communist agenda....they just changed the name from Communism to Liberalism...

Now, that's a real conspiracy....

[edit on 14-5-2006 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by MuaddibThe liberal agenda is exactly the same as the Communist agenda....they just changed the name from Communism to Liberalism...

Now, that's a real conspiracy....

Oh Rly?

Communism is a political ideology that seeks to establish a future classless, stateless social organization based upon common ownership of the means of production. It can be classified as a branch of the broader socialist movement. Communism also refers to a variety of political movements which claim the establishment of such a social organization as their ultimate goal.

en.wikipedia.org...

Liberalism is an ideology, philosophy, and political tradition which holds liberty as the primary political value.[1] Broadly speaking, liberalism seeks a society characterized by freedom of thought for individuals, limitations on power, especially of government and religion, the rule of law, the free exchange of ideas, a market economy that supports private enterprise, and a transparent system of government in which the rights of minorities are guaranteed.

en.wikipedia.org...

Despite the glaring differences between Communism and Liberalism, your argument is non-sequitor as well. As I take it, your argument is...
A. Communists dislike American imperialism
B. "Leftists" disagree with American imperialism
C. Therefore, Leftists are Communists

I do not think this is a valid argument. Two people can dislike the same thing without being the same entity.

[edit on 14-5-2006 by Jamuhn]