May 1 Protest -Will it hurt or help illegals?

Originally posted by shortmanx5
...illegals lower house prices, by just moving in.

Actually in my neighborhood they have considerably raised house values because for whatever reason there are 2 towns in the DC area that are meccas for illegals; herndon and manassas park. i live in "the park" as i affectionately call it and our population is at somewhere around 90% hispanic with a good 50% of those 90% being illegals. Since they all want to live here they have driven the cost of real estate way up. ive made a mad bundle on my house in the past 3 years.

We also have THE highest real estate taxes in the state of Virginia in this town due to the other problems with illegals such as health care, schools, etc. This town used to be a very tiny one horse town before we were invaded with only 2 lane roads in and out for the most part with another larger road (rt 28). Now with all of the influx it takes 30 minutes to go from one side to the other which is about 8 miles.

I got to see the whole thing in slowmo as the invasion took place. It was a very cool sociological experiment in getting to see how an entire town can be converted to little mexico in under 5 years. viv la revolucion'....

posted by Escrotumus

posted by shortmanx5
. . illegals lower house prices, by just moving in.

In my neighborhood they have considerably raised house values . . for whatever reason there are 2 towns in the DC area that are meccas for illegals; Herndon and Manassas Park. [Edited by Don W]

Does not Herndon have some interesting history?

I live in "the Park" as I affectionately call it and our population is at somewhere around 90% Hispanic with a good 50% of those 90% being illegals. Since they all want to live here they have driven the cost of real estate way up . . We also have THE highest real estate taxes in the state of Virginia due to the problems with illegals such as health care, schools, etc.

It is unrealistic to expect property taxes to carry so much of the cost of local government. Either LBJ or RMN signed into law the block grants from the Feds to the locals, but under the philosophy of Reagan and the 2 Bushes, that is a no-no.

“ . . before we were invaded this town was a very tiny one horse town with only 2 lane roads in and out for the most part with one larger road (Rt 28). Now with all of the influx it takes 30 minutes to go from one side to the other which is about 8 miles. I got to see the whole thing in slo-mo . . It was a very cool sociological experiment getting to see an entire town converted to “little Mexico” in under 5 years. viv la revolucion'

If we could get over it, and issue 11 million Green cards, much of the problems you mention would be solved overnight. Raise the minimum wage to $10 would pretty much fix the rest.

Originally posted by donwhite

Does not Herndon have some interesting history?

Indeed, the mayor and many city councilmen were voted out this week for sponsoring an illegal immigrant work location with taxpayer money. They are calling it a serious wakeup call for illegal immigration backlash in this country. Hard to say what it was because only 26% of the registered voters bothered to even vote I do know that there are alot of people in this area waking up to this problem since these demonstrations over the past few weeks and they are not happy about it at all.

www.washingtonpost.com...

It is unrealistic to expect property taxes to carry so much of the cost of local government. Either LBJ or RMN signed into law the block grants from the Feds to the locals, but under the philosophy of Reagan and the 2 Bushes, that is a no-no.

Youre preaching to the choir here. Every time i fork out that $330 a month real estate tax when others who live in nearby counties are paying 1/3 less for the same value house i start to seethe. They will say the high taxes are for schools and the usual things like police and roads etc but i know its largely due to the illegal influx and i prefer to call a spade a spade.

If we could get over it, and issue 11 million Green cards, much of the problems you mention would be solved overnight. Raise the minimum wage to $10 would pretty much fix the rest.

Not sure how that would fix any problems here short of possibly increasing the tax base. The traffic would still be lousy, there would be a major sense of resentment for granting amnesty to criminals (and lets be realistic here, they snuck across the border, many with fake papers so yes they are criminals) as well as a host of other problems. Amnesty didnt work when reagan did it and it wont work now either.

As far as raising the minimum wage to $10 hr that would sort of defeat the purpose of allowing illegals here in the first place which is for cheap labor. For $10 hr you could get an american to do that job and we would have no justification for illegals being here in the first place.

I know the whole give me your tired huddled masses thing and i feel for both sides on this issue. I would want a better life for my family too if i was stuck in a deadend mexican town but somewhere we have to draw the line. Im a soldier on the front lines of what unchecked illegal immigration can do and i think it gives me a unique perspective that many on this board who advocate amnesty dont have.

Originally posted by Marz
Err…yes… According to most sources. Every language has different dialects, even English. Not, to mention that Chinese has tons of them. Mexican Spanish or not, it’s Spanish.

Cite a few, Spanish is number four not two.

Originally posted by Marz
You can debate this all you want, but the Statue of Liberty speaks the truth.
"Give us your poor, your tired, your huddled masses longing to be free..."
-The Statue of Liberty

So you believe a donated French sculpture is forms American immigration policies now?

Even better….you do realize this was never engraved on the statue itself, it was written by Emma Lazarus after the fact. These words are on display inside the museum on a plaque and she raised funds to the words placed on the pedestal…seems she won some literary contest for her work…”The New Colossus”.


mg

Originally posted by missed_gear

Originally posted by Marz
Err…yes… According to most sources. Every language has different dialects, even English. Not, to mention that Chinese has tons of them. Mexican Spanish or not, it’s Spanish.

Cite a few, Spanish is number four not two.

On this subject I’ll have to stand down, the books and sources that I reviewed seem the flip-flop on world numbers. Spanish swings from 2nd to 4th. The one definite truth is that Spanish is number 2 in North America, it is deep rooted in our society whether we like it or not. I for one am glad to have learned such a beautiful Romance language, it shows my admiration for the world, but most importantly…………… The ladies dig it! Japanese is next.

Originally posted by missed_gear

Originally posted by Marz
You can debate this all you want, but the Statue of Liberty speaks the truth.
"Give us your poor, your tired, your huddled masses longing to be free..."
-The Statue of Liberty

So you believe a donated French sculpture is forms American immigration policies now?

Even better….you do realize this was never engraved on the statue itself, it was written by Emma Lazarus after the fact. These words are on display inside the museum on a plaque and she raised funds to the words placed on the pedestal…seems she won some literary contest for her work…”The New Colossus”.


mg

Not only do I believe that we have obtained great things from other nations, but most importantly; their people and culture. Immigrants from all walks of life seeking a better future for their families and themselves. Can you name a better foundation to build a nation? That is America’s true strength. French or not, the statue & quote came from the heart; that is what truly matters.

[edit on 5-5-2006 by Marz]

I just think, it will just make America more polarized than it is. I just think if your an immagrant and your working a illegaly, you should eventually make yourself an American, and learn to at least read english, and how to speak enough of it. Instead of listening to their Presidents, etc. and eventually hurt us all, all in the name of revenage.

You think they would have listened to their own oral histories and folktales, instead of just blindly following leadership, that's based off old warrior-Kings, who gradually lost all interest in really caring for their own people, and have like the current goverment, have decided to follow "Acpoclyspe" weither "self-made" or "Real".

I don't hate them or carry any real racial bias, I just hate people who have no motoviation to see what good things are in US culture. Charity, respect, brother-sisterhood, realistic feminism, self-motoviation, innovation, Beliefs in God; like that in the Consitution and Declaration of Independence. Protection of friends and family, exploration, and Belief in some fun, Sarcasim and satire, since the beginning.

That's just what I think. Feel free to explain your opinion. I may not agree with either policital party on the war, but I believe that America is "full" of workers, and by letting "illegals" in, we will eventually "self-implode" the economy.

The whole point is that these immigrants are trying to change the country. Disrespecting our flag, trying to get the National Anthem in Spanish, etc.

If you want to live in this country, fine. Come in, sign the papers, and get a job. Bam, you become a US citizen with all the benefits. But DON'T try to sneak in, take our money, and try to make the United States of America the Hispanic States of America, and then protest when everyone refuses.

It's like someone walks into your home, beats you up, takes all your stuff, tries to make you more respectful for his culture by insulting yours, and then whine about racism when you calls the cops.

(Edited minor typo)

[edit on 6-5-2006 by chitoryu12]

Originally posted by Marz
Not only do I believe that we have obtained great things from other nations, but most importantly; their people and culture. Immigrants from all walks of life seeking a better future for their families and themselves.

In fairness to all the other hundred plus nations, this could be said of all; however to the latter, why should the US bother to have borders?

Originally posted by Marz
Can you name a better foundation to build a nation?

A foundation implies a solid base on which to build. A ‘foundation’ in the absence of form, design and structure (order and purpose) is useless, especially when in contradiction of existing laws.

Originally posted by Marz
French or not, the statue & quote came from the heart; that is what truly matters.

This is rather relative, I am sure this following statement was "from the heart" as well:

La Raza is a victim of the same political and economic forces that are oppressing the Palestinian people and other people of color around the world. We must awaken to this fact and understand the hidden strategies and tactics being utilized to subjugate our people in order to devise effective counter-measures to neutralize them.

Tezcatlipoca
Minister of Foreign Affairs
Nation of Aztlan

I think it can be said on this board, that most of us in the States, don't support illegals. It's just we pay taxes, bills, etc. Then they come in, and get it all for free, even medical stuff, and we're paying out the nose and through the bum.

It's just upsetting, then with al-quidea, and these "illegals" who think they're too good to register. I have an old bible and my decesed great, great- great aunt from ireland wrote about how hard Ellis Island was, and how she was buying the bible for my great grandmother since she had come the year before here. Our family, althrough no longer strict irish-catholics or even really all irish anymore, did everything we had to; to come to this country legally.

They had to steal potatos from 3 farms and sneak on to a boat, and then come here, register, get put into a hospital 3 days for lice, then we had to pick a place to live. I haven't even read all of it, but you get the idea. And that was at the end of the 2nd Potato famine. So I get irratated hearing how these people break in, and try to become "illegal" Americans.

My family had to jump through all the hoops, ropes, etc. Why can't these people do so, and not try to dicate culture to us? If Hollywood is to them, then I'm sorry.
Call the studio and record labels, it's not my fault or anyone elses.

Hey, I'm all for amnesty...I will forgive them for the 6 months jail time they owe for breaking the law. I will forgive them for all the back taxes they owe...and I'm all for making them legal...IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES!

The events were nothing more than a direct attack on American citizens by foreign thugs trying to force us into changing our laws to accommodate the immigration criminals.

Criminals are criminals. They're breaking our immigration laws and our employment laws and our anti-fraud laws, so I have one question: Where the hell are the COPS?

Originally posted by pinkldyslpr
Hey, I'm all for amnesty...I will forgive them for the 6 months jail time they owe for breaking the law. I will forgive them for all the back taxes they owe...and I'm all for making them legal...IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES!

The events were nothing more than a direct attack on American citizens by foreign thugs trying to force us into changing our laws to accommodate the immigration criminals.

Criminals are criminals. They're breaking our immigration laws and our employment laws and our anti-fraud laws, so I have one question: Where the hell are the COPS?

Amen brutha! Problem was, in most places, there were a lot more demonstrators than cops around. If the cops started checking papers and pulling people out of the crowds things would have gotten ugly fast. I would say the majority of the protesters wanted a peaceful demonstration, but I'm sure there were some in the crowd that would have welcomed a reason to get a riot started (not saying anything about latinos, there always a few troublemakers, regardless of race).

I have a feeling some ineffectual laws will be passed, a few 100 yards of fence built and things will go pretty much back to the way they were before all this started. Ours lawmakers love to slap a band-aid on a broken arm. Unless it's for something they want, then they do open heart surgury for heartburn!

I don't think the solution should be only deportation and fence. It will not work, fence can be always bypassed. What's really necessary is to fine EVERY employer - 50 000 - 100 000$ per illegal. No exceptions. Nothing like "But I didn't know he's illegal". Then give reward (half of the fine - 25-50 000) to those persons who will called Border patrol and informed them about the employer in question. The fine of employer in question could be reduced to half in case he'll inform authorities if someone (highly possibly his competition HAHA) employs illegals too. All expenses would be financed exclusively from fines. It would work like domino. Soon no one would employ illegals and they'll be forced to return home (hell, they could even recieve free ticket from govt!).

[edit on 8-5-2006 by longbow]

Kinda random but, I was doing some research for a school project over illegal immigration and can't seem to find the name of the bill that Bush is proposing that would make illegals felons and proposes a fence across the US / Mexico border. Does anyone know the name of this proposed bill?

Originally posted by longbow
I don't think the solution should be only deportation and fence. It will not work, fence can be always bypassed. What's really necessary is to fine EVERY employer - 50 000 - 100 000$ per illegal. No exceptions. Nothing like "But I didn't know he's illegal". Then give reward (half of the fine - 25-50 000) to those persons who will called Border patrol and informed them about the employer in question. The fine of employer in question could be reduced to half in case he'll inform authorities if someone (highly possibly his competition HAHA) employs illegals too. All expenses would be financed exclusively from fines. It would work like domino. Soon no one would employ illegals and they'll be forced to return home (hell, they could even recieve free ticket from govt!).

[edit on 8-5-2006 by longbow]

I like that idea, but the best way to get a law passed is to send the ideas to politicans, otherwise, trust me. Nothing will ever happen. SO BUG YOUR POLITICANS! So we can slove problems like this together, that are PROVEN and CAN be somewhat RESLOVED and "FIXED".

Originally posted by enlightened_smurf
Kinda random but, I was doing some research for a school project over illegal immigration and can't seem to find the name of the bill that Bush is proposing that would make illegals felons and proposes a fence across the US / Mexico border. Does anyone know the name of this proposed bill?

H.R. 4437

[edit on 9-5-2006 by longbow]

Originally posted by longbow

H.R. 4437

[edit on 9-5-2006 by longbow]

Thanks a bunch! It's nice to finally be able to put a name to the bill that is causing so much controversy throughout the United States.