Thank you America. The gauntlet has been thrown down!

No one in America obeyed the Ten Commandments anyway so why are you crying?

-How is it the government "allowed" these voters to become "disenfranchised",since it was they who allowed themselves to be,I don't get that.

-Jose Padilla Is not the only one,since it is such a big secret,who knows how many were incarcerated?,I'm sure the races make no difference as far as who got locked up.someone noticed Padilla got nabbed,how many were not noticed missing?,how many just didn't ask questions when they disappeared?,how many asked questions and weren't told the truth?.nobody knows except the people who locked them up.

-Myself,I don't really worry about gays since I am not gay.

- I am a white male,you know how hard it is getting anything done when everyone worries about not offending minorities?,us white boys don't get any special treatment either.

You can waste a lot of time fighting pointless battles here,or you can choose one you can win.

Originally posted by Colonel
Now, on this gov taking on minorities:

1) The republican Supreme Court allowing black voters to be disenfranchised in the Florida 2000 election.

2) Jose Padilla, an American. Remember him? He got disappeared by our Justice Dept. for being a suspected terrorist. No lawyer, no nothing. Just disappeared

3) The State of Texas trying to outlaw gays from being together (or something like that).

1.

from the St. Petersburg Times
The ballot, designed by Palm Beach's supervisor of elections, a Democrat, included the candidates' names on either side of punch holes, and many voters say they mistakenly voted for Reform Party nominee Pat Buchanan when they thought they were voting for Gore.

Again this isn't the government taking on a minority. The votes would have been thrown out no matter what color the voters. If you can't work the voting machine, you're vote will not count, it doesn't matter what color you are.

2. Jose Padilla was taken into custody because of his attachments to al-Qaeda. It is against the constitution for the way he is being held. (ie no bond, trial or attorney) but it isn't because of his race. If he were white, or any other color, with his knowledge (dirty bombs) and his al-Qaeda attachments he would have still been detained.

3. Supreme Court strikes down Texas sodomy law....Well first off what is sodomy? Websters New World dictionary says it is
sod[omy n.
sodomie < Sodome, SODOM6 any sexual intercourse held to be abnormal; specif., a) bestiality b) anal intercourse

Abnormal sex... So its against the law to be kinky in Texas. Not necessarily against a minority now is it... or are minorities the only kinky people out there.
Even if the law was to try to keeep gay sex illegal, the Supreme court struck it down, thus the government is defending the minority, huh?

_____________________________________________
Be Cool
K_OS

Originally posted by K_OS

Originally posted by Colonel
Now, on this gov taking on minorities:


1.

from the St. Petersburg Times
The ballot, designed by Palm Beach's supervisor of elections, a Democrat, included the candidates' names on either side of punch holes, and many voters say they mistakenly voted for Reform Party nominee Pat Buchanan when they thought they were voting for Gore.

Again this isn't the government taking on a minority. The votes would have been thrown out no matter what color the voters. If you can't work the voting machine, you're vote will not count, it doesn't matter what color you are.

2. Jose Padilla was taken into custody because of his attachments to al-Qaeda. It is against the constitution for the way he is being held. (ie no bond, trial or attorney) but it isn't because of his race. If he were white, or any other color, with his knowledge (dirty bombs) and his al-Qaeda attachments he would have still been detained.

3. Supreme Court strikes down Texas sodomy law....Well first off what is sodomy? Websters New World dictionary says it is
sod[omy n.
sodomie < Sodome, SODOM6 any sexual intercourse held to be abnormal; specif., a) bestiality b) anal intercourse

Abnormal sex... So its against the law to be kinky in Texas. Not necessarily against a minority now is it... or are minorities the only kinky people out there.
Even if the law was to try to keeep gay sex illegal, the Supreme court struck it down, thus the government is defending the minority, huh?

_____________________________________________
Be Cool
K_OS

1) Kinda funny how they forgot to mention all the republican thugs that were sent down to Florida to belligerently stop the vote count---kind like what happened in the civil rights era. I think it was Tom de Lay that sent them. (This is the birth of my hate for republicans)

2) "It is against the constitution for the way he is being held. (ie no bond, trial or attorney) but it isn't because of his race. If he were white, or any other color, with his knowledge (dirty bombs) and his al-Qaeda attachments he would have still been detained."

This is a lie. Ever heard of John Walker?

3) The fact that Texas would even bring it up tells me soemthing.

I'll bet most people here have no idea what jury nullification is.

I'll bet they think that it is legal for a judge to tell the jury how to decide their verdict.
Kinda pointless wasting time with a jury then isn't it?
Kinda unlawful, regularly practiced because the majority of people here are intimidated by,or ignorant of the law.
There is a fine line between discretion and tyranny,unfortunately it tends to lean toward tyranny.

If the law doesn't fit,f**k the law.

The People can practice any religon they want. The government cannot promote one over the other or appear to and a courthouse is part of government. So, no 10 commandments.

This is absolutely correct....imho....

Why has this turned into another Republican bashing thread... Col.. stop it. I don't think this issue has a thing to do with Democrats or Republicans as there are plenty of opinions regarding this even within the different parties. This is about seperation of Church and State period. Byrd's post was the best one on this subject, go read her words again.

Originally posted by Colonel


1) Kinda funny how they forgot to mention all the republican thugs that were sent down to Florida to belligerently stop the vote count---kind like what happened in the civil rights era. I think it was Tom de Lay that sent them. (This is the birth of my hate for republicans)

2) "It is against the constitution for the way he is being held. (ie no bond, trial or attorney) but it isn't because of his race. If he were white, or any other color, with his knowledge (dirty bombs) and his al-Qaeda attachments he would have still been detained."

This is a lie. Ever heard of John Walker?

3) The fact that Texas would even bring it up tells me soemthing.

1. The fact that republicans wanted to stop it doesn't have to do with race...however, it may have to do with the fact that it would greatly benefit them. (If the voters had been white the republicans would still have tried to stop the vote count.)

2 John Walker, almost had me there... I was thinking and then I went back... He was a captured Taliban P.O.W. not an al-Queda operative located in the U.S.A. There have been other captured P.O.W.'s released back to Palestine etc., We do not hear about them because they are not American. Jose was considering an attack on America. There is a difference. Had Walker been of a different race, he would have still been a P.O.W.

3 .As recently as 1960, every state had an anti-sodomy law, according to The Associated Press. Some of the old laws are now being repealed... again no one is taking on a minority.
_____________________________________________
This is fun though isn't it.

_____________________________________________
Be Cool
K_OS

Originally posted by observer
Why has this turned into another Republican bashing thread... Col.. stop it. I don't think this issue has a thing to do with Democrats or Republicans as there are plenty of opinions regarding this even within the different parties. This is about seperation of Church and State period. Byrd's post was the best one on this subject, go read her words again.

Dude, I'm really getting sick of this. I didn't even bring it up. You read the stupid thread and look to Xaos b/c he asked me the damn question so get off my friggin back.

If you read the bible you will se that it says almost exactly the same thing as your quote from buddhism.
-Hunting for sport is discouraged.....etc...etc...etc,but not all in one place,read the whole thing.

I am not one who needs to claim a religion of any specific denomination,I feel sorry for those who seem to need this connection,they bring much trouble upon themselves.

Originally posted by K_OS
The gov't would never take on a minority because they are so scared that they won't be P.C. (Politically Correct). I know that you know this as well as I do.

We have a winnah!!

I just wonder, now that we have gun control, if our government will ever take on the deadliest weapon yet. PC labels. We have citizens that would stand up to an armed robber only to run for cover when those labels start to fly.


"Don't agree with me? dare to have your own opinion? Want the benefit of your own risk and labors? Well, you're a (insert PC label here)!!"

Ladies and gentleman, what you have just seen is a recreation done by professionals in a controlled environment. Please do not attempt to apply any of these labels to anyone without direct supervision of your area designated self-righteous liberal.

Originally posted by Colonel
Dude, I'm really getting sick of this. I didn't even bring it up. You read the stupid thread and look to Xaos b/c he asked me the damn question so get off my friggin back.

Hey back off. First of all it is K_OS that is asking you to defend the indefensible not xaos. Second of all I am getting sick of your crap too. Speaking as a democrat (which I certainly am) I have to say that your singleminded lunacy over King George the II and the rest of the republicans is ridiculous. I am not a fan of this admin either but I also don't blame him (or the rest of his party) for everything that goes wrong on earth. You complain about Clinton bashing that seems to make no sense yet you do the same thing!
Stick to the topic or go create a "The Republicans are trying to force the 10 commandments on us" thread in the Mud Slinging forum. This was to a RELIGIOUS discussion not political.

Originally posted by observer

Originally posted by Colonel
Dude, I'm really getting sick of this. I didn't even bring it up. You read the stupid thread and look to Xaos b/c he asked me the damn question so get off my friggin back.

Hey back off. First of all it is K_OS that is asking you to defend the indefensible not xaos. Second of all I am getting sick of your crap too. Speaking as a democrat (which I certainly am) I have to say that your singleminded lunacy over King George the II and the rest of the republicans is ridiculous. I am not a fan of this admin either but I also don't blame him (or the rest of his party) for everything that goes wrong on earth. You complain about Clinton bashing that seems to make no sense yet you do the same thing!
Stick to the topic or go create a "The Republicans are trying to force the 10 commandments on us" thread in the Mud Slinging forum. This was to a RELIGIOUS discussion not political.

Dude, read the thread. This is a politcal controversy between church and state. I never mentioned "King Geoge". Then YOUR mod said some BS about minorities and we got into that and it was civil until you butted in.

And as for you getting sick of me? DO you think I EVER gve a crap as to what you think about how I feel? Think on that.

[Edited on 28-8-2003 by Colonel]

Originally posted by mOjOm
Don't misunderstand the meaning of what I'm about to say, but I don't really understand why the 10 Commandments were up in a Court House to begin with. The idea of our legal system is not supposed to follow any Religion or it's teachings. A court house shouldn't have the rules of any religious following because that would give the impression that it was not impartial to those on trial. What if someone was a Hindu or Muslim or whatever and on trial in that courthouse, would their religious belief be held against them??

Understand I'm not saying anything anti-christian here....Just trying to point out that the Laws of our Society shouldn't be intermixed with Spiritual Laws. Especially in a country that was supposed to support the protection for anyone to follow any religion of their choosing, which can only be done by separating church from state policy.

So, should we allow murder just b/c it is written in Christianity that it is wrong? and how is having the 10 Commandments posted in a public place distract anyone from practicing whatever religion they believe in? im not gettin on your case,mOjOm, just stating a point.

Originally posted by chrisnolefan
So, should we allow murder just b/c it is written in Christianity that it is wrong? and how is having the 10 Commandments posted in a public place distract anyone from practicing whatever religion they believe in? im not gettin on your case,mOjOm, just stating a point.

No problem chrisnolefan, thanx for asking me to clearify. Should we allow murder?? Of course not, regardless of any Religious Views, which is why it is ILLEGAL to murder. The Laws that are established within our (supposed) non-religious based society should be the only set of Laws supported and/or affiliated within the Houses enforcing those Laws.

This is not a stance against Christianity or any Religious Teachings, it is a stance toward keeping the Legal System and it's actions connected to the Laws Governing America. America's Laws were not created by God, they were created by American's. While some American Laws and God's Laws may be the same or similar, it does not make the lists interchangable.

This is especially important because America is supposed to be protecting the right yet impartial toward the chosen Religious Paths of the American People. Since All American People are subject to prosecution of American Laws regardless of Spiritual Beliefs, the Establishments of Law need to be clear of their separation as not to lean toward favoritism toward certain Religious Faiths and their rules.

This was not just any public place, but a courthouse. A courthouse is the property of the EVERY MAN, WOMAN AND CHILD in America as they are all subject to prosectution by it's laws. It doesn't belong to the Judge or the Religion of the Majority, but to ALL PEOPLE EQUALLY. This is why Murder within legal terms is much more complicated than God's terms. The idea is to avoid loopholes, although the reality of such ideas are much more difficult to achieve than the ideas themselves.

Does that make more sense now??? I know it's a bit long winded, but you did ask me to clearify...

I didn't look through the replies, I was worng saying nothing happened on the 27th... I believe I am going to be killed (call me paranoid, I honestly hate this life). God has told a man that he has rejected America, making it open for destruction disc.server.com... freedom was nice, perhaps the prophecies of America being nuked by China and Russia will be fulfilled soon, along with martial law... we deserve it.

Ummm. Who's Larry Taylor?

Well, I don't like writing "ditto" posts, but I was thinking this as soon as I saw the news too. Why the hell would they remove the 10 comandments? There are no logical reasons, what harm can they possibly cause? They are the 10 most important, most fundamental laws of mankind, wether you believe in God or not, you can't deny that they are sound laws.

There can be no other explanation for them doing this than shady religion-killing, power stealing business.

Originally posted by chebob
...Why the hell would they remove the 10 comandments? There are no logical reasons, what harm can they possibly cause? They are the 10 most important, most fundamental laws of mankind, wether you believe in God or not, you can't deny that they are sound laws.

There can be no other explanation for them doing this than shady religion-killing, power stealing business.

Am I the only one who bothers to read the other posts inside these debate theads????

Did I imagine the 3 pages of material prior to this that was about just this very idea??? (Excluding a couple of the branching topics that spun off here and there of course)

Maybe I'm the crazy one here.....But the point behind debating such ideas like the one's here at ATS includes reading the posts within each topic as well as adding to them, right?? Otherwise the chances of learning something is a bit slim wouldn't ya think?? Since a person who posts something already knows his own opinion, and reading others posts is how you get different view points. Not that you have to agree with them, but that you at least read them.....

So, should we allow murder just b/c it is written in Christianity that it is wrong? and how is having the 10 Commandments posted in a public place distract anyone from practicing whatever religion they believe in? im not gettin on your case,mOjOm, just stating a point.

Dude, get your nose out of the bible and look beyond the cross. Muder is wrong in EVERY human society. The christians dont have a monopoly on this, nor do they at stealing.

If you go to Shinto Japan, youll find Murder has been wrong for ages. if you go to tribal Africa, even the smallest, most primitive Human societies have laws against taking life for the hell of it. Stealing, killing, lying, ect, all these things are UNIVERSALLY wrong in human societies. Every religion on the planet, save a handful, preaches these thinsg are wrong, and have done so for longer than even Christ Insanity ever was a concept.

Byrd has the best points on here. I used to go to pagan meetings in Californias central valley bible belt. Ive seen what Christians do to Wiccans. Bomb threats, death threats, against a pagan women who oppened up a pagan shop and meeting center in town. her car was trashed, tire slit, and broicks thrown through her windows by loving "christians".

The ten commandments are offensive to many people who dont follow christianity, because the first 4 basically are pure christian dogma (no idols, no gods before me, dont take my name in vain, sabbath, ect). So they are unconstitutional. The push one religious belief on a whole bunch of people. Killing, stealing ect are simplky laws, and as Byrd stated, go back to Hammaraubi and even further, to the very first human societies.

The ten commandments are simply the religious beliefs of one group. It doesnt interfere with peoples right to go to church and worship whoever the hell they wanna pray to. It simply removes that religion being shoved down peoples throats when they go to court. The courthouse is a govornment place. the govornment shall not establish a religion. Putting christianity at the courthouse basically tells the public the state of alabama establishes christianity as the state religion. Unless they plan on filling it with texts of other peoples religions, its unconstitutional. What the judge wants to believe in is his business, he can do it on his own time, with his own money on his own property.

Christian morality is only one moral set of rules. To claim a person is Immoral because they dont follow the christian BS line is stupid. Budists are moral, Hindus are moral, even athiests are moral, they chose what beliefs they want to be guided by.

Its IMMORAL to keep the commandments up, because it etsblishes one religion for the state.

Like other things, keep your religion at home and at church where it belomngs, dont use govornment money and landspace to promote your ideals on the rest of the population.

This country was not founded on christian morals, it was founded on roman and english common law, both being pagan in origin. Christian law includes superstition, burning people at the stake for witchcraft, heresy, or doing evil things like discovering the earth is round and not the center of the universe.

Christianity inflicted 1500 years of inhuman hell on Europe, and spread to other peoples by the sword, robbing them of thier own native cultures.