Native American art is being covered up in museums across the country

originally posted by: 5thHead

I'll butt out.

It's cool, I just thought it was funny a Brit would say that as they tried to colonize the world to include America, two times... The only people worse than them were the Spanish and Portuguese, it is funny how they are never mentioned.

a reply to: 5thHead

I am Cherokee/ Chickasaw senior American.

A boy becomes a man when his kills his 1st hunt.
A man becomes a Warrior when he kills in battle.
A Warrior becomes an Elder, the Elder of Great age...walks in 3 worlds. The world of the past, a foot in the present, another in the future.

If we remove my past, and take away a possible future...then what value is placed on the lives of my Ancestors? Wasn't the Trail of Tears enough?

Mine hid from Jackson in the hills near Grandfather Mountain. We survived to later be erased?

The Indians were obviously not the first people here. They arrived here a lot later then most people tend to think. They didnt build the mounds. It wasnt their land. They walked here from the north. They are asian, and may have arrived as late as 1200

Museum: Good morning, my name is John from the City Central Museum of American History. I’m emailing you because we would love to include some artifacts from your tribe in a marvelous display. I am reaching out to your tribe requesting permission to do so.

Tribe: $ounds fabulou$! We are $o delighted that you’re choo$ing to include $ome of our preciou$ artifact$ $howca$ing our $acred valuable$.

Museum: We would be happy to make a donation to your tribe, of course.
How much will be sufficient?

Tribe: How much do you have?

a reply to: 5thHead

I do believe some ruling bodies of native Americans are involved in a cover up.

Correct me if I'm wrong but some native Americans still have access to the tunnel system inside the grand canyon the contents of which would change world history as we know it.

a reply to: 5thHead

Thank you! I read your original post twice and only now do I see the link. It's been a difficult week and my brain is just coming out of a thick fog - my mistake.

Yes, that makes sense.

Cheers!

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: AdultMaleHumanUK

Why do you ask?

Someone free of colonialism...lol OK

How many Americans do you think ancestors owned slaves or had ancestors back before let's say the Revolutionary War?

What point are you trying to make?
My direct ancestors had no involvement in wiping out indigenous people or stealing their lands, and neither have I lol

I don't really give a # about indigenous American artifacts, or how badly white colonists treated them in history...but when I read a thread about current issues relating to historical actions, I can comment within zero ancestral guilt myself.

I didn't invade and steal lands, and none of my forefathers did...we were already assimilated as peasant farmers since the Romans invaded this little island!
😱🤣

originally posted by: AdultMaleHumanUK

What point are you trying to make?
My direct ancestors had no involvement in wiping out indigenous people or stealing their lands, and neither have I lol

I guess I'm trying to figure out your point as nobody has direct ancestors that stole land...

a reply to: Xtrozero
You ignored my point, you just asked me where I was from.
I answered your sidetrack question, maybe comment on my words that you quoted, when you asked me where I was from?

Here I'll quote it for you, again, now you know where I'm from...

originally posted by: AdultMaleHumanUK
European colonist institutions basically stole their lands, so reading the article, it seems a reasonable request about returning artifacts if requested by tribes today.

I got no dog in this fight though, I didn't steal anyone's lands, and neither did any of my ancestors

Which bit of that troubles you, I assert that my position is reasonable...not that I give much of a toss about the issue to be fair

a reply to: 5thHead

Yet in your link which I was finally able to access, both the tribes and museums feel this is the right thing to do. They want this. So again, I'm trying to figure out how the current administration is to blame for "erasing indigenous culture" and then somehow the blame will be on white people. This is from your link.

“We’re finally being heard — and it’s not a fight, it’s a conversation,” said Myra Masiel-Zamora, an archaeologist and curator with the Pechanga Band of Indians.

“We can say, ‘This needs to come home,’ and I’m hoping there will not be pushback,” Masiel-Zamora said.

“This is human rights work, and we need to think about it as that and not as science,” said Candace Sall, the director of the museum of anthropology at the University of Missouri, which is still working to repatriate the remains of more than 2,400 Native American individuals. Sall said she added five staff members to work on repatriation in anticipation of the regulations and hopes to add more.

Criticism of the pace of repatriation had put institutions such as the American Museum of Natural History under public pressure. In more than 30 years, the museum has repatriated the remains of approximately 1,000 individuals to tribal groups; it still holds the remains of about 2,200 Native Americans and thousands of funerary objects.

Bryan Newland, the assistant secretary for Indian Affairs and a former tribal president of the Bay Mills Indian Community, said the rules were drawn up in consultation with tribal representatives, who wanted their ancestors to recover dignity in death.

“Repatriation isn’t just a rule on paper,” Newland said, “but it brings real meaningful healing and closure to people.”

a reply to: visitedbythem

Dearborn MI....Henry Ford bulldozed miles of land everywhere, including mounds.

He found Aztec flowerbeds. At least they appeared to be. He found other artifacts going back BEFORE the 1st Nations.
He buried artifacts he found in concrete in a local park.

Total disregard....this is documented.

originally posted by: AdultMaleHumanUK
a reply to: 5thHead
European colonist institutions basically stole their lands, so reading the article, it seems a reasonable request about returning artifacts if requested by tribes today.

The linked article is paywalled, so no way to verify, but if indeed it is simply that tribes are asking for things to be returned, whats the hubbub about?

But...

I didn't steal anyone's lands, and neither did any of my ancestors

Sorry to bust your bubble, but everyone alive today is have both dispossessed and dispossessors as ancestors.

a reply to: tanstaafl
No bubble to burst lol, but you can keep any complaints about the native American injustices to the European people who stole their land...my family didn't even leave this island for a holiday until my parents generation, in the 1970's!

Nope, the #ty way the tribes were treated had # all to do with me or my family, and you can keep collective white guilt for yourself lol

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: 5thHead

I'll butt out.

It's cool, I just thought it was funny a Brit would say that as they tried to colonize the world to include America, two times... The only people worse than them were the Spanish and Portuguese, it is funny how they are never mentioned.

And the French 👍

a reply to: frogs453

Well, of course there are people that support it. But there are also quotes from tribal leaders that say they don't have the resources or the funds to deal with this.

I've quoted them quite a bit in this thread. Too lazy to do it again lol


Also there are lots of things that you would have to ask permission for from people that have nothing to do with the objects in question. As I've mentioned before who stole darts 12,000 years ago? Who do you ask about 12000 year old darts?. Things like this will just be in limbo forever?

I could go on but really I've already said it. Just go read my posts in this thread. There are several quotes from the article that I think explain things pretty well.

a reply to: tanstaafl

I did not pay for the article or access to the website and I've returned to it several times to get quotes and post them here.

Sorry if the link doesn't work for you. I don't know what else to say.

a reply to: 5thHead

Yes your link addresses that issue.

The officials who drew up the new regulations have said that institutions can get extensions to their deadlines as long as the tribes that they are consulting with agree, emphasizing the need to hold institutions accountable without overburdening tribes. If museums are found to have violated the regulations, they could be subject to fines.

And tribes can get grants to help offset any financial cost of the work, hiring, etc.

Federal grants are available to museums, Indian Tribes, and Native Hawaiian organizations to assist in consultation, documentation, and repatriation under NAGPRA.

NPS.gov

Defeated nation of people in a time when it was the way of the world.

Call it what you will but that is the truth of it.

White washing it with opinions based on today’s idealism is false and nothing but virtue signaling.

Had any of you been part of the movement west in the US you would have supported all of it.

a reply to: frogs453


Lol. Sometimes you don't know who to ask. How many times do I have to say that.

Also, "they can be subjects to fines" lol exactly. so when in doubt just cover it up or take it down.

And no, the red tape bureaucracy of getting reimbursed is a joke only a Democrat would think of as a good solution. That could take years and when you don't know who to ask in the first place it could just be taken down forever


I fail to see why you don't understand that closing down exhibits and covering this stuff up like a dead body isn't erasing it.

By the way I've mentioned this before [(twice now, this will be the third time) with quotes from the article] but, they say you will now have to ask for permission to do research on native cultures. What? That is crazy. How do you ask permission from a group of people that disappeared before Europeans arrived? Do you ask the tribes that came later? You know, the people that prolly killed them and stole their land?

Is this the death of archeology? Do you think in England they take a survey and ask for permission from the British people before they start digging at Stonehenge?

As I've said before. A lot of this may sound good on the surface but once you start thinking about the details it's just not the answer.

If Biden and the Democrats aren't purposely getting this stuff removed and covered up then at the very least they're pretty dumb, and haven't thought this through.

originally posted by: AlongCameaSpider
Defeated nation of people in a time when it was the way of the world.

Call it what you will but that is the truth of it.

White washing it with opinions based on today’s idealism is false and nothing but virtue signaling.

Had any of you been part of the movement west in the US you would have supported all of it.

I'm not virtue signaling or judging the past with today's standards guy. I just want to see a frick'n canoe at my local museum, you know. Lol