Half a million people march in London for Palestine

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: Leviathan4

Take a look at what your compatriots say about the war.

I don't have to, I talk to them every, single day.
Real, bona fide Brits from across a broad spectrum of backgrounds.
The vast majority are sick to death of the killing and slaughter carried out by followers of the religion of peace.

Of course they don't want to see all the death and destruction....but they understand why Israel has to root out and eliminate these vermin.

And that poll?
An incredibly small sample size.
Any idea of the demographics of those polled, where they are from, their social backgrounds and political leaning.
All of those create a bias and have to be considered if we are to believe its representative.

Unless you do its utterly irrelevant.

How many times are you going to regurgitate this bollocks?

Small size, yes. The polls have usually small samples

But the half million of people who protested are a very large sample.

You can't have it both ways I am afraid.

You're confusing various regional politics with religions and holy wars.

You need to take a look at Netanyahou who recalled the old testament to make his case about war and the defeat - extermination of the enemy.

a reply to: Leviathan4

This is where you expose yourself.

Because no one who has ever fought in a war wants war.

We want to see a quick and decisive end to war.

Primarily because we're the ones getting killed in the god-damned war.

The civilians who have never felt war, dealt with war, and cry for peace are the most dangerous though.

They're the ones who don't understand war, and foolishly cry for peace.

a reply to: DBCowboy

I wonder if there is a larger context here.


How wisdom is propagated and how a binary love/hate society essentially cuts that wisdom in half.


As an example, lets say I hate a veteran but love a teacher. Whos wisdom will I tend to be open to accept? Whos will I immediately refute?

Not based upon the knowledge but from whom it is coming from.

Being against Israel does not equal antisemitism.
You can be against a political body, governing order, military action, but that doesn't mean you somehow automatically hate the Jewish people.
What is your take on the Jewish organizers who are against Israeli airstrikes?
Are they self hating, or are they against the political and military vengeance campaign?
Oh, and those Jewish organizers are also not localized to one country or town! They're also being heard globally condemning the ongoing situation.
Stop picking sides and advocate for peace.

a reply to: FlyersFan

a reply to: Leviathan4

Small size, yes. The polls have usually small samples

Not necessarily.
You do understand bias don't you when talking about polls like this?
And a little context wouldn't go amiss - exactly who was polled?
If it was at a Friends of Hamas meeting then the results are hardly surprising are they?
Was it balanced out with polling outside Bevis Marks?

But the half million of people who protested are a very large sample.

As has repeatedly been pointed put to you, a march consisting largely of Muslims with a smattering of do-gooding, entitled, liberal social justice warrior types.

My take on things is based on talking to British people from all over the UK and from various backgrounds every single day.
The people who politicians have deserted and whose opinions are very rarely sought, considered or reported.

You're confusing various regional politics with religions and holy wars.

Please elaborate.

You need to take a look at Netanyahou who recalled the old testament to make his case about war and the defeat - extermination of the enemy.

So no Hamas terrorist has ever quoted The Quran to justify their barbarity?
Those pieces of # killing all those Israeli's weren't screaming 'Allahu Akbar' when doing so?

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Leviathan4

This is where you expose yourself.

Because no one who has ever fought in a war wants war.

We want to see a quick and decisive end to war.

Primarily because we're the ones getting killed in the god-damned war.

The civilians who have never felt war, dealt with war, and cry for peace are the most dangerous though.

They're the ones who don't understand war, and foolishly cry for peace.

The war may not be quick as you said.
It's an expectation but even the IDF said it may take very long to achieve the objectives.

No I don't think I have 'exoosed' my arguments.
On the other hand there is plenty of exposure from the side that wants death and destruction at annihilation of Gaza...

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: Leviathan4

Small size, yes. The polls have usually small samples

Not necessarily.
You do understand bias don't you when talking about polls like this?
And a little context wouldn't go amiss - exactly who was polled?
If it was at a Friends of Hamas meeting then the results are hardly surprising are they?
Was it balanced out with polling outside Bevis Marks?

But the half million of people who protested are a very large sample.

As has repeatedly been pointed put to you, a march consisting largely of Muslims with a smattering of do-gooding, entitled, liberal social justice warrior types.

My take on things is based on talking to British people from all over the UK and from various backgrounds every single day.
The people who politicians have deserted and whose opinions are very rarely sought, considered or reported.

You're confusing various regional politics with religions and holy wars.

Please elaborate.

You need to take a look at Netanyahou who recalled the old testament to make his case about war and the defeat - extermination of the enemy.

So no Hamas terrorist has ever quoted The Quran to justify their barbarity?
Those pieces of # killing all those Israeli's weren't screaming 'Allahu Akbar' when doing so?

So for once more take a look at what your compatriots say about the war. It looks like the majority want a ceasefire and peace. Do you think they are unrealistic or having idyllic dreams? I have asked you before but you were unable to answer.

People all over the world are not shocked with the right of Israel to defend it self but with the level of brutality and the war crimes committed by both sides.

I don't constantly ignore others. They tend to constantly ignore the evidence and the realities. Why do I have to take the word of only a few accounts here much more seriously than Hundreds of thousands or even millions in the UK who are against the war.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the UK is in favour of what Israel is doing at the moment. Israel has been heavily criticised in most European Countries if not all. The Spanish Government has accused Israel ,through some of its members, for...war crimes! What else?!

You seem not to accept the poll because it has a small size.

Then you seek not to accept the demonstrations because there are many Muslims who attended.

You can't have it both ways I am afraid. It's much more likely that the UK is against the war rather than in favour.

Yes Hamas has quoted the Quran and so did Netanyahou by quoting the Old Testament before arguing for death and destruction of its enemies... It seems that western societies need to rethink their relationship with this state.

originally posted by: Leviathan4
The UN, Amnesty International, Human Rights Lawyers and several countries are arguing that Israel has committed war crimes. They don't obviously believe Israel is innocent.

You really should just stop talking and instead read and educate yourself. Continually saying that the UN and Amnesty International are crying 'war crimes' is a joke and it looks retarded when they are held up as people the world should listen to when it comes to Israel.

United Nations AntiSemitism Platform

Jewish Virtual Library - AntiSemitism History of United Nations

Jewish Chronicle - Amnesty International Spreads The Virus of AntiSemitism

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: Leviathan4
The UN, Amnesty International, Human Rights Lawyers and several countries are arguing that Israel has committed war crimes. They don't obviously believe Israel is innocent.

You really should just stop talking and instead read and educate yourself. Continually saying that the UN and Amnesty International are crying 'war crimes' is a joke and it looks retarded when they are held up as people the world should listen to when it comes to Israel.

United Nations AntiSemitism Platform

Jewish Virtual Library - AntiSemitism History of United Nations

Jewish Chronicle - Amnesty International Spreads The Virus of AntiSemitism

Stop talking?!
In a platform like this?

As I said earlier, The UN, Amnesty International, Human Rights Lawyers and several countries are arguing that Israel has committed war crimes. They don't obviously believe Israel is innocent and it doesn't seem to be a conspiracy against the State of Israel.

Imagine in what state of mind someone must be to claim that there is a conspiracy by everyone in the world against the Jewish State because they have killed thousands of innocent civilians including women and children...

The purpose of all these demonstrations in London and elsewhere in the World.

a reply to: sendhelp

I ve sent you a pm with some useful links. Take a look and as I said earlier I do agree very much with what you said.

originally posted by: Leviathan4
As I said earlier, The UN, Amnesty International, Human Rights Lawyers and several countries are arguing that Israel has committed war crimes.

As I said earlier, you should stop talking and instead read and educate yourself before you speak again. To quote the United Nations and Amnesty International as sources that anyone should bother to listen to when it comes to Israel is absolutely moronic.

United Nations AntiSemitism Platform

Jewish Virtual Library - AntiSemitism History of United Nations

Jewish Chronicle - Amnesty International Spreads The Virus of AntiSemitism

a reply to: Leviathan4

So for once more take a look at what your compatriots say about the war.

I do, every single day in my real life interactions with them, something you seem to put little or no belief in.

It looks like the majority want a ceasefire and peace.

They would like to see an end to all the killing but most understand that's never going to be possible as long as Hamas and their like exist.

Do you think they are unrealistic or having idyllic dreams?

I think its noble and worthy but being the cynic I have become due to my real life experiences I think its naive.
I'd love to be proven wrong.

I have asked you before but you were unable to answer.

I answered, as I try to do so to all direct questions, unfortunately it seems you are unable to understand my reply.

I don't constantly ignore others.

Sorry, from my perspective you do.
And you cherry pick comments to twist and suit your perspective whilst repeating the same old soundbites verbatim over and over again.
That's fine, entirely up to you.....but don't be surprised when others comment on it or do exactly the same.

Why do I have to take the word of only a few accounts here much more seriously than Hundreds of thousands or even millions in the UK who are against the war.

You don't have to, do as you see fit....people here are simply trying to give their perspective and opinion based on our real life, day to day experiences here in the UK. You choose to ignore them, entirely up to you.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the UK is in favour of what Israel is doing at the moment.

Other than first hand testaments.

Israel has been heavily criticised in most European Countries if not all. The Spanish Government has accused Israel ,through some of its members, for...war crimes! What else?!

UK support for Israel is is steadfast....I can't speak for other European countries or people.

You seem not to accept the poll because it has a small size.

Because I know quite a bit about statistics and how you can out any sort of slant on them that you wish.
So, bias and context - without knowing any of that the poll is utter rubbish.

Then you seek not to accept the demonstrations because there are many Muslims who attended.

Of course I 'accept' them, they were real, they happened.
I just question whether they are truly representative of ordinary, British people's opinions and support.
Its my opinion and experience that they aren't.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: Leviathan4
As I said earlier, The UN, Amnesty International, Human Rights Lawyers and several countries are arguing that Israel has committed war crimes.

As I said earlier, you should stop talking and instead read and educate yourself before you speak again. To quote the United Nations and Amnesty International as sources that anyone should bother to listen to when it comes to Israel is absolutely moronic.

United Nations AntiSemitism Platform

Jewish Virtual Library - AntiSemitism History of United Nations

Jewish Chronicle - Amnesty International Spreads The Virus of AntiSemitism

I prefer to quote the UN, Amnesty International, the Red Cross and Doctors who are on the ground.

They're infinitely much more credible than IDF you seem to be quoting that said a few days ago there is no humanitarian crisis in Gaza when at the same time they have killed thousands of innocent civilians including women and children.

You're trying hard with all this Israeli State propaganda but nobody buys it here.

What an argument you made! Stop quoting the UN and Amnesty International and start quoting the IDF!

a reply to: Freeborn

Of course I 'accept' them, they were real, they happened.
I just question whether they are truly representative of ordinary, British people's opinions and support.
Its my opinion and experience that they aren't.

You can question whatever you want but everything so far that's coming from Britain points out there is no much support for the war just as it was back then in 2003 in the Iraq war.

You speak about bias but the bias is in your text. Trying to deny reality, the huge demonstration, and another poll (although a small size) show clearly there is no much support for the war.

.....people here are simply trying to give their perspective and opinion based on our real life, day to day experiences here in the UK. You choose to ignore them, entirely up to you.

One of your compatriots gave his perspective which was as bad as a few others who have been arguing in favour of the war saying that he doesn't care even if the whole Gaza is flattened everyone inside is killed.

a reply to: Leviathan4

You can question whatever you want.....

I will and do.

.... but everything so far that's coming from Britain points out there is no much support for the war ....

Apart from first hand testaments from people who actually live here.

....just as it was back then in 2003 in the Iraq war.

Apples and oranges.

You speak about bias but the bias is in your text.

So, you know absolutely nothing about participation bias in any polling or sampling bias.

Trying to deny reality, the huge demonstration, and another poll (although a small size) show clearly there is no much support for the war.

Again, showing wilful ignorance and disregard for comments made to you.

One of your compatriots gave his perspective which was as bad as a few others who have been arguing in favour of the war saying that he doesn't care even if the whole Gaza is flattened everyone inside is killed.

So, one 'compatriot' is representative of us all?
What about the Palestinian supporters who advocate killing all Jews and wiping Israel off the face of the earth, are they representative of all Palestinian supporters?

Its just the same old rhetoric repeated over and over again.
Your bouncing from one thread to another repeating your heavily one-sided take on things whilst refusing to consider anything anyone says that goes against your perspective.

Sorry, its boring the tits off me now and I have things to do in the real world.....never know, might actually get to talk to some real, genuine British people and ask them about their take on things in Israel. I guess you wouldn't be interested in what they have to say though because first hand testament means nothing to you.

originally posted by: Leviathan4
I prefer to quote the UN, Amnesty International, the Red Cross and Doctors who are on the ground.

Again. You fail to comprehend that the United Nations and Amnesty International are ANTISEMITIC groups. It doesn't matter where they are. If you'd actually educate yourself before you speak, it would go better for you.

They're infinitely much more credible than IDF

No. They aren't.

You're trying hard with all this Israeli State propaganda but nobody buys it here.

Says you. The information I am providing is well documented historical information. You, on the other hand, just give off topic anti-semitic opinion pieces. My information is well received as we can see by the number of stars and applause I get. Yours .. not so much. So your statement that 'nobody buys it here' is false.

AGAIN ON TOPIC - the 100,000 (not half million) people who protested are just useful idiots for Hamas. They want to stop Israel from defending itself which empowers Hamas and the Palestinians to destroy Israel.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: Leviathan4
I prefer to quote the UN, Amnesty International, the Red Cross and Doctors who are on the ground.

Again. You fail to comprehend that the United Nations and Amnesty International are ANTISEMITIC groups. It doesn't matter where they are. If you'd actually educate yourself before you speak, it would go better for you.

They're infinitely much more credible than IDF

No. They aren't.

You're trying hard with all this Israeli State propaganda but nobody buys it here.

Says you. The information I am providing is well documented historical information. You, on the other hand, just give off topic anti-semitic opinion pieces. My information is well received as we can see by the number of stars and applause I get. Yours .. not so much. So your statement that 'nobody buys it here' is false.

AGAIN ON TOPIC - the 100,000 (not half million) people who protested are just useful idiots for Hamas. They want to stop Israel from defending itself which empowers Hamas and the Palestinians to destroy Israel.

That's an unsubstantiated assertion from you with nothing to support it other than propaganda.

As I said earlier I prefer to quote the UN, Amnesty International, the Red Cross and Doctors who are on the ground.

They're infinitely much more credible than IDF you seem to be quoting that said a few days ago there is no humanitarian crisis in Gaza when at the same time they have killed thousands of innocent civilians including women and children.

The people of London who protested are not idiotic. That's your opinion, and...according to you the Israeli Defense Forces are much more credible than Amnesty International and the UN.... Full scale propaganda.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: Leviathan4

You can question whatever you want.....

I will and do.

.... but everything so far that's coming from Britain points out there is no much support for the war ....

Apart from first hand testaments from people who actually live here.

....just as it was back then in 2003 in the Iraq war.

Apples and oranges.

You speak about bias but the bias is in your text.

So, you know absolutely nothing about participation bias in any polling or sampling bias.

Trying to deny reality, the huge demonstration, and another poll (although a small size) show clearly there is no much support for the war.

Again, showing wilful ignorance and disregard for comments made to you.

One of your compatriots gave his perspective which was as bad as a few others who have been arguing in favour of the war saying that he doesn't care even if the whole Gaza is flattened everyone inside is killed.

So, one 'compatriot' is representative of us all?
What about the Palestinian supporters who advocate killing all Jews and wiping Israel off the face of the earth, are they representative of all Palestinian supporters?

Its just the same old rhetoric repeated over and over again.
Your bouncing from one thread to another repeating your heavily one-sided take on things whilst refusing to consider anything anyone says that goes against your perspective.

Sorry, its boring the tits off me now and I have things to do in the real world.....never know, might actually get to talk to some real, genuine British people and ask them about their take on things in Israel. I guess you wouldn't be interested in what they have to say though because first hand testament means nothing to you.

You have no valid arguments and trying to argue against the huge demonstration in London that clearly shown there is not much support for the war. The rest is just whataboutism.

In the real world the British society has said no to the war and you need to get in terms with this despite the continuous denialism and propaganda in these threads.

I am only arguing for ceasefire and peace. I haven't taken sides. It's clear that if you're emotionally invested and support one side, you clearly support Israel together with the war crimes they have committed, then you can't hold a proper conversation.

a reply to: Leviathan4

My Daughter was visiting Liverpool on Saturday and got caught up in the Peace March there, i asked her about the people and she said the march was huge, and made up and all kinds of demograhics.
The point everyone is trying to make clear here is that , people arent being antisemitic, or not particulary anti Israeli.
They see they deaths of thousands and thousands of people in Gaza as a crime , tragedy that should be stopped.
Israels own people are shouting for this war to stop.

I think, perhaps it suits bb, and he wont survive as Prime Minister for much longer in my opinion.

Down with war in what ever form it takes.

originally posted by: Leviathan4

originally posted by: Radchad

originally posted by: Leviathan4

originally posted by: Radchad

It’s interesting to see all these pro Palestine (actually Hamas) demonstrating against Israel’s military action in response to the October attack. Why have these same people never thrown as much support and anger against the Turks who are doing the same against the Kurds or the Myanmar military doing the same against the Rohingya? After all both these victims are Muslims. It’s obvious really these pro Palestine demonstrators are anti Semitic!

Who says the same people or in general those who are against war and atrocities don't campaign or are not concerned about the war between the Turkish State and Kurdish rebels/people or a very recent one the war in Nagorno-Karabakh.

It's a strawman argument the one you just made.

So you say that half million people and many more who don't go to demonstrations are anti-semitic? Any evidence for this?

Funny because I can’t remember a large demonstration in London in support of the Kurds or Rohingya or even the Yemenis. Strange don’t you think?

I am not from London.
But there should have been some sort of demonstrations about other conflicts. There were massive demonstrations everywhere before the war in Iraq started as far as I remember. (for example). I don't know what point you're trying to make.

I’m pointing out to you that all these pro Palestine demonstrators marching in London (about 30 in Manchester) don’t give a monkeys about other Muslims being ethnically cleansed by turkey, Myanmar or Saudi Arabia, just Israel! Now why’s that as I said before they are either anti semites or national socialists. Either way they are Hippocrates.