Ocean Gate Titan submersible has no tactical beacon?

They’re all on a tropical island hiding from the sh!tshow that is the world as we know it.

a reply to: KSDakar01



To critical Stinker.

Maybe for wifi signals water is no good but sonar pings should work just fine.

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: randomuser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

originally posted by: Kocag
Yes it's tragic to read about people going missing like this. I wonder if did they possibly fake their deaths and disappear for some reason? Or, is this possibly a distraction from something we're missing all together?

I'm starting to wonder that myself mate .

No beacon ? No GPS of any kind to locate the vessel ? I find that highly highly HIGHLY unusual and suspect and am I understanding correctly here the vessel is remote controlled ? So no pilot is on board ?

How stupid are these people ? Who in there right mind would even get on this Sub ? I guess bored Rich people.

Supposedly there is an adventurer's club and maybe these people are genuinely adventurers.

Well, my granddad would always say, 'until something goes wrong it's not an adventure.'

I consider these types of adventures extreme...

“Climbing and soloing aren’t worth dying for, but they are worth risking dying for.” — Todd Skinner

I wholeheartedly agree. It also shows a high disregard for the sanctity of life that God has given them. A person who values their life would not needlessly put it in harms way like this. It shows a lack of respect for God's gift of life to us.

I would not go that far, but I don't understand the need for extreme sports or adventures. Maybe they put their lives in God's hands through prayer before taking the risks...God's will be done?

It doesn't take much common sense to understand that he does not will for someone to needlessly put their life at risk. 🤷‍♀️

Nobody knows God's will. Every time I get into my car I am taking a risk with my life.

Yeah, that makes sense, good comparison. An everyday thing you do with a relatively low risk, compared to all of the safety cuts made in an unnecessarily risky submersible with a high chance of death where you have to sign wavers acknowledging the extremes, and now basically have a 100% chance of loss of life.

People around you probably look to you for your common sense advice all the time.

Have you driven on the highways lately? Other risks from other vehicles in disrepair and drunk drivers, it's not 100% safe out there.

Like I said. People must flock to you because of your common sense analogies.

Getting in a car isn't much different than locking yourself into a submersible that wasn't tested to go 3,800 meters deep (it actually has parts that have only been qualified to go 1,300 meters deep.) Basically cut off from the rest of the world, with an extremely high chance of death. I mean everyone should be making these common sense comparisons. It was just like getting in your car and driving down the highway.

I have no doubt that is about as much common sense as the owner of that submersible had as well.

How could that submersible not be tested to go that deep? You don't make any sense.

During the filing, OceanGate mentioned that the Titan had already completed over 50 test dives, including dives to the depth equivalent to that of the Titanic. These test dives took place in deep waters near the Bahamas and in a pressure chamber.

Read more at:
economictimes.indiatimes.com... uring-a-dive-to-titanic-shipwreck/articleshow/101155511.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

Oh, I missed this. He did actually use the exact same common sense logic you did:

“You know, at some point, safety just is pure waste,” Rush said. “I mean, if you just want to be safe, don’t get out of bed. Don’t get in your car. Don’t do anything. At some point, you’re going to take some risk, and it really is a risk/reward question. I think I can do this just as safely by breaking the rules.”

Peas of a pod.

Source is same as link in previous post to the Law & Crime website.

You also conveniently missed this:

During the filing, OceanGate mentioned that the Titan had already completed over 50 test dives, including dives to the depth equivalent to that of the Titanic. These test dives took place in deep waters near the Bahamas and in a pressure chamber.

Just saying.

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

Could probably make this its own thread but will post this here. Sadly it looks like Titan is confirmed imploded. (It's name is Titan and it is a submersible, the title in the YouTube video is wrong, it is not a submarine, and is not called the Titanic.)

From Nick Sortor's Twitter:

COAST GUARD UPDATE: The Titan sub’s tailcone was discovered 1,600 feet from the Titanic on the sea floor.

Debris found is consistent with the “catastrophic loss of the pressure chamber.”

Upon making that discovery, the Coast Guard immediately notified family members their loved ones had been lost.

USGC believes the sub “exploded from the inside”

Current evidence suggests that the sub suffered a “catastrophic implosion” soon after communication was lost on Sunday.

USCG does NOT believe the sub impacted the Titanic, as the sub debris field was 1,600ft away.

Video from Twitter

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: LordAhriman

originally posted by: putnam6
I always wonder about people basically cheering people they don't know dying. Regardless of the size of thier bank accounts

Sorry, how could I allow myself to sink so low?

Ha, who am I to judge right?

I do recall way back when your sister was desperately sick with COVID. How is she doing?

I don't expect others to be the same way, just the way I was brought up.

Look I can feel the Pressure building in here lets tone it down.

Honestly, the replies here are suffocatingly like TikTok, Reddit, and Twitter

Im not outraged or mourning myself LOL not calling for a prayer vigil or a colored ribbon or holding my breath expecting better from ATS, but Im not in middle school anymore either. Been reading the same chit elsewhere

Yes it's Tragic what happened and I hope the company that sent these people down there in a Carbon Fiber Sub get the # sued out of them .

That being said . Welcome to the real world of Consequences . Play stupid games get stupid prizes .

It's no different than some Moron going camping alone and unarmed in the middle of a National Park and getting eaten by a Grizzly Bear .

Everyone is all of the sudden experts on Deep Water Subs and what should have been done differently . Give me a Break , Everyone is an Expert in Hindsight . Hindsight is 20/20 .

Cave Diving is a death trap and yet people do it , Mountain Climbing is a death trap and yet people do it , Doing anything in the deep unexplored ocean is a death trap .

Having a sense of humor is not a bad thing and I don't like being judged or punished for it.

a reply to: quintessentone

in house testing for experimental craft is no substitute for standards set by governments or certifying safety organizations.
people have been known to lie about their sh@@, testing proves they didn't.

Rush refused to have the vessel certified by a independent safety organization, and wasn't fond of safety standards set by them. said it was stifling innovation, and basically said U.S. regulations are needless.

Second, tourist subs, which could once be skippered by anyone with a U.S. Coast Guard captain’s license, were regulated by the Passenger Vessel Safety Act of 1993, which imposed rigorous new manufacturing and inspection requirements and prohibited dives below 150 feet. The law was well-meaning, Rush says, but he believes it needlessly prioritized passenger safety over commercial innovation (a position a less adventurous submariner might find open to debate). “There hasn’t been an injury in the commercial sub industry in over 35 years. It’s obscenely safe, because they have all these regulations. But it also hasn’t innovated or grown—because they have all these regulations.” The U.S. government, meanwhile, has continued to favor space exploration over ocean research: NASA today gets about $10.5 billion annually for exploration, while NOAA’s Office of Ocean Exploration and Research is allotted less than $50 million—a triumph of “emotion over logic,” Rush says. “Half of the United States is underwater, and we haven’t even mapped it!”
A Deep Dive Into the Plans to Take Tourists to the ‘Titanic’

from the wiki, notice that people that got in that death trap had to sign a wavier acknowledging it was a experimental craft and was not certified.

Safety
Because the Titan operated in international waters, it was not subject to any safety regulations and was not certified as seaworthy by any regulatory agency or third-party organization.[38] Reporter David Pogue, who completed the expedition in 2022 as part of a CBS News Sunday Morning feature,[39] stated that all passengers who enter the Titan sign a waiver confirming their knowledge that it is an "experimental" vessel "that has not been approved or certified by any regulatory body, and could result in physical injury, disability, emotional trauma or death."[40] Television producer Mike Reiss, who has also completed the expedition, noted that the waiver "mention[s] death three times on page one."[41]

sounds like the man thought he and his engineers knew better than everybody else and 4 other people paid for that arrogance with their lives.


just saying


ETA: did you catch the part where he acknowledge It’s obscenely safe, because they have all these regulations. a wise man would have heeded that.

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: asabuvsobelow

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: LordAhriman

originally posted by: putnam6
I always wonder about people basically cheering people they don't know dying. Regardless of the size of thier bank accounts

Sorry, how could I allow myself to sink so low?

Ha, who am I to judge right?

I do recall way back when your sister was desperately sick with COVID. How is she doing?

I don't expect others to be the same way, just the way I was brought up.

Look I can feel the Pressure building in here lets tone it down.

Honestly, the replies here are suffocatingly like TikTok, Reddit, and Twitter

Im not outraged or mourning myself LOL not calling for a prayer vigil or a colored ribbon or holding my breath expecting better from ATS, but Im not in middle school anymore either. Been reading the same chit elsewhere

Yes it's Tragic what happened and I hope the company that sent these people down there in a Carbon Fiber Sub get the # sued out of them .

That being said . Welcome to the real world of Consequences . Play stupid games get stupid prizes .

It's no different than some Moron going camping alone and unarmed in the middle of a National Park and getting eaten by a Grizzly Bear .

Everyone is all of the sudden experts on Deep Water Subs and what should have been done differently . Give me a Break , Everyone is an Expert in Hindsight . Hindsight is 20/20 .

Cave Diving is a death trap and yet people do it , Mountain Climbing is a death trap and yet people do it , Doing anything in the deep unexplored ocean is a death trap .

Having a sense of humor is not a bad thing and I don't like being judged or punished for it.

My sentiments exactly and there are no experts here, even though some think they are.

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

It looks like it was the "low quality brittle carbon fiber hull."

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

Random tangent thought:


This highly publicized, tragic, incident, featuring a group of daring, wealthy people dying in the pursuit of dangerous adventure (and discovery) on a privately funded "voyage to the bottom of the sea" could easily be the harbinger of regulations that would prohibit such ventures in the future.

Or, at least "sour" the allure of same...to the extent that they become "redheaded stepchildren".


Remember what the "explosion" of the Hindenberg did to lighter than air travel. Those effects are with us even today.


So who cares if the 1% don't get to play Aquaman anymore?



Well... not too long ago the private space industry got going in earnest. Many, especially on these boards, foresaw an opportunity to do some real, uninhibited, research into the UFO phenomenon by having "civilian" observers in, or near orbit on a regular basis.


And before you could barely say "Little Green Men", the government starts taking "UAP's" seriously!


Some believe that those "visitors" are not from the distant stars, but from our own deep seas...


But perhaps TPTB have learned their lesson, and now craft like the "Titan" will be legislated out of existence, and we'll never know....


Any more than "the Authorities" are willing to tell us, if, and when they decide to tell us.

Since Titan operated in international waters it may be that they can't be regulated by any government even with tragic events such as this.

As we can see from these exchanges, the engineering and regulation of deep-sea submersibles remains somewhat uncharted territory. And since the Titan operates in international waters, it is technically free from governance by any single nation’s regulations.

Although various classification societies propose a set of rules for commercial submarines and submersibles, opting to follow these rules remains a voluntary process (which the asset’s insurer usually pushes for).

It’s time to acknowledge that going deep is as complex, if not more complex, than going into space – and that ensuring the safety of submersibles ought to be more than a matter of choice.

www.scientificamerican.com...#:~:text=And%20since%20the%20Titan%20operates,socie ty%20certify%20the%20vessel's%20design.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

First of all, no I wasn't discussing the lawsuit issue you were discussing it with somebody else. Secondly, the lawsuit is for wrongful termination based on safety questions, of the former employee. Respectfully there is a private submersible association to rate or vet the safety of such a vessel. Thus the signed waivers are likely similar to waivers from Everest hikers. It's an inherently dangerous trip, any idiot should have known the risks and the amount of testing done as well as the type of construction.

I'll have to double check but could have sworn Ive seen an article about the use of carbon fiber in the aerospace industry IIRC in some planes they don't use carbon fiber in high-stress areas because even though it's lightweight and strong it degrades faster than metals traditionally used in those high stressed areas. In other words, perhaps the viewing portal though not rated for those depths was likely the only the that was rated at all for what it was being used for.



www.sciencedirect.com...

Abstract
Carbon fibres and their composites are well known for their excellent tensile properties and light weight characteristics which, amongst other advantages continues to drive demand from new structural applications across a wide range of weight sensitive industries. However, since their inception, their inferior performance under compression loading has remained a major impediment to even wider usage. In this review, a systematic discussion highlights the reasons for this deficiency from a microstructural and macroscale perspective and provides suggestions on how to improve the compressive properties for both carbon fibre and carbon fibre composites. In this work, structure-property, property-property and defect-property correlations from fibre to composite are developed from an analysis of the literature and other available technical information. This review covers the most important issues that require addressing by carbon fibre and composite manufacturers if new applications are to emerge in industries where not only tensile strength or stiffness to weight matters, but so too does compression.

How many times has the Titan gone to the Titanic?
The Titan has made the voyage to the Titanic three times, once a year since 2021.

The trip, which costs around $250,000 (£195,000), is intended as an annual event which allows tourists to see the shipwreck up close.

OceanGate has stated that the Titan completed over 50 test dives, including to depths similar to those of the Titanic, both in waters around the Bahamas as well as in a pressure chamber.

However, previous trips in the Titan have also encountered issues, which have raised concerns about the safety of the vessel.

Reporter David Pogue was onboard the vessel in 2022 when communication was lost with the main ship for two and a half hours.

He later challenged Mr Rush in an interview, saying: ‘It seems like this submersible has some elements of MacGyver jerry-riggedness’.

Titan is driven by a reinforced Logitech game controller and touch screens. The Logitech F710 wireless gamepad was first released in 2011 and costs around £42 on Amazon.

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

First of all, no I wasn't discussing the lawsuit issue you were discussing it with somebody else. Secondly, the lawsuit is for wrongful termination based on safety questions, of the former employee. Respectfully there is no private submersible association to rate or vet the safety of such a vessel. Thus the signed waivers are likely similar to waivers from Everest hikers. It's an inherently dangerous trip, any idiot should have known the risks and the amount of testing done as well as the type of construction.

I'll have to double check but could have sworn Ive seen an article about the use of carbon fiber in the aerospace industry IIRC in some planes they don't use carbon fiber in high-stress areas because even though it's lightweight and strong it degrades faster than metals traditionally used in those high stressed areas. In other words, perhaps the viewing portal though not rated for those depths was likely the only the that was rated at all for what it was being used for.



www.sciencedirect.com...

Abstract
Carbon fibres and their composites are well known for their excellent tensile properties and light weight characteristics which, amongst other advantages continues to drive demand from new structural applications across a wide range of weight sensitive industries. However, since their inception, their inferior performance under compression loading has remained a major impediment to even wider usage. In this review, a systematic discussion highlights the reasons for this deficiency from a microstructural and macroscale perspective and provides suggestions on how to improve the compressive properties for both carbon fibre and carbon fibre composites. In this work, structure-property, property-property and defect-property correlations from fibre to composite are developed from an analysis of the literature and other available technical information. This review covers the most important issues that require addressing by carbon fibre and composite manufacturers if new applications are to emerge in industries where not only tensile strength or stiffness to weight matters, but so too does compression.

How many times has the Titan gone to the Titanic?
The Titan has made the voyage to the Titanic three times, once a year since 2021.

The trip, which costs around $250,000 (£195,000), is intended as an annual event which allows tourists to see the shipwreck up close.

OceanGate has stated that the Titan completed over 50 test dives, including to depths similar to those of the Titanic, both in waters around the Bahamas as well as in a pressure chamber.

However, previous trips in the Titan have also encountered issues, which have raised concerns about the safety of the vessel.

Reporter David Pogue was onboard the vessel in 2022 when communication was lost with the main ship for two and a half hours.

He later challenged Mr Rush in an interview, saying: ‘It seems like this submersible has some elements of MacGyver jerry-riggedness’.

Titan is driven by a reinforced Logitech game controller and touch screens. The Logitech F710 wireless gamepad was first released in 2011 and costs around £42 on Amazon.

That post was not meant for you but thanks for the information and a reasonable reply.

Is there a need for the navy to have equipment that goes this deep?

Yes. Though the US has not lost a Submarine since 1963.
On the other hand Russia, China and Indonesia have all lost subs in the past 10 years.
Submarines are the one place where everything has to go right all the time and go wrong only once.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

First of all, no I wasn't discussing the lawsuit issue you were discussing it with somebody else. Secondly, the lawsuit is for wrongful termination based on safety questions, of the former employee. Respectfully there is no private submersible association to rate or vet the safety of such a vessel. Thus the signed waivers are likely similar to waivers from Everest hikers. It's an inherently dangerous trip, any idiot should have known the risks and the amount of testing done as well as the type of construction.

I'll have to double check but could have sworn Ive seen an article about the use of carbon fiber in the aerospace industry IIRC in some planes they don't use carbon fiber in high-stress areas because even though it's lightweight and strong it degrades faster than metals traditionally used in those high stressed areas. In other words, perhaps the viewing portal though not rated for those depths was likely the only the that was rated at all for what it was being used for.



www.sciencedirect.com...

Abstract
Carbon fibres and their composites are well known for their excellent tensile properties and light weight characteristics which, amongst other advantages continues to drive demand from new structural applications across a wide range of weight sensitive industries. However, since their inception, their inferior performance under compression loading has remained a major impediment to even wider usage. In this review, a systematic discussion highlights the reasons for this deficiency from a microstructural and macroscale perspective and provides suggestions on how to improve the compressive properties for both carbon fibre and carbon fibre composites. In this work, structure-property, property-property and defect-property correlations from fibre to composite are developed from an analysis of the literature and other available technical information. This review covers the most important issues that require addressing by carbon fibre and composite manufacturers if new applications are to emerge in industries where not only tensile strength or stiffness to weight matters, but so too does compression.

How many times has the Titan gone to the Titanic?
The Titan has made the voyage to the Titanic three times, once a year since 2021.

The trip, which costs around $250,000 (£195,000), is intended as an annual event which allows tourists to see the shipwreck up close.

OceanGate has stated that the Titan completed over 50 test dives, including to depths similar to those of the Titanic, both in waters around the Bahamas as well as in a pressure chamber.

However, previous trips in the Titan have also encountered issues, which have raised concerns about the safety of the vessel.

Reporter David Pogue was onboard the vessel in 2022 when communication was lost with the main ship for two and a half hours.

He later challenged Mr Rush in an interview, saying: ‘It seems like this submersible has some elements of MacGyver jerry-riggedness’.

Titan is driven by a reinforced Logitech game controller and touch screens. The Logitech F710 wireless gamepad was first released in 2011 and costs around £42 on Amazon.

That post was not meant for you but thanks for the information and a reasonable reply.

No worries Im enjoying the discussion, the more I read the more red flags I see, but there is a difference in making a vessel and risking your own ass, vs making a vessel and touting its abilities and getting people to sign up for a ride. Like evidently the Portuguese businessman's son was reluctant to go, but he didn't want to upset his father.

More so it had to dive on the Titanic because it was the only site popular enough to attract enough of the wealthy to pay for the ride. FWIW the business end was barely making money, not a good look on something that is literally life and death.



[url]https://www.vice.com/en/article/qjvjdb/it-is-a-huge-vast-opportunity-how-oceangate-went-from-disruptive-startup-to-catastrophic-deepsea-failure[/ url]

Titan began construction in earnest in 2017 and was launched in 2018. NASA records show the agency began working with OceanGate on "automated fiber placement development" via a Space Act Agreement in 2020, which the company announced at the time. Motherboard could find no Space Act Agreement records indicating collaboration with OceanGate between 2016 and 2020. NASA did not respond to a request for comment.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull. Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

Whatever the involvement of outside experts,it doesn’t seem that the Titan’s experimental hull ever was, or even could be, properly tested for safety. David Lochridge, OceanGates’s former director of marine operations, claimed in court filings that he was wrongly fired after raising concerns about the testing of the hull—among them, specifically, was that certain testing wasn’t done at all.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull,” according to the filing. “Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

First of all, no I wasn't discussing the lawsuit issue you were discussing it with somebody else. Secondly, the lawsuit is for wrongful termination based on safety questions, of the former employee. Respectfully there is no private submersible association to rate or vet the safety of such a vessel. Thus the signed waivers are likely similar to waivers from Everest hikers. It's an inherently dangerous trip, any idiot should have known the risks and the amount of testing done as well as the type of construction.

I'll have to double check but could have sworn Ive seen an article about the use of carbon fiber in the aerospace industry IIRC in some planes they don't use carbon fiber in high-stress areas because even though it's lightweight and strong it degrades faster than metals traditionally used in those high stressed areas. In other words, perhaps the viewing portal though not rated for those depths was likely the only the that was rated at all for what it was being used for.



www.sciencedirect.com...

Abstract
Carbon fibres and their composites are well known for their excellent tensile properties and light weight characteristics which, amongst other advantages continues to drive demand from new structural applications across a wide range of weight sensitive industries. However, since their inception, their inferior performance under compression loading has remained a major impediment to even wider usage. In this review, a systematic discussion highlights the reasons for this deficiency from a microstructural and macroscale perspective and provides suggestions on how to improve the compressive properties for both carbon fibre and carbon fibre composites. In this work, structure-property, property-property and defect-property correlations from fibre to composite are developed from an analysis of the literature and other available technical information. This review covers the most important issues that require addressing by carbon fibre and composite manufacturers if new applications are to emerge in industries where not only tensile strength or stiffness to weight matters, but so too does compression.

How many times has the Titan gone to the Titanic?
The Titan has made the voyage to the Titanic three times, once a year since 2021.

The trip, which costs around $250,000 (£195,000), is intended as an annual event which allows tourists to see the shipwreck up close.

OceanGate has stated that the Titan completed over 50 test dives, including to depths similar to those of the Titanic, both in waters around the Bahamas as well as in a pressure chamber.

However, previous trips in the Titan have also encountered issues, which have raised concerns about the safety of the vessel.

Reporter David Pogue was onboard the vessel in 2022 when communication was lost with the main ship for two and a half hours.

He later challenged Mr Rush in an interview, saying: ‘It seems like this submersible has some elements of MacGyver jerry-riggedness’.

Titan is driven by a reinforced Logitech game controller and touch screens. The Logitech F710 wireless gamepad was first released in 2011 and costs around £42 on Amazon.

That post was not meant for you but thanks for the information and a reasonable reply.

No worries Im enjoying the discussion, the more I read the more red flags I see, but there is a difference in making a vessel and risking your own ass, vs making a vessel and touting its abilities and getting people to sign up for a ride. Like evidently the Portuguese businessman's son was reluctant to go, but he didn't want to upset his father.

More so it had to dive on the Titanic because it was the only site popular enough to attract enough of the wealthy to pay for the ride. FWIW the business end was barely making money, not a good look on something that is literally life and death.



[url]https://www.vice.com/en/article/qjvjdb/it-is-a-huge-vast-opportunity-how-oceangate-went-from-disruptive-startup-to-catastrophic-deepsea-failure[/ url]

Titan began construction in earnest in 2017 and was launched in 2018. NASA records show the agency began working with OceanGate on "automated fiber placement development" via a Space Act Agreement in 2020, which the company announced at the time. Motherboard could find no Space Act Agreement records indicating collaboration with OceanGate between 2016 and 2020. NASA did not respond to a request for comment.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull. Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

Whatever the involvement of outside experts,it doesn’t seem that the Titan’s experimental hull ever was, or even could be, properly tested for safety. David Lochridge, OceanGates’s former director of marine operations, claimed in court filings that he was wrongly fired after raising concerns about the testing of the hull—among them, specifically, was that certain testing wasn’t done at all.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull,” according to the filing. “Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

Yeah, me too no worries. Maybe this does boil down to the unrealistic depth of their engineering abilities and their desire to take risks with new ways of moving this technology forward. All in all, it's a tragic human cost and a technological loss to humanity.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: quintessentone
a reply to: randomuser

Yes, but only if the failure was due to the viewport.

Someone here in this thread pointed out the carbon fiber design may have weakened after the tests at depth and previous uses. Supposedly it has delamination issues at those pressures and depths it wouldn't take much. It had 3 trips and testing at depth according to the article

metro.co.uk...

You were specifically discussing the lawsuit and the viewport issue. Now it's the carbon fiber design. It could be both, at this point it's all speculation. How many times was it in the pressure chamber?

First of all, no I wasn't discussing the lawsuit issue you were discussing it with somebody else. Secondly, the lawsuit is for wrongful termination based on safety questions, of the former employee. Respectfully there is no private submersible association to rate or vet the safety of such a vessel. Thus the signed waivers are likely similar to waivers from Everest hikers. It's an inherently dangerous trip, any idiot should have known the risks and the amount of testing done as well as the type of construction.

I'll have to double check but could have sworn Ive seen an article about the use of carbon fiber in the aerospace industry IIRC in some planes they don't use carbon fiber in high-stress areas because even though it's lightweight and strong it degrades faster than metals traditionally used in those high stressed areas. In other words, perhaps the viewing portal though not rated for those depths was likely the only the that was rated at all for what it was being used for.



www.sciencedirect.com...

Abstract
Carbon fibres and their composites are well known for their excellent tensile properties and light weight characteristics which, amongst other advantages continues to drive demand from new structural applications across a wide range of weight sensitive industries. However, since their inception, their inferior performance under compression loading has remained a major impediment to even wider usage. In this review, a systematic discussion highlights the reasons for this deficiency from a microstructural and macroscale perspective and provides suggestions on how to improve the compressive properties for both carbon fibre and carbon fibre composites. In this work, structure-property, property-property and defect-property correlations from fibre to composite are developed from an analysis of the literature and other available technical information. This review covers the most important issues that require addressing by carbon fibre and composite manufacturers if new applications are to emerge in industries where not only tensile strength or stiffness to weight matters, but so too does compression.

How many times has the Titan gone to the Titanic?
The Titan has made the voyage to the Titanic three times, once a year since 2021.

The trip, which costs around $250,000 (£195,000), is intended as an annual event which allows tourists to see the shipwreck up close.

OceanGate has stated that the Titan completed over 50 test dives, including to depths similar to those of the Titanic, both in waters around the Bahamas as well as in a pressure chamber.

However, previous trips in the Titan have also encountered issues, which have raised concerns about the safety of the vessel.

Reporter David Pogue was onboard the vessel in 2022 when communication was lost with the main ship for two and a half hours.

He later challenged Mr Rush in an interview, saying: ‘It seems like this submersible has some elements of MacGyver jerry-riggedness’.

Titan is driven by a reinforced Logitech game controller and touch screens. The Logitech F710 wireless gamepad was first released in 2011 and costs around £42 on Amazon.

That post was not meant for you but thanks for the information and a reasonable reply.

No worries Im enjoying the discussion, the more I read the more red flags I see, but there is a difference in making a vessel and risking your own ass, vs making a vessel and touting its abilities and getting people to sign up for a ride. Like evidently the Portuguese businessman's son was reluctant to go, but he didn't want to upset his father.

More so it had to dive on the Titanic because it was the only site popular enough to attract enough of the wealthy to pay for the ride. FWIW the business end was barely making money, not a good look on something that is literally life and death.



[url]https://www.vice.com/en/article/qjvjdb/it-is-a-huge-vast-opportunity-how-oceangate-went-from-disruptive-startup-to-catastrophic-deepsea-failure[/ url]

Titan began construction in earnest in 2017 and was launched in 2018. NASA records show the agency began working with OceanGate on "automated fiber placement development" via a Space Act Agreement in 2020, which the company announced at the time. Motherboard could find no Space Act Agreement records indicating collaboration with OceanGate between 2016 and 2020. NASA did not respond to a request for comment.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull. Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

Whatever the involvement of outside experts,it doesn’t seem that the Titan’s experimental hull ever was, or even could be, properly tested for safety. David Lochridge, OceanGates’s former director of marine operations, claimed in court filings that he was wrongly fired after raising concerns about the testing of the hull—among them, specifically, was that certain testing wasn’t done at all.

"Lochridge was repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull,” according to the filing. “Lochridge was told that no form of equipment existed to perform such a test."

Yeah, me too no worries. Maybe this does boil down to the unrealistic depth of their engineering abilities and their desire to take risks with new ways of moving this technology forward. All in all, it's a tragic human cost and a technological loss to humanity.

Don't get me wrong I hope it doesn't curtail exploration or discovery, but this seems like it was just exploiting the popularity of the site to make money. There are loads of undiscovered areas or less viewed areas in our oceans worthy of exploration, hell, Im fine with remote submersibles till we figure out how to breathe water and survive the pressure of the depths.

Don't get me wrong I hope it doesn't curtail exploration or discovery, but this seems like it was just exploiting the popularity of the site to make money. There are loads of undiscovered areas or less viewed areas in our oceans worthy of exploration, hell, Im fine with remote submersibles till we figure out how to breathe water and survive the pressure of the depths.

Yes, indeed that technology seemed more like extreme adventures to me akin to touring in outer space.