U.S. Supreme Court Rules Mailed-In Ballots Without a Postmark Date Can NOT Be Counted.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: JIMC5499

Nothing I said is incorrect.

This isn't about USPS postmarks.
SCOTUS never ruled that said ballots can't be counted.
There is [now] no precedent set for this issue.
The issue hinges on the Voting Rights Act and its conflict with state law.
This issue isn't resolved and is still in the courts.

1. The earlier decision the SC made in june was again reversed to PRE ELECTION rules in October.

2.Since it was reversed Even IF the SC did not state it exactly it is in effect Them saying to PA they have to follow their law.
3.PA if they follow their law will not accept screwed up ballots/mail in votes.

There I put it in lamens terms for you.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: JIMC5499

Nothing I said is incorrect.

a reply to: Sookiechacha



Everything you said is wrong;. See the recent rulings out of WI from the last few days as to why you are wrong.

a reply to: yuppa

1. The earlier decision the SC made in june was again reversed to PRE ELECTION rules in October.

You mean the 2020 rules? When PA Supreme Court ruled that they had to count the undated ballots in Allegheny County?



the[Pennsylvania] state Supreme Court ruled that mail-in ballots could be counted even if certain information was not filled in on the outer envelope.

Those pre-election rules?

a reply to: Sookiechacha

Well seeing as how the SC of that state was overstepping their power it wasnt really legal. the LEGISLATURE was the only ones able to legally change the law in that state. The PA SC was wrong because it was not their JOB.

IF PA would had went by the laws on the books, the election would had been for trump. Their SC in PA are not legislatures and had no right modifying the election laws.

a reply to: yuppa

I'm not saying that your opinion is wrong.

I'm saying the OP headline is incorrect.

SCOTUS did not order those ballots to be rejected/not counted.
This isn't about USPS post marks, it's about handwritten dates on return envelopes.

IF PA would had went by the laws on the books, the election would had been for trump. Their SC in PA are not legislatures and had no right modifying the election laws.

Perhaps, but they're saying that the state law violates the Voting Rights Act. That is the issue that the courts have to deal with. It's my opinion that SCOTUS will, ultimately, strike down the relevant section of the Voting Rights Act.

a reply to: Sookiechacha

well yeah the US SC didnt order the ballots rejected,but the Law in PA if followed does. thats All we are saying when it comes down to it. Thats what the OP prolly meant in all fairness.
All we can do is wait and see.

Nearly 250K Ballots Sent to Pa. Voters With Unverified IDs

Nearly 250,000 ballots, state data show, were mailed to Pennsylvania voters without their identities being verified, according to the election integrity organization Verity Vote.

Citing the information provided by Verity Vote, 15 Pennsylvania state House representatives sent a letter to acting Secretary of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania Leigh Chapman on Tuesday.

Citing testimony from Deputy Secretary for Elections and Commissions Jonathan Marks, the legislators pointed out that ballots are being "mailed to unverified applicants."

"But less than two weeks" after Marks' testimony, the legislators continued, "the Department of State sent out guidance informing the counties that the verification is done prior to the mailing of ballots."

"Either the ballots are mailed to unverified applicants or ballots are not mailed to unverified applicants but both statements cannot be true," the state representatives wrote. "Due to this conflicting information, conscientious election workers could unknowingly accept and count ballots for which no verification has ever occurred."

According to Just the News, Marks was asked by state Rep. Francis Ryan about "the large number of requests submitted to the Social Security Administration Help America Vote Verification (HAVV) system."

The deputy secretary for Elections and Commissions responded, explaining that the HAVV systems were being used to verify Social Security numbers for mail-in ballot applications.

However, Marks added, if someone submits an invalid Pennsylvania ID or if the last four digits of their Social Security number cannot be verified for a mail-in ballot application, then the counties must still send the ballot to the voter without verifying their identity. But, he added, "the ballot doesn't count unless the voter provides a valid form of ID."

a reply to: Xcathdra

Interesting since Identification isn't required to vote in Pennsylvania. That's why Identification IS required to get a mail in ballot. Mail in ballots used to be an accommodation. You have the right to vote, you don't have the right to a mail in ballot. Anybody want to bet on how this will turn out?

PA Supreme Court just announced Ballots with no dates will NOT be counted.


'Massive' Win: PA Supreme Court Rules Undated Mail Ballots Can't Be Counted

The Pennsylvania Supreme Court on Tuesday sided with an argument made by Republicans in their lawsuit seeking to prevent the counting of improperly completed ballots in next week's general election, throwing out a lower court's ruling that would have allowed PA election officials to count absentee and mail-in ballots that were not correctly dated and signed.

PA's Supreme Court justices vacated the 3rd US Circuit Court of Appeals' decision that would have allowed the counting of ballots that were not completed as the Keystone State election laws require, and ruled that the "Pennsylvania county boards of elections are hereby ordered to refrain from counting any absentee and mail-in ballots received for the November 8, 2022 general election that are contained in undated or incorrectly dated outer envelopes."

The PA Supreme Court also in its ruling directed "the Pennsylvania county boards of elections segregate and preserve any ballots contained in undated or incorrectly dated outer envelopes" and noted that the "Court is evenly divided on the issue of whether failing to count such ballots violates 52 U.S.C. §10101(a)(2)(B)."

RNC Chairwoman Ronna McDaniel celebrated the win in Pennsylvania as "massive" for "election integrity."

click link for article...


Now they want to preserve any ballots that do not have a date... For the millionth time it does NOT violate the VRA. A person who doesnt follow the rules is allowed to vote. Not following the rules invalidates their vote.

a reply to: Xcathdra

PA Supreme Court Rules Undated Mail Ballots Can't Be Counted

Oh look! LOL


How can it be that the PA Supreme Court ruled on something that you and OP insist that was already resolved and ruled on by The Supreme Court of the United States1?

I mean, the title of this thread is...U.S. Supreme Court Rules Mailed-In Ballots Without a Postmark Date Can NOT Be Counted.

And, you yourself have told me. over and over that SCOTUS ruled that the PA undated ballots CANNOT BE COUNTED
Like here:

That is the order from Scotus that mail in ballots missing information can not be counted.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

So how can it be that the PA Supreme Court would rule on something SCOTUS already ruled on?
I guess the only logical answer is the US Supreme Court NEVER DID rule that PA Couldn't count undated ballots after all.

You were wrong about the VRA not being an issue for the 3rd Circuit Court, and you were wrong about SCOTUS have ruled that PA could NOT count undated ballots.

I told ya so....

a reply to: Sookiechacha

You, like I and others said, are wrong. The PA Supreme Court got involved because the acting Sec State issued guidelines that violated PA election law. She tried claiming the ruling had no affect on PA. A position you also took. Not only did the US Supreme Court say you guys are wrong, now the PA Supreme Court says your wrong. The VRA was not violated.

and yet here you are, still trying to claim a victory from your defeat.

Exactly what color is the sky in your world?

and you are still wrong.

a reply to: Sookiechacha

BOTTOM LINE: Ballots without Postmarks Cannot be Counted. Hopefully this SANE LOGIC extends beyond Pennsylvania!

a reply to: Sookiechacha

How can something be vote suppression when somebody actually cast a ballot? 😎

a reply to: Xcathdra

and yet here you are, still trying to claim a victory .....

You Betcha! LOL

I was right:
SCOTUS NEVER ruled that said ballots couldn't be counted.
The entire case is based on whether or not state law violates federal law, The Voting Rights Act.

The PA Supreme Court got involved because the acting Sec State issued guidelines that violated PA election law.

The PA Supreme Court got involved because the issue wasn't resolved by SCOTUS.

She tried claiming the ruling had no affect on PA. A position you also took

NOPE! It didn't, but that's not a position I ever took. The position I took was that the SCOTUS ruling made sure that there was no no precedent set, at all. You insisted that SCOTUS set the precedent when they ordered PA not to count said ballot. WRONG! NEVER HAPPENED!

The PA Secretary of State claimed that not counting said ballots violates federal law, the Voting Rights Act, a position that I do agree with.

OH LOOK! ...Here's the PA Supreme Court undecided on whether or not state law violated federal law.

The Court is evenly divided on the issue of whether failing to count such ballots violates 52 U.S.C. §10101(a)(2)(B)

That's the Voting Rights Act, by the way...
www.pacourts.us...

So, it still isn't resolved. The PA Supreme Court didn't issue a ruling on the matter, they issued an injunction. The case with go back to SCOTUS for a proper ruling, one way or the other, like I said all along.

a reply to: carewemust

BOTTOM LINE: Ballots without Postmarks Cannot be Counted.

NOPE!
Postmarks have nothing to do with this issue, and postmarks weren't mentioned at all in the PA Supreme Court decision.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: carewemust

BOTTOM LINE: Ballots without Postmarks Cannot be Counted.

NOPE!
Postmarks have nothing to do with this issue, and postmarks weren't mentioned at all in the PA Supreme Court decision.

Maybe Democrat leaders and officials don't think Democrat voters are very competent, which is why they're always trying to make things juvenile-simple for them.

The Envelope dating, for example: www.reuters.com...

originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: Sookiechacha

How can something be vote suppression when somebody actually cast a ballot? 😎

It's not.. If she actually read the scotus review of the 3rd circuits ruling (posted a few pages back) that was specifically addressed. The law in question does not address the issue, instead deferring to the state law. A person gets to vote. However if they dont follow the guidelines set by the state, the vote is invalid. Just as a person who goes to the wrong precinct and votes. That person vote will also NOT count.

PA election law is clear for mail in ballots. The ballot must be filled out completely / correctly. The envelope must be filled out completely / correctly. If not, per PA election law, the vote will not count. That info is spelled out of the Sec States website (for PA) for mail in ballots. It is also included in the direction with the Ballot and envelopes.

It is up to the states to set the rules for legal ballots.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
You Betcha! LOL

I was right:
SCOTUS NEVER ruled that said ballots couldn't be counted.
The entire case is based on whether or not state law violates federal law, The Voting Rights Act.

You are wrong and you really need to learn how our judicial systems works / operates. Scotus, in a 7-2 vote on Oct 11th 2022, dismissed / mooted / what ever term you want to use since it doesn't matter, the 3rd circuits ruling. When that occurred it also threw out ALL of the courts that "touched" the case rulings (The Federal 3rd circuit, the PA Supreme Court, the PA Appeals Court as well as the PA "trial" court.

That REVERTED PA ELECTION LAW back to its stated intent - Ballots / envelopes must be completed correctly or the vote can NOT be counted.

Again PA state law does NOT violate Federal Law, as has been explained to you many many many times. The issue you have is you have no concept of how our judicial system works, which is only embarrassing for you.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
The PA Supreme Court got involved because the issue wasn't resolved by SCOTUS.

Actually it was. PA Supreme Court was asked to essentially clarify the action of Scotus because the PA Sec State gave orders to break PA state law / the Scotus ruling. She tried using the excuse that the Scotus ruling has no impact on the State judicial system, as you are trying to arguide. The PA Supreme Court said that Since the 3rd circuit ruling was dismissed by Scotus, the ruling they made was also not valid.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
useless crap !

YUP, you are wrong also.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
The PA Secretary of State claimed that not counting said ballots violates federal law, the Voting Rights Act, a position that I do agree with.

and you are wrong, It does NOT violate the VRA.

Also the WI Supreme Court just went through the exact same issue. WI election law requires Ballot / Envelopes to be filled out completely / correctly or the vote cannot be counted. The VRA had nothing to do with their ruling because it does not apply.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
OH LOOK! ...Here's the PA Supreme Court undecided on whether or not state law violated federal law.

The Court is evenly divided on the issue of whether failing to count such ballots violates 52 U.S.C. §10101(a)(2)(B)

That's the Voting Rights Act, by the way...
www.pacourts.us...

So, it still isn't resolved. The PA Supreme Court didn't issue a ruling on the matter, they issued an injunction. The case with go back to SCOTUS for a proper ruling, one way or the other, like I said all along.

It is resolved and the Sec State / voters MUST comply with PA election law or the vote does not count.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: carewemust

BOTTOM LINE: Ballots without Postmarks Cannot be Counted.

NOPE!
Postmarks have nothing to do with this issue, and postmarks weren't mentioned at all in the PA Supreme Court decision.

PA election law says postmarks are NOT allowed and cannot be accepted.

Part of the reason is because of Mail in Ballots and the use of drop boxes. Ballots that go to an election office location they are dated / time stamped (thats part of the reasoning PA courts ruled the way the did - whats Material is up to the legislature).. Ballots dropped in drop boxes are NOT date / time stamped.

KABOOM!!!!

Undated mail-in ballots will not count in 2022, Pa. Supreme Court rules
www.wtae.com...#

The Pennsylvania Supreme Court rules that undated or misdated ballots will NOT be counted for the 2022 election. They will be held aside.

Now I want to know what they are going to do with Allegheny County saying that they sent out ballots without the boxes for a signature or date?