A trap for the intellect

a reply to: Itisnowagain

The space which is always here is where everything appears.

The head is usually full of thoughts and ideas about before and after..... 'what's not happening' appears as stories.
Whereas 'what is happening' is non conceptual..... it's sensational.

An insight for consideration, a practical insight.

I was just conversing with "Alice" the girl in my avatar. She is a real one, and deceased. She is talking differently tonight. A normal conversation as the living do. Usually the worded conversation is a tad onesided. I usually have to work out what is being said. In a way the thought being communicated is begun and not finished.

Tonight Alice said; "we like to elicit a response". - an interesting thing for her to say.

Elicit: verb.
evoke or draw out (a reaction, answer, or fact) from someone.
"I tried to elicit a smile from Joanna"

ARCHAIC
draw forth (something that is latent or potential) into existence.

I know full well, Alice as a deceased human girl, I have known her since she died. So Alice is not an aspect nor play of my own mind. To elicit a response is a common thing for the deceased to do. I have generally found it consistantly so over the years.

"A game we play with the living. Like looking into a fish bowl." - Alice.

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

Psychology says "dreams are regurgetations of the day's events by the subconscious mind", personally I disagree with the idea that that is all dreams are.

Interesting. The subtle body in the dream state, no longer being tied to the physical body, is no longer confined to its physical boundaries. So you have escaped the segmentation of your own consciousness to unify with another persons segmentation. It reminds me of a me of a book I recently read. Omh Sety's Egypt, a story of a woman called Dorothy Eady that told of her life long visitations with Seti 1.

a reply to: glend

Hi glend, yeah, that is how one can describe what happens.

The subtle body in the dream state, no longer being tied to the physical body, is no longer confined to its physical boundaries. So you have escaped the segmentation of your own consciousness to unify with another persons segmentation.

'Unify' is a good word to use. One can 'unify' with others to share an interactive 'world' for a time.

It reminds me of a me of a book I recently read. Omh Sety's Egypt, a story of a woman called Dorothy Eady that told of her life long visitations with Seti 1.

I have not read the book, though there is an old video of Dorothy Eady revisiting the temple in her old age. Looking into the lady's eyes one gets the impression she sees so much more than the other people there.

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

Everything you posted is subjective and generalizing - where's the philosophy?

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

Thanks NobodySpecial268, haven't seen that video. In the book she describes the location of Nefertit's tomb. Very near to Tutankhamen's in a place nobody will think to look for it. I do hope they find it which will confirm Dorothy Eady. I found her life fascinating. Perhaps you too should think about writing a book one day.

a reply to: quintessentone

Everything you posted is subjective and generalizing - where's the philosophy?

"where's the philosophy?" - well to be straight forward; the philosophy is over there.

Can't you see it?

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In five dimensions a philosophy is an object, it is a thing. So too religion, catholicism is a thing, a object in 5D. Human thought creates the philosophy, and therefore a philosophy is a construct of the intellectual mind.

It's deceptively simple really. Learn to look at the world in five dimensions. Lenth X width X height X inside X outside gives five dimensions, a cardboad box. Add wheels and we have a car. Motion becomes the sixth dimension.

All we have to then do, is to step outside the philosophy.

The Art of Relative Positioning is the term I coined as a label for something very easily done. To step outside, first one has to know there is an outside. Then shift one's own relative position from inside to outside.

The intellect doesn't like this sort of thinking. It will play tricks like reminding you that "This is everything!"

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From a few pages ago in this thread, here is the catholic philosophy when seen from outside.



Inside there you will find god and satan both, demons and angels too. All the infrastructure according to the descriptions of that philosophy, including the internal physics.

I am more familiar with the Hermetic one and have even spent time in that one too. I can describe the inside of that place.

Philosophies are constructs when one steps outside them. City-states one can call them, scattered here and there in that place sometimes called; 'what is'.

a reply to: glend

I hadn't heard of her before, and since you mentioned her I did a search and found that video. To see the lady herself, especially her eyes, gives a sense of her. She is interesting enough where I will read her book. That will be the fifth book in probably twenty years.

In the little video above, Omm Sety gives a few interesting insights, for me at least.

* Omm Sety: "This temple is really seven temples in one."
* Other person: "Why do you think they included seven chapels?"
* Omm Sety: "I have often wondered about that, and it may be because this was a place of pilgramage. So people coming from all over Egypt, you see, would find their important local god. Another thing, it may be the idea that the gods themselves were coming to (?) on pilgramage.

(bolding mine) That is important to understand old Egypt, I think so anyway. Though not as the archeologist would do

There was a time when I started to care about the dead. Why do they linger? So I started to work out their problems and they would go on their way. I got caught dealing with them for years. Do one over and over. Then two over and over, then in trios, then in groups over and over endlessly. Generally by solving the way they died, diseases for instance. "they worked me to death for months on end" one might say.

Then I got an Anubis head from the dead folks. An anubis taught me how to hold the heart in the left hand and "weigh a life". Then in the right hand appears a feather. I understand the feather is the balance. One would give the feather to the person and his face would brighten, and be gone. The feather is the knowledge he needs to improve himself in his own particular way. So many of those.

Then one day, a man was pointed out in a crowd in the street. He was a particularly bad person blending with the crowd. He was hiding from the Anubis. Then he saw me and looked frightened, looked around for an escape. That's when, just above him, something opened up. The look on his face at seeing what was there was shear horror. I don't know what his crime was, but his look of horror horrified me.

One learns to do this sort of work in life, prove oneself, and continue in the afterlife. The Aunubis are dour and over worked, and too few in number.

All the gods who pictured with a human body and an animal head have roles to play which they learned in the temples.

So when Omm Sety say the gods pilgramage to her temple, it is the human Anubises in the land of the dead making the pilgramage, the other gods too.

I've seen some really muscly looking Sekhmets who walked on all fours, also the lion headed girls Bastet on occassion. The girls of Isis' temple learned something very special. The (male) historians dismiss Isis as a fertility goddess and (I think) place her below Ra - "pfff" is what I think of that. The girls who became an Isis, knew the mysteries of the womb which is the Creatrix of life itself, and the roads of the unborn at very least. (notice I did not use the masculine Creator? Instead I used the archaic feminine form of one who creates).

Omm Sety goes on to talk about the gods "as was the custom they were brother and sister as well as husband and wife". Then: "That was the custom, a good one, it did away with the mother in law."

Apart from Omm Sety's wry sense of humour showing. There is something hinted I have said more than once here on ATS. If one truely wishes to know, the first thing to do is leave your cultural influences and moral judgements at the door.

Oh and I write here on ATS, it does away with Editors . . . ; )

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a reply to: NobodySpecial268

I noticed the technique that shifts one into the now, (where one closes the eyes) gave me the sense that the future and past does not exist. Only what is happening now.

You can't shift into the now......you are now.
Now is what's happening ....now appears as colour, sound, sensation and thoughts as well.

You might believe that you are something....but really you are the space that allows the appearance to appear.
Like a tv screen.......the movie moves on.

Peace is apparent when it is realised that you are not what thought says you are.

You are not a thing that moves in time.

You are not a thought.....you don't do thought and you are not in thought.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

You can't shift into the now......you are now.
Now is what's happening ....now appears as colour, sound, sensation and thoughts as well.

I don't disagree with you Itisnowagain, I just followed the simple exercise and "yes it is". But then again I have mundane work to do and switch off. A habit of mine, like the philosophies as objects, I can step out of them and see them for what they are. And then again, I can choose to step inside one too. The world changes about me, and for a while I am there.

Incidentally, the presenter used Sanskrit words as technical terms. What I really like about the exercise is anybody can do that and experience 'now without past nor future' for themselves. One does not need to live like a Yogi, nor visit Ashrams. The exercise works just the same.

You might believe that you are something....but really you are the space that allows the appearance to appear.
Like a tv screen.......the movie moves on.

One of the things that were familiar in doing the exercises was; the experience is much like my own home grown way. So a common ground for us to talk about these experiences.

Have you thought about the "TV screen" metaphore you used there? In practice with what one sees as "the movie moves on"?

One can use that to (re)live in memories and live them again. That can be used in healing others for instance. One can also live the memories of others, including non-humans, and learn to think like them. An important thing to learn if one wants to work with non-humans.

That is just me, and if someone finds the Ashram, or old Egypt for that matter, is the most home-like of places and is happy there, why shouldn't they stay.

I liken the "TV screen" to "the interface to out there". The interface to the deceased too. I write about the Beings I meet there here on ATS.

You are not a thing that moves in time.
You are not a thought.....you don't do thought and you are not in thought.

Ya know Itisnowagain, I have not yet found a practical reason to obtain a state of mind such as that. Perhaps the "not a thing that moves in time" may be useful. It depends upon what I have to do should such a situation arise.




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In practical terms, it maybe said that reality does not exist. I guess that is the view from the higher plains of existance. The Theosophical masters come to mind.

Yet here in this "physical" world there are practicalities I must deal with. Getting hit by a car for instance hurts and can be fatal.

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

Have you thought about the "TV screen" metaphore you used there? In practice with what one sees as "the movie moves on"?

Look up the cinema screen analogy by Ramana Maharshi.

originally posted by: NobodySpecial268
a reply to: whereislogic
...
Yet the Muslim would say true religion is according to the Koran.

Indeed, one of the reasons I was sticking to how the Bible presents its case, or the situation (the other main reason was that I didn't think I was going to convince you or anyone else here that the Bible is reliable on these matters, or that this was the right thread for that). I sort of added that remark about false religion being a snare at the end of my comment as an afterthought thinking about the usage of the word "trap" in the thread title. Since you asked a question about it I was sticking with answering that question by means of the way the Bible answers that question since that's where my remark about false religion came from, without trying to convince you that it's right about that (didn't want my comment to become too long to read). Or getting into how you can tell which source to trust on this matter.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

“So many pictures pass over the cinema screen: fire burns away everything; water drenches all; but the screen remains unaffected. The scenes are only phenomena which pass away leaving the screen as it was. Similarly the world phenomena simply pass on before the Jnani (one who knows the truth about himself), leaving him unaffected.”

-- Ramana Maharshi.

Geez Itisnowagain, you could have done that : )

Sure.

However the yogi philosophy, the Hindu, probably wants the student to learn in a certain way according to the tradition.

They probably don't want novices doing something like this:

Gazing into the mirror, my reflection disappears.
She steps forward and smiles, my love lost so long ago.
Her hands reach up, her palms upon the glass.
Our hands nearly touch.
Then her fingers interlace with mine, then mine with hers.
The boundaries are breached, she pulls herself across and into me.


In practice mirrors are surfaces just like the interface. They are also two dimensional having a 'this side' and a 'that side'.

a reply to: whereislogic

Indeed, one of the reasons I was sticking to how the Bible presents its case, or the situation (the other main reason was that I didn't think I was going to convince you or anyone else here that the Bible is reliable on these matters, or that this was the right thread for that). I sort of added that remark about false religion being a snare at the end of my comment as an afterthought thinking about the usage of the word "trap" in the thread title. Since you asked a question about it I was sticking with answering that question by means of the way the Bible answers that question since that's where my remark about false religion came from, without trying to convince you that it's right about that (didn't want my comment to become too long to read). Or getting into how you can tell which source to trust on this matter.

I see now. From the perspective, a fair thing to say. And I would consider that for the Christian, the two movies (I did watch them) are proper instruction. My only qualification would be "relative to the Christian living a Christian life".

I would think the same thing of the Muslim as the Koran has relative instruction for propermuslim living too.

Indeed, one of the reasons I was sticking to how the Bible presents its case, or the situation (the other main reason was that I didn't think I was going to convince you or anyone else here that the Bible is reliable on these matters, or that this was the right thread for that).

Well . . .

When one looks at philosophies (religions included) as homes for people as in the concept that Islam is different from the Christian, then the Bible is authority, yet so is the Koran.

My own opinion on the "one world religion concept" is it will be another created container trying to contain the existing religions and philosophies. Probably a bad idea.

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

a reply to: Itisnowagain

He is talking of the 'here', the preparations for the meditation, lighting incense and so on. He says the 'future' and 'before' do not exist.

Then one must also speak of the dark side too. The premeditated rape and murder of a young girl for instance. Then those things must be there also.

originally posted by: NobodySpecial268
a reply to: Itisnowagain

He is talking of the 'here', the preparations for the meditation, lighting incense and so on.

Here is all there is.
No incense is required to be here .

Then one must also speak of the dark side too. The premeditated rape and murder of a young girl for instance.

Why are you talking about premeditated rape?

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Ya know Itisnowagain, Living in the 'eternal now' and accepting 'what is' won't solve things in the long run. That is the way the ascended masters and hindu saints think. The bottom line with them is the Hindu saint wants to escape this world, and the ascended master already has.

Have a look at children. They are simply happy to be alive. Philosophy is of no interest to them and religion is something they have to be taught. As they grow older they begin to loose something; the joy of being alive.

I used to sit in shopping centres with a coffee and watch the people passing by. The children, the teenagers, young parents and older folks. One can see the progression of petrification of the spirit. The light in the eyes goes out as people age.

What changes that is the presence of misery. Happiness can't manefest in the presence of misery, and misery accumulates.

The "spiritual aspirant" is looking for something to distract him from the misery.

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Here is all there is.
No incense is required to be here .

The fella in the movie was talking about setting up meditation and so on, and that all that was already here.

Why are you talking about premeditated rape?

Because I'm pointing out really bad things happen too.

a reply to: NobodySpecial268

Living in the 'eternal now' and accepting 'what is' won't solve things in the long run.

Who can accept what is?

What is is.

Thought makes believe there is a someone that can accept or not accept what there actually is.