Y’all watching China

a reply to: JAGStorm

I've been warning about this for quite some time... no one seems to want to listen.

China does not think like we do in the USA. Here, we care about how much money a company can make in the next year, sometimes in the next quarter. We have an entire industry dedicated to buying up older companies that are not deeply into debt, liquidating them, closing the doors, distributing the profits from the liquidation, and moving on. China looks toward what they can accomplish in the next 10, 20, even 50 years.

China right now owns the vast bulk of the refined rare earth elements (REEs) on the planet. REEs are abundant, really; the darn things are everywhere. But they also exist in microscopic concentrations. China's plan has been to install REE refining capability at their other mines, so an iron mine can also produce yttrium, for example. We don't do that; the initial cost to refine REEs is quite high, and when one considers ecological costs it becomes astronomical. To illustrate, there is only one active REE mine in the United States: the Mountain Pass mine in California. USA Rare Earths out of Texas is planning to open a mine at Round Top, but that's next year. It is supposed to produce several REEs, including gallium and lithium.

The chances of that mine making a dent in global REE production are slim to none. Not to mention, anything produced will likely cost ten times what we pay China, assuming ecology activists don't get it shut down (they will),

The REE mines are the biggest reason why we hear of so many pollution issues in China. REE mines produce toxic waste in a ratio of 20 to 1... for every pound of REEs produced, it produces 20 pounds of toxic waste that has to go somewhere. That somewhere is typically groundwater... the stuff that comes out of your kitchen sink. The mining process is also quite energy intensive.

That last bit of info is the reason REEs are considered "rare." They're really not, as they exist pretty much everywhere in tiny concentrations. But ore does not help anyone... the high-tech electronics we all rely on today need pure REEs to use in everything from substrate doping to ion implantation. These procedures operate on an atomic scale; impurities destroy the end product. As technology improves, we get even further into the atomic scale of things, and a single wrong atom can cause a device to simply not work or to fail unexpectedly.

For every computer CPU, just imagine a small pond of toxic, radioactive water. That's what it takes to make that one computer chip. Now, think about how many computer chips are running right now this minute in the USA.

China has too many people. The CCP looks at humans as a resource and nothing more. They require a certain amount of resources to operate (food, water, air) and produce a certain amount of labor in return. They're essentially considered machines. If one has too many machines, what does one do? Get everything one can get out of the machine and throw it away. People, human lives, are cheap in China. Workers are disposable assets. So if a village has high cancer rates from the REE mining/refining operations, so be it. The REEs are worth more than the workers anyway.

This is how China became the world leader in REE refining. That is how China became the world leader in semiconductor manufacturing. Almost every electronic chip or transistor or diode is made in China. I know; I use such semiconductors regularly. I recall back in the 80s, if I remember correctly, one of China's two ceramic plants burnt down (they make the black "stuff" you see when you look at a semiconductor device). It became almost impossible to find many chips almost overnight, and the ones that were available quadrupled or more in price. It took over a year for that market to recover. Even today we have a computer chip shortage for one simple reason: China has enacted export quotas on them.

China is also buying up mineral rights in Africa for the sole purpose of mining REEs there.

The one limiting factor on China's REE production has always been energy. China is not blessed with vast oil and gas reserves, which is why they still rely on coal; they do have some coal reserves, as does North Korea. But now they have something even better than coal: oil and natural gas! Since Biden started the sanctions on Russia, Russia has simply switched to selling to the Chinese. Historically, the two countries do not like each other, but it seems their mutual dislike for the USA is making that less and less of an issue. Russia needs money; China has money (mostly from us buying their cheap crap). China needs energy; Russia has more than they can pump through their pipelines. So they're building more pipelines. The Russian people are intense, but they're not stupid.

If China can continue to grow economically, as it seems they now can easily, they could pull off an REE-based International Reserve Currency. And if that happens, we can kiss the dollar (and our standard of living) bye-bye. It will be worth less than a Confederate note. We'll all be dealing in yuan.

TheRedneck

radiated water is the least of chinas worries just look at there illegal fishing fleets.

a reply to: JAGStorm
the release has been approved
No building a long pipeline into the ocean
completion due in 2023 October

a reply to: musicismagic

This is trapped runoff from the buildings, right? I'm curious, when you say "long pipeline," how long and in what area will it be dumped?

It can't be from the actual cores. Those are sitting in magma pools in the bedrock below the plant.

TheRedneck

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

LMAO@U

When did anyone ever sit in a grocery store, or any other venue, and figure out how much to pay based on the spot price of gold when the dollar was backed by gold? Never. Why? Because the value of the dollar was still face value, even if the spot price backing it vacillated, which it did constantly.

You know nothing.

a reply to: TheRedneck

China is also buying up mineral rights in Africa for the sole purpose of mining REEs there.

Glad you brought this up.
I follow a lot in the Asian community as a whole... Let me tell you Asians can be some of the most racist people on the planet, especially when it comes to black folks.....but.......................things are changing super fast.
Chinese men are marring african women. Cultures are joining. Seriously, things are happening.

qz.com...

Uganda is worried about the number of Chinese men marrying their women
But according to Ugandan immigration officials, there’s one major downside: an increasing number of Chinese men are marrying Ugandan women to gain residency and continue their business interests in the country.

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
When did anyone ever sit in a grocery store, or any other venue, and figure out how much to pay based on the spot price of gold when the dollar was backed by gold?

They didn't. Do you know why? The price of gold was fixed globally. Maybe try looking things up next time.

originally posted by: Arnie123
a reply to: Vroomfondel
Yes, you're misinformed.

Secondly, you need to post your source so that we may dissect it and understand who and what is filling your head with non sense.

None of the "research" you did was accredited and or sourced in anyway. If this represents the epitome of your research abilities, it's no wonder many don't buy into your views.

All in all, I would refrain from consuming opinion by those who's interest are non-American.

The sooner you realize that, the sooner you'll be off this pendantic train of ignorance.

I asked you for citation and you avoided it like the plague. I wonder why...

I told you who I was quoting:

wallstreet, schwab, IMF, investopedia, business professor

Now you get to demonstrate:

the epitome of your research abilities

This should be interesting. Or do you need me to do it for you? I suspect you need pretty much everything done for you...

I asked you for citation - anything that supports your asinine allegations of the US obligation to assume other nations debt due to our status as reserve currency. Or any of the other bs remarks you made. Much like in life, you failed in every respect. So I invite you once again - stop deflecting and spinning, and provide credible citation for you asinine claims.

investopedia Hmmmm. Absolutely nothing in there but what I said - a means of conducting international business. Nothing about assuming other nations debt...I wonder why...
the business professor Nothing in there about other nations debt. But it did say, "Reserve currency is used in the global economy, countries hold large reserve currency through central banks in order to influence domestic exchange rate and mitigate exchange rate risks while transacting with other countries." Exactly what I said....
wall street mojo And Yet another source that says nothing like what you said. I am seeing a trend here...
schwab Not a single thing about the obligation to assume other nations debt. I'm shocked...

All of these, and many many more say exactly what I said about the reserve currency: it provides an easy fast and safe way to conduct international business. It involves none of the additional criteria you assigned to it. Again, again, again, I ask you to provide credible citation to any source that backs up your ridiculous claims. How will you dodge it this time? Too busy? Tired oft explaining it? (which you have yet to do) Going to do me a favor and let me research it for you? What will the dodge be this time? Something new, or the same tired crap you keep pulling...deflect and ignore.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
When did anyone ever sit in a grocery store, or any other venue, and figure out how much to pay based on the spot price of gold when the dollar was backed by gold?

They didn't. Do you know why? The price of gold was fixed globally. Maybe try looking things up next time.

emphasis added

You were the one whining about buying power, not me. You said

LOL. That's the definition of pegging, the commodity goes down and so does the currency value since it now takes more of that currency to purchase outside your system.

If the price of gold was fixed, how did it lose value when the commodity went down? If the price of gold was fixed, how did it go down in the first place? The price of gold was fixed globally. There is no "outside your system". Unless you mean solar system... Which is about how close you are to being right on the subject of economics.

You just spew this crap with out a single thought don't you...

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
If the price of gold was fixed, how did it lose value when the commodity went down?

You obviously don't understand the gold fixing scheme that was in place at the time, it didn't go up or down, it was FIXED, as in the price didn't change. Maybe go read up on it before you ask more absurd questions like this one.

In the modern times there is no fixed price of rare earths, they fluctuate with the market, just like gold does now.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
If the price of gold was fixed, how did it lose value when the commodity went down?

You obviously don't understand the gold fixing scheme that was in place at the time, it didn't go up or down, it was FIXED, as in the price didn't change. Maybe go read up on it before you ask more absurd questions like this one.

In the modern times there is no fixed price of rare earths, they fluctuate with the market, just like gold does now.

YOU SAID:

LOL. That's the definition of pegging, the commodity goes down and so does the currency value since it now takes more of that currency to purchase outside your system.

Now you say:

it didn't go up or down, it was FIXED, as in the price didn't change

Those are diametrically opposing statements. You are an ignorant fool. Stop trying to act like you are not.

I am done with both of you.

You both talk out your ass and when I point out you are wrong you just answer by saying I don't understand. Well, you are both right about one thing: I don't understand why you cant admit you are wrong and leave it at that.

You demand citation from me, even after I provided my sources, then refuse to provide your own. You repeatedly accuse me of a lack of understanding while continually contradicting yourselves. You make baseless assertions about the world economy, which neither of you understand in the least, then accuse me of being naive.

You say "my" view on a new reserve currency is naive and lacks understanding. Yet what you refer to as my view is, in reality, the view of the BRICS nations. In other words, you are saying that you two idiots understand the BRICS reserve currency potential better than Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa. I was just referring to their thoughts on creating their own reserve currency. From now on why don't you go tell those five nations, and the many others who will join them such as south Asia and the middle east, that they are confused, lack any understanding of how reserve currency works, and are naive. Your argument is with them not me. I just quoted them after all...

a reply to: Vroomfondel

We're talking about your dopey proposed rare earth backed currency, not the fixed gold price dollar of the last century which you brought up thinking it worked the same as your current want.

Current rare earth prices are not fixed and will never be fixed, therefore your inane currency concept will be DOA.

Gold was $35/oz until it wasn’t the gold standard anymore. Didn’t matter if there was only 35 tons of gold or 350 million tons of gold on the Earth. Gold was $35/oz.

Or you could say a US Federal Reserve Note One Dollar Bill was worth exactly 1/35 of an ounce of gold.

It was $35/oz in 1934 after FDR bought it from Americans for $20/oz in 1933. In 1960 it spiked at $40/oz value but not payout. Worth $40, still only paid $35. Which makes JFK a bit better than FDR because he didn’t force you into a $15/oz loss and then take away your guns over it.

a reply to: Ahabstar

What did they call it when the price of gold was set by the London and New York banks? Was it:

1) Fixing
2) Fixing
3) Fixing
4) All of the above

a reply to: TheRedneck

China has a world of economic problems right now, their real estate bubble is leaking air like a hot air balloon with a hole in it.

Real estate makes up a huge portion of their economy, think it's up to 4 banks failed several billion missing, tanks possibly on the streets to break up protests. Govt running lines of credit trying to keep evergrande afloat and promising to compensate those that lost everything in those bank collapses.
Other areas have people refusing to pay mortgages on property because there are delays on construction because banks aren't loaning money to the construction companies, and some provinces limiting how much you can pull out.

IF they can balance things again yes they can gut the dollar, but that's a pretty big IF at the moment.

Eta; last 2 weeks every time I go digging I find more issues pointing to major problems. Assuming the information is correct.

a reply to: nerbot


Do you think world war three tech war started a long time ago? A cumulative of all the R&D threw History?


I dont think its the tech. Its who uses the Tech. Tools, weapons.

a reply to: JAGStorm

things are changing super fast.
Chinese men are marring african women. Cultures are joining. Seriously, things are happening.

That is good news! I doubt the CCP would think so, however. They detest any form of Westernization.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: Nightstalker2010
a reply to: nerbot


Do you think world war three tech war started a long time ago? A cumulative of all the R&D threw History?


I dont think its the tech. Its who uses the Tech. Tools, weapons.

Unless they can bring Bruce Lee back... their secret meat buffet cuisine can only do so much damage to us beer drinking, call of duty playing, womanizing Americans and our false sense of entitlement.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

FFS!

Its not MY concept. Its BRICS.

Go argue with them if you think you know more than they do.

Wow - you really are freaking ignorant. Reading comprehension is not your friend. He never even heard of you...

Do you really expect ANYONE to believe you know more about international economics than Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa? I know you are a supremely arrogant POS but damn...I never thought you would go that freaking far to assert your imaginary superiority...