Y’all watching China

originally posted by: namehere

ugh why does this myth persist? America doesn't just endlessly print dollars, they have to buy securities and deposit them into reserve banks when they want to print money, though its mostly digital nowadays so there's not so much printing anymore but the same process happens digitally. in fact this whole situation has been caused by china flooding US markets with mystery dollars they probably created themselves, as a result the value of the dollar has gone down faster than normal and our government cant really do much to stop it.

Lol who taught you this? Just because they use debt-monetization schemes to create new money, doesn't mean the creation of new dollars wont cause inflation. It clearly does cause inflation, because every time they create massive amounts of money, it causes massive inflation. We can see it happening all around the world, every single nation which created large amounts of money out of thin air in order to support people throughout the lockdown now has a large amount of inflation. So you can't simply just shrug it off and blame it on some obscure theory about mystery dollars from China.

We constantly warned people throughout the entire pandemic about what would happen if we kept the global economy locked down for a long period of time and printed large sums of money to keep the boat afloat. It was always destined to end poorly, and now the entire world is suffering. Even those nations who chose to keep their economies open will not escape this disaster unscathed because it has become an issue with the global economy, since the puppet masters forced nearly every nation on Earth into this self-created disaster. And now the only people left to blame are the pro-nanny-state morons who chose to give up all their most important rights due to MSM fearmongering.

a reply to: Zrtst

We've been at war with China since before their wu-flu weapon was released...its just that the US gov't and media haven't told the sheeple.

yep, and no matter what anybody says it started back in 1950, the ungrateful bastards.

originally posted by: Arnie123

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
a reply to: JAGStorm

Its sort of frightening to contemplate, but the truth of the matter is our currency only has value today because the majority of people who use it believe it will continue to have value tomorrow. There is literally nothing backing it, not even the assurance of the US to provide value for it. In fact, we are devaluing it at a record rate. We have nothing more than a faith-based currency. That wouldn't be such a bad thing if people had faith in the government. By far the majority of people on this Earth do not. Not any more.

The moment the dollar is replaced as the reserve currency will be the moment of our insolvency. We can never hope to pay our debts now, they are simply too big. And a reserve currency based on rare earth elements that are abundant in China and Russia, but not in the US, well that is pretty much game over.

Typical doom porn.
Rare earth elements are in abundance even here in the US. We don't mine them because of the enormous ecological impact it has. So, we let the chinese do it.
However, since Trump, who literally forsaw the weakness of outsourcing endeavored to correct that.

Also, the reason why the US Dollar won't be replaced anytime soon is the amount of investment within US institutions. Despite our current setback, the Dollar remains where it needs to be.
You can't compare the US economy like others, simply based upon our role as the Resrve Currency, certain obligations are attached and much of US debt was in response to global deals and initiatives.

If anything, the World owes the US.

This is not doom porn. This is the real world.

Some rare earth elements are abundant here, many are not. But, as you pointed out, we will never mine them. Using them to back currency is therefore not an option for us. Yes, there is significant investment within US institutions in the dollar. That is why we wouldn't replace it as the reserve currency. It is also precisely why China and Russia would.

The US dollar is not the reserve currency because it is the strongest. It has strength because it is the reserve currency. Remove that title, and it is fancy scrap paper and nothing more. The problem is not the little pieces of paper themselves, but the economy that created them - so many of them. Our credit/debt issues are the real problem. We have created massive amounts of debt, more than we could ever hope to pay off. That is an untenable situation. It cant be maintained indefinitely. We pump massive amounts of cash into the economy to keep it afloat but that will stop working at some point. That point is near. The effect of pumping massive amounts of cash into an economic system to prevent debt collapse is inflation. We have inflation near to 10% right now. In reality, with all columns tallied, its more like 25%. That is not survivable without significant change.

Weimar, Germany, prior to WWII, had a similar situation. Their answer, the only one that had a chance of working, was to replace their currency with something new. They were literally facing an economy where it took a wheelbarrow full of cash to buy a loaf of bread. And they had only a fraction of the printed currency we have now. Paper currency is only about 150 years old. We gave it a try. It worked for a while, but people are afraid of paper becoming meaningless. And that is the problem with the US dollar. It relies on faith to keep its value. When no one believes it will continue to have value, that value evaporates quickly.

Replacing it may not even work for us like it did in Weimar. Whatever we replace it with still has to be accepted as having some value by the rest of the world. And hopefully they will accept it at the value at which we present it. You could go to bed tonight with $100,000 USD in the bank and wake up with $10,000 Patriot dollars. But what if the rest of the world says they are only worth $1,000? What then? We cant force them to accept our currency at the value we prefer. If we could, there would be no inflation. We would just raise the alleged value of the currency to meet the demand. Obviously, it doesn't work that way.

I bought the eight year Subaru extended warantee with the Subaru Forester a couple of years ago....so before the regular warrantee runs out, there will be a war over there and my extended warrantee will just be a piece of paper. You can't get parts from Japan if Japan is no longer around.

originally posted by: rickymouse
I bought the eight year Subaru extended warantee with the Subaru Forester a couple of years ago....so before the regular warrantee runs out, there will be a war over there and my extended warrantee will just be a piece of paper. You can't get parts from Japan if Japan is no longer around.

I had a hybrid Lexus and I dumped that sucker. The battery would cost more than the car was worth.

Sometimes progress is going back to basics. We need to be honest. We’ve made mistakes and bought too much foreign crap, time to reel it in. Time to lessen our use of plastics and micro plastics and all the other stuff poisoning us.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

...you're missing the point.

Anyone nation with the title, "worlds reserve currency" carries certain obligations with it.
Remember why we get mad and say, "The US isn't the world police!" Typical pouting, of course it is.

Since the US operates globally, sends food to poor Countries, assist other Nations militarily or financially, much of what we spend on those endeavors, that either aim to improve or solve problems, all take MONEY. It all contribute to the overall debt.

In otherwords, to maintain the titel, Worlds Reserve Currency, it'll come with the Worlds Debt.

This is why the matter is so complex, it's beyond your simple "checking account view", you're trying to apply here.

If China becomes the world reserve currency, they too will be burdened with debt.

Now, does that mean we can print money all crazy? No. As all things regarding finances, you gotta know when to say NO.

We can do a much better job of managing our debt.

However, to say we're just printing and our money is not worth it is ridiculous. If you saw a $100 bill on the street, you're sprinting after it. For something that's worthless, you'll appreciate that you just found it.

Is this to do with evergrande needing bailing out. Read about his a while back. If they cant get goverment to bail them out. Their housing market will crash and will have a huge knock on effect.

Seems that might bw the case

foreignpolicy.com...

a reply to: JAGStorm

originally posted by: JAGStorm
There’s so much going on sometimes it’s hard keep up with the big picture.

China, oh boy…

They are going through a mortgage/housing collapse like our 2008 but worse. There are runs on banks people have
Stopped paying their mortgages and the whole thing is a giant cluster just like our 2008.

They have warned Pelosi not to visit Taiwan. Right now the US says it’s a “possible” trip.
Will this woman and this one chess piece start WWIII?
From what I’ve read Taiwan is already boarding up and bracing themselves, that can’t be good.

China is about sick of Japan and Fukushima. Apparently Japan wants to release more Fukushima toxic water into the ocean and China isn’t having it. The US said it looks OK..😵‍💫


Lastly…and this one will have a direct impact on the US. China and Russia are being all besties and talking about a New currency based on rare earth minerals.. I believe there was a post about this so I won’t go into too much detail, but it doesn’t look good for the US and it’s never ending printed paper money.


What does this mean for the US… to me it signals one thing and one thing only.. war…

China is the only threat to Earth as we speak.
It use to be the Roman Catholic church , but not anymore.
There is no NWO , but rather a China World order on the rise . WW3 would be a natural course for the world turmoil going on . Wait until fall when food is an issue in 2/3rds of the world’s countries.

originally posted by: face23785
Honestly it's the perfect time for China to invade Taiwan. From what I understand, it would be no cakewalk, but the U.S. is in a weaker position than China is likely to see again in decades. Our economy is stumbling, we have projected weakness with our Afghanistan debacle and our feckless, token response to the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and our President is a joke. Biden said he'd defend Taiwan and he literally flipflops on everything, so he'd likely do nothing.

I mean honestly, is the American public be ready to endure the pain of war with China over Taiwan? Sanctions would be hard to do because our economy is so dependent on Chinese goods. War would be the only option, and I don't think we have the stomach for it right now. If China calls our bluff, I bet we do next to nothing.

I don't believe for a moment that Biden will declare war on China.
would be real interesting if Japan joins with Taiwan and demands our help.
Beijing might see this as a chance to take them both.
Biden will protest but do nothing.

a reply to: Arnie123

I respectfully disagree.

Many of the points you are making are simply untrue.

Your assertion that being the reserve currency obliges us to assume other nations debt is blatantly false. That is a ridiculous statement. Yes, we send money to other countries. That money is federal tax dollars collected from US citizens. It has absolutely nothing to do with whether the USD is the reserve currency or not. Same thing with the US being the world's police force. That is entirely independent of reserve currency. They are completely disassociated of each other in very respect.

Yes, the matter is complex, but not at all due to the reasons you suggested. I do understand the reason and the process, much better than you do, based on your statements here. My view is not a simple checkbook view, as you put it. Though that wouldn't be far off the mark. Its not what you think it is.

Reserve currency does not include assuming any debt. None. Nothing. Period. The purpose for reserve currency is to establish and maintain a method of international business without requiring multiple currencies and having to account for exchange rates and changes in value. It has absolutely nothing to do with assuming someone else's debt. Seriously, I am stunned that anyone would even think that. Other nations give money to each other too, without being the reserve currency. That debt is not absorbed by someone else, it is their debt. They gave the money away - they pay for it.

I am seriously struggling with how you apparently think this works. If China/Russia create the new world reserve currency, do you think our trillions of debt will suddenly disappear from our ledger and appear in China/Russia? That isn't going to happen. What will happen is that our ability to pay that debt will sink even lower when our currency is devalued compared to the new reserve. If we had 45 trillion in USD debt we could easily end up with equivalent of 450 trillion USD debt if the USD is valued at 10% of the new reserve. And at 10% I am being generous. We will be lucky to get ten cents on the dollar.

And no, the world owes us nothing. You don't give a gift and then charge for it. Ethically, yes it would be nice if other nations treated us with the same generosity that we treated them. But ultimately, they owe us nothing in return for the gifts we give them. The concept that as the worlds police force other nations owe us something is laughable. When we finish 'policing' a foreign nation we get hit with reparations bills. We pay them for our police work, not the other way around.

Look at it this way:
We finance 10 trillion dollars. We hope that if we invest that money it will get us enough returns to pay off the debt and show a profit. But the investment fails due to corruption, market instability, etc. So we borrow another 10 trillion from China/Russia, because our credit rating has dropped and we cant finance more debt, so we can make our payments on the first 10 trillion. We have successfully avoided default, but we are now 20 trillion in debt. We cut our spending on social programs and raise taxes. By doing that we have increased the number of payments we can make on the first 10 trillion but we haven't even started thinking about how to pay off the second 10 trillion.

Now here is the tricky part...

The USD is replaced as the reserve currency by the new China/Russia currency. The USD plummets in value to just 10% of the new reserve currency. We now have to pay ten times as much on the first 10 trillion just to stay at the same level of debt we had before the reserve change. And we now owe China/Russia 100 trillion, not 10, for the money we borrowed from them. They are now the reserve currency. Our debt increased 1000%, not theirs...

Typical misinformed ATS doom porn.

We don't borrow very much, relative to our debt, from China, they aren't even the top foreign purchaser of United States Treasury Bonds. There is not going to be a commodity backed foreign currency since it would be hyper volatile and subject to instant manipulation. China's overheated real estate market is potentially worse than the 2008 market here since the Chinese government encouraged citizens to invest in property and in many cases that property is not even habitable as it was never built/completed.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

Those tax dollars is how the world turns and it absolutely includes certain obligations, globally speaking.

I'm sorry you can't understand that. The real issue here is the reckless and blatant spending that puts us in ill positions. It means our institutions lose credibility in an era where no other nations institutions come close to the one installed.

Every Nation and Power on earth has massive investments in dollars within Western Central banks. Their entire apparatus hinges on that. Sure, we can go back and forth about self sustainability, but at the end of the day, we're talking regional Politic and Monetary issues, that exist across multiple spectrums and levels, nevermind the global aspect
Hence, the complexity of such a thing.
Hence, why this whole thread is doom porn.

Lastly, US Military patrols the water ways of the worlds trades, thereby providing protections, we fight in defense of allies if needed. We have bases in nearly every Country, a satellite networks countries use and media the world consumes. How does all that work? From you, The American Tax payer.

Seriously, you're barely understanding our role and what it means to hold World Currency Status? Without it, our lives change VERY DRAMATICALLY.

This is a TOLD YOU SO moment for me

This was what covid was all about especially the lockdown, the lockdowns killed the CCP running already dangerously RED HOT economy, the ghost cities exposed the fraud/scam

When the consumer economy's of the west self cannibalized their own economy's there was nobody to buy from the manufacturing/exports based economy's

So in china you get massive factory shutdowns and job-losses = housing defaults = China's driving growth engine collapse

The end results is the collapse of the CCP

Those who are disappointed we didn't get to WWIII with Russia-Ukraine, are now demanding that Pelosi give China the "middle finger" by going to Taiwan.

www.cnn.com...

a reply to: TritonTaranis

Right, the total inverse of this doom porn thread.

originally posted by: Arnie123
a reply to: TritonTaranis

Right, the total inverse of this doom porn thread.

You have your opinion, I have mine.
It doesn’t matter what we think anyways, time will tell, one domino piece at a time.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

Typical misinformed ATS doom porn.

We don't borrow very much, relative to our debt, from China, they aren't even the top foreign purchaser of United States Treasury Bonds. There is not going to be a commodity backed foreign currency since it would be hyper volatile and subject to instant manipulation. China's overheated real estate market is potentially worse than the 2008 market here since the Chinese government encouraged citizens to invest in property and in many cases that property is not even habitable as it was never built/completed.

For once we are in agreement. If I'm not mistaken, we owe most of our debt to ourselves, in a manner of speaking.

a reply to: JAGStorm

In Seattle Wa Hong Kong investors (Gaw Capital Partners) purchased The Columbia Tower for 711 million. For several years China has been buying real estate in the United States.

Want to take over...buy real estate in that country....or maybe they want to help.

Between Chinese covid and Chinese fentanyl the amount of Americans dead is staggering

a reply to: Arnie123

Dude, I'm sorry that you can understand our taxes have NOTHING to do with the fact that the dollar is the reserve currency. The ONLY thing you said that was even remotely correct was that our spending is a big part of our problem. But we are not obliged to any nation in any way other than our allies in NATO. Again, that has NOTHING to do with the reserve currency. Proof - all the other nations in NATO whose currency is NOT the reserve have the same obligations to their allies as we do.... (think here)

Yes, any nation that wants to conduct international business probably has a stake in the USD. As I said, the purpose of a reserve currency is to make international business easier and less risky. Everyone using the same currency levels the playing field in terms of risk. If the dollar gains or loses value, it affects both sides of an exchange equally. Its not complex or hard to understand, unless you start adding in all sorts of nonsense about how our reserve currency obliges us to assume other nations debt as our own. Then, yes, it gets ridiculously difficult to understand. As in, "Why the phuck would be bless ourselves with some other nations debt when we cant even pay our own?"

Yes, the US military patrols the waterways of international trade. We are not alone in those duties. Our NATO alliance members also help keep the trade channels open. That has nothing to do with the reserve currency. We fight in defense of our allies. That has nothing to do with reserve currency. We have bases in nearly every country (not even close). That has nothing to do with reserve currency. We have satellite networks that provide communication and media. That has nothing to do with reserve currency. Proof - there are plenty of other nations who do the exact same things - and their currency is not the reserve. Try to understand this: the fact that other nations depend on us does not mean we are obligated to them in any way due to reserve currency. It means they pay us for what they need from us. You need cell phone service? You will pay for it. Yes, you will use a satellite most likely owned by the US, or a cell phone provider (they aren't all government property). Some guy in Liberia has a monthly bill from Verizon to pay, but that has NOTHING to do with the USD being the reserve currency.

Yes, without us holding reserve currency our lives would change very dramatically. WTF do you think this thread is about???

If China/Russia want to destabilize the US the absolute best way to do it is by replacing the USD as the reserve currency. I find it amazing that people can believe a ground war could happen, or a nuclear war, or an EMP. But the best way to hurt us without firing a shot - nope. Cant happen.

Reserve currency means we are obligated to other nations? Jeeezus Christ... Our sh1tshack government doesn't even feel obligated to us - the taxpayers! Your examples of our "obligations" due to our reserve currency status are bullsh1t. You are saying that if the USD is no longer the reserve currency we no longer need to aid our allies in NATO, or have a satellite network, or any other bs reason you gave. If someone else has the reserve currency, they have to put up the satellites, right? Its tied to reserve currency, right? We don't have to patrol the oceans any more because someone else will do it, right?

I understand this issue far better than you do. I am sorry you don't see that. It is painfully obvious you never will.