Vaccine Expert Vanden Bossche Calls For "Immediate Halt" To Vaccinations

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: SeventhChapter

A reminder of context seems to be called for.

This is the statement to which I was responding.

As far as mutations and the vaccine, it should not take more than a couple of brain cells to realize that a vaccine that does not stop the virus in its tracks will allow said virus to mutate.

Tell me, does no vaccine at all stop a virus in its tracks? Tell me, do viruses only mutate under the influence of vaccines?

Smallpox and covid are two different animals or viruses if you will. Even with vacciation it is not believed covid will be eradicated or capable of eradication.

But COVID-19 is also a different epidemiological beast than smallpox and polio—two diseases the US has eliminated through mass vaccination. The two historical viruses are ancient, so people had been living with them for centuries before the vaccines came around. Long before Washington inoculated his troops against smallpox, people in Africa, the Middle East, and elsewhere were applying the same method to survive the disease, Rogers explains. Similarly, babies may have gained immunity to polio from exposure to small amounts of the virus in contaminated water. COVID-19, on the other hand, is a novel disease derived from a more lasting class of viruses. Humans have little to no immunity to it, and vaccination is crucial to stopping its spread.

Even after everyone in the US who wants the vaccine gets it, COVID-19 will probably persist, in part because there’s no global plan for stemming the virus. With coordination across borders, the World Health Assembly declared smallpox eradicated in 1980, and there have been no cases of polio in several countries in the past few decades. But eradication of COVID-19 could be impossible for several reasons, according to a letter in The Lancet published last fall. The authors cited the fact that the virus spreads through non-human hosts and is asymptomatic in about 20 percent of those infected. For those reasons, many public health experts think that COVID-19 will likely come and go in waves like the flu. Unlike with smallpox, vaccines won’t signal the end of the virus—it will possibly just weaken it so that it feels like the common colds people have come to expect each winter.

www.msn.com...

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

Even with vacciation it is not believed covid will be eradicated or capable of eradication.

Which has nothing to do with my point.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

if a vaccine doesn't actually aid the body in killing off the virus,

Hospitalization rates for vaccinated vs unvaccinated indicate that the vaccines do aid the body in killing off the virus.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: 727Sky

As far as mutations and the vaccine, it should not take more than a couple of brain cells to realize that a vaccine that does not stop the virus in its tracks will allow said virus to mutate.

And without vaccines viruses don't mutate?

That's what makes this claim so specious. Mutations don't happen because of any particular thing (except maybe a random cosmic ray strike). That's not the way it works.

Misunderstood.

Why is it impossible to make a hiv vaccine?

They kicked off the vaccine train in january when they were already aware of several mutations. WHO has Delta listed as a known already in october 2020.

Virus mutate on random, but since viruses job is to survive then it will evolve under the circumstances.

You put a fence in front of it, and it gets over because your fence was instead a tall doorstep, the there is a risk the virus will adapt to this.

Hence you dont headlessly cast yourself into mass vaccination when evolution is going on. You might miss the mark.... and it seems like they did. Intentionally? Maybe.
We surely are getting more dependant on bio tech now.

The amazing thing is how most just still eat raw what politicians and so called goverment approved ezperts barf up. They either have no clue about what they are doing or saying or they are lying through their teeth.

a reply to: flice

Why is it impossible to make a hiv vaccine?

HIV is a special kind of virus. A retrovirus. Quite different from most viruses and very problematic to deal with. But perhaps new technologies can be successful against it. Someday.

You put a fence in front of it, and it gets over because your fence was instead a tall doorstep, the there is a risk the virus will adapt to this.

So "natural" immunity isn't a wall? Isn't it the bestest, strongest immunity of all?

They either have no clue about what they are doing or saying or they are lying through their teeth.

That is what is known as a false dichotomy. It is a logical fallacy.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: themessengernevermatters

Even with vacciation it is not believed covid will be eradicated or capable of eradication.

Which has nothing to do with my point.

I quoted the wrong one, bit it is why smallpox vaccines were able to eradicate smallpox, while the covid vaccine, doesn't seem to have the same effect and since vaccinated people can still be infected and transmit covid, they very well could make the virus stronger. Like bacteria can grow stronger from stopping antibiotics to soon.

If you have a vaccinated person infected and their immune system is attacking it and then it gets transferred into another person whose immune system isn't even fighting covid yet, that virus would go from a hostile environment fighting for it's life into an open environment, while still waging the war. It could very well overwhelm and decimate the new host much quicker. Everything in nature fights to live, even bacteria and viruses.

And I don't think either the smallpox or polio vaccines were leaky vaccines. They were designed to confer immunity and stop the viruses in their tracks, two things even the manufactures of the covid vaccines, have said, the covid vaccines was never intended to do.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

If you have a vaccinated person infected and their immune system is attacking it and then it gets transferred into another person whose immune system isn't even fighting covid yet, that virus would go from a hostile environment fighting for it's life into an open environment, while still waging the war.

How is this different from an infected unvaccinated person whose immune system is attacking the virus infecting someone?

Comparing the two vaccines is like comparing apples and oranges.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

And you too ignore the context.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: themessengernevermatters

If you have a vaccinated person infected and their immune system is attacking it and then it gets transferred into another person whose immune system isn't even fighting covid yet, that virus would go from a hostile environment fighting for it's life into an open environment, while still waging the war.

How is this different from an infected unvaccinated person whose immune system is attacking the virus infecting someone?

I don't get your point. Vaccination status doesn't have anything to do with whether the virus would get stronger or not.

Oh I see what you are saying. I guess there would be no difference, but it doesn't mean the vaccine isn't also making it stronger.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

I don't get your point.

Seems you do.

In any case, the vaccines are not very effective at stopping the spread of covid and they will not eradicate covid like either the smallpox or polio vaccines.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

There is evidence that before Delta became dominant the vaccines were effective in reducing transmission.

There is evidence that the vaccines are still very effective in reducing the severity of infection, which was the only thing claimed by the Stage 3 trials.

If the severity of infection is reduced one might speculate that the duration of infection is also reduced. Reducing the opportunity for mutation. One might speculate.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: themessengernevermatters

There is evidence that before Delta became dominant the vaccines were effective in reducing transmission.

There is evidence that the vaccines are still very effective in reducing the severity of infection, which was the only thing claimed by the Stage 3 trials.

If the severity of infection is reduced one might speculate that the duration of infection is also reduced. Reducing the opportunity for mutation. One might speculate.

By your own quote before delta.

a reply to: Phage

The human body has developed a pretty good system for fighting off various bugs, but if I have got this right, if you have the jab, it tells the interior of the blood vessels to produce a spike protein, which changes things that nature did not intend, to make it harder for this covid to latch onto the cells. But what about all the other bugs which the body is dealing with, will this change make it easier for them to get on the cell wall. This is nothing to do with clotting it could be another complication entirely, just because it could be done with one virus if the change is locked in it might be another problem altogether. We are assuming a bit too much.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

I suppose you have a point?

And one might speculate. But, if the vaccinated are still able to infect others it doesn't seem to me like it would reduce mutations. Every time the virus moves into a new host it can mutate.

a reply to: anonentity

But what about all the other bugs which the body is dealing with, will this change make it easier for them to get on the cell wall.

No.
Antibodies are custom built. If you had measles or were vaccinated against measles you have measles antibodies. They don't fight with the antibodies from the last tetanus shot you had.

Like you said, our immune systems have developed over millions of years, actually. Used to be we had to get infected before it would go to work. Turns out we don't.

a reply to: themessengernevermatters

Every time the virus moves into a new host it can mutate.

Probably mutates before it does that, actually. And the longer someone is infected, the greater the chances of a bad mutation.

Think of it as more chances to roll the dice. The more often you roll, the more likely you'll get snake eyes.