Corona Virus Updates Part 5

originally posted by: anonentity
a reply to: Maker22

I am pretty sure after a week just taking the zinc pills, being metallic the zinc would have formed into ions that pass into the cells anyway. That's why they work.The year I took 15mg a day I didn't even catch a cold when I was around people who had quite bad ones. I got the idea of a blog saying that's what Doctors use in the flue season. Imagine all the who ha if that was all it took to clear this thing up. No one would admit to it, its like the King has no clothes , they might even be dressing it up now to say it has to be taken with some quinine. Even so isn't their a Bitters you take with booze that has quinine in it.?

but we are an island

a reply to: Toinski
Define young. I read earlier today that half of all hospitalized patients were under 50. Sorry, don't have link. And the idea of the healthcare system being overrun so badly that even nonCOVID19 patients die unnecessarily? Because even if nonCOVIDs get hospitalized, I think the chances of staff making errors or communicating another nosocomial would be much higher under those conditions....those things won't stop killing people just because we have a pandemic. In fact, I think those stats will get worse.

originally posted by: drussell41
a reply to: musicismagic

What's a "special site"? Hospital, quarantine camp, concentration camp, what?

Thanks for asking.
Right now everyone is waiting for the 9 o'clock news.

What we are waiting for , (happens tomorrow) is to be maybe expected. Airlines will stop all international flights to Japan. ( Please keep this in MIM "street talk".

I live in the city with one airport with passsengers coming from Tokyo, the flights are almost empty .

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
I go back to the table in my opening post.. every day we allow packed trains, bars, cafe's to operate is another day of exponential growth at the other end. Shut it all down NOW Scomo!

I'll ask again...

So, you shut everything down. Destroy the worlds economy.

Let's even say you are successful, you stop the virus spreadin in its tracks, new cases go to almost zero for 4 weeks straight.

Now what?

Now what???

You lift the bans/curfews/closings, open everything up again...

And cases start spreading again...

Now what???

Sorry, that is just pure insanity.

The only way to handle this, that makes any kind of sense, is close things down everywhere for a short period of time - maybe 1 or 2 weeks - to provide time to prep - where prep means, doing anything and everything that is reasonably possible to protect the most at risk - absolute isolation quarantine on all group homes where the at risk are concentrated, require care-givers to live-in during this time, nothing but supplies in or out, and then provide guidelines for private citizens who are at risk but not in these group home settings to protect themselves, hopefully with the help of their loved ones, but if needed, with the help of locals willing to assist.

Then, just open things up, and let this thing run its course through the rest of the population that is at very low risk.

After that period - to be determined, but hopefully not more than a couple of months - States can start removing the quarantines in a staggered and controlled fashion, to prevent ICUs from being over-run.

This will allow for protecting those at most risk, but more importantly, allow this thing to run its course naturally, without destroying the worlds economy.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
I go back to the table in my opening post.. every day we allow packed trains, bars, cafe's to operate is another day of exponential growth at the other end. Shut it all down NOW Scomo!

I'll ask again...

So, you shut everything down. Destroy the worlds economy.

Let's even say you are successful, you stop the virus spreadin in its tracks, new cases go to almost zero for 4 weeks straight.

Now what?


it only takes one from the outside to reinfect the populatation agaian

Now what???

You lift the bans/curfews/closings, open everything up again...

And cases start spreading again...

Now what???

Sorry, that is just pure insanity.

The only way to handle this, that makes any kind of sense, is close things down everywhere for a short period of time - maybe 1 or 2 weeks - to provide time to prep - where prep means, doing anything and everything that is reasonably possible to protect the most at risk - absolute isolation quarantine on all group homes where the at risk are concentrated, require care-givers to live-in during this time, nothing but supplies in or out, and then provide guidelines for private citizens who are at risk but not in these group home settings to protect themselves, hopefully with the help of their loved ones, but if needed, with the help of locals willing to assist.

Then, just open things up, and let this thing run its course through the rest of the population that is at very low risk.

After that period - to be determined, but hopefully not more than a couple of months - States can start removing the quarantines in a staggered and controlled fashion, to prevent ICUs from being over-run.

This will allow for protecting those at most risk, but more importantly, allow this thing to run its course naturally, without destroying the worlds economy.

a reply to: drussell41

That wasn't really clear from the speech, watch it on youtube, link posted, subtitles available I think.

To me it seemed he meant below 40 years. But it was very unclear.

It's not only old people that die.

a reply to: tanstaafl

The strange thing is that south korea seems to have it contained, and obviously from the looks of it, im suspecting, china is itching to declare they have wiped it out from their country. Which according to the numbers they keep giving out, they will fairly soon. So it becomes a question of whatever they did work, and we should imitate, or they are lying, and we will soon see an increase in those countries. But this mere fact of china, has me perplexed.

This whole thing is very odd. Huge explosions in cases and then poof, it just disappears.

Spain Update:

11178 Infected
491 Deaths

Assume there are probably twice as many affected as reported.

a reply to: Phage

And yes i read the article wrong, and did try to find clarification of whether it was a retrovirus or not, and really any kind of classification of this new Wuhan virus (never did). But how it was described was "a retrovirus-like infection clinically." So not a retrovirus, but has many similarities in it's manner of infection.

read this:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: drussell41

I would have to look that one up, they should be similar because they're both RNA viruses.

Comparing the two is like comparing two fruits, similar but not the same. An RNA virus brings it's own polymerase (genetic printer) with it. They do this because they are copying a single sided sheet of paper (genetic material). Genetic material contains the plans for all protein or building blocks in the body. An RNA virus, like coronavirus cares about speed, so it will love mutations that increase the speed of printing new genetic material. This will increase the error or mutation rate, the faster you work the more errors you make. They will also try to increase spike protein (key to cell door) affinity (strength) to its target receptor (cell door).

Influenza has far more natural hosts so we have the problem above also combined with recombination events. Pigs and Birds can be infected with influenza, what happens is two viruses could get together and share their secrets about printing, keys, disabling alarm systems, even hiding and it could be worse.

You also have DNA viruses which use the printer from the host because they are printing double sided sheets of instructions instead of single sided. These are slower but more accurate so lower mutation rate.

Because it's new and moving quick, it probably has a higher mutation rate than flu, nothing crazy though like 10 or 100 times difference, the numbers are really small. It also doesn't have hosts like influenza which is good.

ETA: A mutated virus still has to compete with and win against the original in the host. Most mutations could be bad and die out, the ones they are tracking should be improvements or evolution against our immune responses. Don't worry our immune system knows this and is able to counter it in most cases.

I work in the IT industry and heard in work today that Chinese manufacturing is picking up. There has been no / minimal stock of anything hardware (laptops, desktops etc) for the past 2 months, with many vendors having manufacturing facilities based in Wuhan, and if they do have other plants located elsewhere, there are high chances that they rely on China for at least some of the parts.

General hardware stock is flying out like hotcakes at the moment. Headsets are an EXTREMELY rare commodity with the WFH initiative and little / no manufacturing on the back end.

Never seen it like this..

Also, this week there is now panic and talks from above about people's jobs ...

Tom Hanks and his wife Rita Wilson have been released from hospital to self quarantine. They are both feeling much better, no doubt because of the Vegemite

Weird update about shopping today too. Stores are using staggered shopping times for customers like only allowing senior citizens in during the morning. They are disinfecting daily so bringing in the most vulnerable early is a great idea to limit fomite spread. No idea how they can disinfect everything though but it will at least help a bit.

You also have to wear gloves provided by the store and disinfect carts before entering with provided wipes. I forgot to look at what type, if ammonia or ammonium it's useless.

CSDA Recommending Closing CT Dental Offices for 2 Weeks

I found out last night that the Connecticut State Dental Association is recommending postponing all
routine and elective procedures for 2 weeks as of tomorrow (18 March 2020) and treating only emergencies. In other words, effectively shutting down. One of the oral surgeons I refer to was saying that the ADA is recommending 3 weeks but I can't find that as of this morning.

Not sure how many offices are going to cooperate with this (there was a lot of grumbling last night in our local e-mail round table) but I'm planning on following their directive.
Especially since one of my employees is 75.

One office down the street, as of yesterday had all of their staff (including front desk) in full clinic PPE. That can't be good for the patient's mindset.

This is going to be tough. Most of us can't pay the bills based only on emergency cases. I'm looking into SBA loans and trying to figure out options for my employees that don't include going on unemployment.

I'll update as I get more info.

-Wizzz

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
a reply to: Agit8dChop

What happens when someone that already has bronchitis catches coronavirus? I cant find anything on the net regarding this.

I've been asking something similar for months, can't find any 'official' response...

I believe that this explains a lot of the anomalies with respect to who has more serious problems - people who get exposed to CV that also catch influenza or possibly any number of other bugs have much more difficult problems.

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
a reply to: redpassion
Unfortunately Americans are going to be reluctant to quarantine.

The question is - who do we quarantine? Everyone? Or just those at most risk?

Please explain to me how it makes sense to quarantine everyone - which has massively bad economic repercussions - vs only those who are at most risk - which would have a much much smaller economic impact.

originally posted by: FellowHuman
a reply to: tanstaafl
The strange thing is that south korea seems to have it contained,

I've been saying we need to look much more closelt at not just SK, but also Germany. Germany's CFR is the lowest of all, at 0.2%.

china is itching to declare they have wiped it out from their country. Which according to the numbers they keep giving out, they will fairly soon. So it becomes a question of whatever they did work, and we should imitate,

We cannot - we are not a communist dictatorship.

I'm curious - what is it about my contrarian position on handling this - quarantine only those at most risk, and let nature take its course naturally with those at very low risk - that bothers you or anyone else here?

a reply to: Phage

Lol. Not at all.

a reply to: tanstaafl

I think this is sound logic.
Two weeks to fortify, then shield the at risk groups. Unfortunately I know a couple of at risk people who’s jobs are forcing them to work (one currently has a fever) or lose their job. I’m trying to talk her into staying home anyway but this kind of stuff will increase the spread during the two weeks.