Alabama Senate passes nation’s most restrictive abortion ban

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: underwerks

If you're hooked up to me and I'm providing life support to you, do I have the right to unhook myself and walk away?

Not sure if it's still that way, but we were warned when I first learned CPR that the law says you cannot start CPR and simply walk away until medical personnel arrive and take over; you can be charged with negligent homicide or sued for wrongful death. The only way to ensure you are not charged is to literally pass out from exhaustion.

TheRedneck

The most ironic part of this whole situation is the fact that the people pushing to have the right to kill a child at birth are the same people trying to pass laws to get rid of the death penalty.

a reply to: InTheLight

Nope, just where women have an equal voice and representation.

Women's Suffrage

You're about 80 years late.

TheRedneck

a reply to: CriticalStinker

I think this is a terrible standard

Yes we all have the right to decide what to do with our own bodies

But that o my applies of you don’t consider a fetus a life

Once it is considered a life, then all of us, no matter what gender have a say in it

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: InTheLight

Nope, just where women have an equal voice and representation.

Women's Suffrage

You're about 80 years late.

TheRedneck

You mean equal representation within government is 80 years late.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheRedneck

No, it apparently makes men sit down in the corner and shut up, though.

As a man, I've never tried to take a hard stance on this issue one way or the other, because it's a women's issue.

Well, if that's the case, then you should never have an opinion on the military unless you've served or have an opinion on taxation of millionaires unless you are one.

a reply to: Grambler

I agree with you, but there has to be an acceptable range to have the procedure done. There can be a window where you have a choice to make, an acceptable one. No late term abortions, no post birth abortions.

But to outright ban it is asking for more societal problems... Something we don't need right now.

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Nyiah

Roe v Wade doesn't make people get an abortion

No, it apparently makes men sit down in the corner and shut up, though.

Doesn't matter. Gone.

TheRedneck

Yes and no. You can mouth off about it all you want, but you have about as much right to tell me what I can and cannot do regarding my reproductive system and what is or isn't occupying it (released eggs, or zygote) about as much as I can demand you turn over all choices pertaining to your reproductive system to ME. You expect me to STFU up about your babymaking junk and I expect the same of you regarding mine in return. It's a simple personal opinion & personal rights draw -- bitch all you want, but hold no power over the other's junk.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Grambler

I agree with you, but there has to be an acceptable range to have the procedure done. There can be a window where you have a choice to make, an acceptable one. No late term abortions, no post birth abortions.

But to outright ban it is asking for more societal problems... Something we don't need right now.

Well i agree with that

But saying she not women should decide is divisive and a terrible decision

a reply to: Nyiah

It’s not just other people junk

It’s about a life being terminated, and at what point we consider the fetus to be a life

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheRedneck

No, it apparently makes men sit down in the corner and shut up, though.

As a man, I've never tried to take a hard stance on this issue one way or the other, because it's a women's issue.

Well, if that's the case, then you should never have an opinion on the military unless you've served or have an opinion on taxation of millionaires unless you are one.

Being part of selective services while dipsh##s ran the country isn't enough?

Joking aside, I've always had (IMO) a pro military stance. Soldiers and vets should be taken care of, I never speak ill of our service men, but rather those who (IMO) exploit them.

As for the millionaires part, all I ask is they pay their fair share... Millionaires these days is not a naughty term. Anyone who's worked hard in life, has their house paid off, and a 401k could be considered a millionaire. So I'm not that guy.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheRedneck

No, it apparently makes men sit down in the corner and shut up, though.

As a man, I've never tried to take a hard stance on this issue one way or the other, because it's a women's issue.

Well, if that's the case, then you should never have an opinion on the military unless you've served or have an opinion on taxation of millionaires unless you are one.

And here all this time I thought you were for freedom of expression. oh well...

a reply to: TheRedneck

No I didn't I complained that the legislatures who wrote this law and voted for it were stupid and pointed out that it was predominantly men who voted for it.
And I listened to part of the Senate debate last night most of the talking that was done on the Senate side was being done mainly by one man while I was listening. And he didn't really sound too bright.
And well it was one women and the rest republican men who voted for this law
So I guess I should have said that that one women and all those men didn't care about the right of minor children let alone the rights of grown women when it comes to issues involving pregnancy.

a reply to: Grambler

But saying she not women should decide is divisive and a terrible decision

That's my stance, I'm not saying people can't have an opinion about it.

I was just offering a different perspective. I think women should have their own decision in what happens with their body, within reason.

But this bill isn't about within reason, it's about taking it away.

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Nyiah

It’s not just other people junk

It’s about a life being terminated, and at what point we consider the fetus to be a life

I'll take the biblical approach...it's not mentioned. You wanna play God?

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: InTheLight

Well if it is overturned then society will have two deaths on their hands if women are forced to seek illegal abortions.

No, you will. You are the one who changed my mind. Congratulations.

TheRedneck

I highly doubt your mind is changed.

Are women's constitutional rights not worth the paper they were written on?

What makes a woman so special that she has the legal right to kill but I don't?

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Nyiah

It’s not just other people junk

It’s about a life being terminated, and at what point we consider the fetus to be a life

That's what a middle ground number does -- appeases one side with a reasonable limit (and not ending just as soon as someone realizes they missed a period) and the other with a reasonable window (beyond that missed period to reflect, make choices, figure out payment, etc) Beyond that, it's not your right to tell someone else what to think outside of those guidelines. Trying to make people do so or shortening the established time period already on the books is not even worth debating, that's oppressing others because you have a belief that differs from theirs and think YOU -- and no one else -- must be right.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: Grambler

But saying she not women should decide is divisive and a terrible decision

That's my stance, I'm not saying people can't have an opinion about it.

I was just offering a different perspective. I think women should have their own decision in what happens with their body, within reason.

But this bill isn't about within reason, it's about taking it away.

I personally am for allowing early term abortions

I don’t know when the cutoff should be

But the reason we have laws is to protect people from being victims

At some point the fetus is a baby worth protecting; there is a lot of debate as to when that is

But at that point all of us have a say in what the laws should be, not just women

a reply to: CriticalStinker

As a man, I've never tried to take a hard stance on this issue one way or the other, because it's a women's issue.

I should have no say in the reproductive rights of women.

As a man, I have always tried to understand the position of women. I admit that the issue is likely of more interest to women than to most men, but I will not say I should have no say. The same thinking would tell me I should have no say in someone killing their neighbor, because I'm not them.

That is where I take exception. I am demonized over this issue for two reasons, both quite evident in this one thread alone: the fact that I am male, which I had no control over, and the fact that I am a Christian, which is my right. I draw the line at such demonization, especially when my initial response was to condemn this bill. I simply do not respond well to insults and attacks without merit. Thus my position change.

My heart has not changed. I still want women to be able to get safe abortions when needed. I still want to preserve the life of the unborn whenever possible. I want balance. I have simply acknowledged that such balance cannot happen when Roe vs. Wade exists. So, in order to achieve the goal I see as optimal, I am forced to oppose something that could have been used to make a transition to a more reasonable position much less painful.

Again, proof is in this very thread... insults and slurs abound at even the thought that a man could actually have an opinion. Remove all protections, send things back to the horrific days of yore, and those who now think they are superior to others because of an anatomical difference will learn that they are not so superior... and maybe, just maybe, balance can be achieved.

TheRedneck

a reply to: Nyiah

Debating when the fetus should be allowed to be terminated is not off limits or me just forcing my opinion on people

It’s a debate worth having that medical professionals should weigh in on

Refusing that debate is oppressing the lives of the babies that are killed

a reply to: InTheLight

You mean equal representation within government is 80 years late.

Then go vote... don't tell me men shouldn't vote.

TheRedneck