Bob Lazar : Area 51 & Flying Saucers... The whole story.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear


Thanks for taking the time to reply Kev.
Just wanted to hear your opinion on what you think Lazar was really seeing, what you feel is the truth in this story and what you think he was being used for? Lazar's story reminds of the Serpo story, in that a lot of us just wanted it to be true, a lot sounded almost true but so, so much of it sound like a word I will not post and rhymes with hull split which turned out to be what it was!!

originally posted by: Kurokage
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear


Thanks for taking the time to reply Kev.
Just wanted to hear your opinion on what you think Lazar was really seeing, what you feel is the truth in this story and what you think he was being used for?

He's a useful idiot (useful as a cover for the particle beam testing and to promote the false UFO narrative).

Kev

according to secureteam10 the theater is having a hard time selling out.

there are between 3-400 seats they are trying to sell, I guess they over estimated the demand for a Bob Lazar film.

They should have a public Q&A and i would buy a ticket and go there all the way from NY as long as i could ask a question, a simple quick question in person that way Bob's handlers/google could not bail him out.

originally posted by: Paddyofurniture
a reply to: pigsy2400

Great find!

I think a accurate , articulate number of questions for a AMA here at ATS would be a good idea.

Show Corbell and Co. the concerns the UFO / ETH / phenomena community has with the Lazar story and for Corbell to be able to tell Lazar's story accurately questions like his alleged Ph.D at MIT and Cal-Tec need to be addressed and fully explained by Lazar.

I mean the name of the movie is Bob LAZAR - Area 51 & Flying Saucers

Lazar on the payroll and part of the promo team.

Here December 3rd

theatre.acehotel.com...



Another tid bit. I wonder how much Mick cost? 😬


"We are pleased to announce Oscar Nominee Mickey Rourke as narrator. ".

I do not know where i stand with lazar, but I have to ask this. If he is doing all this for money, then why did he shun away from it for such a long time? If he made up all this for money, then he went the completly wrong way about it. As far as I know, he tried to forget about it and get on with his life.

Yes, certain people are obsessed with saying " everyone is doing this ufo stuff for money" seems like an easy cop out, just like debunkers saying that humans make the worst witnesess, esp when it comes to ufos.

Alot of egos clashing here on both sides.

a reply to: Jay-morris

He wants to stay out of prison. No money need be involved, in a case like that.

www.otherhand.org...

Good thread. Thanks to the infamous Gazrok for the update on the second island of stability around heavier Elements (note I was guessing 294 but reviewing Gazrok's video reference, he says 247 (around 04:27 in the video Gazrok cited). In addition, talking about 'detectors' preventing the material from being spirited out of the base, Lazar says his isotope is stable and in not radioactive.

There's the original video that Bob put out during that time which seems very 'commercial', where he lectures about the subject (40 minutes long = the video intro repeats again for some reason), which repeats some of this explanation. I'm still not seeing the connection or path from 'electrical energy' and the effects of bombarding the Element 115 to creation of a gravity wave (gravity A as he calls it) but he does go into more detail on that in this video.


I have to say having made a study of body language, lie detection, micro-expressions, duping delight, and facial expressions (see the Lance Armstrong lying videos for more of this) I do NOT see any of this in Lazar so I have to agree with others, that HE believes all of what he is saying.

There are some tiny details which do not ring true. Here are two:

1. He made the "mistake" IMO of using the MAJ designation on his reproduction of the S4 ID badge. We now know that this was faked by, probably Bill Moore, so that puts somewhat of a deception on his story.

2. One detail I just picked up on when he describes being led into the room with the 'Sport Model' he said he ran his hand along the side of the saucer and it felt metallic and cold but he was immediately 'disciplined' by Dennis Mariani. Think about it. Would you not have the area roped off so no one could touch it? How did he in fact enter it and look at it (later) if he was not allowed to touch it? It's not consistent.

I do believe that Bob believes in what he is saying. Which creates a conundrum of sorts.

I'm almost tempted to say he has been 'brainwashed' by TPTB, but is that Manchurian Candidate-like notion fast becoming a cliche in Ufology discussions?

It's doubtful that Lazar will have anything fresh to add to his relatively brief story; his recent interviews with Knapp simply went over the same ground, so why should this documentary provide anything fresh beyond being yet another well-made, absorbing 'history lesson' from Corbell's 'Extraordinary Beliefs' series.

Corbell's 'fish tank' metaphor was absent from the Skinwalker doc, but I fully expect its return here. Personally I suspect it's a signal to 'tread carefully' with our own beliefs - the John Lear and Patient 17 docs were besieged by such tanks, lol.

a reply to: ConfusedBrit

I think there is some new information. For example BL talks about releasing possibly, the list of 22 names of people who worked at S4. We know of a couple and we know one was named 'Jones' and there was a call-in to a radio show (Art Bell) where someone guessed one other name (Hayes) and of course Bob and Dennis Mariani and Bob's co-worker Barry Castillo, a Mr. Hayes, Mr. Jones, and a female Renee'. There are other aspects that Lazar said he kept to himself to weed out possible hoaxers to his story (people trying to support his story who weren't there in actuality).

Another little detail I found was that BL says that when the gravity emitters were operating in planetary mode, or locally they converted the Gravity A wave to a B wave and it formed a heart shaped pattern around the saucer which from above looked like a torus (in cross-section) and at that time the craft distorted space-time and was invisible. How, then, could he have seen the test flight with the coronal discharge and the craft being flown in a small pattern at the base if it was in lift mode and thus, according to his account, invisible. Of course he often says he can only relate what he's told and he can't explain every little detail. Maybe he was 'told' it was invisible and maybe the test was in only 'partial mode' or something.

I have to admit his story is extremely detailed, extremely consistent and in the video I posted he is lecturing on It in such a fluent manner, it would have to have taken many hours to be able to do that without any mistakes and he does not appear to be reading much of it except at then end seated at a desk. This guy is quite amazing and unlike any other 'UFO' story tellers.

Here's a website where the infamous Glenn Campbell talks about Bob from 2002.

He gives a bit of an example as to how someone can be so fluent and glib and consistent in their story with the case of the guy who forged the Mormon Documents, Mark Hoffman. Read Glenn's statement below for more info.

Glenn Campbell

originally posted by: penroc3
according to secureteam10 the theater is having a hard time selling out.

there are between 3-400 seats they are trying to sell, I guess they over estimated the demand for a Bob Lazar film.

They should have a public Q&A and i would buy a ticket and go there all the way from NY as long as i could ask a question, a simple quick question in person that way Bob's handlers/google could not bail him out.

I think you should go check it out for us penroc. Do some smart-phone journalism. Maybe some interviews. You'd be great. Be a cool thread.

a reply to: Maverick7

Excellent article thank you.
But can you trust ANYONE that worked there, I do believe the story of worker's getting sick and the US military incinerating waste there causing noxious chemical's to be released and to make those worker's sick but other than that I take it all with a pinch of salt.
Except for one the sighting by a commercial co-pilot whom saw a swarm of aircraft out of his window making right angled turn's and flying in an unbelievable fashion over the area as well as seeming to land on a holographic like runway which just lit up for them to land on.
And there is a question - was he seeing aircraft or a powerful holographic device since let's be fair psychological warfare research and application is just as important as gun's in any military arsenal.
And of course I do believe the Roswell incident was a genuine crash of something we would call a UFO but non human or captured Nazi technology that is the question for me and that was supposed shifted to all manner of site's including Area 51 - I am also inclined to believe the kecksburg incident was probably a recreation of and test flight of a varient on the NAZI Bell - Die Glock project.

If Area 51 had a drive thru.....

originally posted by: ValleyLord
If Area 51 had a drive thru.....

I think I can see Stan Romanek peeking out through that window.


back on topic...

originally posted by: Maverick7
Here's a website where the infamous Glenn Campbell talks about Bob from 2002.

He gives a bit of an example as to how someone can be so fluent and glib and consistent in their story with the case of the guy who forged the Mormon Documents, Mark Hoffman. Read Glenn's statement below for more info.

Glenn Campbell

That article is more or less where I fall on this, but I wouldn't say "for sure" that its all made up. Rather, I think it is likely all made up (although it's hard to prove the negative), and there is no evidence other than Lazar's word.

a reply to: The GUT

I wish, if I had unlimited funds or a month's heads up I would have gone.

I wonder if they are selling VIP tickets to ask questions, if they are im pretty sure it comes with all sorts of stipulations and rules about filming and maybe the requirements to submit the questions to his press people.

I will watch the video but hopefully it will be hosted by a friend so I dont have to pay, but if not I'll pony up the few $ to see it. I have listened to most of his interviews on Coast and what not, and I don't think he is a really bad guy but all of his fame(if you call it that) has served him and his business's well.

I could be 100% wrong about him and his story but so much of it all s wrong and seems like a plant

a reply to: penroc3

According to Tom Mahood, Bob's main in-depth researcher, you could just give him a simple differential equation that any college physics major could solve and see him fail to be able to do the math.

Math is what you can easily use to debunk or verify if someone has a physics degree.

We must not use the normal things people use to test 'believability', because we know there are people out there who are just very, very good at spinning a cohesive and believable story.

For example the novelist J.K. Rowling. Her story of 'Hogwarts' is 'magical' and a 'fantasy', but she is able to write a story which is very believable (not the movies, but her books) that she could stand up in front of an audience and rattle off an answer to any question without thinking about it.

Bob is very fluent, lacks cues (though there are a few) of deception and is able to babble off a physics-sounding answer, sprinkled with 'I don't know' and 'I can only tell you what I read in the blue folders' that is it mind boggling, but he is not alone. Other people do that including the known 'story-teller' Phillip Corso who is now known to be 'telling stories' as his children explain, he is very good at and none of the tale he tells is true.

Anyway, it should be pretty easy to suss out if Bob is a legit physicist and math is the way to do it, not trying to find a flaw in his 'story'.

a reply to: Maverick7

Differential equations are fxdx stuff are easy, I used to do them all the time along with fourier analysis and plas transform's etc.
That is not Degree level mathematics I would rather give him a complex equation to solve.

Now in his defense I used to be able to do those thing's really easy at 'AS' Level but then I had head injury's and a few other problem's and even simple equations my mind would go blank.
Also a lot of people need to keep in practice with there knowledge, a degree is not worth the paper it is written upon unless the person with the degree also has a tracked and tested proven history of using those equations in the real world and has not simply forgotten them or how to solve them from lack of practice and memory fogging with we all have - well almost all.
But a research scientist whom has multiple PHD's and is actually not only using them but constantly expanding upon them in there own equations is another matter entirely.
As are mathematician's whom may be crap at history, engineering and art but know there numbers.

I was once humiliated like that, I told someone while I was in Japan about my electronic's training which I had not used, I did mention that I had head injury's which was why I dropped from a degree course and then they asked me to solve a simple differential equation and my mind went blank to my absolute horror and humiliation, It was not there fault but after head injury's I had lost the ability to concentrate and lost a few memory's as well, the once simple equation's were like something written in a foreign language.

Easier and more fair due to his claim to being to being trained in electronics give him some karnaugh map's and a few - make them complex if you like Boolian expressions to solve.

But remember most that learned this stuff even without a knock on the head never actually used those equations in there real life, they are part of there early adult or late childhood schooling and like the face of there old teachers probably long forgotten.
But in your favor if someone had extensive research history using such knowledge then they would be able to solve something a little more complex than that.

I would argue also that there are people whom could easily solve those equation's that had nearly no schooling such as self taught TV repair men and amateur electronic's enthusiasts which the US has plenty of many of whom if given the chance could outdo most that have formal qualification's in the field.

Here is an anecdotal but funny fact, LONG DIVISION, the oldest form taught to kid's in junior school these day's is almost not used at all in day to day life but for some higher level mathematics this simple practice has often to be retaught to student's whom have forgotten how to perform long division since it form's a necessary component of many equation's.
Very simply and low level electronic's often also uses J notation, now what is J you might ask, well it is used to represent an impossible number and is substituted for algebraic equation's, J is used to represent the square root of -1.

Or electronic's color codes, most of you learned them in school but how many remember.
Black = 0
Brown = 1
Red = 2
Orange = 3
Yellow = 4
Green = 5
Blue = 6
Violet = 7
Gray = 8
White = 9

Silver tolerance +/- 10%
Gold tolerance +/- 5%
Brown tolerance +/- 1%


Best way that electronic's was ever 'analogized' to me was that it is like plumbing but instead of water we are dealing with electron's and instead of gravity we are dealing with potential difference.
Often for the sake of calculations complex circuit's are mathematically reduced to an equivalent Norton or Thevenin (Thevenise it) circuit in order to simplify the calculations.
Super position theory is also used to solve mathematical dilemma's arising from multiple power sources etc this is all low level stuff not even high level.

a reply to: Springer

Thank you Springer,

anything that has George Knapp in it is always a pleasure to see, and his many years of tackling these kinds of subjects has really done a lot to bring out all kinds of things into public view. Area 51 is known all around the globe because of his journalism and Bob Lazar's story about his work near there. Looking forward to this!

a reply to: LABTECH767

Sorry to hear about your injury.

What I was getting at was the way to test Bob's credentials was not to ask him how 'gravity A' works, which he could flummox his way through with "faux-Physics talk" which is hard to separate from real knowledge, but to ask him a math equation or something along those lines.

Now we know he has skill in areas like solar power, hydrogen generation from hydride, jet-engines (which he might have taken from some person who sold those, but I digress).

I'm not in a position to say what kind of an equation might be relevant, maybe solving a limit, or a differential equation or something like recognizing a formula which ALL physicists should be able to say in their sleep.

Maybe ask him to write out Einstein's first field equation and name the terms.

A physicist would know that Rμν was 'sigma', 'nu', (the first part of the Ricci Tensor part). for example.

Or ask yourself if you had a masters in Physics what part of that education would remain with you that a person who is familiar with the periodic table, the standard model and that kind of thing would not really understand. To me the thing that makes real physicists stand out is their understanding of the math.

Of course you'd want to make your question something that would anticipate the requirement that the questions be given beforehand (for some 'reason' of brevity or something) or that he couldn't sidestep and say 'it's been 30 years since I solve a differential equation. So you might then say 'well can you recognize a differential equation if I show it to you?', or give him a card with the field equation on it and ask him to go over it.

You might say 'what is Hilbert space' or 'what is Minkowski space' or 'what is a Calabi-Yau manifold'? I've only had one Modern Physics class and we solved differentials and reduced equations and talked about all that (it included quantum mechanics at a beginner level and relativity), and I could give a rough idea just seat-of-the-pants, but there are not concepts that a layperson who read up on physics could describe yet anyone trying to reverse engineer a gravity emitter would have to know.

Or ask him in detail how he knew the atomic number of the the stuff he was told was something 'LA-1000' packed in what turned out to be aero-gel?

Anyway you get the point.

dupe

a reply to: Maverick7

Personally I do not believe in ANTI gravity since it would require anti time but hey I may be wrong.
Now there is a theory that gravity arises as a non local (to our time space continuum - the universe we know) event and that is why it is actually so very weak compared to other forces such as electromagnetism etc.
Now this is also partially explained in brane theory - a spin off of quantum theory which has the idea of universe's called membranes as they are modeled as a two dimensional entity which float around in a hypothetical space which would be the REAL universe beyond called super space, the theory's speculates that sometimes these membranes collide and when they do thing's like our universe come into being and gravity is actually not from the membrane universe that most of our reality is based in but that it rather comes from another membrane universe in peripheral contact with it.
IF so then gravity is not a product of mass but rather it is lense'd by it.
Now to explain that we will have to go to superstring theory which is yet another hypothetical model of our universe.
Superstring postulates that everything including empty space is made up of one substance and this is the so called superstring, matter is really just superstring bunched up if you like or a waveform to a more speculative observation of it.
If so then gravity is actually at a ONE TO ONE ratio with TIME everywhere in space except were there is a bunched up area of that superstring - or membrane - and so there the gravity to volume of space ration is far larger while the time to volume of space ratio is actually lower.
But Membrane theory may allow us to find a way to make artificial contact with other membrane universe in superspace and to use there particular property's to nullify or bypass both time and gravity.

Bit long winded I know but it is merely me speculating on the subject.

Until then our best option is quantum science which may allow us to make something very like anti gravity or even to find real anti gravity - though that would be even more dangerous than the atomic bomb ever was since playing with that may also create localized time reversal's and even has the potential to expel an object using it from the time space reality perhaps into a negative time stream with no way of saving itself.