Trump Admits he Punked his Supporters on Mexico Paying for the Wall

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You say that but Trump keeps failing at his "deal making". Though he keeps assuring us he is a top rate deal maker.

Yes he has about a half-century's worth of experience in deal making, and you pretend like he doesn't know what he is talking about.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: randomthoughts12
a reply to: buster2010

Yes and he just started. When he gets up there and tells a bold face lie to the people over and over like keep your doctor along with all the other crap we are finding out he boldly lied to our face.....Then I will stop defending him. People like MCCAIN, Pelosi, Waiters, Wasserman and so forth deserve this negative attention before Trump.

Feel free to link some bold face lies and I will see if it changes my mind.

Trump has told more bold faced (and easily proven) lies than any politician in modern history. The fact you excuse all of them to say this just tells me you aren't even close to sincere about your statements. Hell his lies range from the petty to ones like this where he lied about campaign promises or others where he pursued policies and agendas counter to what he promised on the campaign trail. There is literally zero chance I believe you will ever hold Trump to the same honesty standards you hold Obama, because we passed that line a LONG time ago.

And since you asked:
T r u m p ’ s L i e s

Partisanship has infected the minds of America.

I frequently listen to unfiltered audio from both chambers of Congress -- and I can honestly say that listening to most politicians talk is beyond annoying. They're afraid to say anything that could be used as a sound-bite to indict them during election season, so their entire modus operandi consists of "Attack opponent, promote myself." They never, ever leave campaign mode.

And they all sound EXACTLY the same. Anyone who can listen to any of these guys without recognizing the robotic con-job isn't listening very hard: and yet partisans do it all the time.

Partisans are useful-idiots, carrying water for their party: "Attack the other party/Promote my party."

Seriously, what kind of BS is this?

And of course Trump takes it to a whole new level. His brand of stink is the worst I've ever encountered. But it's the same old partisan crap from his supporters. Trump is okay because he's my guy.

I would normally be quick to point out that the President's haters are also acting like partisan useful idiots, attacking him for anything and everything. But how do I reconcile that with the fact that nearly everything the man says is almost utterly devoid of substance? It's hard. Belee me.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I'm not pretending anything. I'm looking at his results. Clearly his half century of deal making doesn't translate over as well as he thought it would to politics. Ranting at Congressmen on Twitter or ranting at the Mexican President to pay for his wall isn't going to get either of them to do what he wants them to do. They'll just shutdown and make it harder to negotiate with them.

Of course it's obvious why. He's a conman who is willing to walk away from things just because things get tough and that is something you can't do in politics, and he only has that one trick. Once politicians called his bluff the first time, he ran out of options to dealmake for future endeavors.

originally posted by: randomthoughts12
a reply to: buster2010

Yes and he just started. When he gets up there and tells a bold face lie to the people over and over like keep your doctor along with all the other crap we are finding out he boldly lied to our face.....Then I will stop defending him. People like MCCAIN, Pelosi, Waiters, Wasserman and so forth deserve this negative attention before Trump.

Feel free to link some bold face lies and I will see if it changes my mind.

Up to three so far.
Promise Broken rulings on Trump-O-Meter

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: introvert

It's one of the unspoken checks and balances of the government. Public civil disobedience. It is an American tradition that dates back 241 years. Trump can rant and rave about whistleblowers, protestors, rioter, ramble rousers, and other ways liberals are speaking out, but the more he does the louder they'll get. Americans don't like being ignored.

True. I think it could be said that is one of the reasons Trump came to win the presidency. His supporters felt that their ideas and beliefs were being ignored by the "establishment".

Now that he is in power, he should set the example, lead a strong administration and people would follow his lead. It appears he is not doing that. These leaks are indicative of his weak leadership.

originally posted by: Dudemo5
But it's the same old partisan crap from his supporters.

QFT. Partisanism is at an all time high these days and arguing against it is rather tedious. Especially with how badly the right keeps trying to beat down the left for the right's own failures. Its pathetic really. The left can be partisan too, but the right is taking the taco currently.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I'm not pretending anything. I'm looking at his results. Clearly his half century of deal making doesn't translate over as well as he thought it would to politics. Ranting at Congressmen on Twitter or ranting at the Mexican President to pay for his wall isn't going to get either of them to do what he wants them to do. They'll just shutdown and make it harder to negotiate with them.

Of course it's obvious why. He's a conman who is willing to walk away from things just because things get tough and that is something you can't do in politics, and he only has that one trick. Once politicians called his bluff the first time, he ran out of options to dealmake for future endeavors.

You're looking at the so-called results of which will not be apparent until his presidency is finished. Didn't you do the same sort of fortune-telling during the election, assuming he was going to lose?

a reply to: introvert

It's funny how the very coalition that rose up and took control of the government because they were being ignored is fostering the EXACT same sentiment towards the rest of the population. All they are doing is heralding the end of their movement that much sooner, and Trump is leading the way into obscurity.

a reply to: introvert

Now that he is in power, he should set the example, lead a strong administration and people would follow his lead. It appears he is not doing that. These leaks are indicative of his weak leadership.

The leaks could also be indicative of unelected bureaucrats hell-bent on stifling the democratically elected leader.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Krazysh0t

I'm not pretending anything. I'm looking at his results. Clearly his half century of deal making doesn't translate over as well as he thought it would to politics. Ranting at Congressmen on Twitter or ranting at the Mexican President to pay for his wall isn't going to get either of them to do what he wants them to do. They'll just shutdown and make it harder to negotiate with them.

Of course it's obvious why. He's a conman who is willing to walk away from things just because things get tough and that is something you can't do in politics, and he only has that one trick. Once politicians called his bluff the first time, he ran out of options to dealmake for future endeavors.

You're looking at the so-called results of which will not be apparent until his presidency is finished. Didn't you do the same sort of fortune-telling during the election, assuming he was going to lose?

I'm not fortune telling. I'm going by his results. Trump has been President for 7 months now. Other Presidents have legislative victories under their belt and are shored up for the coming legislative battles for the months and years to come. Trump has diddly outside of signing a bunch of EO's that overturn policies Obama put into effect. Or have you already blocked the recent failure to repeal Obamacare out of your head? Are you ignoring the fact that Congress literally forced Trump to sign a bill putting more sanctions on Russia?

I don't need to make predictions when Trump's existing failures are already on display.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I'm not fortune telling. I'm going by his results. Trump has been President for 7 months now. Other Presidents have legislative victories under their belt and are shored up for the coming legislative battles for the months and years to come. Trump has diddly outside of signing a bunch of EO's that overturn policies Obama put into effect. Or have you already blocked the recent failure to repeal Obamacare out of your head? Are you ignoring the fact that Congress literally forced Trump to sign a bill putting more sanctions on Russia?

I don't need to make predictions when Trump's existing failures are already on display.

"Results" while at the same time suppressing evidence to the contrary is not "going by his results" by any stretch of the imagination.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: introvert

Now that he is in power, he should set the example, lead a strong administration and people would follow his lead. It appears he is not doing that. These leaks are indicative of his weak leadership.

The leaks could also be indicative of unelected bureaucrats hell-bent on stifling the democratically elected leader.

That is a possibility as well, though that would be on Trump to uproot those people and kick them out on their asses. Perhaps that is what Sessions will discuss tomorrow at his press conference.

What we cannot deny at this point is that Trump is not providing stable, respectable leadership. Poor leadership leads to resentment and higher turnover. That's a very basic management principle.

It all starts at the top.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope
What evidence am I suppressing? That's a might tall accusation you just leveled without any supporting reasoning.

a reply to: introvert

That is a possibility as well, though that would be on Trump to uproot those people and kick them out on their asses. Perhaps that is what Sessions will discuss tomorrow at his press conference.

What we cannot deny at this point is that Trump is not providing stable, respectable leadership. Poor leadership leads to resentment and higher turnover. That's a very basic management principle.

It all starts at the top.

I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that Trump is not providing stable, respectable leadership, but it is likely not from anyone working for him. A tweet or opinion piece is not an adequete measure of work environment.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

What evidence am I suppressing? That's a might tall accusation you just leveled without any supporting reasoning.

You mentioned his so-called results while mentioning one or two things that favour your assertion. You failed to mention other measures of success such as the economy, deregulation, immigration and so on.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope
Well I COULD go there, but that just makes things worse for Trump. But hey, I like putting you in your place so let's continue since you brought it up:

Economy - Trump likes to take credit for this, but this is Obama's economy still. Funny how up until the election Trump was ranting and raving how this exact, same economy was in the toilet. Trump hasn't passed a tax plan or budget yet and the one that they are trying to push through currently is one page long, missing tons of important details, has no money to fund it because Obamacare repeal failed, and is facing the same Republican divisions that doomed the Obamacare repeal.

Deregulation - Actually I already went into this when I mentioned how Trump has done a lot of things to remove Obama era policies. Older policies have to go through Congress for removal, so he has much less movement there.

Immigration - Well first off we have the spectacular failure that is his border wall promise (you know the reason this thread was written?). Congress doesn't want to pay for it either so all they've done is approve funds to finish pending improvements/construction that pre-dates Trump's Presidency. I guess we can note how Trump has stepped up illegal immigration deportations, but he also lied and said that he would only deport violent criminals and repeat offenders. Instead he deports pretty much anyone who innocently checks in with ICE. And finally that brings us to his new Immigration bill that he debuted recently. That piece of # has agreement for the merit based system, I'll give it that, but it is facing fierce opposition because it wants to cut legal immigration numbers by half. Something that runs counter to Trump's economic goals of getting to 5% gdp growth.

So pretty much anything that he can do by himself, he has no problems implementing. But whenever he needs to "deal make" he falls flat on his face.

Got anything else you'd like me to comment on? Feel free to point out Trump's victories that make me wrong. I eagerly await your spin.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Oh it's Obama's economy. So everything that is good is Obama's doing, everything bad is Trump's doing.

As for the border wall it hasn't even started yet. If you say it is a failure now, much like you said his campaign and run for president was before the election was over, we'll have some eggs on faces if it ends up being built.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Oh it's Obama's economy. So everything that is good is Obama's doing, everything bad is Trump's doing.

You said that. Not me.

As for the border wall it hasn't even started yet. If you say it is a failure now, much like you said his campaign and run for president was before the election was over, we'll have some eggs on faces if it ends up being built.

Maybe but considering that there is no feasible way that wall could be built and finished before Trump's Presidency ends, the next President could halt construction on it before it is finished. So that isn't even guaranteed. In any case, as it stands Trump is still batting 000 in the legislative department. That is something you can't get around no matter how much "Hope and Change" you are guzzling.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: introvert

That is a possibility as well, though that would be on Trump to uproot those people and kick them out on their asses. Perhaps that is what Sessions will discuss tomorrow at his press conference.

What we cannot deny at this point is that Trump is not providing stable, respectable leadership. Poor leadership leads to resentment and higher turnover. That's a very basic management principle.

It all starts at the top.

I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that Trump is not providing stable, respectable leadership, but it is likely not from anyone working for him. A tweet or opinion piece is not an adequete measure of work environment.

As the leader of the party, he couldn't get the GOP to pass anything in regards to Obamacare. The GOP is pushing back on the transgender issue and he has GOP senators openly saying they are glad Kelly is in as CoS to help put some order in to the admin.

That does not indicate strong leadership when you can't get the party in power, which you are the leader of, on your side.

a reply to: introvert

Don't forget that Congress mobilized to prevent Trump from firing Mueller or Sessions while they are on break and unanimously voted to add more sanctions against Russia AND remove some of Trump's power to withdraw and add sanctions at the same time. Trump is getting some serious rebukes from the Republicans currently.