So now flirting or asking a girl out is sexual harassment

a reply to: Phage

Phage...

I cannot believe what I am seeing. One of the most famous, renowned, intelligent and all-time go-to members for anything science related or if you want to experience a potent sense of dry wit...just encouraged another member to continue his self-deception. How could you do such a thing? I suppose you agree with what he wrote? Have you read everything up until now...please tell me you haven't and just saw his comment and it seemed appropriate to the thread title.

A sad, sad day indeed.

a reply to: grainofsand

‘Stealthing’ is the alarming new sex trend where men remove condoms during sex without consent

The study’s author Alexandra Brodsky said she wanted to study this phenomenon after she realised so many of her female friends were having negative sexual experiences.

They were “struggling with forms of mistreatment by sexual partners that weren’t considered part of the recognised repertoire of gender based violence, but that seemed rooted in the same misogyny and lack of respect,” Brodsky told The Huffington Post.

Many had experienced “stealthing” but weren’t sure how to handle the situation.

“Survivors [of stealthing] describe nonconsensual condom removal as a threat to their bodily agency and as a dignitary harm,” Brodsky writes in the study. “‘You have no right to make your own sexual decisions,’ they are told. ‘You are not worthy of my consideration’.”

What’s worse, is that there is a growing online community of men encouraging others to practice “stealthing”.

“Internet forums provide not only accounts from victims but encouragement from perpetrators. Promoters provide advice, along with explicit descriptions, for how to successfully trick a partner and remove a condom during sex,” says the study.

Brosky opens the study with the story of a woman named Rebecca, who had been “stealthed” herself, and found many other women were calling the sexual violence crisis hotline where she worked, sharing similar experiences.

“Their stories often start the same way,” Rebecca said. “’I’m not sure if this is rape, but ...’”

WOW! Talk about coincidence and timing. What are the odds...is news.com.au monitoring ATS or something?

It looks like Sweden was not the only expected target after all. This is a PURE propaganda piece, mark my words. Soon in Australia "stealthing" will be the "new" addition to the apparent rape culture that is so prevalent throughout the West...

Taking a vowel of celibacy seems rather appealing now. (No, I am actually not joking when I say that.)

a reply to: Dark Ghost

Dark Ghost,

I think you have misunderstood what I am, what I do, and the reason I do it. I do not behave like a gentleman because it makes others happy. It does not. Some of my friends, although they find it useful at times to have a gentleman as a friend, continuously tell me that my unwillingness to alter my path even slightly frustrates them, because they see it as something which prevents me from getting ahead, from competing in the dating market for example, which has precisely no use for a fellow of my calibre.

They also find it frustrating when they are trying to drink me under the table, but force of will and a necessity to remain capable of uprightness and logical thought prevent me from succumbing to even the most inhuman levels of alcohol consumption. But that is by the by.

I am a gentleman because it makes ME happy to be so. Like many things that are worth doing in this world, it is not easy, but it is worth a great deal TO ME, to occupy the position in life that I have made for myself. I have been given in life, many reasons to fail to respect myself, to fail to love myself even slightly, to sublimate myself in favour of the needs of others, or simply to make my life easier. But I do respect myself, and although I do not think I am in any way a glorious thing, I do love myself enough. Not too much, not too little. Enough. And I do NOT sublimate myself willy nilly, only taking myself out of the picture entirely, the better to be a good friend when people need it, when it is absolutely necessary. I am not a gentleman for the purposes of other people, but for my own purposes. The fact that occasionally people come to appreciate the solidity of what I represent, when they really need someone unflappable and unrelenting to stand beside them, or hold them up when the chips are down, is a happy, a very happy accident.

With that in mind, with it understood that I do what I do because it pleases me greatly to do so, affords me a measure of self respect and the like, you must also understand that revelations of the nature you refer to in the post to which I am responding, have precisely no consequence or affect on my choice to live life the way I do. They do not, in and of themselves, or in combination with any other factor, induce me to lay down my character and my dignity, my self respect. These things, you see, are the only things that cannot be taken from me by force of arms, or the arm of the law.

It is also wrong to consider me to be one who merely plays the gentleman. I simply am one. This is not a game, this is not a persona I erect, this is who I am. This is, as the young people might say, how I roll.

I find it very difficult to understand why it is, you think the information contained within this thread, ought to make me change my position. From what I understand of it, all the information in this thread has said, is something I have known for many, many years. My beliefs are outmoded, the modern age has no use for them, or particularly, for me as a person. That does not mean that I will stop holding those beliefs, because I still have a use for them. I still maintain that the ability for me to respect myself is a necessity, regardless of how little use the world at large may have for me, or what I represent. I am who I am, and ridiculous, antiquated and anachronistic as it may be, it pleases me greatly to be the man I am, rather than pretend to be something I am not. I consider myself very lucky in that regard, despite the limitations it may place upon my progress from time to time.

Why is it you think, that I ought to change the fabric of my character, to keep up with a world I find absolutely rife with detestable and ignoble behaviour?

a reply to: TrueBrit

TrueBrit, I have been somewhat disparaging of your previous contributions in this thread, but this:

The point is this: As a man, all I have any control over, or should have any control over, is my personal conduct. If my standards of behaviour, comportment and conduct are high, then it does not matter what the people around me are doing. I can rest easy knowing that I did my part. I do not need for everyone around me to operate to my standards, I only need to make sure that I do.

showed me that I might have misinterpreted your intent. If so, I apologize.

Integrity, as in doing what one feels is the correct action irrespective of base desires, is a good thing.

My problem is not that I cannot control bodily urges... I certainly can, and do... but that doing so can often be insufficient. People are quite capable of lying, making inaccurate conclusions, or setting traps for the unsuspecting to fall into. Being a 'gentleman' offers no protection from such. And in the society I find myself living in, it most certainly does matter what others around me do.

So while I do agree with your philosophy, I cannot agree with its sufficiency. Experience has shown me different.

TheRedneck

This is why western civilization will be eclipsed by other cultures in less than a century. Political Correctness will lead to declining populations at unsustainable levels (it is already). PC does not exist in these other culture, certainly not to the extent it does here.

Figure though, I guess...people are so selfish and self-absorbed now days, the future is irrelevant to them.

a reply to: TheRedneck

I appreciate your admission, with regard to your initial interpretation of my contributions.

I also accept that you are correct, in so far as being a gentleman does not protect one from being defamed, and I have personally experienced such a thing, so I know whereof I speak in that regard.

originally posted by: Dark Ghost
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

IF she then asks for advice, tell her one way she can help herself is to suggest she TRY dressing more modestly. (You did mention "the totality of all the shots taken together would amount to a virtual guarantee of death if nothing were done to mitigate the risk." Which indicates you realise her being so attractive puts her at an extra risk compared to most average or ugly women, even though she never chose to be attractive in the first place.) Reality is reality whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, so if you DO care for her as you say, it's probably best to use your position as a man to inform her of this knowledge you have picked up.

You've got to be kidding, right?

The reason we have sexual harassment rules is because we've decided, as a society, that we don't want women to be afraid to be attractive. It is their RIGHT. Rights are worth fighting for.

They are also worth ruining someone's career for if they don't UNCONDITIONALLY respect that right as an ABSOLUTE right.

Men who make a woman's attractiveness into a liablity for her and then get fired get exactly what they deserve.

In regard to the rest of your "male guilt" identity stuff, it's unfortunate you need to highlight the worst in male behaviour from almost 100 years ago as if it has not — at all — improved in terms of the the male collective behaviour as a whole today in the year 2017, while disregarding women's progress in the Western world, and all the accomplishment that has been made in that time.

The reason I think it's 100 times worse for her is because in a one on one fight, I can kick that guy's ass if I'm cornered or stalked.

Again, I am not judging you because I have never met you before or even interacted with you on this forum (unless I have forgotten), but I do pick up some signs that you might be overcompensating for the guilt you feel as a man seeing these other men do these things and feeling so powerless to stop them from hurting women like your friend, that you choose to instead believe that most men have this problem, most men are potential psychos so therefore it is acceptable to treat all men as potential psychos to avoid any risk.

I likened it to Russian Roulette precisely because I believe only a small percentage of the male population has this problem.

But just like in the game of Russian Roulette, it only TAKES a small percentage to kill you.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Mate...the picture you are trying to paint is an easy picture to paint in an online forum, actions speak louder than, and since I can't observe you in action I'm left having to take your word for it.

AndI think you're a liar.

a reply to: HeathenJessie

You could have suggested that I was mistaken.

You could have suggested that I simply do not know what I am talking about. But no. You had to make a personal attack on me, suggesting that I am a liar. Why? Have I been discourteous to you during my interactions with you in this thread? Have I made accusations against you, belittled you, antagonised you and insulted you throughout?

Why then, do you see the need to be accusatory and rude?

originally posted by: Dark Ghost
a reply to: Phage

Phage...

I cannot believe what I am seeing. One of the most famous, renowned, intelligent and all-time go-to members for anything science related or if you want to experience a potent sense of dry wit...just encouraged another member to continue his self-deception. How could you do such a thing? I suppose you agree with what he wrote? Have you read everything up until now...please tell me you haven't and just saw his comment and it seemed appropriate to the thread title.

A sad, sad day indeed.

you pick fights with everyone on this board? Is it everyone else that is bad/wrong or maybe just you that is a bit nutz?

Im very curious about you, are you male? age? how many friends? do you live in your parents basement? Do you like video games?

can you please post a pic?

thank you

a reply to: TrueBrit

You're mistaken...

I haven't insulted you throughout this thread, out of 19 pages I've responded to you twice.

a reply to: HeathenJessie

That is not what I asked.

I asked, why you had to be rude and accusatory, and call me a liar, when all I have done throughout this thread, is be polite and try to explain myself as best I can? I think that is a fair question.

a reply to: TrueBrit

I don't have to give into your demands.

But since you were so polite in asking, let me make it clear....the stuff you are claiming, the attributes you are claiming, about how you're a proper English gentleman, I believe to be in the least exaggerated or at worst, false.

Hence...lies.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Now, since I was civil and gentlemanly enough to answer to your demanding questions, perhaps you can extend that same courtesy to me and answer my question...

Why do you care what some random dude in a forum thinks of you?

a reply to: veracity

I'm pretty sure he's tall, athletic with shoulder length blonde hair, and a penchant for the dark side. You know, a handsome brooding type.

a reply to: HeathenJessie

I do not care what you think of me. I am concerned as to why you felt it appropriate to be rude and accusatory, absent any legitimate inducement to do so. It is a matter of community. As a member of this community, you are expected to treat other members with a certain degree of respect, and refrain from personal attacks, for example, calling someone a liar, which is a pretty combative position to take.

You can call me out on my position, my argument, but calling me a liar is over the mark, and I want to make sure you understand where that mark is. The reason for that, is that I value the community here, and it only functions when everyone is playing from the same rulebook.

a reply to: TrueBrit

You know what - let me answer my own question.

You care, because...normally, you'll construct some well-written post that's full of virtue, and it's a house of cards.

Normally, people on the forum see that it's TrueBrit...a nice guy, an old ATS stalwart...and they simply give you the pat on the back you desire and the praise you crave for prosting something so eloquent, so thought provoking.

But it is a house of cards, and all it really takes is one person to highlight that it is, for the most part, virtue signalling BS...the minute someone does that, the little house of cards collapses and you're exposed.

And you don't like it...you can't handle it. So you need, demand answers.

I'm sick of BS artists getting applause because people are too blind or too scared to challenge them simply because of who they are, or their status on some forum. Most of what you said is nonsense that wouldn't fly in the 19th century never mind the modern day.

Offer her my coat, indeed!

Anyway...this threads crap.

I'm out.

a reply to: HeathenJessie

And if I was a BS artist, I would agree with you.

I am sorry that you have not experienced enough decent people, to accept that there are people of uncommon good character, walking the world.

If a guy ever flirted with me, Id just kick him in the gonads. End of problem.

People are too hooked on love crap. Who f'ing cares!

Signed a Woman who doesn't give a f'ck about that sh't.

Finding aliens is so much more entertaining. Get over yourselves. Sorry to be blunt but holy crap, get another bloody hobby...