'Space federation'

To skip all the repetitive and repeating arguments and personal attacks, which by the way shouldnt exist. Just opinions, and their differences.

"We were all created equally the same, yet equally different"

The truth is, and I second earthsister on this, and anyone else whom may be aware: This "Federation" does in fact exist, and it is not a far fetched, metally-unstable concept. (Though they would LIKE for you to be thought of as unstable, and farfetched.)

I do not care to go into details now, but.. Many "starseeds" "indigos" etc, may 'be' and very well 'are' members of this "fed-eration" assuming a "ground crew" type of situation. And no, I am not an irrational thinker. Origin speaks for itself. The way this concept is talked about is mostly put in a way a human can understand it. It differs vastly from any preconceived notions you may have, but in general.. they are "of the light' so to speak.

Personally, I just got fed up with all the abduction, cow mutilation, malevolent fear-striking et crap. I began my search with chemtrails and local ufo sightings, I then experianced something totally out of the context of words. I wanted the truth, and it may not be nessisarily easy to swallow for most of you - It was not for me. (Being such a sacreligious, unbeliever and skeptical-of-all evil kind of young man.) But it did not come without exceptional proof for me and many of those who are close to me. Make your choice.. Its solely yours. "Free will"

The truth changed my life and how I live it completely. To say the least.

I hope you all live to see these words become a reality, cause I sure anticipate the years to come.



[edit on 30-4-2005 by Cide]

Originally posted by Cide
To skip all the repetitive and repeating arguments and personal attacks, which by the way shouldnt exist. Just opinions, and their differences.

"We were all created equally the same, yet equally different"

The truth is, and I second earthsister on this, and anyone else whom may be aware: This "Federation" does in fact exist, and it is not a far fetched, metally-unstable concept. (Though they would LIKE for you to be thought of as unstable, and farfetched.)

I do not care to go into details now, but.. Many "starseeds" "indigos" etc, may be and are very well members of this "fed-eration" assuming a "ground crew" type of situation. And no, I am not an irrational thinker.

I just got fed up with all the abduction, cow mutilation, malevolent fear-striking et crap. I wanted the truth, and it may not be nessisarily easy to swallow for most of you - It was not for me. But it did not come without exceptional proof for me and many of those who are close to me. Make your choice.. Its solely yours. "Free will"

The truth changed my life and how I live it completely. To say the least.

I hope you all live to see these words become a reality, cause I sure anticipate the years to come.

So anytime any questions are raised, it becomes a personal attack?

I will agree, sarcasm and name calling is unwarranted, and I've been guilty of that myself.

But if someone is going to weave a fantastic tale, and portray it as gospel truth (which i also have an issue with), I want some proof....any proof....

Wanting to discover nature's truth's is a very HUMAN endeavour.

So let me in on it.....trust me ...I can handle it.

If you can't.....your gonna get this......

Originally posted by warthog911
Not at all earth sister,i believe in you but its just that the dulce files and lacerta files tell a different story.They tell about the unholy six alliance,dracos taking over planet earth by covert manuplation like mind controlling of world leaders like bush and the placing of NWO and the illuminati.It's just that you say that there are 218 alien races and i find it odd that if there are 218 races then why they dont reveal themselves.There is more proof about the elohims creating us,saurians manuplating our society,greys working for the reptilians and so on.I am sorry that i put the lol simily.And who will be representing earth for alien contact for the federation?

Sorry, warthog. I see I misunderstood the tone of your reply. Of course not everyone can see what is true and what is not true. I am not offended by disbelief, but you should not just believe anything anybody says. It seems you are willing to absorb everything available to you and then go somewhere down the middle maybe. The truth does not sound much like all the bunk traveling around so don't expect the stories to match.

Almost everything you hear and read about alien life is UNTRUE. People lie A LOT. People lie by mistake and on purpose for lots of different reasons. Few people never lie about anything- I don't think I know a single one. The people who are too wise to fabricate things they might get caught for, still might lie in a subject they think they could NEVER get caught for.

True professional material about alien life is not allowed out to the public- it is confiscated, manipulated and disguised so by the time it gets to you, you would not believe it. Or you would believe it for now, only to be shown later how easy you are to fool, successfully turning your trust away from any other similar opportunity to learn something. The other "Professional" material being fed to you is fabricated to counteract any and all other TRUE information being shared by the publics. "They" put enough obvious truth in it to lure your good nature, and then they take you someplace else.

The best thing to do to protect yourself is don’t believe anything unless you experience it yourself. Wait and see for yourself. That is the rule you can go by.

Many individual humans are already representing the organization of alien races for others. It's a steadily, successfully growing effort. It is not safe or necessary for any one person to represent the aliens yet, but Japan is chosen by the organization as the nation to accept first open contact for our world.

Originally posted by The DeBunker

So anytime any questions are raised, it becomes a personal attack?

I will agree, sarcasm and name calling is unwarranted, and I've been guilty of that myself.

But if someone is going to weave a fantastic tale, and portray it as gospel truth (which i also have an issue with), I want some proof....any proof....

Wanting to discover nature's truth's is a very HUMAN endeavour.

So let me in on it.....trust me ...I can handle it.

If you can't.....your gonna get this......

Oh great, another DeBunker. Just what we all need. Let's see what damage you can "weave" and what "fantastic tales" of doubt you can portray as gospel against the truth.

You're a little late. Most members is this section of ATS already know the aliens are real. Just because they don't all know what the truth IS about them yet, does not mean they can't recognize the tactics and intentions of the real debunkers.

Ok EarthSister, can you tell me why that last post was needed?

I didn't see anything that warrented it.

Originally posted by EarthSister

Originally posted by The DeBunker

So anytime any questions are raised, it becomes a personal attack?

I will agree, sarcasm and name calling is unwarranted, and I've been guilty of that myself.

But if someone is going to weave a fantastic tale, and portray it as gospel truth (which i also have an issue with), I want some proof....any proof....

Wanting to discover nature's truth's is a very HUMAN endeavour.

So let me in on it.....trust me ...I can handle it.

If you can't.....your gonna get this......

Oh great, another DeBunker. Just what we all need. Let's see what damage you can "weave" and what "fantastic tales" of doubt you can portray as gospel against the truth.

You're a little late. Most members is this section of ATS already know the aliens are real. Just because they don't all know what the truth IS about them yet, does not mean they can't recognize the tactics and intentions of the real debunkers.

As far as Aliens go, neither I nor anyone I've ever acquainted myself with has ever seen one or their preferred modes of transport.

So as they say, seeing is believing.

They very well may exist, and I'd be ignorant to think that there wasn't a possibility of life out there in the universe other than ourselves.

But to believe that extra-terrestrial life is so abundant at a "local" level, but decides to present itself to only a "select" few is somewhat far-fetched, and actually seems quite self-serving if you ask me.

I'm truly no debunker, just a realist who actually finds possibililties based on fact and evidence much more intriguing.

People such as yourself weave a compelling tale, and unfortunately for you, a guy like me thinks the only thing that would make it all the more interesting, is if you could provide some shred of evidence that it were true........and drawings of aliens that look like they came off the cover of Michael Jackson's BAD album...does not suffice.

[edit on 30-4-2005 by The DeBunker]

[edit on 30-4-2005 by The DeBunker]

WOW why should anyone bother posting with all the bickering? Here's some real information regarding the original subject is there a GALACTIC FEDERATION and for the proof youll just have to dig for it yourselves- Now I certainly wouldn't have come to this conclusion if a was a 'flat earth' type (an et-non-believer) and have pondered the very question of this post since first hearing about the federation in 1997. Is it real, I don't know but my opinion is based on all the research I have read on the et issue that the federation and/or other similar organizations do indeed exist.
Take it from Hollywood, who sometimes (and I believe in the case of huge budget marketing blockbuster alien pics) work to silently push the agenda of the government (not crazy conspiracy talk there are dozens of examples in the film and tv world) Just a hunch on the specific meddlings of 'close encounters' or 'independance day' or 'war of the worlds' but these films sure do play like propaganda pieces.
My whole reason for posting regarding THE FEDERATION is something WILL SMITH said when on the junket for MIB II- appearing on I think Conan or some other late-night major network show, WILL gave us a very calculated plug for us to chew on after chatting with the host about the fictional agency in the movie he said something to the effect of " You know there really is an agency that does this" or "The agency is real" or something like that. The interviewer didnt bother to follow up (they plan what they are going to say/ask) and that was that.



[edit on 30-4-2005 by tv_larry]

Originally posted by intrepid
Ok EarthSister, can you tell me why that last post was needed?

I didn't see anything that warrented it.

Intripid

Had I seen this before I went out for the afternoon, I would have asked you if you would like me to change my post, and if you did, I would have.

Here I am being put down and poked at and RUDELY, arrogantly challenged for what I experience by somebody just because they have not experienced it, so he says. I only take issue with those who are obviously actual believers- apparent by how they follow the knowledgeable experiencers around everywhere, but are ONLY provoking dissent and confusion for other members against them.

Here comes another DeBunker. Look at his name! And he quickly refers to ME in the derogatory as he's talking to somebody else! He uses words like "weave a fantastic tale" which is calling me a LIAR. And "portray it as gospel truth" which misrepresents me as having said something I never said. And "I want some proof....any proof.... " Like I am responsible for all the confusing sightings across the earth throughout history!

I am just getting ready for what's coming and if you want ATS to become like all the nowhere stalemate primitive professionally manipulated message boards you will just allow it to happen. First they attack the alien experiencers- ALL of them, not because they sound fake, but because they say they have alien experiences, but especially those who can help others. Then they attack any other member who is politely willing to listen, ask questions and THINK about the progression of our world:

But to believe that extra-terrestrial life is so abundant at a "local" level, but decides to present itself to only a "select" few is somewhat far-fetched, and actually seems quite self-serving if you ask me.

So he's saying that people who have alien experiences think they are "special" and that we are "select." Like that means THAT is true, AND that there is something wrong with people who decide to embrace their experiences and try to help others.

I'm truly no debunker, just a realist who actually finds possibilities based on fact and evidence much more intriguing.

So then why his his name DeBunker? And also, then why is he HERE in this forum, provoking those who actually could HELP him understand the alien races? LOL

People such as yourself weave a compelling tale, and unfortunately for you, a guy like me thinks the only thing that would make it all the more interesting, is if you could provide some shred of evidence that it were true........

There is that "weaving a tale thing again. And every debunker KNOWS that no evidence is true. Anything presented as evidence must be fake. It is 100 times easier to prove to people that any evidence about anything is fake than to prove that it is real. There are always endless possibilities to the unknowns. All you have to do is imagine one, and it is another possibility.

and drawings of aliens that look like they came off the cover of Michael Jackson's BAD album...does not suffice.

My drawings are very accurate to what my alien contacts look like considering that is the way I draw! And I am HIGHLY insulted by that extra debunking of my personal talent, honesty and affiliation with a ridiculous MJ remark.

If this guy doesn't believe it and doesn't want to learn about it and can't even be polite and friendly in talking about it, why should he expect any respectful personal discussion from me after he insults me?

HOW RUDELY PROVOCATIVE! He's deliberately coming here to this site to start fights by way of passive aggressive professional tactics of DEBUNKING, and to targeting certain particular kinds of knowledgeable people to do it to.

Nobody has evidence except the aliens and this "DeBunker" freaking knows that perfectly well.

Originally posted by EarthSister

Originally posted by intrepid
Ok EarthSister, can you tell me why that last post was needed?

I didn't see anything that warrented it.

Intripid

Had I seen this before I went out for the afternoon, I would have asked you if you would like me to change my post, and if you did, I would have.

Here I am being put down and poked at and RUDELY, arrogantly challenged for what I experience by somebody just because they have not experienced it, so he says. I only take issue with those who are obviously actual believers- apparent by how they follow the knowledgeable experiencers around everywhere, but are ONLY provoking dissent and confusion for other members against them.

Here comes another DeBunker. Look at his name! And he quickly refers to ME in the derogatory as he's talking to somebody else! He uses words like "weave a fantastic tale" which is calling me a LIAR. And "portray it as gospel truth" which misrepresents me as having said something I never said. And "I want some proof....any proof.... " Like I am responsible for all the confusing sightings across the earth throughout history!

I am just getting ready for what's coming and if you want ATS to become like all the nowhere stalemate primitive professionally manipulated message boards you will just allow it to happen. First they attack the alien experiencers- ALL of them, not because they sound fake, but because they say they have alien experiences, but especially those who can help others. Then they attack any other member who is politely willing to listen, ask questions and THINK about the progression of our world:

But to believe that extra-terrestrial life is so abundant at a "local" level, but decides to present itself to only a "select" few is somewhat far-fetched, and actually seems quite self-serving if you ask me.

So he's saying that people who have alien experiences think they are "special" and that we are "select." Like that means THAT is true, AND that there is something wrong with people who decide to embrace their experiences and try to help others.

I'm truly no debunker, just a realist who actually finds possibilities based on fact and evidence much more intriguing.

So then why his his name DeBunker? And also, then why is he HERE in this forum, provoking those who actually could HELP him understand the alien races? LOL

People such as yourself weave a compelling tale, and unfortunately for you, a guy like me thinks the only thing that would make it all the more interesting, is if you could provide some shred of evidence that it were true........

There is that "weaving a tale thing again. And every debunker KNOWS that no evidence is true. Anything presented as evidence must be fake. It is 100 times easier to prove to people that any evidence about anything is fake than to prove that it is real. There are always endless possibilities to the unknowns. All you have to do is imagine one, and it is another possibility.

and drawings of aliens that look like they came off the cover of Michael Jackson's BAD album...does not suffice.

My drawings are very accurate to what my alien contacts look like considering that is the way I draw! And I am HIGHLY insulted by that extra debunking of my personal talent, honesty and affiliation with a ridiculous MJ remark.

If this guy doesn't believe it and doesn't want to learn about it and can't even be polite and friendly in talking about it, why should he expect any respectful personal discussion from me after he insults me?

HOW RUDELY PROVOCATIVE! He's deliberately coming here to this site to start fights by way of passive aggressive professional tactics of DEBUNKING, and to targeting certain particular kinds of knowledgeable people to do it to.

Nobody has evidence except the aliens and this "DeBunker" freaking knows that perfectly well.

I'm sorry EarthSister, as I didn't mean to be so harsh.

If I offended you, I'm sorry. Although you gotta admit that that one alien does bear a striking resemblance to the king of pop.

I do have some bones of contention.

Firstly, the ATS board is not just a place where those who have had similar experiences to yours, can post and share. ATS at its roots, is all about challenging and questioning what is presented to us, in the hopes that some sort of facts or closure can be gained.

Secondly, yes my screen name is Debunker, but it has little to do with who I am and why I participate on this board. I enjoy engaging in challenging dialogue, and ATS by far is the perfect forum.

The problem I have is I come on here and enjoy reading about the experiences of yourself and others.

But as soon as I say "Wow, that's a great story....do you have any proof?", I get painted by the broad brush making me a trouble-maker and instigator.

Your experience is a fantastic one, and I'm sure you've been challeged about quite a bit, and over time you probably get sick of being questioned....

so in your case...i will stop questioning.

But unfortunately for you, I won't be the last.

Originally posted by The DeBunker

I'm sorry EarthSister, as I didn't mean to be so harsh.

You absolutely, certainly did!

If I offended you, I'm sorry. Although you gotta admit that that one alien does bear a striking resemblance to the king of pop.

THAT is not an apology, it is another insult. What do you think I am, stupid?

I do have some bones of contention.

Firstly, the ATS board is not just a place where those who have had similar experiences to yours, can post and share. ATS at its roots, is all about challenging and questioning what is presented to us, in the hopes that some sort of facts or closure can be gained.

Respectful members can do that very well without your kinds of tactics. For a wonderful example, please visit this thread: www.abovetopsecret.com...
and this one: www.abovetopsecret.com...
And many others where members ask what they want to know and have no difficulty expressing their disbelief without personally offending the poster with an all out attack. The moderators in these forums do not allow personal attacks, not even by sneaky debunkers.

Secondly, yes my screen name is Debunker, but it has little to do with who I am and why I participate on this board. I enjoy engaging in challenging dialogue, and ATS by far is the perfect forum.

People choose their names for a reason. I don't believe that it's a mere coincidence that you chose that name and then happened to act just like it too for no reason.

The problem I have is I come on here and enjoy reading about the experiences of yourself and others.

How is that a problem for you? You are welcome to read and engage in discussions, but you are not welcome to insult other members just because you do not agree. You singled me out, without ever having talked with me before. I am not going to just let you treat me that way.

But as soon as I say "Wow, that's a great story....do you have any proof?", I get painted by the broad brush making me a trouble-maker and instigator.

But that is not what you said. Go back and look again at what you actually said. And you certainly DID start trouble with me immediately, and tried to instigate a fight with me by talking about me, insulting me, to somebody else.

Your experience is a fantastic one, and I'm sure you've been challeged about quite a bit, and over time you probably get sick of being questioned....

Wrong. I love to be challenged and questioned by honestly serious skeptics as well as believers and those just interested. And I can take a lot of heat. Read my back posts and see for yourself. I just don't like being provoked and attacked with sneaky tricky tactics designed to belittle myself or others and confuse the real issues.

so in your case...i will stop questioning.

Thank you very much!

But unfortunately for you, I won't be the last.

I know who and what you and those like you are. You are one of a relentless tide of debunkers working to throw sticks into the spokes of progression of true public knowledge. If you don't want the bad name of DeBunker, don't wear it and don't act like a wannabe. You are on ATS now, which is not one of the rude, cruel, chaotic free-for-all sites you got your debunking training on. You don't have to act like that here. If you want to hear what somebody thinks about something, just ask.

If you are curious about the truth about the alien races, there are many informed members of ATS who are willing to talk with you about what they know, if you are reasonably polite and respectful, whether you "believe in them" or not.

Originally posted by The DeBunker
So anytime any questions are raised, it becomes a personal attack?

I will agree, sarcasm and name calling is unwarranted, and I've been guilty of that myself.

But if someone is going to weave a fantastic tale, and portray it as gospel truth (which i also have an issue with), I want some proof....any proof....

Wanting to discover nature's truth's is a very HUMAN endeavour.

So let me in on it.....trust me ...I can handle it.

If you can't.....your gonna get this......

The thing is no one of us knows ALL the truth. So we should be careful right?

No one begs you to believe in anything. And not all of other people are too foolish to choose right beliefs. Everything that is not falsified has a chance to be true. I don't have a fantastic tale nor do I believe in any gospel but I thumb down your attitute.

And you say you can handle the truth without a picture on what they are talking about. I thumb down this ego.

Based on these I do not think it is beneficial for you to know anything. I'm no sarcastic but 100% serious. People would better rule out arrogance and paranoia before dealing with these stuff. After all we expect to have our lives continue even with aliens flying around, don't we? (But I'm fine if they don't come. I'm not that bored about my life.)

In fact if you want to know there are way so many information on the internet you can read. But EarthSister is right. "Stop believing every single thing you hear."

Regards,
string

[edit on 30-4-2005 by silentstring]

THis thread has become one big argument, how sad, its such a good topic.
Anyways,

How do you think that the world woould change if a federation was revield to the public?

I think some of the more fanatical types would kill themselves, but apart from that I dont think there would be a great amount of negativity.

Originally posted by silentstring

Originally posted by The DeBunker
So anytime any questions are raised, it becomes a personal attack?

I will agree, sarcasm and name calling is unwarranted, and I've been guilty of that myself.

But if someone is going to weave a fantastic tale, and portray it as gospel truth (which i also have an issue with), I want some proof....any proof....

Wanting to discover nature's truth's is a very HUMAN endeavour.

So let me in on it.....trust me ...I can handle it.

If you can't.....your gonna get this......

The thing is no one of us knows ALL the truth. So we should be careful right?

No one begs you to believe in anything. And not all of other people are too foolish to choose right beliefs. Everything that is not falsified has a chance to be true. I don't have a fantastic tale nor do I believe in any gospel but I thumb down your attitute.

And you say you can handle the truth without a picture on what they are talking about. I thumb down this ego.

Based on these I do not think it is beneficial for you to know anything. I'm no sarcastic but 100% serious. People would better rule out arrogance and paranoia before dealing with these stuff. After all we expect to have our lives continue even with aliens flying around

, don't we? (But I'm fine if they don't come. I'm not that bored about my life.)

In fact if you want to know there are way so many information on the internet you can read. But EarthSister is right. "Stop believing every single thing you hear."

Regards,
string

[edit on 30-4-2005 by silentstring]

So let me get this straight.....

It's better that I not be provided any proof because someone like "me" couldn't handle the truth.

Talk about arrogance. This actually plays to a point that I made earlier that many folks that have had these "experiences".

I have no problem with someone getting up on the proverbial soapbox and professing the wonderful events that come to pass in there lives.

But as soon as you say "is there any genuine artifact, document, or alien tracking device jammed into your cerebral cortex that you can show me ..........or ANYTHING.....to lend a little more believablity to you story".....the stock answer is usually "there nothing I can show you other than to say, we will all be experiencing something wonderful soon, then we'll all know the truth, and until then only "I" have been chosen as the special communications conduit between earth and this other worldly intelligence." Umm.....OK?

As far as finding all the evidence I need on the internet, I think our ideas of concrete evidence may differ a bit. Hypnotically induced testimonials, fuzzy photos, and drawings don't quite cut it....for me. With some folks, that might be all they need.

I may have been one of those guys who thought the earth was flat, but at least someone would have eventually been able to provide me concrete evidence to prove otherwise and make me look like ang ignorant turd.

In this case, that hasn't happened yet, and with regards to the topic of this thread, I'm "arrogantly" confident that anyone ever will in any of our lifetimes.

The shame of it all is that I truly want to believe. It would be great to know that we are not alone in the cold universe, and that someone is watching over us, and will prevent us from destroying ourselves in this pre-pubescent era of our civilzation. For the sake of family and those close to me, I want to believe that VERY, VERY badly.

But years of getting duped by false prophets, snake-oil salesmen, and the emotionally unbalanced have made me very skeptical.

So as far as I'm concerned, don't proclaim having a message, because I will question the messenger and it's source.

After going through this entire thread thoroughly, I found something pretty frightening.

Although I personally have doubts reagarding alien experiences, I can appreciate the conviction and knowledge some posters have presented on this thread.

And yet after being labeled as nothing more than a dis-crediting trouble maker by some, I find these same people questioning the motives of other "experiencers", and painting them as government "agents" or just naive sheep.

This is hippocracy at it's highest level.

Apparently we are being forced at gunpoint to believe that the alien experience franchise belongs to only a select group.

I have been convinced of one thing......

Witch hunts are alive and well in eastern Massachusetts.



[edit on 1-5-2005 by The DeBunker]

Originally posted by The DeBunker
It's better that I not be provided any proof because someone like "me" couldn't handle the truth.

This is only_my opinion_at this moment_. In this circle negative thoughts can be badly made use of.

I have no problem with someone getting up on the proverbial soapbox and professing the wonderful events that come to pass in there lives.

I doubt the objectivity of this saying. You'd better ask the story teller whether he/she thinks it wonderful, or rather, disturbing. I am not familiar with the discussions on EarthSister's stories. But she warned you to stop believing anything even what she said. Does this suggest she's another emotionally unbalanced, or something else? Your choice. I just think sometimes we need to treat others in a more HUMAN way.

In this case, that hasn't happened yet, and with regards to the topic of this thread, I'm "arrogantly" confident that anyone ever will in any of our lifetimes.

There is a possibility that nothing will happen to the public. In that case you can claim your victory and I'll be really happy for it, although that will never change what others have experienced.

The shame of it all is that I truly want to believe. It would be great to know that we are not alone in the cold universe, and that someone is watching over us, and will prevent us from destroying ourselves in this pre-pubescent era of our civilzation. For the sake of family and those close to me, I want to believe that VERY, VERY badly.

I guess you are using your confidence in a wrong way. If you think we are on the path of destroying ourselves, ask yourself what you have done, and what you can do, to make this world better even for a little bit. Before making choices for your family and those close to you, ask them what they actually want. It might be your good luck that nothing has happened to you. The truth can be very farfetched. There can be different kinds of aliens and we do not know all their true purposes and physical properties. And so it is void to expect someone to tell you what exactly will happen.

No one in this thread said they are 'a selected group'. We are human. We are in a same group.

Edit: did't read your last post.


[edit on 1-5-2005 by silentstring]

Originally posted by silentstring
I am not familiar with the discussions on EarthSister's stories. But she warned you to stop believing anything even what she said. Does this suggest she's another emotionally unbalanced, or something else? Your choice. I just think sometimes we need to treat others in a more HUMAN way.

silentstring

Thank you for speaking up here regardless of your personal beliefs. More people should really do that for others, but luckily we have wonderful MOD's on ATS who enforce the rules and keep most ridicule in check. I applaud them every day.

Since we are already way off topic because of "this" subject, here is something I think you will find very interesting. It is about a sneaky movement, and to know about it is imperative to your understanding and education about what is happening on Earth to true information about alien life. There are many intelligent professionals doing this for the powers of Earth, and lots of annoying little people copying them and doing it too. ATS is not immune from either of them.

It's called Zen . . . And the Art of Debunkery. I have the author's permission to refer to it here. This is a little bit taken from the whole insightful article at members.aol.com... which I highly recommend for your study of the subjects of alien life. There are many other sites on the Internet to learn about this sinister, psychological art also.

Part 2: Debunking Extraterrestrial Intelligence

Argue that all reports of humanoid extraterrestrials must be bogus because the evolution of the humanoid form on Earth is the result of an infinite number of accidents in a genetically isolated environment. Avoid addressing the logical proposition that if interstellar visitations have occurred, Earth cannot be considered genetically isolated in the first place.

Argue that extraterrestrials would or wouldn't, should or shouldn't, can or can't behave in certain ways because such behavior would or wouldn't be logical. Base your notions of logic on how terrestrials would or wouldn't behave. Since terrestrials behave in all kinds of ways you can theorize whatever kind of behavior suits your arguments.

Stereotype contact claims according to simplistic scenarios already well established in the collective imagination. If a reported ET contact appears to have had no negative consequences, sarcastically accuse the claimant of believing devoutly that "benevolent ETs have come to magically save us from destroying ourselves!" If someone claims to have been traumatized by an alien contact, brush it aside as "a classic case of hysteria." If contactees stress the essential humanness and limitations of certain ETs they claim to have met, ask "why haven't these omnipotent beings offered to solve all our problems for us?"

When reluctant encounter witnesses step forward, accuse them indiscriminately of "seeking the limelight" with their outlandish stories.

Where hypnotic regression has yielded consistent contactee testimony in widespread and completely independent cases, argue that hypnosis is probably unreliable, and is always worthless in the hands of non-credentialed practitioners. Be sure to add that the subjects must have been steeped in the ET-contact literature, and that, whatever their credentials, the hypnotists involved must have been asking leading questions.

If someone claims to have been emotionally impacted by a contact experience, point out that strong emotions can alter perceptions. Therefore, the claimant's recollections must be entirely untrustworthy.

Good day all,

sorry i haven't participated much in this topis, but i have been busy.

First off No-one should try to debunk any experiences or stories on this thread as No-one as yet is portraying their experiences as 'you must believe them or else'. It is up to you and your own personal experiences if you believe a perticular person or not. If you really want to debunk an ATS members experiences then this isnt the place for you.

*****If you just want to turn this thread into a continuation of an unessisary argument then dont even bother posting!!!!!*****

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MY own oppions is that i think that Earthsister and her experiences are genuine, but that is just my belief. She is a teacher and does not need anybodies acknologment to know that her ecperiences are real, she experienced them.

Before i talked to EarthSister and read her webpage, i was really scared of aliens and all teh stuff that come with it. As soon as i heard her experience and knowledge i felt relief and a sense of happiness in me. I cant really describe it that well, but hearing Earthsister has changed me alot.

You lot probally think that it is stupid baseing your life on someone... 'blah blah blah' but i genuine have a feeling that she is telling the truth.

I just wish we were all as lucky as her and her family, of recieving such exelent and important teachings.

All hypothetical based on contactee reports.

Why do ET visitors go through apparent large effort for continued personal contact with a few humans over many years, and then go out of their way to make sure that it is virtually impossible for any other human to verify the story objectively? If I were a contactee put in this position, I'd tell them I think they were being jerks to me.

i.e., if they are trying to get across a message to "humanity" in general, they're not going about it very well. In fact, positively atrociously. The message now for most people is that "ETs are for loonies".

If they were all telepathic species maybe they don't understand how much "external evidence" humans need to convince one of the other rather than "beaming thoughts" to one another. Maybe some aliens are (literally) physically incapable of lying to one another since they can be "scanned". So this idea and the interactions based around it (where humans have to talk and not just imagine) aren't obvious. but still---they're supposed to be the smart ones.

If there's an alien coverup, it's 99% their fault.

If they want to send us a message, land in Times Square or downtown Tokyo and give us a book.

Like one called.....say "To Serve Man" j/k

Howdy all, I'm new to actually posting here, although I've been lurking anonymously for some time now (or I think anonymous, you never know - oops that belongs in a seperate forum).

Firstly, thanks to both EarthSister and gl2 for posting some completely fascinating personal experience. You have both expended a considerable amount of effort to bring your experience and information to this forum, and that is very commendable. You both help to expand our minds and think outside of the box.. erm... perhaps outside of the big blue marble would be a more appropriate metaphor.

I wanted to add my 2c to the conversation very briefly. In my short time on this planet, I have begun to realize that there is truly nothing which can be PROVEN as true. This may seem to belong in the nether regions of the study of philosophy, but it has a direct bearing here. Most of us understand that even our own personal experiences can be false or could be manipulated in some way shape or form (hallucinogenics, lucid dreams, whatever). I am not suggesting that any of the experiences or information posted here is false.

So given that we understand that information can be false for whatever reason (not necessarily malevolent reasons), and personal experience can fail you, what's left? Good question, and I think the answer is nothing. No thing. But there are times that we experience something or read something and there is a feeling that arises inside that just makes the information FEEL right. It's intuition, and it's correct more often than not, I believe. My hallucination is that most of us are not in good communication with our intuition because of societal influences (again, a discussion which belongs in another forum).

My point is this. Read these posts, and try to get a sense of what feels right to you. Most of us visit this forum because we believe that there is extraterristrial intelligence abound in the universe, and we desperately want to be part of the bigger picture. Trust that instinct, that intuitive process and see what you feel before you make any judgements. And above all, try to be excellent to each other!!

As for my own humble hallucinations, I perceive there are elements of both sides that are correct (and my apologies to other posters because I've focused mainly on ES and GL2's posts). I firmly and possibly naively believe that if a race was to advance for millions of years as both posters profess, it must move beyond the desire for anything physical, even if it should be something as large as a planet. Isn't that why we're fighting amongst ourselves now? Paltry scraps at the dinner table? To imply that joining the cosmic community means joining the fray at a larger table for bigger scraps doesn't sit right with me. Also, it seems right to me that there are likely beings far more advanced than the ones who are physically visiting our planet that are interested in what may be happening. But to ascribe argumentative traits to races that have existed for billions of years seems a little strange to me. I would think that even communicating with such beings would be nearly impossible given their understandings of the universe. Have you ever tried to discuss exopolitics telapathically with an ant? Well.. erm.. wrong place to ask that kind of question, I guess but you get my point.

Take everything with a grain of salt (celtic sea salt if possible), and be excellent to each other!! After all, think about this: if either end of this spectrum played out, if alien beings are completely hostile and we battle for the survival of humanity or if alien beings are completely benign and we spend years realigning our belief systems - what would we have left at the end of it all? Don't spew your jolt all over your keyboard when I say this, but we would only have each other. We won't be able to join a universal community in a meaningful way for quite some time to go, and we wouldn't have a whole lot of luck defending against races with a million year head start. We need to stick together and support each other, put away the distrust and fear that permeates our society and just have some fun together!!

Peace, love and good fortune to all of you.

First off No-one should try to debunk any experiences or stories on this thread as No-one as yet is portraying their experiences as 'you must believe them or else'. It is up to you and your own personal experiences if you believe a perticular person or not. If you really want to debunk an ATS members experiences then this isnt the place for you.

*****If you just want to turn this thread into a continuation of an unessisary argument then dont even bother posting!!!!!*****

I couldnt have said it better myself.