Why Are White Americans So Racist?

Some great insights here.. when you can disregard all of those who clearly lump human beings into certain unalterable categories, you can find some genuine concern and intelligent thoughts concerning the greater good for all of mankind.

a reply to: SuspiciousTomThe Roman empire, would not discriminate: slaves were both white and black (so were Emperors and Popes).
In the middle ages, all European countries outlawed slavery (of course, Western powers retained countless "civilized" ways to enslave their citizens, but that's another story), whereas the African kingdoms happily continued in their trade.
Therefore, only colored people could be slaves, and that is how the stereotype for African-American slavery was born.
It was not based on an ancestral hatred of blacks by whites, but simply on the fact that blacks were the only ones selling slaves, and they were selling people of their own race. (To be precise, Christians were also selling Muslim slaves captured in war, and Muslims were selling Christian slaves captured in war, but neither the Christians of Europe nor the Muslims of Africa and the Middle East were selling their own people).
Europeans began transporting black slaves to America, most trade was just that: "trade". In most instances, the Europeans did not need to use any force to get those slaves.
The slaves were "sold" more or less legally by their (black) owners.
Scholars estimate that about 12,000,000 Africans were sold by Africans to Europeans (most of them before 1776, when the USA wasn't yet born) and 17,000,000 were sold to Arabs.
The legends of European mercenaries capturing free people in the jungle are mostly just that: legends.
A few mercenaries certainly stormed peaceful tribes and committed terrible crimes, but that was not the norm.
There was no need to risk their lives, so most of them didn't: they simply purchased people.

It's just disgusting how people will side with police officers and bring up a guys record. What about the thousands of other men, women, and children that were killed by law enforcement? You can't expect people to be selectively executed and not fight back.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: Puppylove

My point being: cause and effect.

Shuffle me into an environment where I have no chance to raise my kids with honor, character, etc, and you can expect disastrous results.

Some people are poor due to circumstance. Others, due to choices. The incredibly dense populations found in urban developments means that you essentially comingle the two above (with everyone else) and ensure that the lowest common denominator brings down the average.

Some context to how your culture can actually change your brain:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Rather than quote boring text, the summary is: neuroplasticity allows our brains to mold to our environment. Ill add to this the results of epigenetic impact from the socioeconomic and environmental stressors.

Long story short: there are real consequences to the herding of people into ghettos. Cause and effect.

Well said. Let me see if I can use this wording and get an angle here. Post-Slavery, forced into the ghetto, if you've never lived in a ghetto you won't understand the mentality, you won't understand what you have to do to survive. This is where privilege which so many people deny comes in. Let me tell it to you here, if Joel says "Hey lil bro, move this brick for me" if you don't do it, you can die. You can get threatened. You must appropriate yourself, if you're soft, you can find yourself dead. Peer pressure is a real thing, it's not just smoking cigarettes after school with your buddy cause that's cool. There's far more to it, having a gun forced into your hand at a tender age, and using said gun to kill a man of the same skin color because he's not aligned to the goals of those that placed that gun in your hand, it's no easy task. It's not ohh, just get up go get a job. Beyond that, they will have 2 personalities around their friends that aren't from the ghetto they show their fun, jovial side. But once they enter their home grounds they must 'act hard' and 'be hard'. Some of us here cannot understand that it goes beyond having a choice. A lot of kids killed out there, by the hands of 1 above him because of kill or get killed.

It's not just murders, police brutality, racial profiling, the way we are framed in media. Don't assume everyone you see out there is there because of the narrative, "Ohh police are killing you guys real bad", many are there because of their own experiences with the police. Who do you turn to, it's almost an impossible plea to those who cannot conceptualize or understand the conditions one experiences. You think an entire race is unjustly rioting because oh, they just want more, oh they are all stupid and cannot see beyond simple concepts. The black race has had its fair share, Slavery > Segregation > Partial Acceptance.

For those that can't understand privilege a great one is, you are assumed innocent until found guilty. And as for the guy who also made mention of peaceful protest, Colin Kaepernick received much negative feedback. Anything done, is criticized.

a reply to: Ujjvala

Everyone brings up gang violence and black on black crime but no one wants to talk about the roots of it like cycles of abuse and poverty and lack of economic opportunities. No one wants to highlight that their drugs and guns come from white people. Why would the powers that be stop white arms dealers from selling to blacks when they'd like for them to destroy each other?

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I understand, but what's your solution? The only one I can think of is to change that environment. Which is not easy to do.

I have all sorts of solutions. But not being an expert in any way, i have no idea if they'd work, make things worse, etc. So im a poor source for solutions, honestly. Im more of a "lets brainstorm and think" kinda guy.

That said, i think that forcing anything at gunpoint (like desegregation did) is a horrible idea. The only way in is hearts and minds. Rather than penalize bigots legally, it'd be far better to allow social pressure to do its job. The one thing I have that may help:

news.rpi.edu...

Scientists at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute have found that when just 10 percent of the population holds an unshakable belief, their belief will always be adopted by the majority of the society. The scientists, who are members of the Social Cognitive Networks Academic Research Center (SCNARC) at Rensselaer, used computational and analytical methods to discover the tipping point where a minority belief becomes the majority opinion. The finding has implications for the study and influence of societal interactions ranging from the spread of innovations to the movement of political ideals.

“When the number of committed opinion holders is below 10 percent, there is no visible progress in the spread of ideas. It would literally take the amount of time comparable to the age of the universe for this size group to reach the majority,” said SCNARC Director Boleslaw Szymanski, the Claire and Roland Schmitt Distinguished Professor at Rensselaer. “Once that number grows above 10 percent, the idea spreads like flame.”

As an example, the ongoing events in Tunisia and Egypt appear to exhibit a similar process, according to Szymanski. “In those countries, dictators who were in power for decades were suddenly overthrown in just a few weeks.”

Just 10%. That is all it takes....10%.

a reply to: SuspiciousTom

A "race" isn't rioting, an extreme minority of a "race" is rioting. Stop trying to talk for all black people. As I said I know many who do not buy into this narrative and are fed up with it. They are people like that free hugs guy. These are the normal innocent peaceful people who you never see rioting anywhere. You're quick to defend the rioters. Almost all the rioters arrested in Charlotte are from out of town. These aren't even the people from that community. You're standing up for people coming into other peoples communities and wrecking the place. You're also quick to ignore all the black people who are not the rioters that say you are wrong and implore people to stop protecting the criminals and pushing this agenda.

originally posted by: Ujjvala
a reply to: Ujjvala

Everyone brings up gang violence and black on black crime but no one wants to talk about the roots of it like cycles of abuse and poverty and lack of economic opportunities. No one wants to highlight that their drugs and guns come from white people. Why would the powers that be stop white arms dealers from selling to blacks when they'd like for them to destroy each other?

Uh huh. no a majority of drugs come from other countries that arent majority white. Guns are from all over as well. the roots of the problem is not lack of oppurtnity but lack of motivation to improve their own lives instead of letting th e government give them hand outs.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

But how does that work when you have to diametrically opposed ideas both at 10%, they can't both encompass the whole culture they are opposites. How does this 10% thing interact with other 10% "unshakeable" ideas?

a reply to: SuspiciousTom

If we are to bring in trauma and PTSD....you are opening a whole nuther can of worms. One that happens to live in the gritty underbelly of all of humanity, but seems to be distilled into something more concentrated among the poor.

www.nctsnet.org...

Even with that, its not just the exposure to people. Its the exposure to constant crisis:

Optimal family functioning can be negatively impacted when families experience chronic exposure to
trauma(s) and environmental stressors associated with urban poverty . Urban poverty increases the number of trauma exposures, as well as distress associated with the high burden and hassles of daily living. When coping resources are depleted family relations can suffer and vital functions, such as protection from harm, provision of basic needs, and capacity to adapt and develop, are threatened, often resulting in perpetual cycles of crises. Although it is widely accepted that parental response and family functioning are powerful mediators between trauma and its impact on children, including treatment outcomes more research is needed to understand how all levels of the family system promote resiliency and adaptation or present risks to positive outcomes

Note: i removed all the citations, which make it unreadable here. Click the link if you want to see the whole thing.

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: SuspiciousTom

I'm curious though, where are all the bullhorns and protest leaders reminding everyone to stay non violent... was a really good strategy that seems abandoned these days.

Protests seem to lack generals, leaders and organizers once they start these days. You run a completely chaotic protest you get a completely chaotic protest.

Well I have no clue where the idea of the protest came from. It could be just persons angry who've spread word that they are going to show their disdain. BLM supporters? I think many people fail to understand BLM is understood by many as exactly what the phrase suggests rather than the organization which goes by the name.

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

But how does that work when you have to diametrically opposed ideas both at 10%, they can't both encompass the whole culture they are opposites. How does this 10% thing interact with other 10% "unshakeable" ideas?

Now you know why i am just some dude on the internet, and not giving TED talks.

I just don't know. I read a lot, and am smart enough to link disparate ideas together. Im a brainstormer....but thats it. I don't have solutions beyond those for my own home and job.

One other idea that comes to mind is to muzzle media, and encourage a rebirth of journalism. Journalism doesn't report on skin color, media does. Journalism isn't concerned with the number of viewers, media is.

a reply to: SuspiciousTom

So the US police are killing black people

This is what I'll never fully understand... Why make the issue of police brutality in america a racial issue?
It's pretty much fact that blacks are not the only ones subject to mistreatment by LEOs,your honestly apart of the problem as to why police continue to abuse their power over the citizen. Of course racism still exists in the U.S but to suggest a disproportionate amount of victims of police brutality tend to be African-American is such a skewed perspective on the bigger issue.

Trust me Cops will use force against anyone if you give them a reason to do so, you can find countless questionable uses of force against children,women and crippled men all over the internet...

Why not focus on why such violence occurs to begin with and how to reduce said violence,rather than rehashing the same bs I and many members have heard here and elsewhere on the web.

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: SuspiciousTom

A "race" isn't rioting, an extreme minority of a "race" is rioting. Stop trying to talk for all black people. As I said I know many who do not buy into this narrative and are fed up with it. They are people like that free hugs guy. These are the normal innocent peaceful people who you never see rioting anywhere. You're quick to defend the rioters. Almost all the rioters arrested in Charlotte are from out of town. These aren't even the people from that community. You're standing up for people coming into other peoples communities and wrecking the place. You're also quick to ignore all the black people who are not the rioters that say you are wrong and implore people to stop protecting the criminals and pushing this agenda.

The mindset of a black person outside of poverty is different from that of one who is within it. The mindset of one who has to face the struggle is different. An entire race will never see eye to eye on everything. The mindset of a college educated student is far different from that of an uneducated student. They are also treated differently, but they are still both subject to the same racial profiling.

Show me the black people suggesting that we are wrong and the narrative doesn't exist. Mind you, I'm not out here looking for a riot, but you can't control emotionally charged people.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

We need good journalism back desperately.

I'm a brainstormer myself. I'm not really pretending to have all the answers. Just trying to express ideas and solutions as I've seen them. I've tried starting several brainstorming threads specifically to no positive effect.

I have many different opinions on things now than I had when I first started on ATS. I used to be damn near one hundred percent anti-cop.

I still am to a degree. I tend to take the opposite side of any extreme that's getting too much support and is clearly too far outside the bounds of truth and hope to bring people closer to the truth so we can deal with the situation and not the distorted view of it.

I am very anti-police corruption however, and were this a thread unrealistically making all police out to be saints, I'd probably be on the other side.

There's two sides to every story, and more often then not the truth lies towards the middle.

a reply to: NateTheAnimator

You are absolutely right.....

....but I can attest to the basic profiling done by police, and how it changes their interaction with you. When I had long hair and a goatee, i ran a local call center. The way I was treated by LEO then, vs now when I have a full beard and short hair, is remarkably different. I know it sounds dumb....but once I cut my hair I didn't even get pulled over for traffic violations. Let alone have my car searched.

So the attitude that the citizen begins engagement with during interactions with LEO can vary widely just based on physical appearance. Which, in turn, alters the attitude of the citizen going forward. Due to my own negative interactions with LEO in my life (note: i have no convictions on my record, and have never been arrested for anything other than being harrassed over a traffic violation), I have a VERY negative outlook towards them.

originally posted by: NateTheAnimator
a reply to: SuspiciousTom

So the US police are killing black people

This is what I'll never fully understand... Why make the issue of police brutality in america a racial issue?
It's pretty much fact that blacks are not the only ones subject to mistreatment by LEOs,your honestly apart of the problem as to why police continue to abuse their power over the citizen. Of course racism still exists in the U.S but to suggest a disproportionate amount of victims of police brutality tend to be African-American is such a skewed perspective on the bigger issue.

Trust me Cops will use force against anyone if you give them a reason to do so, you can find countless questionable uses of force against children,women and crippled men all over the internet...

Why not focus on why such violence occurs to begin with and how to reduce said violence,rather than rehashing the same bs I and many members have heard here and elsewhere on the web.

Read through the thread and have a jolly good time finding the answers to the questions you ask, with statistics. Hopefully, it's different from the "bs" you've read elsewhere.

a reply to: SuspiciousTom

You can at least attempt it. That's the problem with BLM protest resulting in riots the only people attempting real peace are people like the free hugs guy. There's one example for you. You're making excuses for people not even trying to control themselves.

There's right and wrong ways to do things. Disorganized chaotic protests only ever end badly. Stop defending them and help me educate and encourage proper effective protesting without riots.

Things were much worse during Martin Luther King Jr's day and they managed it. Instead of making excuses look, learn and educate.

You're enabling bad behavior by doing not a damn thing to stop it, nor encouraging anything to prevent it, and refuse to look at and consider things that have proven effective in the past.

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: SuspiciousTom

You can at least attempt it. That's the problem with BLM protest resulting in riots the only people attempting real peace are people like the free hugs guy. There's one example for you. You're making excuses for people not even trying to control themselves.

There's right and wrong ways to do things. Disorganized chaotic protests only ever end badly. Stop defending them and help me educate and encourage proper effective protesting without riots.

Things were much worse during Martin Luther King Jr's day and they managed it. Instead of making excuses look, learn and educate.

You're enabling bad behavior by doing not a damn thing to stop it, nor encouraging anything to prevent it, and refuse to look at and consider things that have proven effective in the past.

I agree. Not suggest to them to be peaceful is bad, and enabling.

Not pointing fingers, just another point; would you not argue it's enabling to allow an officer to go on paid suspension after killing someone who disrespected him? Or didn't follow his orders? Doesn't it suggest ohh, that doesn't matter. He's a nobody anyway?

Mind you I still have your idea of 'crime will surge if police fall back'