Whatever they are, they are not normal cloud formations

Okay, someone explain this one to me, the day after I wrote this OP I was walking to the store doing what I normally do, looking at the sky, not for evidence of anything, just observing, and as if to answer a question for me these planes appeared going in the same direction, both at a seemingly high altitude and both with vapors behind them, strangely they both did not do the same thing as they traveled, one plane had "persistent" vapors that lingered long after they appeared and the other plane had vapors that evaporated, so tell me why?

Why did they have different vapors? Are you going to tell me that their exhaust was affected differently because of the atmosphere they were traveling in? According to my eyesight, they looked very similar in size, they seemed to be at very similar altitudes and yet they behaved completely different.

How come some days I see nothing but normal planes exhaust and on other days I see these "persistent" ones, same weather on either day, from an altitude perceived to be the same daily? Are you doubters seriously trying to tell me that there are no such thing as "manufactured" "persistent" vapor trails? Not buying it. You must be the same people that think Oswald acted alone and that 9/11 was investigated properly.

a reply to: INEVERQUIT

Yes. One was flying in drier air than the other. Just because they looked at the same altitude doesn't mean they are. I've seen pictures from the ground of two aircraft that looked side by side, with a 10,000 foot difference in altitude between them.

The atmosphere changes very rapidly and very radically in short distances. If you were to measure the temperature at ground level, there are places you could measure a 10 degree temperature difference in about 10 feet starting at ground level. Why wouldn't the upper atmosphere change that fast too?

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: GoShredAK

The black line is a contrail shadow. Like any shadow it's going to be longer than the object casting it, depending on the angle of the sun.

Thanks Zaphod

Here is another that was created shortly after the first pic,

You can really see the shadow..

a reply to: waynos


Thanks for the well written and thought out response

a reply to: GoShredAK

That's a good one. You don't see the shadow often. There has to be an extremely thin layer of cloud to cast it on.

originally posted by: INEVERQUIT
Okay, someone explain this one to me, the day after I wrote this OP I was walking to the store doing what I normally do, looking at the sky, not for evidence of anything, just observing, and as if to answer a question for me these planes appeared going in the same direction, both at a seemingly high altitude and both with vapors behind them, strangely they both did not do the same thing as they traveled, one plane had "persistent" vapors that lingered long after they appeared and the other plane had vapors that evaporated, so tell me why?

Why did they have different vapors? Are you going to tell me that their exhaust was affected differently because of the atmosphere they were traveling in? According to my eyesight, they looked very similar in size, they seemed to be at very similar altitudes and yet they behaved completely different.

Yeah it's weird looking isn't it, but an altitude difference of 1000ft, called vertical separation, can make a huge difference as both aircraft could be flying through different conditions. The atmosphere is very fluid in this respect.

How come some days I see nothing but normal planes exhaust and on other days I see these "persistent" ones, same weather on either day, from an altitude perceived to be the same daily?

Perceived is right, it's impossible to judge altitude with the naked eye. Couple that with the common basic airliner layout of a tube with wings and an engine on either side that is shared by aircraft so vastly different in size as the 75 passenger E170 and the 400 passenger 777-300, and the task is even more impossible.

Are you doubters seriously trying to tell me that there are no such thing as "manufactured" "persistent" vapor trails? Not buying it. You must be the same people that think Oswald acted alone and that 9/11 was investigated properly.

But that's just a stupid thing to say.

a reply to: INEVERQUIT


This photograph helps to illustrate what I was saying. The Air India 787 is at 15,000ft descending into BHX, around 85 miles from my location, while the 777-200F (with the blue tail) is at 28,000ft on its way to Frankfurt. It certainly doesn't look almost twice as high and these are two similarly sized aircraft. With an aircraft half the size of the 787 going to BHX the positions may well appear reversed. This is the problem with looking up and guessing.

originally posted by: waynos
a reply to: INEVERQUIT


This photograph helps to illustrate what I was saying. The Air India 787 is at 15,000ft descending into BHX, around 85 miles from my location, while the 777-200F (with the blue tail) is at 28,000ft on its way to Frankfurt. It certainly doesn't look almost twice as high and these are two similarly sized aircraft. With an aircraft half the size of the 787 going to BHX the positions may well appear reversed. This is the problem with looking up and guessing.

Great photo. And illustrates things perfectly.

a reply to: waynos

damn Wayne, I wish I could put you in my pocket and pull you out with your photos whenever I need to explain this in a visual way. Fantastic point.

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: waynos

damn Wayne, I wish I could put you in my pocket and pull you out with your photos whenever I need to explain this in a visual way. Fantastic point.

I wish i could be in HIS pocket and go to all the cool plane spotting locations he seems to go to.

a reply to: waynos
Indeed a very nice illustration. One could also use google maps and look at the bigger airports to see how much the planes differ in size:
Airport Heathrow

originally posted by: Sometimes

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Sometimes

originally posted by: nancyliedersdeaddog
a reply to: Sometimes

It seems like the experts aren't really experts at all.
Metabunk

How can someone prove something doesn't exist? Do you not find it strange that these experts on "chemtrails" don't realize how flawed their method was when collecting samples and all the holes people have been able to poke in their arguments?

If a government agency can legally use weather modification devices, why wouldn't they? To say chemtrails don't exist I want proof that every contrail does not contain some chemical that aides in cloud formation and or blocking out light from reaching the Earth. But when a farmer comes out and says, "Hey, in the past five years I have tested my soil and the metals aluminum and barium keep increasing in the top layer, how is that possible unless it is in the water," then what else is the cause if there are no factories near his farm and yet he has photographic evidence pointing to planes as being the main culprit? I'm sorry but a contrail should not bea able to sit in the air for hours and spread into a haze, that is not merely water exhaust.

I'd very much like to see these lab tests and historical comparisons if you have them handy

Here is a link GeoEngineering Watch to everything geoengineering with links to studies, news articles, etc. That is merely one that is available but there are quite a few. Here is a news video from that site I picked at random.

Do you have any actual examples of changes in soil composition you described? And please don't tell me to look for them myself

originally posted by: Sometimes
Here is a news video from that site I picked at random./quote]
This is already debunked:
contrailscience.com...
They mixed up the units, the reporter admitted he was wrong.

But I see it was already dealt with....

edit on 15-6-2016 by MissVocalcord because: Already covered, need more caffeine

originally posted by: MissVocalcord

originally posted by: Sometimes
Here is a news video from that site I picked at random.

This is already debunked:
contrailscience.com...
They mixed up the units, the reporter admitted he was wrong.

Yes I already covered that on page 4

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Sometimes

originally posted by: mrthumpy

originally posted by: Sometimes

originally posted by: nancyliedersdeaddog
a reply to: Sometimes

It seems like the experts aren't really experts at all.
Metabunk

How can someone prove something doesn't exist? Do you not find it strange that these experts on "chemtrails" don't realize how flawed their method was when collecting samples and all the holes people have been able to poke in their arguments?

If a government agency can legally use weather modification devices, why wouldn't they? To say chemtrails don't exist I want proof that every contrail does not contain some chemical that aides in cloud formation and or blocking out light from reaching the Earth. But when a farmer comes out and says, "Hey, in the past five years I have tested my soil and the metals aluminum and barium keep increasing in the top layer, how is that possible unless it is in the water," then what else is the cause if there are no factories near his farm and yet he has photographic evidence pointing to planes as being the main culprit? I'm sorry but a contrail should not bea able to sit in the air for hours and spread into a haze, that is not merely water exhaust.

I'd very much like to see these lab tests and historical comparisons if you have them handy

Here is a link GeoEngineering Watch to everything geoengineering with links to studies, news articles, etc. That is merely one that is available but there are quite a few. Here is a news video from that site I picked at random.

Do you have any actual examples of changes in soil composition you described? And please don't tell me to look for them myself

I'll take that as a "no" then. Next question is why did you think there were examples of what you claimed?

It's amazing how sometimes you just hear a song that is perfect for what you're doing at the time. For example, just now;

"So many things I could have done but clouds got in my way,
I've looked at clouds from both sides now,
From up and down but still somehow
It's cloud illusions I recall
I really don't know clouds at all"

Both Sides Now - Mel C. How's that for a chemtrail anthem?

a reply to: shycitizen

It's amazing to me yow many people seem unable to grasp elementary science. Kind of scary.

a reply to: INEVERQUIT

Not sure what to think of it but here is an interesting conspiracy theory about what is really going on...

I`m not convinced that this is indeed happening to all of us but I cannot deny the possiblity to say the least. It is far more sinister than I could have ever imagined and so absurd at the same time that can easily be hidden in plain sight.

INEVERQUIT, don't you wonder why this person is spending so much time and energy trying to disprove to you what you have already noticed and seen with your own eyes? a reply to: 3danimator2014