Abortion doctors would lose medical licenses under new Oklahoma bill

originally posted by: ArnoldNonymous
a reply to: Annee

Left my auger in the shed so no goal posts are getting moved.

While abortion, murder, and slavery may not have a direct connection, making an argument that says if something doesn't specifically affect me I should be okay with it.

While it may not affect me, it affects another being (although unborn).

Abortion is Legal

Murder is a crime

Slavery also illegal

originally posted by: Tempter

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: BIGPoJo

Can you offer examples of other "elective" procedures which have been made illegal based on "moral" grounds?

I can. M.U.R.D.E.R.

Is that an acronym? What's with the periods?

a reply to: Greggers

Didn't you know? Women are murder on their periods and are murdering between their periods.

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: buster2010

The absolute incredible stupidity and reckless endaangerment to actual humans walking around in this is staggering. I would say I am speechless, but Republicans do this kind of thing DAILY. They think BY THE MINUTE what is the NEXT family values looking thing we can WRITE as a proposed law to get more votes? It is ABSOLUTELY sickening.

If this passes and when the death rate for 'back alley abortions' goes up in Oklahoma maybe they can ask forgiveness from whatever God they pray to.

In the hypothetical (legal) abortion free world I wonder how these holier-than-thou types are going to feel about the huge spike in crime, domestic abuse and people on welfare. That's exactly what 'God' has in store for them if they get their way. In addition to the back alley deaths, of course.

Pro 'life' yay!

a reply to: SlapMonkey

Looks like Atsbhct has already covered the statistics of accidental pregnancies. Allow me to address female sterilization.

I'm currently pregnant with my third at 37, I am SO done with this crap. I have a hernia, carpal tunnel and pelvic injury from the previous pregnancies. I have to have a c-section so my big plan was to do a tubal at the same time. But I just came across PTLS (post tubal ligation syndrome) and I'm really having second thoughts. Apparently a lot of women experience hormone imbalance, heavy bleeding, pain and massive weight gain. Doctors believe this is a 'myth', because they will never admit that they caused a f*ck up. But I've read through literally hundreds of posts from women who say it's the biggest mistake they've ever made. And despite the quoted statistics women still do get pregnant after the procedure, usually an ectopic (tubal) or otherwise abnormal pregnancy...resulting in what? A necessary abortion.

Just pointing out that even the most 'fail proof' methods have life altering consequences and could still result in abortion.

another story, this time, Queensland...


It involves a twelve year old girl, who had to fight up to the supreme court for an abortion, but that's not all she did...

In a ruling made last Wednesday, Justice McMeekin allowed the abortion to go ahead.

Earlier this year, Q had run away from home, had attempted suicide and had been finding pregnancy "very stressful emotionally", she said in an affidavit.

Her mother told the court there was "a very real risk of self harm and or suicidal behaviour if her pregnancy was to continue".

www.brisbanetimes.com.au...

oh, ya and the daddy is about the same age, there's no reason to start griping about the pedeophiles. the boy was as ignorant and the girl was in this case.

so, would a 12 year old now have to fight all the way to the supreme court in oklahoma for what common sense would deem to be the most prudent course of action?

The issue against abortion has nothing to do with babies. It has to with women are just enough of a person (3/5) to pay taxes but not enough of a person to make decisions about her body. From our slave days now transferred to all women.

a reply to: MOMof3

AMEN! I have been through so much crap this pregnancy. I've been to 7 doctors trying to get prenatal care.
Doctor 1: Denied treatment altogether because I refused to consent to a drug test that I felt was unconstitutional.
Doctor 2: After telling him I wanted to skip a Pap smear (blood proves no STDs, so it would just be a cancer screen) he says 'you have the right to refuse' but was such a blatant dick about it I didn't feel comfortable continuing with him. I asked to see one of the other 2 docs in the practice and was denied.
Doctor 3: Kept me waiting a month and a half for an appointment before figuring out they didn't take my insurance.
Doctor 4: Refused to see me altogether for refusing a Pap. (Did I mention I am on disability for PTSD? And the reason I'm refusing the Pap is because I'm afraid of an episode, which lasts up to 2 months and can't be medicated because of the pregnancy?)
Doctor 5: Overbooked, not taking new patients.
Doctor 6: Didn't take my insurance.
Doctor 7: Now I've made it full circle and I'm back to a colleague of the FIRST doctor. I HAVE to submit to a drug test to be accepted as a patient even though I morally don't agree with their policy. I also have to submit 12 months of progress notes from my psychiatrist to PROVE I suffer from PTSD so that the doc will allow me to skip the Pap.

I am 28 weeks pregnant and have really only received ONE thorough prenatal appointment. In no other area of medicine does any patient have to go through such crap. As a pregnant woman my rights as an individual are non-existent. I love this baby, and she was planned and wanted...but damn, it shouldn't mean that her rights trump mine. And it's complete bullsh*t that I have no say over my own medical treatment. It really does make me feel like less of a human being. 3/5 is being generous.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

sorry to hear you are still going through this crap... and it is crap.
how's you son doing, rash gone?

a reply to: dawnstar

Thanks for asking, you're sweet! It's been gone, but he actually ran a little fever the other day and it didn't pop up. I'm just glad to know the booster isn't due for another 2 years. Plenty of time for his little body to filter out whatever. I did just post on the vaccine thread ATS Vaccine Thread. They threatened to kick him out of Head Start because he was on a DELAYED schedule even with a note from the doctor for the reason. I had to file an affidavit with the state for them to back down.

It may seem like a derailment from THIS thread, but it actually isn't...

How about the government stay the f*ck out of people's medical decisions? How about letting individuals decide for themselves what's best for them?

....too much to ask for women and children I guess.

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie


compared to just how much they don't meddle with men's healthcare, it's rediculous.
men do drugs also, sure they might have to take a drug test when they apply for a job, some may even have them popped onto them occasionally, but, those drugs that he is taking before, during, or after conception can adversely affect a baby also.

and if it's our job to bring healthy babies into the world can nurture them to adulthood, then it should be their job to ensure they are physically able to work and bring in the bacon. how many times have you heard about men having back surgery so he can get back to work and pay his child support? don't happen.

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie

How about the government stay the f*ck out of people's medical decisions? How about letting individuals decide for themselves what's best for them?

But, it is people (not the doctors) that created the whole malpractice mess.

It is because of people suing doctors that they require blood tests, and have certain requirements to protect themselves.

People created the problem.

a reply to: Annee

I totally get that. And I'm almost not even mad at the doctors, I know that they're just bowing down to regulations. Doctor 4 (mentioned above) didn't even enter the room to speak to me, just used her nurse as a go-between. Then a few days later I got a letter to the effect of 'a patient doctor relationship was not established on this visit'. They spent more time covering their ass than actually addressing me as an individual with concerns about my health.

On the other hand, I'm permanently disabled due to medical malpractice. I went to several lawyers and no one would take my case. Even though an investigation by the Texas Department of Health confirmed my allegations. I had one legal secretary tell me "Due to tort reform it's almost impossible to sue for medical malpractice anymore. You basically have to be dead or disabled." I responded "I AM disabled." She replies, "Yeah, but you can still bathe yourself and handle your daily activities."

So, here we are in 2016, multiple state governments are trying to tell women when/if they can have abortions. Kids are being vaccinated even after they have adverse reactions because it's mandated by the government. I can't get tailor made prenatal care that takes into account my medical history or personal beliefs. And on top of all that, no one can sue for malpractice unless they're dead or paralyzed.

I don't have the answers on how to fix all this. But I can make the observation: "It's a cluster f*ck."

a reply to: ladyvalkyrie

I've been through a lot of medical care, facilities, doctors - - - etc.

I had something wrong that no one could figure out. Turned out to be an odd birth defect. My jaw joint was not formed properly and not connected. But, in such a way it was not detectable without more modern methods.

The muscles on one side of the body became dominant and created an imbalance through out my whole body. A chain reaction thing.

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie
Kids are being vaccinated even after they have adverse reactions because it's mandated by the government.

I support mandated vaccinations.

We live in a collective, even if people don't want to accept that or think of it that way.

You not vaccinating your child affects my child.

a reply to: Annee

My kids are vaccinated, but some individuals are more sensitive than others. Or perhaps more genetically predisposed to adverse reactions. My daughter has had all of hers on schedule with no issues. My son, on the other hand, has shown reactions to the DTaP (but not the DT) and the MMRV. He is being vaccinated, but on a delayed schedule so that I can monitor for reactions. If he shows a moderate to severe reaction (as he did with the Pertussis) then he is NOT getting that one again.

Back to the topic of this thread, my current pregnancy was planned and wanted, but if a severe birth defect was detected - one not compatible with life, or one with no chance of a decent quality of life, then I would 100% seek an abortion. And yes, I'm past the magic 20 week mark.

Every medical issue comes with a plethora of history and circumstances that can not be blanketly accounted for by government regulation. A pregnant woman or a vaccine sensitive child should not be considered acceptable collateral damage and offered up as sacrifice to people who believe this or that about their care. Medical care should be left to individuals and their doctors. And doctors should have the freedom to practice medicine, with minimal dictation from people not directly involved.

Some people 'believe' abortion is murder and want it banned. If this were allowed then all the women who feel they need an abortion for one reason or another are harmed by this legislation. You 'believe' everyone should be vaccinated. But when vaccine sensitive children are injected even after displaying adverse reactions they very well might be permanently harmed. THAT is the problem with making a medical decision for EVERYONE. There are always exceptions.

reply to: buster2010 funny how we talk about the rights of the transgendered child to use whatever bathroom he wants but suddenly when the rights of the unborn child are involved we are supposed to keep Godly morality out of it, Funny how the seculars can dictate their morality to us but we are not supposed to bring God into it when the Holy Innocents are involved. Do you not see the hypocrisy here? What makes the Progressives think they have the moral high ground on these issues?

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

funny how we talk about the rights of the transgendered child to use whatever bathroom he wants but suddenly when the rights of the unborn child are involved we are supposed to keep Godly morality out of it

What does "Godly morality" have to with what bathroom a person is allowed to use? Are you trying to say that God is against trans children? Or is God just against trans children using public bathrooms?

The Bible doesn't condemn abortion, it advocates it.

Do you not see the hypocrisy here?

I see yours.

originally posted by: ladyvalkyrie
a reply to: Annee

My kids are vaccinated, but some individuals are more sensitive than others. Or perhaps more genetically predisposed to adverse reactions. My daughter has had all of hers on schedule with no issues. My son, on the other hand, has shown reactions to the DTaP (but not the DT) and the MMRV. He is being vaccinated, but on a delayed schedule so that I can monitor for reactions. If he shows a moderate to severe reaction (as he did with the Pertussis) then he is NOT getting that one again.

OK. We did delayed too. And one at a time when he was under 3 years old. I think they do have "weaker" vaccines for those who have a reaction. Nothing is ever 100%. There is always going to be someone affected. I wonder if they have allergy tests you can take before getting vaccines.

Some people 'believe' abortion is murder and want it banned. If this were allowed then all the women who feel they need an abortion for one reason or another are harmed by this legislation.

Your "belief" ends where mine begins.

It just pisses me off "those of belief" dictating to me what they think is right. NO! I decide what is right for me.

I have 2 daughters. Which means I knew a lot of young girls. There were several abortions. Not one of them that became pregnant chose to go to term. Many of them have kids today. But, they chose to have kids when they were ready to have them and take care of them.

I support LIVING CHILDREN. The self-righteous believers can take their precious "morals" and go take care of those children. When ALL of them are cared for - - then you can talk to me.

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
. . . funny how we talk about the rights of the transgendered child to use whatever bathroom

That is a LIVING CHILD - - - and there is nothing funny about it.

A fetus is not a living child - - - no matter what your belief is.