Black/Urban English? Is the inability to speak correctly contributeing to unemployment?

I know how to punctuate and speak correctly and I understand when and where it's appropriate. That doesn't mean I'm not 'cool' or down with the homeboys in the hood; I can 'hang loose' with the best of them; I'm hip and groovy, but professional as well.

originally posted by: woodwardjnr

I know how to speak at work or while public speaking, but I can fall into a 'Buffalo speak' when with friends and I am relaxed. We have a local dialect like many places. Common phrases are "Where are you at?" or "That ain't right". My mother corrects me each time I say either of these phrases, though linguists agree, that in casual conversation, this is allowed.
I am glad I have never used the pronunciation of some words that are a local phenomenon. Roof=ruf, Jaguar=Jagwire, creek=crick. I don't correct others in casual conversation, though.

originally posted by: grainofsand
The tragedy to me is that the teen girls who are unable to communicate effectively/read are having kids of their own.
Who the # is going to read 'correct English' bedtime stories to the next generation, the early years are the most influential to communicative development.

Yeh, red ridin-ood was bare shook when da wolf showed...

It's sad really.

Den da hunter entered da house with hiz glock an da wolf "cried I dindu nuffin! "
Im a bad bad ewok


Sorry couldn't help myself

a reply to: grainofsand

To be honest I was just having fun and didnae think you were bashing the Scots. It is true though that 'dinnae' and 'ken' are not Glaswegian...'didnae' is though. I think having an accent can be nice although I do agree with you about those that make no effort to accommodate others.

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: woodwardjnr

I know how to speak at work or while public speaking, but I can fall into a 'Buffalo speak' when with friends and I am relaxed. We have a local dialect like many places. Common phrases are "Where are you at?" or "That ain't right". My mother corrects me each time I say either of these phrases, though linguists agree, that in casual conversation, this is allowed.
I am glad I have never used the pronunciation of some words that are a local phenomenon. Roof=ruf, Jaguar=Jagwire, creek=crick. I don't correct others in casual conversation, though.

Nothing wrong with local slang or local dialects when out of work.

I have my own in my chatham chav sort of way.

But at work is the problem.

Long as you can keep the two separate its fine.

a reply to: crazyewok

I know, dark humour, but it's exactly how some kids (parents who are barely adults themselves) are telling bedtime stories to their kids, if indeed they even do anything other than sit them in front of the TV/tablet/mobile.
Those kids have no chance.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
Im sure it doesn't help, out here in the states it is the south in general I think, everyone speaks a little different out there.

I understand why this is your opinion but, as a southerner I disagree. There is a distinct difference in the southern accent and 'ebonics' . The best example I can give is an incident that occurred to my nephew. He grew up in my hometown and went to public school. My hometown (actually the county) is very mixed. Blacks are in the minority but not by much. So, he went to school with a rather large percentage of blacks. When he went to college, the county it was located in had a lower percentage of blacks.

One day he sat with a group of guys that were in some of his classes for lunch. They happened to be black. They started talking to each other in 'ebonics' and were making fun of him, thinking he would not understand them. He understood them perfectly having grown up around a larger population of blacks. He proceeded to politely respond to what they were saying. They were shocked to say the least.

It may not be popular or PC to say it but in all honesty, blacks have their own language in the south. It isn't a southern accent. It is something else all it's own.

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: crazyewok

Insufficient schools as well as the 'twitter generation' , as others have said. One would think governments would put more money into job fairs and emphasize this problem. It is definitely not just a 'black problem'.

O no its definitely not. As I said I have had a few white applicants with the same language problem.

But the majority are from the black community.
Though it seems a inner city problem.

The black community outside London were I live seems not to have this problem. Though I am hesitant to say black community as unlike the city they are far less segregated and part of the same community as everyone else.

I live in the southern U.S. and you would have to go far out into some rural areas, and find someone really old before you would find someone you couldn't understand, or they you.

So no, I don't think accent has to do with finding a job... well, depending on the job of course. Some jobs require better communication skills than others.

It comes down to a refusal to adapt. You can't blame schools for failing to teach kids how to speak. Turn on a radio or television and listen! The dialect is a choice. A bad choice.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: crazyewok

Insufficient schools as well as the 'twitter generation' , as others have said. One would think governments would put more money into job fairs and emphasize this problem. It is definitely not just a 'black problem'.

O no its definitely not. As I said I have had a few white applicants with the same language problem.

But the majority are from the black community.
Though it seems a inner city problem.

The black community outside London were I am seem not to have this problem. Though I am hesitant to say black community as unlike the city they are far less segregated and part of the same community as everyone else.

You are correct. But, if I saw something of intelligence in someone, I might hire them even if they didn't interview well with speaking. If they are over 25, they can normally snap out of 'city talk' quickly if gently mentioned.

I have treated every job interview as if it were a Public Speaking class assignment- as well as other tips. The longer the interview lasts, the higher percentage chance that I would receive the job. I became quite good at them.

Now, having my own business, I know some haven't had the same opportunities and in m business, loyalty and trustworthiness are at the top of the list. How an applicant speaks may be third. For someone who I think is worth it, I may hire them and have a conversation.

The trouble is, unless you consistently make the effort to not slip into slang or that moronic, guttural way of speaking, it tends to creep in without you realising it.

My edest lad can't stop swearing for about 8 hours after coming back from Summer Camp with Marines, I know that when I've been working the shop floor in a job I've had a propensity to adopt the same slang unless I keep myself aware.

I'm not advocating a return to the plummy voiced toffs that used to announce every BBC program, but I do wish we could knock all this "Yoof speak" rubbish on the head.

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: crazyewok

Insufficient schools as well as the 'twitter generation' , as others have said. One would think governments would put more money into job fairs and emphasize this problem. It is definitely not just a 'black problem'.

O no its definitely not. As I said I have had a few white applicants with the same language problem.

But the majority are from the black community.
Though it seems a inner city problem.

The black community outside London were I am seem not to have this problem. Though I am hesitant to say black community as unlike the city they are far less segregated and part of the same community as everyone else.

You are correct. But, if I saw something of intelligence in someone, I might hire them even if they didn't interview well with speaking. If they are over 25, they can normally snap out of 'city talk' quickly if gently mentioned.

In my line of work I dont have that luxury.

A badly filled out form or wrong order could have legal repercussions.

a reply to: crazyewok
Lets face it the nature of the job should suggest to the applicant what is required. The fact that they haven't grasped that simple fact does show a lack of something.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: reldra

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: crazyewok

Insufficient schools as well as the 'twitter generation' , as others have said. One would think governments would put more money into job fairs and emphasize this problem. It is definitely not just a 'black problem'.

O no its definitely not. As I said I have had a few white applicants with the same language problem.

But the majority are from the black community.
Though it seems a inner city problem.

The black community outside London were I am seem not to have this problem. Though I am hesitant to say black community as unlike the city they are far less segregated and part of the same community as everyone else.

You are correct. But, if I saw something of intelligence in someone, I might hire them even if they didn't interview well with speaking. If they are over 25, they can normally snap out of 'city talk' quickly if gently mentioned.

In my line of work I dont have that luxury.

A badly filled out form or wrong order could have legal repercussions.

I am only training people to clean houses. In some of the bigger homes, it is more important that everything is just right, so I see what you mean.

originally posted by: midicon
a reply to: crazyewok
Lets face it the nature of the job should suggest to the applicant what is required. The fact that they haven't grasped that simple fact does show a lack of something.

I have met social workers, with Master's Degrees in Psychology (friends of friends) not be able to drop the 'vernacular', yet they still have a job. I can't pretend to understand why, though.

It is the white man's fault blacks can't get jobs, didn't you know?

originally posted by: Khaleesi

originally posted by: Sremmos80
Im sure it doesn't help, out here in the states it is the south in general I think, everyone speaks a little different out there.

I understand why this is your opinion but, as a southerner I disagree. There is a distinct difference in the southern accent and 'ebonics' . The best example I can give is an incident that occurred to my nephew. He grew up in my hometown and went to public school. My hometown (actually the county) is very mixed. Blacks are in the minority but not by much. So, he went to school with a rather large percentage of blacks. When he went to college, the county it was located in had a lower percentage of blacks.

One day he sat with a group of guys that were in some of his classes for lunch. They happened to be black. They started talking to each other in 'ebonics' and were making fun of him, thinking he would not understand them. He understood them perfectly having grown up around a larger population of blacks. He proceeded to politely respond to what they were saying. They were shocked to say the least.

It may not be popular or PC to say it but in all honesty, blacks have their own language in the south. It isn't a southern accent. It is something else all it's own.

I am from the south and black. Our ebonics is definitely different and not as easy to pick up and is further compounded because of the heavy southern accents. To make my point, here is a rap video from awhile ago by youngbloodz with big boi from Outkast.

At the very beginning of the video there is a skit basically highlighting that difference. Two guys are talking and they offer a translation. This is how we talk in the south.




Southern slang almost reminds of the classic skit from Airplane! movie.

This problem was well before the internet (twitter, emoticons, etc...). I remember in high school, a classmate of mine got an A on an English paper. The paper was to be written about a job you had or a project you worked on (if you didn't have a job). His paper was 2 pages long and the title... you better sit down... "How I gets mines". This is not a joke, that was word for word the title of his 'A' paper!

Pittsburgh Public Schools

JT

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: crazyewok

I know, dark humour, but it's exactly how some kids (parents who are barely adults themselves) are telling bedtime stories to their kids, if indeed they even do anything other than sit them in front of the TV/tablet/mobile.
Those kids have no chance.

I think there are a lot of educated, suburban, 'old enough' married mothers 'just sitting them in front of the TV/tablet/mobile'. So, that can't be the cause.