Turkey 'downs aircraft on Syria border'

a reply to: Rosinitiate

America getting its "wee-wee" slapped equals American lives, you get that right? There is a world theater man, like it hate it whatever. The super powers operate in this theater they flex their muscles they also engage in none kosher activity,and I'm not saying they sell pork hot dogs but they probably do that to.its fine to be upset or to address issues internally I have no problem with that, and that's what we should do, and yes of course certain actions and policy's need changing. When it comes between the U.S and other countries I have chosen my side and I stand firmly with our people.the government lap dog heh that's funny, you go on and keep thinking you are some sepperate omnipresent being, get real you are as much a cog as anyone else, and you being a squeaky wheel just means you get the grease.

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: Rosinitiate

America getting its "wee-wee" slapped equals American lives, you get that right? There is a world theater man, like it hate it whatever. The super powers operate in this theater they flex their muscles they also engage in none kosher activity,and I'm not saying they sell pork hot dogs but they probably do that to.its fine to be upset or to address issues internally I have no problem with that, and that's what we should do, and yes of course certain actions and policy's need changing. When it comes between the U.S and other countries I have chosen my side and I stand firmly with our people.the government lap dog heh that's funny, you go on and keep thinking you are some sepperate omnipresent being, get real you are as much a cog as anyone else, and you being a squeaky wheel just means you get the grease.

No it doesn't have too. You another way besides the hammer? I do.

Governments, although self-serving can't go against the will of the people. It's the whole point of keeping us ignorant. But if there is an overwhelming opposition to imperialistic behaviors that government will back off.

Our government was warned very clearly twice now by our own citizens. Obama being elected was a stark rebuke of the Bush doctrine. Obama offered change and we fell for it. No change emerged and the anger of the people was reflected in outing the Democrates from majority. Many david readers of ATS already know what the general population is just now becoming disillusioned too. I think Russia gets that and is one of the reason why now they chose to act plus the sanctions, I mean what else do they have to lose?

If the U.S. Government's foreign policy reflected the will of the people we wouldn't have this problem. All you're saying is because another nation will just do what we are doing we might as well do it first. Wrong! That was the whole point of the world accepting is as global protector for a time because are decisions were just or appeared as such. Instead of raping a nation because someone else will anyway is just stupid foreign policy for a just and right nation. We should protect and offer assistance to them from potential aggressors.

Yeah, I know wishful thinking. Puppies and rainbows.

a reply to: TechniXcality

Well you can blindly follow a foreign policy thats formed by retards but Il pass on that thank you


Not a fan of US, my own or Russian foreign policy.

Call me a supporter of iceland

a reply to: crazyewok

Call me a supporter of iceland

Seconded.

Me too. At least they've got a pair.

a reply to: TechniXcality

America getting its "wee-wee" slapped equals American lives, you get that right?

I don't think it means American lives. All the US is doing at the moment is dropping in weapons and ammunition. I should point out to you though, that American lives are no more important than anyone else's.

a reply to: crazyewok

Alright brother, Iceland it is. Maybe we can start up a hot dog stand in Iceland and sell none kosher and kosher dogs. I'm sure that would be a lucrative niche. I must say though you've given me the most reasonable answer you dont support any of them,good on you. I love my country, I love the west and that's where I stand and really when this all boils down that's what the true point is where do you stand? Do i support within my country and voting ability a foreign policy that sacrifices moral compass for strategic positioning, no I do not. However I will stand with my country and I do believe the people at the top who have a clearer view aren't trying to eat all of us alive and make child sacrifices on Sunday's, I digress my point is this is a side issue always has been always will be.

a reply to: TechniXcality

However I will stand with my country and I do believe the people at the top who have a clearer view aren't trying to eat all of us alive and make child sacrifices on Sunday's, I digress my point is this is a side issue always has been always will be.

Big straw man argument there. See you are not even able to acknowledge the real issues here, instead you try to act like this criticism is the result of some sort of irrational hate against the US government, acting like a victim.

Man up. Supporting the policies of your government is not supporting your country.

a reply to: RogueWave

Not an argument at all, just stating my position not attacking anyone else's in that post. I am a man thanks, I don't need to hear your # about victims ect, not sure you understood that post at all.

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: crazyewok

Alright brother, Iceland it is. Maybe we can start up a hot dog stand in Iceland and sell none kosher and kosher dogs. I'm sure that would be a lucrative niche. I must say though you've given me the most reasonable answer you dont support any of them,good on you. I love my country, I love the west and that's where I stand and really when this all boils down that's what the true point is where do you stand? Do i support within my country and voting ability a foreign policy that sacrifices moral compass for strategic positioning, no I do not. However I will stand with my country and I do believe the people at the top who have a clearer view aren't trying to eat all of us alive and make child sacrifices on Sunday's, I digress my point is this is a side issue always has been always will be.

Thing is i dont think those at the top have any control which is why foreign policy is so erratic, unpredictable and at times amoral. Its all decided by there corporate sponsers which are many and hense why its so eratic and at times conflicting.


You ask were I stand? The honnest answer is I dont actually know. There is no black and white, just grey and I dont deal with grey matters very well.
All i know is I DONT stand with the souless groups working behind the political scene as I am pretty sure they dont have my intrests at heart, only there own bank accounts.

If the UK itself ever came under attack or even the US or our cousins in France or Germany I would defend them as family.

But I wont support the political games and proxy wars going on in my countrys name.

a reply to: crazyewok

Call me a supporter of iceland

Call me a supporter of the my underground bunker in the woods that I plan to run to when the "stupid" foreign policy makers and "limitlessly greedy" oligarchs and billionaires unleash the 3rd great war on the human race.

a reply to: crazyewok

Fair enough well said

a reply to: TechniXcality

Why do you need a side. It seems you stance is just that you don't like Russians.

They are doing some good right now, how can you not support someone doing good.

If the USA would work together with them maybe it would be even better. Why won't they? Because it seems like you your government just doesn't like Russians. Or maybe the conspiracy is right and the USA hasn't been trying to do good all a along.

Who knows.

It is a Russian designed drone. The same type and variants have been shot down and or malfunctioned over Ukraine.

One of the Russian Orlan variants. Some have t-type tails with end plates and some just have normal tail fins.

This is one found in Ukrainian territory.

Orlan Ukraine

Orlan type

Now who from the die-hard conspiracy people is going to suggest that the Ukrainians provided the drone wreckage to NATO so that they could claim a Russian airspace violation? I can see it coming .. 5. 4. 3. 2. 1

a reply to: Nexttimemaybe

Good in what way? Because they are trying to keep Assad in power.

The type has been seen before in Syria and have crashed in rebel held territory during July 2015. Could well be the Syrians operating this Russian UAV and hence the claim from the Russians of no UAVs lost?

3.bp.blogspot.com...

When looking at all the pics of found Orlans none of them actually seem to have been shot, rather they seem to have crashed.

So I would say this one either crashed by itself, was planted, or was perhaps downed by gps jamming.

The story that they shot it down after trying to contact it still doesn't seem very credible, since they wouldn't have mistaken it for a real plane if it even showed up on radar.

This whole Turkey/Russia/US/Syria/islamic turd state thing is ridiculous.

The US created a power vacuum by toppling Hussein in Iraq. The "experts" should have seen this whole scenario coming. The Sunni minority in Iraq made up a large part of the Iraqi military. Big surprise. They're pissed and cutting off heads and trying to keep what they once held. A not small amount of funding from the kingdom of Saud helped. The US ignored it for the most part since they need a bad guy in order to convince joe sixpack he needs to support an inordinate amount of money for bombs and guns, cuz terror.
Same with the US support for the Kurds of the area. Give 'em guns and air support and you KNOW they will use them. And they did. In Turkey.

Syria had its own problems. Assad was losing support. A failed coup or two. And now no less than six countries are involved in a conflict with no real goal, no real leadership (other than Assad, and he is an ass), and a whole lot of human misery.

Now this whole Russia thing. NATO. Turkey was on the outs with them. Now, they are suddenly darlings again.

The whole thing stinks. Will World War 3 happen? No. But those who profit from human suffering sure would like you to think so.

It's Friday...sorry for the rant.
Cheers all

originally posted by: RogueWave
When looking at all the pics of found Orlans none of them actually seem to have been shot, rather they seem to have crashed.

So I would say this one either crashed by itself, was planted, or was perhaps downed by gps jamming.

The story that they shot it down after trying to contact it still doesn't seem very credible, since they wouldn't have mistaken it for a real plane if it even showed up on radar.

All the F-16 Pilot has to do is bring it down with his own jet wash. It is called thumping. One pass in front would disrupt the airflow and the UAV would spin out. Why is everything a conspiracy with some of you guys. I'm still waiting for the claims that it was one of the Orlans recovered from Ukrainian territory and supplied to NATO for this type of incident!

It was likely a Syrian operated Russian supplied Orlan variant hence the no loss claim from the Russians. The type has malfunctioned or been brought down before in rebel held Syria back in July 2015.

spioenkop.blogspot.co.uk...

a reply to: tommyjo

Why is everything a conspiracy with some of you guys.

I gave three options, of which only one would really be in the conspiracy catagory, and two of them would actually mean that Russia, or Syria was flying it in Turkish airspace. All of them are possible, so what are you whining about.

The explanation you offered falls in line with my observation that it wasn't shot, so again, what is your problem?

a reply to: tommyjo

All the F-16 Pilot has to do is bring it down with his own jet wash. It is called thumping. One pass in front would disrupt the airflow and the UAV would spin out.

Btw, can you back this up. I can't find any mention of this. Nothing to indicate that this is a safe, practical or even theorized method of bringing down drones with jets.

On the other hand, I can back up my claims of signal jamming to bring down drones.

On 4 December 2011, an American Lockheed Martin RQ-170 Sentinel unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) was captured by Iranian forces near the city of Kashmar in northeastern Iran. The Iranian government announced that the UAV was brought down by its cyberwarfare unit which commandeered the aircraft and safely landed it, after initial reports from Western news sources inaccurately claimed that it had been "shot down".[1] The United States government initially denied the claims but later President Obama acknowledged that the downed aircraft was a US drone and requested that Iran return it.[2][3]

en.wikipedia.org...