Why Creation Is The Only Logical Explanation...

a reply to: TzarChasm

But TzarChasm ... God is Love .... Lenny sang it so ......

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction

Pretty sure fear is one of the main aspects of the religion

a reply to: Noinden

If I thought I didn't have free will and was not responsible for my own actions or if God made me sin I guess I would have a reason to fear him...
Instead what that means is to be afraid of your own actions separating you from God by doing wrong by him...
We are responsible for our own judgement not God because of our own actions...
So the fear is of doing wrong...
Not of God...

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: TzarChasm

But TzarChasm ... God is Love .... Lenny sang it so ......

but it says in the bible, love doesnt get angry or jealous...

and in the same book, it says this god is a jealous and vengeful god...

and then they say "no, you are misreading it!"

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Barcs


I cam pile the evidence that the science behind evolution is a bonfire of lies and your response, no

Yet here we are, 43 pages into the thread and you have not yet posted any peer reviewed data supporting your position.

I guess the best thing is, no matter your claims, evolution is not an accepted science by the majority

By which majority? Americans dumbed down since Carter instituted the Department of Education? The 95% of scientists who agree that MES is the most well founded Scientific Theory with the most evidence supporting it since the inception of scientific dialogue? Or the Protestant Evangelical movement who support the tenets of a young Earth?

a reply to: TzarChasm

It must be all that filthy science I do that has poluted me? Or that I don't follow that God and see it as supreme?

a reply to: TzarChasm

You are taking that verse out of context of course. If you don't believe it's true then you can't read it with the proper context.

a reply to: Noinden

Evolution is a lie of the devil don't you know. So is the big bang and all other sciences that disprove the bible.

Dinosaurs lived with man at the same time or the devil put their bones everywhere. But there's no way they could have existed 65 million years ago because that would make the bible false.

a reply to: Joecanada11

It would be much easier for everyone if Jehovah/Allah just sent memo's out to our emails, I mean come one get with the 21st century, and stop using random illiterates in the desert.

a reply to: Joecanada11

I think these people are reading a different Bible to the one I had foisted on me in Highschool Other religions (besides the Abrhamic ones) tend to not have as many of these issues.

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: TzarChasm

You are taking that verse out of context of course. If you don't believe it's true then you can't read it with the proper context.

and its irrelevant. what is relevant here is an alternative theory of "how everything came to be". a theory that can compete with the big bang theory. i'll be nice and leave the theory of evolution out of this. so far, the "science of creation" has been awfully vague.

a reply to: TzarChasm

I should have made myself a bit more clear. Anytime I point our contradictory scriptures in the bible (such as God is angry and jealous and then later God is loving and gentle ) then the apologist answer is to claim out of context.

a reply to: Joecanada11

Sometimes it is very hard in these thread to see that (I was guessing that was your purpose, I've been wrong on that before with people here).

a reply to: Noinden

I just have to remember the old sarcasm smiley.

a reply to: Joecanada11

Sometimes a /sarc is required

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: Raggedyman

science isn't a religion. Facts and evidence do not consitute faith.

So you take all of the evidence that scientists have worked so hard to uncover and say they are garbage and lies. Why would they lie ? What would be gained by this supposed cover up?

But you take the words of a 2,000 year old book that defies logic and reason as truth. That makes sense. Not!

I am looking for the evidence, I dont take a scientists word on evidence I cant see.

I take a 2000 to 5000 year old book on faith.

Science should not be a faith.
Evolution is a faith statement.

This article while I believe is flawed for theological reasons, I believe also explains a truth in relation to science and its faith
Its not a religious article, sortof, it is in so far as to explain the faith of scientists
www.theatlantic.com...

I will post the conclusion because I doubt you will open it

"But science as an institution behaves differently than particular scientists. Science establishes conditions where rational argument is able to flourish, where ideas can be tested against the world, and where individuals can work together to surpass their individual limitations. Science is not just one “faith community” among many. It has earned its epistemological stripes. And when the stakes are high, as they are with climate change and vaccines, we should appreciate its special status."

So my conclusion, science is important, it has many places and has changed many things.
As far as evolution, its not a science, its a faith

originally posted by: Joecanada11
a reply to: Noinden

Evolution is a lie of the devil don't you know. So is the big bang and all other sciences that disprove the bible.

Dinosaurs lived with man at the same time or the devil put their bones everywhere. But there's no way they could have existed 65 million years ago because that would make the bible false.

Hey Joe

Here is a great debate as to the issue of dinosaurs and mankind coexisting

www.debate.org...

I will leave it with you, if you want to seek both sides of the argument

a reply to: Raggedyman

Interesting article. It still doesn't make creationism the only logical conclusion. It's a possibility. However that doesn't change the fact that we still don't have any solid evidence of the creator being.

It doesn't change that the bible is rife with stories of miracles and phenomenon that we have not seen in our lifetime. That there are many inconsistencies in the bible. And therefore it cannot be taken as literal truth.

The ark story itself is just a logical and logistical nightmare. Seven animals of each kind. That means 7 tigers 7 bears 7 lions 7 wolves 7 cats 7 giraffes 7 elephants 7 rhinos 7 mastadons and on and on. All being kept in a boat slightly larger than a football field. What did they eat? All the vegetation of the earth would have perished after the flood and it would have taken time for it to grow back. Therefore the herbivores wouldn't have food. And what about the carnivores. They would have had to wait for the herbivores to reproduce enough that they could eat. They would have perished while waiting.

The logical explanation for the flood story is that many thousands of years ago there was a great flood. To the people at the time they would have considered it the end of the world. Of course they would say the cause was a diety being angry at the people because that's how natural disasters were explained due to lack of knowledge. Then the story grew even more and it included how one family escaped and it grew and grew and you have the story.

Great story.

Then Sodom and Gomorrah would be similar. A volcano erupts and spews fire down from heaven. The survivors tell the story of God being angry. And it grows. This isn't too hard to understand.

Why isn't God performing any of these great acts anymore. Oh right he sent himself to sacrifice to himself on our behalf and no longer is active. How convenient.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Raggedyman

Ahh here we go again. The big lie that "science is a religion" never you mid that it does not fit the requirements, firstly that for something to be a religion, it relies on faith. Science is based on evidence, etc etc

We've done this monkey dance many many times.

I see you edited it out, but none of us are terrified of "God" indeed Christians are the ones who are "God FEARing". I donb't fear my deities of worship, I respect them.

Yes I do tend to edit lots, I also tend to say things and figure they are best tempered

My God fearing statement was based on the fact I think you are afraid of Gods wrath, better to deny

I figure Oracle was closer to my point than me.

Anyway, it shouldnt have been said and I removed it, my apologies.

And yes, I do fear God, His judgement is final

a reply to: Raggedyman

I appreciate the link. I'll be honest. I've investigated that side of the story. I was a hardcore YEC advocate and believer until a couple of years ago. My best friend is a SDA pastor. We talked a lot of the dinosaurs and man coexisting.

As I have said in other threads I spent 7 years as a believer. I went all in. Giants, dinosaurs, young earth I went there. I'm not sure exactly when it changed. Maybe it was that I never really felt anything from the god that I prayed to. I began to see things in the bible that clearly were wrong. Not only how God was violent but he enjoyed it in the old testament. He also repented at times. I mean God's emotions were all over the place. It just didn't make sense. Then it snowballed from there.