Just Wondering...

a reply to: tigertatzen

ou have had gobs of direct evidence provided to you, and I am not going to waste my time giving you more.

But first, please point out the specific time line where explosions are heard as WTC 2 collapsed.

WTC 2 collapse close up

No sound of demolition explosions in the video proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that no explosives were used.

WTC7

So we go there and on the north and east side of 7 it didn’t look like there was any damage at all, but then you looked on the south side of 7 there had to be a hole 20 stories tall in the building, with fire on several floors. Debris was falling down on the building and it didn’t look good.

Boyle: There was a huge gaping hole and it was scattered throughout there. It was a huge hole. I would say it was probably about a third of it, right in the middle of it. And so after Visconti came down and said nobody goes in 7, we said all right, we’ll head back to the command post.

Hayden: Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You actually could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o’clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o’clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse.

WTC Building 7 appears to have suffered significant damage at some point after the WTC Towers had collapsed, according to firefighters at the scene. Firefighter Butch Brandies tells other firefighters that nobody is to go into Building 7 because of creaking and noises coming out of there. [Firehouse Magazine, 8/02]

Battalion Chief John Norman later recalls, "At the edge of the south face you could see that it is very heavily damaged." [Firehouse Magazine, 5/02]

Heavy, thick smoke rises near 7 World Trade Center. Smoke is visible from the upper floors of the 47-story building. Firefighters using transits to determine whether there was any movement in the structure were surprised to discover that is was moving. The area was evacuated and the building collapsed later in the afternoon of Sept. 11.

www.debunking911.com...

originally posted by: In4ormant

originally posted by: Flatcoat

originally posted by: In4ormant

originally posted by: soulpowertothendegree
a reply to: In4ormant




Blowing the foundations would have toppled the buildings, probably destroying half of Manhattan. As it was, the destruction was kept mainly to the WTC complex.

I'm confused, half you guys say they blew the base in a controlled demolition. Has that changed? I honestly can't keep up. Point is, why use planes if you don't need to. You can just as easily blame terrorists for the demolition.

Do some research on the construction of the towers. Planes did not bring these buildings crashing down in their own footprint. Never happened. Projectiles? Dust? Molten steel? None Of it happened the way they claim it did. None of it.

Then why did they even use them? Seems like an unnecessary step to use just to blame terrorists. Could have just as easily said terrorists for bombs on the foundation.

Perhaps, because the MAJORITY of the US population could watch it on LIVE TV (2nd plane, obviosly)?
Therefore...
Oh, & speaking of LIVE TV, I still can't get how BBC know 7 fell while it was still standing.
Hmm.
PNAC
7/7
Apparently, I'm on that list now.

originally posted by: skyeagle409
a reply to: randyvs

Let's go here. Can office fires weaken structural steel of the WTC buildings to the point of failure? Yes or not.

How do you figure that to be a yes or no question?
See you only think I'm stupid.

a reply to: tigertatzen

I facepalmed so hard i almost knocked myself unconscious.

I know

Well, to Skys credit, he was do'in a lot of cutting and pasting from modern
literature that affirms the lies he chooses to believe. As if there wouldn't
be any lies out there that wouldn't affirm the OS.

They collapsed in an uncontrolled fashion, causing extensive damage to surrounding structures

A child would see thru that lie. But Sky?

a reply to: tigertatzen

What derision? I hadn't noticed. Flies love the smell and taste of crap. Me I am butterfly, I know the difference, I flutterby crap.

Peeling the 9/11 Onion: Layers of Plots within Plots

www.veteranstruthnetwork.com...

Leslie Raphael has offered reason after reason for concluding that the Jules Naudet film was staged. The evidence that no planes crashed in Shanksville or hit the Pentagon is beyond reasonable doubt, where others have shown that the videos of Flight 175 hitting the South Tower are fake, which may have been a brilliant stroke to generate dissension within the 9/11 Truth movement, since the truth of video fakery has proven to be politically divisive. The scientific evidence disproving the official account is also abundant and compelling. Given what we know now, anyone who continues to believe the “official account” of 9/11 is either unfamiliar with the evidence or cognitively impaired.

Just some other crazy truthers....

a reply to: skyeagle409

“From the photographs I have analyzed very, very carefully,” Stubblebine has explained, “it was not an airplane.” During an interview in Germany, he explained that there should have been wing marks on the façade of the Pentagon. “If it had wings, it would have left wing marks. [There are] those who claim that the plane tilted and hit the ground first and lost a wing. But airplanes have two wings, and he could not find indications of any wing in any of those photographs.” Regarding the Twin Towers, he added, “Look at the buildings falling—they didn”t fall down because of an airplane hit them. They fell down because explosives went off inside. Demolition. Look at Building 7, for God’s sake.”

The amount of people that have come forward are all wrong! You are the only one that is right? Do you see how ridiculous it is to keep insisting that the OS is the truth?

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

a reply to: skyeagle409

Yeah the lobby didn't explode. The firefighters just thought it did. Boy they sure are silly.

a reply to: soulpowertothendegree

As it was, the falling elevators was the explosive sound they heard in the lobby. However, sound of explosions outside the building were attributed to exploding gas lines and other things such as transformers and even falling bodies.

In addition, exploding manholes in New York City are nothing new.

Manhole Explosions Set Cars On Fire
December 29, 2012 4:22 PM

NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) — Several cars were ablaze on Prince Street in SoHo Saturday afternoon, after a series of explosions in manholes below.


Predicting the Next Deadly Manhole Explosion

Every so often in New York City, a disk of cast iron weighing up to 300 pounds will burst out of the street and fly as high as several stories before clattering back to the blacktop. Flames, smoke or both may issue from the breach, as if somebody had pulled hell’s own pop-top

Manhole explosions aren’t just spectacular; they’re dangerous. As one firefighter observed after a manhole exploded near Times Square in May: “It’s not Disneyland, people. Get the hell out of the way.”

www.wired.com...

a reply to: soulpowertothendegree

9/11 was not an inside job and I will challenge those who think it was an inside job to post evidence. After all, it has been 14 years and in a country full of news reporters looking for a break though story, no evidence has surfaced, which is understandable considering that countries around the world issued warngings to the United States that Osama bin Ladne and al-Qaeda were in the final stages of carrying out their terrorist attack on America by hijacking airliners and using them to kill thousands.

Let's not forget that even the Taliban in Afghanistan had warned the United States that Osama bin Laden would attack America. They all blame the terrorist group, which proved that 9/11 was not an inside job. That is why truthers have failed to provide evidence of a False Flag operation after 14 years.

No evidence = no inside job.

a reply to: soulpowertothendegree

Question then, why are you supporting a 9/11 False Flag claim without evidence?

a reply to: skyeagle409

Evidence is not the equivalent of a truth.
Because
Evidence can be used to hide the truth.

a reply to: randyvs

There is no evidence of a False Flag operation and there is no evidence for demolition explosives either, which is why truthes have been unable to provide evidence.

I guess they can't connect the dots in regard to the many warnings issued by countries around the workd that Osama bin laden and al-Qaeda, not the U.S. government, would carry out a terrorist attack on America and Osama bin Laden's admission for the 9/11 attack and al-Qaeda's release of the martyr videos of the 9/11 hijackers, not to mention that the body of one 9/11 hijacker was found in the cockpit wreckage or that remains of passenger and crew of the 9/11 aircraft were recovered and identified via DNA.

On the other hand, I've caught truthers posting disinformation and in some cases, outright lies and I have compiled a list over the years.

a reply to: skyeagle409

many warnings issued by countries around the workd that Osama bin laden and al-Qaeda, not the U.S.
government, would carry out a terrorist attack on America

Do you have any evidence of this?

Technology has led to significant changes in the way we work, significant efficiencies in time savings, and increases in accuracy. Technology has also become the principal tool of fraudsters. We have evolved to a state where a computer is a required tool for the perpetration of fraud. That same technology offers challenges for the examiners who gather evidence in support of a case. In this article I will discuss the effect of readily available technologies on the quality of engagement evidence, and practical approaches examiners can use to validate their evidence.

source

a reply to: randyvs

Do you have any evidence of this?

Yes I do.

WARNINGS THAT THE DANGER WOULD COME FROM THE AIR

BRITAIN, WARNING #1: Al-Qaeda is planning to use aircraft in "unconventional ways", "possibly as flying bombs"

the British intelligence agency, gives a secret report to liaison staff at the US embassy in London. The reports states that al-Qaeda has plans to use "commercial aircraft" in "unconventional ways", "possibly as flying bombs." [Sunday Times, 6/9/02]

BRITAIN, WARNING #3: An Al-Qaeda attack will involve multiple hijackings

Early August 2001 ©: Britain gives the US another warning about an al-Qaeda attack. The previous British warning (see July 16, 2001) was vague as to method, but this warning specifies multiple airplane hijackings. This warning is included in Bush's briefing on August 6. [Sunday Herald, 5/19/02]

CAYMAN ISLANDS, WARNING #2: Three al-Qaeda agents are part of a plot "organizing a major terrorist act against the US via an airline or airlines"

August 29, 2001: Three men from either Pakistan or Afghanistan living in the Cayman Islands are briefly arrested in June 2001 for discussing hijacking attacks in New York City (see June 4, 2001). On this day, a Cayman Islands radio station receives an unsigned letter claiming these same three men are agents of bin Laden. The anonymous author warns that they "are organizing a major terrorist act against the US via an airline or airlines." The letter is forwarded to a Cayman government official but no action is taken until after 9/11 and it isn't known when the US is informed. Many criminals and/or businesses use the Cayman Islands as a safe, no tax, no questions asked haven to keep their money. The author of the letter meets with the FBI shortly after 9/11, and claims his information was a "premonition of sorts." The three men are later arrested. Its unclear what has happened to them since their arrest. [Miami Herald, 9/20/01, Los Angeles Times, 9/20/01, MSNBC, 9/23/01] FTW

EGYPT, WARNING #1: An undercover agent learns 20 al-Qaeda agents are in the US, four have received flight training

Late July 2001 (D): CBS later has a brief mention in a long story on another topic: "Just days after Atta return[s] to the US from Spain, Egyptian intelligence in Cairo says it received a report from one of its operatives in Afghanistan that 20 al-Qaeda members had slipped into the US and four of them had received flight training on Cessnas. To the Egyptians, pilots of small planes didn't sound terribly alarming, but they [pass] on the message to the CIA anyway, fully expecting Washington to request information. The request never [comes]." [CBS, 10/9/02] This appears to be one of several accurate Egyptian warnings based on informants (see June 13, 2001 and August 30, 2001). Could Egypt have known the names of some or all of the hijackers? Given FBI agent Ken Williams' memo about flight schools a short time before (see July 10, 2001), shouldn't the US have investigated this closely instead of completely ignoring it?

GERMANY: Terrorists will use airplanes as weapons to attack "American and Israeli symbols"

June 2001: German intelligence warns the CIA, Britain's MI6, and Israel's Mossad that Middle Eastern terrorists are planning to hijack commercial aircraft to use as weapons to attack "American and Israeli symbols, which stand out." A later article quotes unnamed German intelligence sources who state the information was coming from Echelon surveillance technology, and that British intelligence had access to the same warnings. However, there were other informational sources, including specific information and hints given to, but not reported by, Western and Near Eastern news media six months before 9/11. [Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, 9/11/01, Washington Post, 9/14/01, Fox News, 5/17/02] FTW

ITALY: Muslims warn of an attack on the US and Britain using hijacked airplanes as weapons

September 7, 2001: Father Jean-Marie Benjamin is told at a wedding in Todi, Italy of a plot to attack the US and Britain using hijacked airplanes as weapons. He isn't told time or place specifics. He immediately passes what he knows to a judge and several politicians. He states: "Although I am friendly with many Muslims, I wondered why they were telling me, specifically. I felt it my duty to inform the Italian government." Benjamin has been called "one of the West's most knowledgeable experts on the Muslim world." Two days after 9/11, he meets with the Italian Foreign Minister on this topic. He says he learned the attack on Britain failed at the last minute. [Zenit, 9/16/01] He has not revealed who told him this information, but could it have been a member of the al-Qaeda cell in Milan (see August 12, 2000 and January 24, 2001), which appears to have helped with the 9/11 attacks?

JORDAN: A major attack using aircraft is planned inside the US

Late summer 2001: Jordanian intelligence (the GID) makes a communications intercept deemed so important that King Abdullah's men relay it to Washington, probably through the CIA station in Amman. To make doubly sure the message gets through it is passed through an Arab intermediary to a German intelligence agent. The message states that a major attack, code named The Big Wedding, is planned inside the US and that aircraft will be used. "When it became clear that the information was embarrassing to Bush Administration officials and congressmen who at first denied that there had been any such warnings before September 11, senior Jordanian officials backed away from their earlier confirmations." Christian Science Monitor calls the story "confidently authenticated" even though Jordan has backed away from it. [International Herald Tribune, 5/21/02, Christian Science Monitor, 5/23/02] FTW

RUSSIA: Russian intelligence clearly warns the US several times that 25 or so terrorists, including suicide pilots, will attack the US, targeting "important buildings like the Pentagon"

August 2001 (D): Russian President Putin warns the US that suicide pilots are training for attacks on US targets. [Fox News, 5/17/02] The head of Russian intelligence also later states, "We had clearly warned them" on several occasions, but they "did not pay the necessary attention." [Agence France-Presse, 9/16/01] A Russian newspaper on September 12, 2001 claims that "Russian Intelligence agents know the organizers and executors of these terrorist attacks. More than that, Moscow warned Washington about preparation to these actions a couple of weeks before they happened." Interestingly, the article claims that at least two of the terrorists were Muslim radicals from Uzbekistan. [Izvestia, 9/12/01, (the story currently on the Izvestia web site has been edited to delete a key paragraph, the link is to a translation of the original article from From the Wilderness)] FTW
OTHER WARNINGS

AFGHANISTAN: Al-Qaeda is planning an imminent "huge attack" inside the US that will kill thousands

ARGENTINA: A major terrorist attack is planned against either the US, Argentina, or France

Late July 2001 ©: Argentina's Jewish community receives warnings of a major terrorist attack against either the United States, Argentina or France from "a foreign intelligence source." The warning was then relayed to the Argentine security authorities. It was agreed to keep the warning secret in order to avoid panic

a reply to: randyvs

I didn't have enough room on my previous page, but as you can see, the United States received many warnings from around the world and from within the United States as well.

Continue:

They Tried to Warn Us: Foreign Intelligence Warnings Before 9/11

Source


Taleban 'warned US of huge attack'

An aide to the former Taleban foreign minister, Wakil Ahmad Muttawakil, has revealed that he was sent to warn American diplomats and the United Nations that Osama.

news.bbc.co.uk...


Al-Qaeda: Declarations & Acts of War

The First Fatwa

In August of 1996, Osama bin Laden issued his first fatwa, a 30-page polemic entitled "Declaration of War Against the Americans Occupying the Land of the Two Holy Places," against the United States and Israel, and it was published in a London newspaper called Al Quds al Arabi.

The Second Fatwa

The second fatwa was published on February 23, 1998, in Al Quds al Arabi. Unlike the first fatwa, which was issued by Osama bin Laden alone, this fatwa was signed by Osama bin Laden; Ayman al-Zawahiri, leader of Jihad group in Egypt and al Qaeda second-in-command; Abu-Yasir Rafa'l Ahmad Taha, leader of the Islamic Group; Sheikh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jumiat-ut-Ulema-e-Pakistan; and Fazlul Rahman, leader of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh.

The fatwa reasons that "three facts that are known to everyone" compel war against the United States. First, the United States has been "occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places." Second, the "crusader-Zionist alliance" has inflicted great devastation upon the Iraqi people. Third, the United States' goal is "to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there.

www.heritage....da-declarations...


Abdul Hakim Murad confessed

Abdul Hakim Murad confessed detailed Phase III in his interrogation by the Manila police after his capture.

Phase three would have involved Murad either renting, buying, or hijacking a small airplane, preferably a Cessna. The airplane would be filled with explosives. He would then crash it into the Central Intelligence Agency headquarters in theLangley area in Fairfax County, Virginia. Murad had been trained as a pilot in North Carolina, and was slated to be a suicide pilot.

There were alternate plans to hijack a 12th commercial airliner and use that instead of the small aircraft, probably due to the Manila cell's growing frustration with explosives. Testing explosives in a house or apartment is dangerous, and it can easily give away a terrorist plot. Khalid Sheik Mohammed probably made the alternate plan.

A report from the Philippines to the United States on January 20, 1995 stated, "What the subject has in his mind is that he will board any American commercial aircraft pretending to be an ordinary passenger. Then he will hijack said aircraft, control its cockpit and dive it at the CIA headquarters."

Another plot that was considered would have involved the hijacking of more airplanes. The World Trade Center (New York City, New York), The Pentagon (Arlington, Virginia), the United States Capitol (Washington, D.C.), the White House(Washington, D.C.), the Sears Tower (Chicago, Illinois), and the U.S Bank Tower (Los Angeles, California), would have been the likely targets. Abdul Hakim Murad said that this part of the plot was dropped since the Manila cell could not recruit enough people to implement other hijackings in his confession with Filipino investigators, prior to the foiling of Operation Bojinka.


The Bojinka Plot

he Bojinka plot was a planned large-scale three phase Islamist attack by Ramzi Yousef and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed. The attack would involve a plot to assassinate Pope John Paul II, an air bombing of 11airliners and their approximately 4,000 passengers that would have flown from Asia to the United States, and Murad's proposal to crash a plane into the CIA's headquarters in Fairfax County, Virginia, in addition to the plan to bomb multiple aeroplanes.

Airports planned to be targeted

Asia
Hong Kong (Kai Tak) International Airport, Hong Kong
New Tokyo International Airport, Narita, Chiba Prefecture, Japan, near Tokyo
Ninoy Aquino International Airport, Pasay City/Parañaque City, National Capital Region, Philippines, near Manila
Taiwan Taoyuan International Airport, Taoyuan, near Taipei, Taiwan
Singapore Changi Airport, Singapore
Gimpo International Airport, Gimpo, South Korea (Now a part of Seoul)
Bangkok (Don Mueang) International Airport, Bangkok, Thailand
United States
Honolulu International Airport, Honolulu, Hawaii
John F. Kennedy International Airport, New York City, New York
Los Angeles International Airport, Los Angeles
Chicago O'Hare International Airport, Chicago, Illinois
San Francisco International Airport, San Francisco

Phase III, CIA plane crash plot

Abdul Hakim Murad confessed detailed Phase III in his interrogation by the Manila police after his capture.
Phase three would have involved Murad either renting, buying, or hijacking a small airplane, preferably a Cessna. The airplane would be filled with explosives. He would then crash it into the Central Intelligence Agency headquarters in the Langley area in Fairfax County, Virginia. Murad had been trained as a pilot in North Carolina, and was slated to be a suicide pilot.

There were alternate plans to hijack a 12th commercial airliner and use that instead of the small aircraft, probably due to the Manila cell's growing frustration with explosives. Testing explosives in a house or apartment is dangerous, and it can easily give away a terrorist plot. Khalid Sheik Mohammed probably made the alternate plan.

A report from the Philippines to the United States on January 20, 1995 stated, "What the subject has in his mind is that he will board any American commercial aircraft pretending to be an ordinary passenger. Then he will hijack said aircraft, control its cockpit and dive it at the CIA headquarters."

Another plot that was considered would have involved the hijacking of more airplanes. The World Trade Center (New York City, New York), The Pentagon (Arlington, Virginia), the United States Capitol (Washington, D.C.), the White House(Washington, D.C.), the Sears Tower (Chicago, Illinois), and the U.S Bank Tower (Los Angeles, California), would have been the likely targets. Abdul Hakim Murad said that this part of the plot was dropped since the Manila cell could not recruit enough people to implement other hijackings in his confession with Filipino investigators, prior to the foiling of Operation Bojinka.

This plot eventually would be the base plot for the September 11, 2001 attacks which involved hijacking commercial airliners as opposed to small aircraft loaded with explosives and crashing them into their intended targets. However, only the World Trade Center (which was destroyed) and The Pentagon (which suffered partial damage) were hit.

en.wikipedia....ki...

edit on 31-7-2015 by skyeagle409 because: (no reason given)

edit on 31-7-2015 by skyeagle409 because: (no reason given)

originally posted by: randyvs

Do you have any evidence of this?

Do you have any evidence of this being Photoshoped ?

originally posted by: soulpowertothendegree
a reply to: skyeagle409

Yeah the lobby didn't explode. The firefighters just thought it did. Boy they sure are silly.

The three firemen were in the lobby of the Marriott Hotel when WTC 2 collapsed on them. They mistook the collapse for an explosion.

We know they were not in the lobby of WTC 2 because they are not dead.

originally posted by: soulpowertothendegree

The amount of people that have come forward are all wrong! You are the only one that is right? Do you see how ridiculous it is to keep insisting that the OS is the truth?

Thats the man who stared at goats and walked through walls. He's a Kook.