Senate CIA Torture Report Released: "Mismanaged Dungeons"

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: whyamIhere

So flying drones in the middle of the night killing 1000's. Is somehow OK with people. I guess torture is worse than death from above. I see hypocrites...

It's all wrong

If you can't come out an say that torture is wrong - as a stand alone statement - without pointing fingers at others, then I have to ask - what do you stand for?

Doesn't matter who did it, who covered it up, however they want to justify it - wrong is wrong

This is our country - and we torture people

No different from Pol Pot, Stalin, Hitler - Assad, Kim Jong Un...the list goes on

It is all wrong...

So, why the selective outrage by some.

originally posted by: whyamIhere

Drones where conviently ignored in this thread.

Innocent women and children by the 100's have been Droned.

Drones were not conveniently ignored in this thread. They were logically ignored in this thread...Because it is not relevant to the topic.

If you want to start a thread on the morality of various military technology or the rules of engagement, please feel free to.

Absent that it is a clear DERAIL.

Why not skip the smaller BS and skip to the bigger BS/Derail? Toss in Abortion? or Nazi's and gay marriage?

"Democrats can't be critical of the torture program while supporting the murder of unborn children!!"

Just intellectual cowardice IMO...

Can we discuss the effectiveness? Merits? Morality of the CIA Rendition and Torture program???

That IS the topic.

I can't wait for the drone report. When is that due out? Where are the pictures of the 5 year old mangled children. Arms blown off, families obliterated, tortured souls walking the planet in the wake of Obama's drone policy.

Where is this moral outrage in this context? Or is this recent report just a means reserved for "certain" political ends?

What Obama has done, the Nobel Winner, the chosen messiah for many here at ATS, what he has done is much, much worse. We know, we understand, symbolism over substance.. You will give him a pass. He could slaughter millions and you wouldn't care.

False outrage..

originally posted by: truckdriver42
I can't wait for the drone report. :

I have a hard time with folks looking to change the topic to Drones...DERAIL

and an accusation of hypocrisy FALSELY based on the premise that everyone against torture is for drone strikes.

Man up and face the topic honestly or bow out of the discussion.

a reply to: Indigo5

I disagree...

This is selective outrage and by saying I'm off topic is incorrect.

The law breaking continues as we speak.

But, some want to go back in time to pile on the previous Administration.

Why, cause you can conviently ignore what your guy is doing today ?

It's either all wrong....Or its selective outrage. Which is it ?

a reply to: Indigo5

I beg to differ... Drones are valid in this context. Entire families are tortured by drone strikes. Let's say your 5 year old was blown apart in front of you. Would that not torture your soul? Or is the agenda to narrow it down to a political statement.. LOL

AND THAT is why we don't really fear ANY takeover from our Govt.
NOTE the streamlined SKILL and flawless executuion of the mission...

a reply to: whyamIhere

So, why the selective outrage by some.

It's not selective

It's what we're talking about

You're the one (like so many others) trying to deflect

This - is what we're talking about

a reply to: whyamIhere

We need to be honest with ourselves.

Yes.

So - how do you feel about the fact that we torture?

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: whyamIhere

So, why the selective outrage by some.

It's not selective

It's what we're talking about

You're the one (like so many others) trying to deflect

This - is what we're talking about

I am against all of it...

But, some can ignore the killing of innocents if their guy pulled the trigger.

This double standard is becoming obvious.

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: truckdriver42
I can't wait for the drone report. :

I have a hard time with folks looking to change the topic to Drones...DERAIL

and an accusation of hypocrisy FALSELY based on the premise that everyone against torture is for drone strikes.

Man up and face the topic honestly or bow out of the discussion.

LOL.. So how narrow are we to focus the discussion? Anything that doesn't touch this administration and only goes back almost a decade is allowed for debate? Drone strikes (Obama ordered) tortured more people than CIA did given the context of torture.

Fine, I will bow out of the pro-Obama, pro-drone strike, anti-Bush, very narrow definition of torture thread.. Have fun..

originally posted by: whyamIhere
a reply to: Indigo5

I disagree...

This is selective outrage and by saying I'm off topic is incorrect.

Selective outrage? No one here on ATS complaining about drone strikes? But complaining about the torture program is off limits?


Again..can we return to the actual topic?

originally posted by: whyamIhere
a reply to: Indigo5

But, some want to go back in time to pile on the previous Administration.

Why, cause you can conviently ignore what your guy is doing today ?

What?...since when was it claimed that this program began and ended with the Bush administration?

It's either all wrong....Or its selective outrage. Which is it ?

For effs sake...enough with the fallacies..

This is called binary choice fallacy...Choices (a) ALL of it is WRONG or (B) I am faking my outrage

AKA...when did you stop beating your wife? Are you a child molester or simply a thief? ad infinium.

DISCUSS the topic or take a hike IMO. The rest is just BS and DERAIL...with it's only contribution being that you are admitting in a round about fashion that you have no actual HONEST defense of Torture.

a reply to: crazyewok

What if it did? If you had to choose between another terrorist attack on America during that time, or "torturing" a few knuckleheads....what would you choose?

Would you choose torture to get someone in the know to confess to who raped your daughter?

a reply to: whyamIhere

But, some can ignore the killing of innocents if their guy pulled the trigger.

I'm so sick of this partisan BS

Why even bring it up?

Every single time someone does, all it amounts to is a: yeah, but...

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Thats the game Spira. The 2 party system is a system of deflection and deception. My mom would have called it "flinging the booger".

"I may kill babies, but you eat them".

a reply to: Indigo5

Torture = Bad

Drone Strikes on people not even charged with a crime = Good

I will leave the thread...

Continue with your selective outrage...it speaks volumes.

You can't justify the killing of innocents...No matter how hard you ignore the obvious.

It's going on as we speak...But, hey you are getting your partisan kicks.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Thats the game Spira. The 2 party system is a system of deflection and deception. My mom would have called it "flinging the booger".

"I may kill babies, but you eat them".

Precisely...and grown-ups would look to skip the deflection and discuss...just for moment..in a mature way...why killing babies is bad....vs. the "Tommy did it too" nonsense.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Honestly Tex, you would think with a story like this that it would stop us in our tracks and make us think

And maybe even unite

My heart is broken

originally posted by: whyamIhere
a reply to: Indigo5

Torture = Bad

Drone Strikes on people not even charged with a crime = Good

I will leave the thread...

Continue with your selective outrage...it speaks volumes.

You can't justify the killing of innocents...No matter how hard you ignore the obvious.

It's going on as we speak...But, hey you are getting your partisan kicks.

When did I declare Drone Strikes on innocent people good?

When did I justify the killing of innocents?

It is a steady stream of blatantly dishonest posts from you here. If you can't discuss the topic..or need to falsely assign beliefs to me .....then why bother?

a reply to: Indigo5

But, that's what you did to me.

You don't like it when it is done to you ?

Why bother indeed.