Senate CIA Torture Report Released: "Mismanaged Dungeons"

Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld should all hang. Politicians need to feel fear, and the only way I see that happening is if they all saw the execution of one of their own.

This "we learned our lesson" bullsh*t is nothing but lies. What civilians ever get away with murder saying, I'm sorry, I learned my lesson? They should be executed. Let future leaders learn the lesson.

a reply to: spiritualzombie

I thought your "well shame on you" was sarcastic". The above statement, if NOT sarcastic would show otherwise.

You can choose to believe the spoon fed bs or listen to someone who was there.

This is just ridiculous. you might consider getting offered papa john's and McDonald's torture, but I don't.

While, there may have been limited instances of enhanced CIA interrogations, they were just that, limited, individual instances for time sensitive intelligence.

This was not a, let's go daily torture the goat herder cause he's only telling us goat eating habits...

Jaden

a reply to: Masterjaden

Not buying your spin. It's a day late and a dollar short. Go sell that spin somewhere else.

originally posted by: Realtruth
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Here's my question in all of this.

Didn't Obama promise to end this asap, as a campaign promise?

And if so, why did he wait until he was a lame duck president to do so?

He did. And he still didn't end it, he just let us know what was going on before he was president (or rather, the Senate did that). Obama is continuing the program just like he's continuing every other thing Bush enacted.

a reply to: spiritualzombie

REally, I'm the one full of #??? ok whatever you say...

Jaden





Now I offered first hand experience, what is it that you are offering besides political rhetoric???

originally posted by: Masterjaden
a reply to: spiritualzombie

REally, I'm the one full of #??? ok whatever you say...

Jaden

Now I offered first hand experience, what is it that you are offering besides political rhetoric???

Thank you for your Service Jaden.

Some of us are proud of you...🇺🇸

originally posted by: whyamIhere
a reply to: Indigo5

But, that's what you did to me.

You don't like it when it is done to you ?

Why bother indeed.

Drone strikes are indiscriminately murdering civilians. The CIA is instead indiscriminately torturing people. They're different topics. The drone strikes aren't fantastic but they have nothing to do with what we're talking about.

a reply to: Masterjaden

Congrats. You aided war criminals.

I'd like to add, I will be the first person to come out against the government. I can't stand some of the BS we have let them get away with.

I don't think we have any business overseas when not in a declared war against a specific nation.

If there are terrorists that aren't part of a nation, we give the nation harboring them the ultimatum of handing them over to us or us declaring war on that harboring nation.

We should close down all overseas bases except as needed during a declared war. We have enough projection power with our carrier battle groups to more than scare the bejesus out of anyone who might threaten us or our allies.

The things said about GTMO though are simply NOT true and I have absolutely NO reason to lie. I don't even need to maintain my clearance any more although I still have an inactive TS/SCI clearance and an active Secret.

Jaden

originally posted by: Masterjaden
Camp xray was only up while the more permanent facilities were being built. It was only being used for a very short period of time, but it's ALL the media ever portrays of GTMO even though they HAVE had access to the newer facilities.

Just curious since you bring up media access. Did you watch the VICE video where they went in? It was very heavily censored. Everyone read from a script and they were told precisely where to point the cameras and for how long.

If that's the type of access given, maybe you can understand us being skeptical?

originally posted by: spiritualzombie
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld should all hang. Politicians need to feel fear, and the only way I see that happening is if they all saw the execution of one of their own.

This "we learned our lesson" bullsh*t is nothing but lies. What civilians ever get away with murder saying, I'm sorry, I learned my lesson? They should be executed. Let future leaders learn the lesson.

If we've decided NK tactics are ok, I say we apply them to our leaders for breaking the law as well. Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld are guilty, but it only starts with them. Three generations of punishment, that's how the Kim's do it. Cheney can be forced to watch his daughter beaten and raped repeatedly for the crimes he committed. Then Bush could do the same.

If we're going to torture the innocent "just incase", I say we punish those related to the guilty "just incase".

a reply to: Aazadan

No I haven't watched any videos that the media has put out, I DID watch various media personnel and congresspeople get taken on tours of the facilities and it was open access for the most part.

I've already showed how the media has biased their reports, if you choose to continue to believe their rhetoric and contrived bs over someone who was actually there for an extended period, then there's really not much I can do.

Jaden

p.s. I can't go into the reasons for any editing. All electronic devices and media that leave GTMO are screened for any sensitive materials. That's as much as I can say. I lost a lot of good porn on my laptop that I didn't want them to see when screening my devices...

a reply to: Masterjaden

I would suggest giving it a watch it's only 20 min long or so. For whatever reason as they were trying to be more forthcoming with information VICE was chosen to get a first look at the facility, from what you've said you were probably there as they came through. Unlike what you would expect from a center/left leaning media media outlet they were fair. If I remember right they even showed prisoners playing Nintendo DS's and talked about it for a bit.

However, the censorship was very apparent. VICE had complete freedom to say whatever they wanted in the voice overs, but the filming itself was completely scripted. I had the impression that the media tried to give them a fair shake but that the military just didn't want to comply, kind of like the military was ordered to do it so they complied to the letter of the order but not the spirit of it.

a reply to: Aazadan

Yes, we weren't allowed to say much to media, we were VERY limited. A lot of that had to do with classified information. For instance, I'm not even allowed to say the NAME of some of the SCI systems I used, let alone what they do.

When walking through the detainee areas, military personnel were required to wear duct tape over name badges etc when they were sewn onto the uniforms and regularly check ourselves on google to make sure no hits were put out on our families.

The 450 or so detainees out of the original 800 or so that were still there by the time I had gotten there were legitimate BAD GUYS that would slit your throat given the opportunity.

Yes, there were one or two detainees that were given preferential treatment, one had his own house and access to the internet. The reality is that the US treated these prisoners better than almost any country in the world and all we hear about is how BAD the US treats these guys.

It's pathetic.

Jaden

a reply to: Masterjaden

Jaden, all I see in your responses is a single person trying to speak for the entire program. You don't want to mention any of the actual torture, so it's all McDonald's and Papa John's. It's such the extreme subversion tactic, and I'm not buying it for a second. Maybe you saw nothing, but that doesn't really mean much.

I think it's interesting the timing... all of a sudden we have these watered down versions of what really happened by a person who was there. Sounds like Hannity tactics. Just a bunch of right wing smoke and mirrors.

We know we were lied to to get us into war. We know the CIA regularly lied, fabricating false evidence that the torture program was working, and we know the torture methods were known to not work. Lies on top of lies and you want to post a scanned image of your service and hope that trumps the entire report?

Not buying it at all.

I will say, let there be a full blown trial. Charge the administration with war crimes. You can be witness for the Bush Administration, and either your testimony will hold water or it won't, but on here, compared to the recently released report, your word means jack.

a reply to: Masterjaden

As I thank you for your service as well. I know that you were not everywhere, doing everything. Impossible.

We did normal interrogations, some advanced/enhanced interrogations and then we did Torture. If you were NOT present for the torture, that's really good for you. However, you're experience, though valid, only paints a small picture of the reality. You apparently weren't there for the bad stuff. You missed it.

This stuff happened. It's bad. We were wrong. Some people should face criminal charges. Cheney for one, Brennan for another and the list goes on, and on, and on.

a reply to: spiritualzombie

maybe you should try a search, when all the obama bs about closing down GTMO came out in 2008 and 2009 I said the same things on this forum.

They even asked me if I might be on the podcast to talk about it back then...

Jaden

a reply to: Masterjaden

You also said this once "It is injustice. You must stand up against injustice in ALL of its forms."

It seems to me, on this particular issue, you're on the wrong side of the fight.

So where's your stance on the injustice of torturing innocent people? Do war crimes constitute an injustice? CIA fabricating evidence to sell a false war... Is that an injustice worth standing up against?

a reply to: Masterjaden

No disrespect to your service..

but a 5 month tour at Guantanamo 10 years ago doesn't qualify you to discredit a report derived from the CIAs own records spanning roughly 72 months/6 years from Black Site detention facilities in

Poland, Lithuania, Thailand, Romania and Afghanistan...that we know of so far..

I am confused why you think your 5 month tour at Guantanamo wholly equals what the CIA engaged in at black site detention facilities around the world?

It seems to me that Guantanamo is the only detention facility that was publicly known and received scrutiny?

Do you think the hundreds of detainees at black sites, beyond the publics awareness or scrutiny received the same treatment as Guantanamo? Why would they? What would qualify you to claim the same in the face of limited awareness, narrow exposure and clearly contradictory evidence from the CIA's own reporting.

I see the headline of CIA and Mismanaged dungeons, and the first thing that pops into my head is some seriously freaky BDSM parties going on in the cellars of the Pentagon, lol.