13 Common Misconceptions About Global Warming

Cold Records Broken In 10 Days

I'm probably ignoring science somehow.

originally posted by: Yeahkeepwatchingme
Cold Records Broken In 10 Days

I'm probably ignoring science somehow.

I am not saying you're ignoring science but can you please explain what those 9 cold records are supposed to prove?

I think you are trying to say because there was a cold record broken in one place on one day or 9 separate days in the past 25 years dating back to 1989 that....

Nope I don't get what your saying sorry.

You know one day out of the month in one location does not make the climate for the year right. If someone says this has been the hottest year on record that is because they averaged all the temps for the entire year.

Maybe I am misunderstanding you. Can you please explain your point?

a reply to: Grimpachi

Those are 1,695 cold records broken. They only chose 9 to show in the article. 282 records tied, 1,413 broken (colder).

a reply to: Yeahkeepwatchingme


OK thanks for clarifying that but still can you please explain what your point is?

Is it that it still gets cold? I know that in fact that was covered with number 1 in the video then further in number 2. It starts at the 20 second mark.

(Global Warming does not mean it will be warmer everywhere all the time which can lead to some confusion like say on a cold winters day you might say "so much for global warming")

Furthermore at the 53 second mark.

(13 of the 14 hottest years have occurred this century) When they say "hottest years" that would be global mean which is all the temps from around the globe not just the US which is taken and averaged. So like when it is winter in the US and cold it is summer Australia and hot. Both temperatures from the upper hemisphere and lower hemisphere of the Earth have to be taken into account when speaking in Global terms.

I will add for verification of those figures please go to the youtube channel and below the video there is a tab that says "more info" click on that and it will show the links to the data.

If I misunderstood your point please clarify the point you were trying to make.

PR firms are behind the conversation to push the warming talking points and have readied retorts to slam anyone who doesn't buy in and a database of people to discredit. They are paid to sell. The 13 Common Misconceptions video is high lighted with other web pages for "How to talk to a Denier".

www.desmogblog.com...

a reply to: searcher109

That is kinda funny actually but that just goes to show how stale the conversations have gotten. I ran across an article a while back reporting that someone programed a BOT to debate climate denial to where it was winning debates. All it had to do was reference the studies and science to win.

Anyway, I had never seen that How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: Responses to the most common skeptical arguments on global warming before. It seems to have a lot of information.

I am a horrible debater but it is a bit easier when the science backs up your position.

a reply to: Yeahkeepwatchingme

A “Low Max” means that the maximum temperatures for the day was the lowest it has ever been.

Interesting. A few points:
1) These are daily records (lowest max for September 12th). Not all time records.
2) These are not record low temperatures, not the coldest September 12th ever. That would be "low min".
3) These are daily low max records for the US.

Lets look at some other records:

The combined average temperature across global land and ocean surfaces for August 2014 was record high for the month, at 0.75°C (1.35°F) above the 20th century average of 15.6°C (60.1°F), topping the previous record set in 1998.

The combined average global land and ocean surface temperature for January–August (year-to-date) was 0.68°C (1.22°F) above the 20th century average of 14.0°C (57.3°F), the third highest for this eight-month period on record.

www.ncdc.noaa.gov...

Global average temperatures for both land and sea are still setting records for highs, not lows.


In the past 365 days in the US, there have been a total of 60 all time high temperature records (max high and max low) set vs 48 all time low temperature records (low max, low min).
www.ncdc.noaa.gov...

In the the past 365 days globally, there have been a total of 160 all time high temperature records set vs 80 all time low temperature records.
www.ncdc.noaa.gov...

We are seeing more all time high temperature records than all time low temperature records. Both globally and in the US. I find that fact quite interesting.

You believe that source?
Heaven help us if that equates to research in your world, just a misguided and foolish nong.a reply to: Grimpachi

a reply to: Colbomoose

Let me guess. You didn't know the links to the information could be found on the youtube page in the "show more" tab.

Yeah that has been the subject of many posts on here. It was my mistake from now on when postings things such as that I will not take for granted that people know how to navigate youtube pages.

So here is the link.

Just below the video there is a tab that says "show more" click on that and there are 13 links to the information presented in the video.

The guy in the video is "presenting information" he was thoughtful enough to post links to where that information can be found.

a reply to: Phage

Interesting. A few points:
1) These are daily records (lowest max for September 12th). Not all time records.
2) These are not record low temperatures, not the coldest September 12th ever. That would be "low min".
3) These are daily low max records for the US.

Oh man. I missed that. I should know better than to take sites like that at face value. Looking at the comments there I wasn't the only one that missed it so I don't feel to bad for being suckered.

Edit to add:

HAHA. On that page I posted "does anyone here know what "Low Max" means? You should look into it".

Not 5 minutes later my post was deleted. So I am pretty sure they want to mislead people. They can't have people understanding what they are looking at you know.

originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Was there a point you were trying to make, or were you just getting a load off your chest?

You people are history, thank God. It's over.

The point is look at your responses... not one iota of common sense, but rather to just try to demean when people like you don't even bother to understand this topic but would label anyone who disagrees with you as a "climate change denier"... Do you people even hear/read yourselves?... Who the hell "denies climate change"?... Come up with an intelligent argument instead of putting labels on other because they disagree with you... BTW, the one "getting a load off your chest" would be those like you...

"You people are history"?... What the hell are you on about now?...

a reply to: Grimpachi

The biggest misconception about climate change is the assumption that government can do anything remedial about it.

Economic strength is the best defense against the unknown, and all governmental activities reduce economic strength.

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: ElectricUniverse



Oh I read it at least the ones where the links worked. One said we should have been experiencing a cooling effect the opposite of what you implied.

You actually have to provide direct evidence of what you are talking about and within context.



As for the PH levels you posted, and other AGW proponents post, on any occasions none of you actually give where proper blame is due. For example, the PH levels from the Canary island, the increase in PH level in that area is being "used" by the AGW proponents to proclaim "the ocean PH is changing because of anthropogenic CO2", and of course they don't explain what the actual reason of the changes of the PH levels in the canary island was because of underwater volcanoes, and not because of humans or atmospheric cO2.

Here is an example on how the AGW crowd try to hide the truth.

This figure shows the relationship between changes in ocean carbon dioxide levels (measured in the left column as a partial pressure—a common way of measuring the amount of a gas) and acidity (measured as pH in the right column). The data come from two observation stations in the North Atlantic Ocean (Canary Islands and Bermuda) and one in the Pacific (Hawaii). The up-and-down pattern shows the influence of seasonal variations.

Data source: Bermuda Institute of Ocean Sciences, 2014; 6 González-Dávila, 2012; 7 University of Hawaii, 2014 8

www.epa.gov...


That's directly from the EPA website, and instead of giving blame where it is due, for example they were blaming the PH reduction in the Canary Island on anthropogenic CO2, when it was the underwater volcanic activity which caused the PH level to lower"...

There you have more proof of the LIES, and false data that the AGW proponents keep getting from people who keep lying to them, but hey, you go ahead and keep believing them if you want.

The natural ocean acidification and fertilization event caused by the submarine eruption of El Hierro
J. M. Santana-Casiano,
M. González-Dávila,
E. Fraile-Nuez,
D. de Armas,
A. G. González,
J. F. Domínguez-Yanes
& J. Escánez
Affiliations
Contributions
Corresponding author
Scientific Reports 3, Article number: 1140 doi:10.1038/srep01140 Received 02 October 2012 Accepted 11 January 2013 Published 25 January 2013


The shallow submarine eruption which took place in October 10th 2011, 1.8 km south of the island of El Hierro (Canary Islands) allowed the study of the abrupt changes in the physical-chemical properties of seawater caused by volcanic discharges. In order to monitor the evolution of these changes, seven oceanographic surveys were carried out over six months (November 2011-April 2012) from the beginning of the eruptive stage to the post-eruptive phase. Here, we present dramatic changes in the water column chemistry including large decreases in pH, striking effects on the carbonate system, decreases in the oxygen concentrations and enrichment of Fe(II) and nutrients. Our findings highlight that the same volcano which was responsible for the creation of a highly corrosive environment, affecting marine biota, has also provided the nutrients required for the rapid recuperation of the marine ecosystem.

www.nature.com...


Typical of the AGW crowd to lie and twist the truth to keep pushing for the AGW religious agenda...

As for what is causing problems in our oceans? it is not CO2, but it is for example the coreexit that was released in the gulf of Mexico to hide the true extent of the oil spill. And what did AGW fanatic lunatic OBama do?... Obama is one of your pals no? since he wants to impose taxes and laws against CO2, you two must be good pals, but what did he do?... NOTHING, he didn't demand for BP to completely clean up the mess they caused, and while the "cap and trade" scheme keeps making rich richer, the people keep getting the shaft...

Oh and about Hawaii... isn't Hawaii also undergoing some recent volcanic events?... But naa, the volcanic events "canot" in the minds of the AGW proponents by the reason for the changes in PH levels in those areas...

Watch, soon the AGW crowd are going to show us what the PH levels are around Icelandia, and close to the Icelandic volcano and they will blame the chage in PH levels to "the evil anthropogenic CO2"....

Yep no cyclic temperature changes in past. Please accept the fact that exhaling CO2 endangers your existence.

a reply to: Semicollegiate

and all governmental activities reduce economic strength.

I think oil, coal, gas, railroad and space exploration would have to disagree with you on that one. I'm all for small to no government myself but that doesn't mean we should be willfully ignorant that sometimes big things can only be achieved by business and government working together. Any government that exists should be working for the people that elect it and as was the case in history, so is the case now... when it comes to massive projects, paradigm shifting projects, use of tax dollars are required and as these projects gain their footing then private dollars will overtake the tax dollars and governments financial participation shrinks. We are starting to see that now with renewables, especially innovations with solar to make it more efficient, cost effective and less rare earths dependent.

a reply to: Kali74


Prohibition, a big government action, derailed the developement of alternative fuels, and organic chemistry research in general, for 13 years, at a time when those organic chemicals commanded a greater share of new research.

The Anti-Saloon League

The ASL, under the shrewd and ruthless leadership of Wayne Wheeler, became the most successful single issue lobbying organization in American history, willing to form alliances with any and all constituencies that shared its sole goal: a constitutional amendment that would ban the manufacture, sale and transportation of alcohol. They united with Democrats and Republicans, Progressives, Populists, and suffragists, the Ku Klux Klan and the NAACP, the International Workers of the World, and many of America's most powerful industrialists including Henry Ford, John D. Rockefeller, Jr., and Andrew Carnegie – all of whom lent support to the ASL's increasingly effective campaign.
www.pbs.org...

Railroads received more subsidies from the government than any other industry in history, except maybe he space program. The railroads received free government land, and the services of the US Army for free, from the big government Republicans of the 1860's. The railroad cartel decided using indians as slave labor wouldn't work out, but the government was OK with it.

All the Pay, None of the Risk
In essence, Durant hired himself to construct the railroad, paying Credit Mobilier with money given to the Union Pacific by government bonds and risk-taking investors. He subcontracted railroad work to real construction crews while using inflated estimates to ensure significant profit. Because there was no liability, it didn't matter whether the railroad actually got built. In case of forfeiture, Durant could not lose the profit he had already earned. With a crazily bent, ox-bow-shaped line out of Omaha adding nine unnecessary profit-generating miles to construction, the money-making machine got off to a roaring start.
www.pbs.org...

Waste does not increase the standard of living for everyone. Only a free market minimizes waste.

Government maximizes waste.

The space program never had a chance to develop as a laissez-faire program. The first ocean going ships were not made by government, they were made by laissez-faire businessmen seeking profit.

Communications satellites would have been the first man made things in space, and sooner, without the big progressively constructed welfare-warfare state domination of the 20th century.

If the progressive government had been installed in 1776, we wouldn't be in space at all. We would still be laying a railroad track to every welfare recipients front door, in the name of fairness and equality.


There are only two ways to make an income.

1) Produce something for trade.

2) Take something without paying for it.

The government takes wealth out of the economy.

Big business cartelism uses big government coercion to destroy the most advanced and productive economy.

Wealthy countries deal with disasters better than poor countries. The best solution to climate change is a strong and versatile economy.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

they don't explain what the actual reason of the changes of the PH levels in the canary island was because of underwater volcanoes, and not because of humans or atmospheric cO2.

Here is an example on how the AGW crowd try to hide the truth.

That's directly from the EPA website, and instead of giving blame where it is due, for example they were blaming the PH reduction in the Canary Island on anthropogenic CO2, when it was the underwater volcanic activity which caused the PH level to lower"

It is pretty amazing how those three stations coincide with each other over all those miles from each other. And for them to match up over so many years as well....hmmm...BTW what is the volcano in Bermuda that must be emitting the same amount of gas as the other two stations for all those years? Hasn't that place been inactive for about 33 million years? Maybe you are saying one volcano in the Canary Islands that is effecting the world PH.

Please...think will you.

As for what is causing problems in our oceans? it is not CO2, but it is for example the coreexit that was released in the gulf of Mexico to hide the true extent of the oil spill.

So are you claiming coreexit from the gulf that is affecting all the stations even in the pacific now.

Obama is one of your pals no? since he wants to impose taxes and laws against CO2, you two must be good pals, but what did he do?... NOTHING, he didn't demand for BP to completely clean up the mess they caused, and while the "cap and trade" scheme keeps making rich richer, the people keep getting the shaft.

You know there is a forum for slinging mud on ATS. Please at least try to to stay on topic here. Yu were the one complaining about insults in the thread can you not hold yourself to the same standard?

Oh and about Hawaii... isn't Hawaii also undergoing some recent volcanic events?... But naa, the volcanic events "canot" in the minds of the AGW proponents by the reason for the changes in PH levels in those areas...

Yes, it’s true, Mauna Loa is an active volcano. In fact it’s the biggest volcano on earth! So, should we suppose that Charles Keeling didn't know that?

Well, no, he did know it. And using subtle scientific indicators like “wind direction,” he was even able to ensure that his readings were not contaminated by any out-gassing when it was occurring. OK, to be fair, it is not really always that simple; out-gassed CO2 can be carried far away on a favorable wind, only to return much later on an ill one. But really, these are clever people, these scientists, and while mistakes are made, they are not usually such simple ones.

A quick look at the actual levels recorded makes it pretty hard to believe there is any volcanic influence. We have a nice, slow, steady trend with a regular up and down seasonal variation. No spikes, no dips. Nothing random, as one would expect from an overwhelming volcanic influence. The record is here among other places.

But, OK, let’s throw out Mauna Loa. There are dozens of other sampling stations scattered all over the globe, including one in the Antarctic, far from cities, SUVs, cement plants, and active volcanoes. It also shows the same , though the southern hemisphere tends to lag a few years behind the northern hemisphere, where the majority of the CO2 is produced. Here are eight others — same results.

Sorry, its all of us Joes, not the volcanoes. As far as I know that volcano outgasses above ground not underwater.

Don't take my word for it look at the station data yourself. www.pmel.noaa.gov...
OA moniyoring stations
Also can you please explain what your point is about El Hierro eruption. I explained to you why that was a bad example so you post it again without addressing anything????? So what is your point?

a reply to: Grimpachi

It isn't just one volcano, there are many... In case you didn't know we think there are over 3 million volcanos underwater and the majority are much bigger than any land volcano.

Here is a photo where you can see some of the underwater volcanoes which have been discovered all over the world.

...
More than 3,000,000 underwater volcanoes!

In 2007, oceanographers Hillier and Watts surveyed 201,055 submarine volcanoes. “From this they concluded an astounding total of 3,477,403 submarine volcanoes must reasonably exist worldwide,” said this article by John O’Sullivan.

Hillier and Watts “based this finding on the earlier and well-respected observations of Earth and Planetary Sciences specialist, Batiza (1982) who found that at least 4 per cent of seamounts are active volcanoes.”

According to Batiza’s survey, the Pacific mid-plate alone contains an incredible 22,000 to 55,000 underwater volcanoes, with at least 2,000 of them considered active.

Thinking that anyone could know exactly how many volcanoes lurk beneath the surface of the ocean is ludicrous, of course. But that 3,477,403 number, coming from two well-respected oceanographers, does reinforce my point rather nicely, namely, that underwater volcanoes are heating the seas.
...

www.themoralliberal.com...


Also, in case you haven't been paying attention volcanic and seismic activity is increasing all over the world. Even a good portion of the volcanos on land are erupting right now.

www.volcanodiscovery.com...


But in case you didn't know, there is evidence that for example areas of the Antarctic are being melted by underwater volcanic activity. This activity in turn changes the PH level in these areas.

Researchers Find Major West Antarctic Glacier Melting from Geothermal Sources


June 10, 2014

AUSTIN, Texas — Thwaites Glacier, the large, rapidly changing outlet of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, is not only being eroded by the ocean, it’s being melted from below by geothermal heat, researchers at the Institute for Geophysics at The University of Texas at Austin (UTIG) report in the current edition of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

The findings significantly change the understanding of conditions beneath the West Antarctic Ice Sheet where accurate information has previously been unobtainable.

The Thwaites Glacier has been the focus of considerable attention in recent weeks as other groups of researchers found the glacier is on the way to collapse, but more data and computer modeling are needed to determine when the collapse will begin in earnest and at what rate the sea level will increase as it proceeds. The new observations by UTIG will greatly inform these ice sheet modeling efforts.
...

www.utexas.edu...


I have already shown several times that the Earth's magnetic field is now 10 times weaker than it has been since the 1990s. Although these changes started much earlier around the 1840-1860. Since then the Earth's magnetic field has been weakening and this is evidence of changes in Earth's interior. There have been recent changes which started occurring 7 months ago, including the speed at which true magnetic north is moving towards Siberia, which it's been going through a sudden increase in speed starting 7 months ago.

These changes seen on Earth's magnetic field means that large plumes of magma are rising from the core causing these changes on Earth's magnetic field and also causing the increase in seismic and magmatic/volcanic activity.

Earth's Magnetic Field Is Weakening 10 Times Faster Now

by Kelly Dickerson | July 08, 2014 11:29am ET

Changes measured by the Swarm satellite over the past 6 months shows that Earth's magnetic field is changing. Shades of red show areas where it is strengthening, and shades of blue show areas that are weakening.
Credit: ESA/DTU
View full size image


Earth's magnetic field, which protects the planet from huge blasts of deadly solar radiation, has been weakening over the past six months, according to data collected by a European Space Agency (ESA) satellite array called Swarm.

The biggest weak spots in the magnetic field — which extends 370,000 miles (600,000 kilometers) above the planet's surface — have sprung up over the Western Hemisphere, while the field has strengthened over areas like the southern Indian Ocean, according to the magnetometers onboard the Swarm satellites — three separate satellites floating in tandem.

The scientists who conducted the study are still unsure why the magnetic field is weakening, but one likely reason is that Earth's magnetic poles are getting ready to flip, said Rune Floberghagen, the ESA's Swarm mission manager. In fact, the data suggest magnetic north is moving toward Siberia.
...

www.livescience.com...


The Earth has been going through changes and nothing that you, or the entire human race can do will stop it. These changes started occurring BEFORE the height of the industrial revolution, and Earth started warming in the early 1600s. Some other members and I have been trying to show people these changes and the evidence that they are happening, and not because of mankind's activities.

The changes the Earth is experiencing haven't been seen in over 800,000 years if not longer.



The above graph shows the fluctuations on Earth's magnetic field for the last 800,000 years. The red dots on the left of the graph shows the changes in the current period, and that graph is not showing the recent changes that started happening 7 months ago.

But if you look at the graph you can see that Earth is going through changes that haven't occurred for over 800,000 years+.

You can blame mankind's activities for a lot of things, you can hate mankind all you want but mankind's activities are not the reason for these changes which affect the CLIMATE and cause other physical changes on the Earth.

These changes will continue and will get a lot worse but it won't be "because of mankind's activities".

BTW, the areas where Earth's magnetic field is strengthening have shown evidence of activity which has never been noted before.

The recent thread a member made showing the photos about strange glowing lights being seen in the ocean south of the Russian peninsula Kamchatka. Before that even the witnesses saw lightning coming from the ground up, and this even occurred in one of the three areas where Earth's magnetic field is strengthening.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I reported on that thread that a similar event happened south of Madagascar in 2004, another area where Earth's magnetic field has been strengthening, and was classified as a new event. Before the glowing lights were captured by the camera, there was a lightning bolt similar to what happened in the latest event.

Space shuttle observation of an unusual transient atmospheric emission
Yoav Yair,1 Colin Price,2 Baruch Ziv,1 Peter L. Israelevich,2 Davis D. Sentman,3
Fernanda T. Sa˜o-Sabbas,4 Adam D. Devir,1 Mitsuteru Sato,5 Craig J. Rodger,6
Meir Moalem,2 Eran Greenberg,2 and Ofer Yaron2
Received 17 September 2004; revised 11 November 2004; accepted 10 December 2004; published 18 January 2005.

[1] We report an observation of an unusual transient luminous event (TLE) detected in the near IR, south of Madagascar above the Indian Ocean. The event was imaged from the space shuttle Columbia during the MEIDEX sprite campaign [Yair et al., 2004]. It was delayed 0.23 seconds from a preceding visual lightning flash which was horizontally displaced >1000 km from the event. The calculated brightness in the 860 (±50) nm filter was
310 ± 30 kR, and the morphology of the emitting volume did not resemble any known class of TLE (i.e., sprites, ELVES or halos). This TIGER event (Transient Ionospheric Glow Emission in Red) may constitute a new class of TLE, not necessarily induced by a near-by thunderstorm.

We discuss possible generation mechanisms, including the conjugate sprite hypothesis caused by lightning at the magnetic mirror point, lightning-induced electron precipitation and an extraterrestrial source, meteoric or
cometary. Citation: Yair, Y., et al. (2005), Space shuttle observation of an unusual transient atmospheric emission,
Geophys. Res. Lett., 32, L02801, doi:10.1029/2004GL021551.
...

onlinelibrary.wiley.com...


These two events are very rare, and imo they could be an indication of changes occurring in Earth's interior which are affecting Earth's magnetic field and is increasing the seismic and magmatic/volcanic events.

originally posted by: Grimpachi


So are you claiming coreexit from the gulf that is affecting all the stations even in the pacific now.

No, you need to learn to understand what people say within the context of the conversation. I wasn't saying that the coreexit from the Gulf of Mexico is affecting the Pacific... "show me where I wrote this"...

originally posted by: Grimpachi

You know there is a forum for slinging mud on ATS. Please at least try to to stay on topic here. Yu were the one complaining about insults in the thread can you not hold yourself to the same standard?

All I said is that Obama must be your pal since he wants to implement taxes and laws on CO2, and like you believes CO2 must be sequestered, but he didn't do # about the destruction that BP caused in the Gulf of Mexico and allowed BP to leave with only a minor slap in the wrist... Of course, now BP can't be sued for destroying the Gulf of Mexico since they already paid a small sum and all they did was hide the oil and coreexit.

BTW, I said that the problems with the coreexit that is at the bottom of the Gulf is ONE of the real problems that we should be fixing. I did not state that the corexit from the MExico oil spill is causing all the problems all around the world...

originally posted by: Grimpachi
Well, no, he did know it. And using subtle scientific indicators like “wind direction,” he was even able to ensure that his readings were not contaminated by any out-gassing when it was occurring. OK, to be fair, it is not really always that simple; out-gassed CO2 can be carried far away on a favorable wind, only to return much later on an ill one. But really, these are clever people, these scientists, and while mistakes are made, they are not usually such simple ones.

...

Oh really, so did he take into account the underwater volcanoes in the Hawaii area as well?

For example.

This is just showing an eruption underwater on the West Mata volcano, Lau basin.