Is that a Drill Sergeant or a Police Officer? Belligerent Cop Loses it On Man for Knowing His Rights

Driving is not a freaking privilege.

They have no right to tell me if I can drive or not period it's stupid.

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: jhn7537

Well for starters, passports are permits to be in a country. Driver's licenses are permits to drive a car.

I don't mean like that, I'm talking about common forms of identification that people have.

a reply to: smithjustinb

No I saw that but it's still wrong. You can't go a buy a junky car and drive off without insurance and a drivers license. You have to write a test to prove your road knowledge and pass a competency road test. Then you are issued a permit which is valid only between two dates. This happens because driving is regulated. Look on the back of your card. It's says permit. Not Right. Permit means your are permitted. Don't know why your arguing this. It's really common knowledge.

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: smithjustinb

No I saw that but it's still wrong. You can't go a buy a junky car and drive off without insurance and a drivers license. You have to write a test to prove your road knowledge and pass a competency road test. Then you are issued a permit which is valid only between two dates. This happens because driving is regulated. Look on the back of your card. It's says permit. Not Right. Permit means your are permitted. Don't know why your arguing this. It's really common knowledge.

All these things are true. But, none of this makes driving a privilege. Despite all these things, I still say it is a right and remains a right. If it weren't a right, then this Orwellian officer would have been justified in his behavior. If it weren't a right, then licenses could be revoked without cause. It is a right with reasonable limitations.

a reply to: jhn7537

Police have the right to ask you for your drivers license when your behind the wheel or have keys in your hand. It's been that way for 100 years. Believe it or not, you can get a DUI even if the car is off and the keys are in your pocket. It's called care and control.

a reply to: smithjustinb

I still say it is a right and remains a right. If it weren't a right, then this Orwellian officer would have been justified in his behavior. If it weren't a right, then licenses could be revoked without cause. It is a right with reasonable limitations.

lol but it isn't a right...lol. Just because you feel it should be does't make it above the law. Can I ask how long you've been driving? I'm dying to know.

Listen, all it takes is a quick google search to answer your question. Say, what if suddenly flying cars are on the market tomorrow. Does that mean we all have the "right" to fly one? No, it would be regulated too and we would have to get a permit.

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: jhn7537

Police have the right to ask you for your drivers license when your behind the wheel or have keys in your hand. It's been that way for 100 years. Believe it or not, you can get a DUI even if the car is off and the keys are in your pocket. It's called care and control.

Yes, they certainly can ask, but I believe they need cause to pull you over to check for that identification...

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: smithjustinb

I still say it is a right and remains a right. If it weren't a right, then this Orwellian officer would have been justified in his behavior. If it weren't a right, then licenses could be revoked without cause. It is a right with reasonable limitations.

lol but it isn't a right...lol. Just because you feel it should be does't make it above the law. Can I ask how long you've been driving? I'm dying to know.

Listen, all it takes is a quick google search to answer your question. Say, what if suddenly flying cars are on the market tomorrow. Does that mean we all have the "right" to fly one? No, it would be regulated too and we would have to get a permit.

You 2 keep going back and forth with this right vs privilege stuff. I'll just simply ask this to both of you. If you are driving down the road and not breaking any laws do the police have the right to detain you without probable cause or reasonable suspicion?

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: Aazadan

Wrong. The check point set up was a regulatory one therefore classifies as legal. Regulatory stops are for the purpose of verifying vehicle licences and registration.

And regulatory checkpoints are against the law. They were given a special exception precisely because they go against the fourth amendment. Stopping a vehicle without cause, and then demanding documents from the driver is not legal.

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: smithjustinb
Say, what if suddenly flying cars are on the market tomorrow. Does that mean we all have the "right" to fly one.

As long as we comply with FAA regulations. If I made my own flying car, I should be able to take it to the skies as long as can do so without putting others in danger. Its a right.

originally posted by: XTexan

originally posted by: FlySolo
a reply to: smithjustinb

I still say it is a right and remains a right. If it weren't a right, then this Orwellian officer would have been justified in his behavior. If it weren't a right, then licenses could be revoked without cause. It is a right with reasonable limitations.

lol but it isn't a right...lol. Just because you feel it should be does't make it above the law. Can I ask how long you've been driving? I'm dying to know.

Listen, all it takes is a quick google search to answer your question. Say, what if suddenly flying cars are on the market tomorrow. Does that mean we all have the "right" to fly one? No, it would be regulated too and we would have to get a permit.

You 2 keep going back and forth with this right vs privilege stuff. I'll just simply ask this to both of you. If you are driving down the road and not breaking any laws do the police have the right to detain you without probable cause or reasonable suspicion?

My answer is, of course not.

a reply to: smithjustinb

Rights are those that are defined in the bill of rights correct?
Find me the one that says you have the right to drive.
I will agree the cops have no right to pull you over on the premise that it is a only a privilege to drive.
But you do not have a right to drive

a reply to: FlySolo

originally posted by: FlySolo
He wasn't even mouthing off, just being an annoying tool. Which could very well be considered police interference which IS an indictable offence.

He was asking a question. He was asking if he was being detained, they wouldn't answer his question with a straight answer (ask yourself why).

Cops are just regular people too but when you immediately jump out of the gate on them, they go into 'work mode'. You don't want that.

Why, are cops so incapable of controlling themselves when questioned that we have something to fear? If yes why are you acting like the driver is the problem in this video?

At least I would try to get a sense of the cop first before I started in.

You would take extra steps to assess the demeanour of the cop before questioning or exercising your rights (because the reality is your life, safety and well-being mean nothing to a cop). Being submissive isn't going to change that.

I've seen worse cases of police abusing their authority

So that makes it okay in your eyes?

Not long ago I got pulled over for no seat belt plus I was speeding, motorcycle cop.

Since you were breaking the law when stopped, I fail to see the relevance?

He probably would have been gone sooner if he hadn't made such a stink about it.

Ah yes, the usual cop catch phrase. Are you a cop?

Whether or not these check stops are illegal is besides the point.

Reminds me of Hillary Clinton's "What difference does it make" comment tbh.

These were just some thoughts while scanning your posts.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: smithjustinb

Rights are those that are defined in the bill of rights correct?

All the rights in the bill of rights are rights. But, they don't cover all rights. There are more rights.

Find me the one that says you have the right to drive.

Well there were no cars when the bill of rights was written, so that would be hard to find.

I will agree the cops have no right to pull you over on the premise that it is a only a privilege to drive.
But you do not have a right to drive

As long as your license isn't being revoked for no reason (and its not), then it can be considered a right. Someone who doesn't pay taxes can be considered to be driving privileged. But, as a taxpayer who pays for the road, I have a fundamental right to drive. I enabled the road to be built, according to my means, just as much as every other citizen who can drive safely. By natural right, I have the freedom to drive. Not by bill of rights. Rights don't come from the bill of rights. Rights come from being a human. I shared the task of building and maintaining the road. I share in the freedom and right to use it.

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
What is the deal about picking a fight with LEOs by DENYING to show ID and Insurance? I've DONE it for YEARS.

The Cop got the ass about that alone I don't SEE why someone refuses to be IDENTIFIED in THIS day and age.

What I hear is... I bend over and take it up the rear, so everyone should bend over and take it up the rear! Just no... If YOU are happy to do it, carry on and do it! But if someone is not happy then they can stick up for their RIGHTS! Simple as that!

To detain you they NEED probable cause buddy! Hense why these pigs dont just say yes you are being detained! Dont you notice that in these vids? They ALWAYS avoid the question! WHY? Because they KNOW they can't do this!

a reply to: smithjustinb
I don't know how long you've been driving, but it's a well known fact that driving is definitely a privilege, not a right. The only rights we have are located in the bill of rights, so I'm kind of confused as to what other rights you are referring to.

originally posted by: Voyaging
a reply to: smithjustinb
I don't know how long you've been driving, but it's a well known fact that driving is definitely a privilege, not a right.

Its not a fact. Its a regurgitating belief that keeps asserting itself despite it being wrong.

The only rights we have are located in the bill of rights,

The rights that are allowed to us aren't the only rights we have. The citizens of North Korea have the same rights we do. They just get punished for exercising them. But rights aren't given by governments. They are given by our creator. Its human rights. Not government sanctioned rights. Know the difference.

so I'm kind of confused

Of course you are.

what other rights you are referring to.

I'm just referring to the right to drive as a consequence of helping maintain the means that enable everyone to drive right now. I'm not referring to any other right now.

originally posted by: Voyaging
a reply to: smithjustinb
The only rights we have are located in the bill of rights, so I'm kind of confused as to what other rights you are referring to.

You have unenumerated rights (right to travel, the right to autonomy, the right to privacy, the right to dignity, and the right to an Abortion are all aknowledged by the Supreme Court, though there are many things that could fall under this category) and they are protected by the Ninth (IX) Amendment to the United States Constitution.

Also there Human Rights as written in The Universal Declaration of Human Rights (United Nations), though those are quite similar to the Bill of Rights.

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
What is the deal about picking a fight with LEOs by DENYING to show ID and Insurance? I've DONE it for YEARS.

The Cop got the ass about that alone I don't SEE why someone refuses to be IDENTIFIED in THIS day and age.

The cop said "I've asked you for your driver's license" which he actually hadn't. But the driver was technically wrong when he said he doesn't have to provide his license. Since he is operating a motor vehicle, he DOES have to provide the license.

According to the supreme court, REGULATION checkpoints are legal under the 4th amendment, while ENFORCEMENT checkpoints are illegal if they conduct any sort of search (like looking into your pupils) without probable cause (driving, looking or smelling drunk).


If I were the other officer, I would have told Gunnery Sergeant Hartman there to calm down and step back, and I would have explained calmly to the driver that he is mistaken, and if I were asking for just an ID card then he is right, but while behind the wheel, he does have to show proof of being a licensed driver.

I just do not understand cops who like to ESCALATE things.

Amerika.
Land of the free, home of the jack-boot.