Malaysian 777 Passenger Airline Shot Down Over Eastern Ukraine

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: rustyclutch

How is something that's highly suspicious a fact? The only fact you stated is that the Ukraine has BUK systems, along with a lot of other countries.

So....the video that the News is using as a confession has the same look about it as a video made 2 months ago and it's not suspicious? Are you saying the videos I linked don't exist? What fact are you disputing?

Am I supposed to believe that this guy has been getting his phone or whatever he talks on tapped for 2 months and he is still blabbermouthing away about every military move they make on it? It took you a whopping 2 minutes to respond and one of the videos is like 14 minutes dude. At least ATTEMPT to understand what I post before making me defend myself.

a reply to: rustyclutch

You said "people should get some facts straight", and then said that the videos were suspicious. That isn't a fact, it's simply something suspicious. I understand what you wrote, but that still doesn't make it fact, it makes it something that needs to be further looked into.

Some equipment was said to have been moved back to Russia.

Including the rebels hauling a BUK missile battery back to Russia with one missile missing. Would love to see the pic or video if true.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: rustyclutch

You said "people should get some facts straight", and then said that the videos were suspicious. That isn't a fact, it's simply something suspicious. I understand what you wrote, but that still doesn't make it fact, it makes it something that needs to be further looked into.

The fact that someone made another video using the same template is worthy of note and it is a fact. Whether or not YOU believe it's suspicious is irrelevant. I presented two FACTS. plural. More than one. I stand by my statement. You care to disprove either statement? 1 that they have the BUKs. 2 that there are other videos "allegedly" attributed to this guys conveniently in Youtubes archives before the plane crash ever occured. I know you are a mod and all....lol but you should bring it down a notch dude.


ETA...not trying to be rude at all. It's just the thread is 72 pages and people keep debating the wrong things, taking conjecture as fact, and overall not debunking any of the information. That's what I was attempting to do. Debunk the alleged phonecalls and the fact that they don't have buks. I've noticed that is the evidence a lot of people are using to come to their conclusions.

originally posted by: NoRulesAllowed

originally posted by: Hilux1996
This was in the David Icke Headlines this morning!

Explain to me how "the West" "wants" a war with Russia?

TBH, a war with RUSSIA is likely the *least* thing we want, first it would be an ultimate catastrophe (WW3 basically), secondly we cannot even afford it.

Of course they want a war with Russia. Why do you think the US and EU took over the Ukraine in the first place?! Do you think it was an accident that the guy in power in Ukraine at the moment (Poroshenko) has been working with the US since 2005? Do you think it was an accident that the rebels that were on the rooftops in Kiev were US employed and that they shot innocent people on the streets that subsequently was blamed on the 'Elected' Government.

And it's strange Putin's plane looks similar to the Malaysian one and Putin't plane was supposed to be in the air at the same time?

rt.com...

Ukraine shoot down? Or should I say Uraine puppet US and EU?!

a reply to: AstralTrespass

I already stated that I do not want an all out war. What we need are some leaders with balls that speak out when something like this occurs and does not simply head off on vacation. I am also not comparing administrations as those people are in the past and did what they did. I mean the current admin. I would not care if it was O or Hil or some other puppet, the fact is that you cannot threaten more sanctions when it is 'very clear' what happened. Look at the facts...

1. A commercial airliner was shot down.
2. No mechanical failures...cannot back track
3. Very large and long debris field
4. Multiple airplanes were shot down or hit in the past 3 weeks in the same region.
5. The Ukrainian invasion is at a stalemate. We have not moved to assist the Ukraine so this is a "poke the West' moment. This is not a 'downed US drone caught' situation. This was not a mistake. It is a calculated way to gain response, reaction and allow a further foothold in the region for Russia. They will tell the Ukrainians, even though it was pro-Russian separatists they need more protection in the region...and people will buy it.

There is no need for war but if the US and its allies do not call Russia out on this they will not be able to say anything in the future. It is setting a dangerous precedent for the loss of innocent lives.

a reply to: Nochzwei
Sorry after so many flip flops and utter lies Mr. Obama have 0 (zero) credibility. Even that evil Putin have more credibility - and I say it as citizen of former CCCP satelite country (ie we hate Russians). Those neocon bastards were at least consistent with their warmongering. Obama, Nobel peace laureate, is war criminal as Bush and Cheney are - but they are at least proud of it. Obama is just wallstreet clown pretending he isn't.

Forgot to mention Hitlary/Hitlery/Killery Clinton. If she is leftist politician then I'm saint living on Mars and practicing fascist.

originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: VegHead

He said "at least one American."

They could be waiting to release the other names after their families have been notified.

Yeah heard this just now.

And if past actions are any indication of what is going to happen now ?

One need look no further than Benghazi.

Where nothing was done.

originally posted by: rustyclutch

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: rustyclutch

You said "people should get some facts straight", and then said that the videos were suspicious. That isn't a fact, it's simply something suspicious. I understand what you wrote, but that still doesn't make it fact, it makes it something that needs to be further looked into.

The fact that someone made another video using the same template is worthy of note and it is a fact. Whether or not YOU believe it's suspicious is irrelevant. I presented two FACTS. plural. More than one. I stand by my statement. You care to disprove either statement? 1 that they have the BUKs. 2 that there are other videos "allegedly" attributed to this guys conveniently in Youtubes archives before the plane crash ever occured. I know you are a mod and all....lol but you should bring it down a notch dude.

I think it useful for people to investigate first.

If you are talking about the Rebel "Defense Minister"...his phones weren't tapped..He bragged about shooting down the Airliner on both FB and VK (Russia's version of FB) when he thought it was still a Military Cargo Craft. he even included video!

Plus Twiiter I think...I'd have to hunt it down. Something like "we just shot down one of your birds. I warned you not to fly over our territory"...followed by all the specifics of where the plane crashed.

americablog.com...

He also bragged about obtaining the Anti-Aircraft weaponry the week before!

Both posts have now been pulled..but the internet is forever.

Add to that pictures of the Same SAMs set up in the center of a village where it was shot down..

Plus the fact that where the SAM originated is thoroughly held Rebel occupied territory...The idea that Ukraine Military drove a huge SAM truck into the dead middle of that territory, surrounded by rebels who took no notice and conducted operations without notice, then left is ridiculous.

The Rebels OWN LEADER took very public credit for this right when it happened, then pulled the posts once he realized in was a civilian craft he shot down.

a reply to: LeatherNLace
Sorry I originally used this source but this link didn't work so I looked for another article, Sorry my mistake.
www.ibtimes.co.uk...
it says they where all attending a conference in Malaysia I guess some of them where activist and delegates so not all researchers

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: rustyclutch

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: rustyclutch

You said "people should get some facts straight", and then said that the videos were suspicious. That isn't a fact, it's simply something suspicious. I understand what you wrote, but that still doesn't make it fact, it makes it something that needs to be further looked into.

The fact that someone made another video using the same template is worthy of note and it is a fact. Whether or not YOU believe it's suspicious is irrelevant. I presented two FACTS. plural. More than one. I stand by my statement. You care to disprove either statement? 1 that they have the BUKs. 2 that there are other videos "allegedly" attributed to this guys conveniently in Youtubes archives before the plane crash ever occured. I know you are a mod and all....lol but you should bring it down a notch dude.

I think it useful for people to investigate first.

If you are talking about the Rebel "Defense Minister"...his phones weren't tapped..He bragged about shooting down the Airliner on both FB and VK (Russia's version of FB) when he thought it was still a Military Cargo Craft. he even included video!

Plus Twiiter I think...I'd have to hunt it down. Something like "we just shot down one of your birds. I warned you not to fly over our territory"...followed by all the specifics of where the plane crashed.

americablog.com...

He also bragged about obtaining the Anti-Aircraft weaponry the week before!

Both posts have now been pulled..but the internet is forever.

Add to that pictures of the Same SAMs set up in the center of a village where it was shot down..

Plus the fact that where the SAM originated is thoroughly held Rebel occupied territory...The idea that Ukraine Military drove a huge SAM truck into the dead middle of that territory, surrounded by rebels who took no notice and conducted operations without notice, then left is ridiculous.

The Rebels OWN LEADER took very public credit for this right when it happened, then pulled the posts once he realized in was a civilian craft he shot down.

You are assuming that this twitter account even belongs to said individual. The videos were uploaded to youtube before the plane even crashed. This guy has known for almost 3 months he has been getting his phone tapped. If he's so twitter savvy as everyone believes I would imagine he would also be aware of youtube videos purporting to have his communications tapped. Also I thought SAMS were missiles. Missiles shoot over distances don't they? It's not like u gotta get within shotgun range of the plane. I would imagine you could be a couple miles outside of town and it would make no difference really would it?

ETA...I've never used twitter once in my life. Never tweeted a word. What makes you think this guy in the middle of a war zone is giving everyone updates?

a reply to: neo96

Let's assume there were Americans on board. What should be done?

Should we invade the Ukraine? Should we declare war on Russia?

Should we pound our chests, become outraged and potentially risk the lives of thousands of troops just to get justice for the handful of lives that were taken in this tragedy?

In all seriousness, Neo....what would you do?

a reply to: Zaphod58

Could it be that, there is a problem with the 777 aircraft with a combination of bad maintenance and manufacturing Flaw? There have been 3 with problems.

6 July 2013; Asiana Airlines; 777-200ER; HL7742; flight 214; San Francisco, CA:

www.airsafe.com...

A 777 made an emergency landing at Midway Island due to burning odor and failing electronics.

Textwww.abovetopsecret.com...

I will look at any reason not to beat the war drums.

The second interview with the free lance reporter there once again talks about the tail being in a different area then the main part of the aircraft. So it does seem like the tail was separated from the plane causing it to crash.

What we need is the radar and satellites info. The black box is irrelevant if we have this info.

originally posted by: roadgravel
Some equipment was said to have been moved back to Russia.

Including the rebels hauling a BUK missile battery back to Russia with one missile missing. Would love to see the pic or video if true.

I haven't been able to verify this:

a reply to: sheepslayer247

What should be done?

Should have listened to Romney then maybe this wouldn't have happened.

Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney called Russia "without question our number one geopolitical foe" Monday on CNN.

www.huffingtonpost.com...

I say without question HE WAS RIGHT.

What should we do ?

Sanctions.

Pull out of any treaties.

Put back the missile defense network in the EU.

Kick their snip off of the UN Security Council.

Lots of stuff could be done.

Instead of worrying about hurting anyone's feelings.

a reply to: sheepslayer247
Im from Australia we have 28 dead we have called in the Russian ambassador and given him a dressing down and are putting forward in the UN security council a resolution to have an open independent enquiry into this act,the Dutch government I imagine will also act and try to influence its European allies to act,if theres no or only one US dead it may consider it not in the national interest to pursue it too hard especially if it knows theres more to it than meets the eye the world just cannot expect moral leadership out of the US anymore and will have to learn to do it itself.

The Guardian claiming seperatist trying to hide evidence. Showing picture a what they say might be a buk-platform on the move:
www.theguardian.com...


SVD in Sweden claiming OSSE is on the spot but armed separatist shouting at them to leave because they havnt negotiated.

www.svd.se...
Google translate:

Mattias Mach: The leader of the rebel group, which reportedly rejected the OSCE mission from the scene of the crash, should have justified this with the inspectors to come there without negotiating with the rebels.
- Now, none of our leaders here who can make a decision, so give you away, and when you negotiated this came back, he should have screamed, according to The Guardian posted.

Mattias Mach: A delegation from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, OSCE, has arrived at the place where MH17 crashed to investigate the incident. Now comes reports that they faced restrictions from armed militia that controls the area. According to The Guardian posted, they have been rejected, without being able to inspect the site. Heavily armed rebels must have blocked a large part of the site.
OSCE inspectors should have left the scene

a reply to: peck420

How many missiles they hold 4 or 5? If 4 it looks like it's only missing one. But that's still a missing missile.