Six months after marijuana legalization: Colorado tax revenue skyrockets as crime falls

originally posted by: KyoZero
...

But regardless of my overall desire for legalization, NOBODY intoxicated on ANY substance should ever drive or oprate something that can harm others.

Irregardless of your knowledge about cannabis/MJ, imo you are right. I am not saying everyone who smokes cannabis/MJ is evil, but you can see the irrational and irresponsible actions of some of the members who have used MJ illegally, going as far as paying drug cartels from Mexico to partake in the high of cannabis.

originally posted by: Donkey_Dean

Lest we forget. There is no shortage of this stuff on our streets. Folks are driving on it anyhow!

Yeah, well. The fact is that the legalization of MJ has proven in other countries to increase the use of the drug even by minors.

28/09/2009 Teenage cannabis addiction on the rise

The number of Dutch under-18s addicted to cannabis is on the increase. Many of them begin smoking pot regularly at age thirteen, and get into such difficulties that they have to be admitted to a rehab clinic.

The young smokers are getting into conflicts with their parents, are dropping out of school and many of them are known to the police. They often steal to get money to finance their habit.

In the past year, 370 teenagers diagnosed with a cannabis addiction were staying in three specialised rehab clinics, a survey by NOS public TV has shown. Three more treatment centres are being built to cope with the rising number of young addicts. Since 2002 the number has increased fourfold.
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www.expatica.com...

In the U.S.

Myths and Current Research

INTRODUCTION

Second only to alcohol, marijuana is the most popular and widely used drug in the United States. According to the National Survey on Drug Use and Health, 95 million Americans age 12 and older have tried pot at least once. By 2001, the proportion of under-18 users had increased by 67% since the 1960’s. Researchers attribute this to the significant increase of pro-drug messages in multimedia venues. Students of all ages today have access to the Internet where they can easily find websites that promote marijuana use, kits for beating drug tests, and can advertise and sell marijuana and paraphernalia. Meanwhile, the prevalence of higher potency marijuana (which is measured by the levels of THC delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol) is increasing.
...

oade.nd.edu...

While many Coloradoans rang in the new year by lining up outside marijuana dispensaries for a celebratory toke, some rehab centers are prepping for an increase of marijuana-addicted patients in 2014, especially teenage users.

Although only people over the age of 21 are allowed to buy marijuana, psychiatrists and others remain concerned that teens could be most at risk for becoming addicted.

Dr. Christian Thurstone, a professor of psychiatry at the University of Colorado and the head of the teen rehab center Adolescent STEP: Substance Abuse Treatment Education & Prevention Program, said 95 percent of patient referrals to the program are for marijuana use.

After the law legalizing marijuana in Colorado passed in November, he started applying for a series of grants to expand his staff. He now has doubled his staff and still has a waiting list of patients.

Teenage Marijuana Use May Hurt IQ

While marijuana has a reputation for being non-addictive or mostly harmless, Thurstone said for some teens, especially those already suffering from mental illness, the drug is far from harmless.

Thurston said after medical marijuana was legalized in the state in 2009, adolescents started to report that “they’re using much higher potency products,” such as solid forms of synthetic marijuana called “waxes,” which can be up to 50 or 60 percent THC.
...
“Anecdotally, yes, we’re seeing kids in treatment here who have paranoia and seeing things and hearing things that aren’t there,” said Thurstone. “Adolescent exposure to marijuana [raises] risk of permanent psychosis in adulthood.”

Ben Court, an addictions expert at the University of Colorado Hospital Center for Dependency, Addiction and Rehabilitation (CeDAR), said ever since medical marijuana became legal in Colorado in 2009 he’s seen an increase in patients coming for treatment for marijuana addiction.

abcnews.go.com...

The claim that the legalization of cannabis/MJ would not increase the use of the drug by minors is false, as demonstrated by the increase of marijuana-addicted patients in rehab centers and the necessity of increasing their staff because the number of users, including minors, has increased.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse
According to this study, you have to worry more about coffee addiction, than you do about a pot addiction lol.

Also remember, a large chunk of people that go to rehab, do so only because the "justice" system funnels a lot of business their way. They tell a person caught with drugs, hey you can go to jail, or go to rehab.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: KyoZero
...

But regardless of my overall desire for legalization, NOBODY intoxicated on ANY substance should ever drive or oprate something that can harm others.

Irregardless of your knowledge about cannabis/MJ, imo you are right. I am not saying everyone who smokes cannabis/MJ is evil, but you can see the irrational and irresponsible actions of some of the members who have used MJ illegally, going as far as paying drug cartels from Mexico to partake in the high of cannabis.

all I was saying was to not operate machinery or cars while high...and my knowledge of cannabis...well ToC and all right?

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: ElectricUniverse
If you wish to believe the AMA and the APA go right ahead. I see two industries just trying to protect their monetary interests, being the two largest drug pushers in the world. They want you to use their expensive synthetic treatments, not something you could grow in your windowsill.

You cannot effectively control something like that, same as you cannot control other natural things like alcohol. Any natural sugary juice without chemical added crap can be made into alcohol in two weeks. Although aging it a lot more is better of course.

Couldn't agree more...I still am not sure what the ToC says about drug use here but I will say this

I am directly governed by the ACA and to a lesser extent the APA because of who I work for. And yes big pharma pushes medicine like crazy. I am not saying everyone with schizophrenia should go out right now and toke up or shoot up...but I know what I see in clients...again I am not saying ALL...but I see plenty of clients who find no relief of medications and yet somehow find a source of relaxation on something that shouldn't be schedule 1 in the first place

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
I am not saying everyone who smokes cannabis/MJ is evil, but you can see the irrational and irresponsible actions of some of the members who have used MJ illegally, going as far as paying drug cartels from Mexico to partake in the high of cannabis.

One of the reasons we fight for and assert our freedom is to eliminate this ridiculous notion that smoking weed supports Mexican cartels. Everything used by everyone I know is produced domestically, almost always by people we know and trust. Decriminalizing a nontoxic plant would allow everyone to produce their own, limit its exposure to chemicals, and never again give a red cent to any Mexican cartel wishing to do business in the US when it comes to THC. And every time some moron tells me to my face that I personally support violent Mexican gangs gets the earful they deserve, whether or not they are intelligent enough to comprehend it.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Methadone might as well be "legal". It is not "controlled" like you are trying to make it out to be.
Want to know how hard it is to score some methadone where I live? Go to "dome clinic" (yeah, we even have catchy nicknames for the place)...tell them you're a junkie. Be assessed. You don't even have to fail the drug test, just claim to be an addict. Pay the money ($140 up front....$13.50 a day for your dose)....show up daily, take methadone....nod out.

Guess what....those people are driving, everyday. I know MANY of them. Suboxone isn't much different, only in that it has naloxone in it...but for that, there is always subutex (suboxone without the naloxone...which is an opiate inhibitor btw)
One can get far more plastered off some methadone or suboxone (again, VERY easy to obtain) than cannabis. I have seen the aftermath of this. I have LIVED the aftermath of this!

And btw....your ideals that cannabis is "addictive" and there are people "in rehab" for this "addiction" is laughable to any and all who have experienced true addiction (aka...actual physical drug dependency)....< Me and many others.
Those who claim an "addiction" to cannabis don't know what true addiction is. Talk to me some more when you have experienced acute opiate and benzodiazepine withdrawl. Until then, those people just THINK they are "addicted".
Psychological addiction can be caused by basically ANYTHING on this earth that one attaches to...it has VERY little to do with "addiction" and a TON to do with human psychology.

Let's also not mention the plethora of elderly and sickly folks driving around on drugs that make them ubber drowsy and sometimes causes them to "blank out"....Let's pretend that doesn't happen.
Seems some facts are omitted in this fear campaign.

Again...I could go on for days as I am INTIMATELY familiar with the entirety of this subject matter. "Been there, done that"....in so many ways that it would take days to even glean the surface of it all. Even then, the T&C wouldn't allow for me to convey what I know and what I think on these things due to the fact that personal experience plays a HUGE role in this. (It is the reason I ever researched any of it in the first place)

originally posted by: TheSpanishArcher
I should be able to go out in my yard, clip a bud, dry it out and smoke it - for free. Not pay ANYTHING for it. I can't, unless I pay for the "priveledge".

Don't Colorado laws allow growing your own plants for self use?

a reply to: igor_ats

I don't live in Colorado. Their laws don't affect me.

Which is part of my point, it should be legal everywhere and no one should have to go to a store and be taxed to get it. You should be able to grow it yourself, anywhere. No government involvement is needed.

originally posted by: beezzer
Okay.

I'm going to pee on everyone's parade.

Cannabis is a teratogenic substance.

Define Teratogen at Dictionary.com. teratogen. teratogen. a drug or other substance capable of interfering with the development of a fetus, causing birth defects.

We may not see the results now.

But we will be paying the price for this soon.

But party on. The bill won't be in the mail until your child is born deformed.

Before CO legalized it a study indicated no danger in the development of an adult over the age of 18. Once the human body has finished puberty, MJ has no known negative effects on brain development what so ever. Once the brain completes its pruning down process as a teenager.

This fact was required before CO would allow the bill to legalize in the first place. There is a reason you must be 21 to purchase, and partake; your brain has finished developing by then and its development cannot therefore be hindered by its use.

Regarding smoking while pregnant: just like alcohol, or tobacco, smoking MJ while pregnant can have a negative side effect on the developing fetus. Since the laws passed in CO treat MJ the same as Alcohol, so to does a pregnancy warning appear on recreational MJ shops regarding the potential danger to pregnant women.

If pregnant don't use Alcohol, Tobacco, MJ... or ride trill rides at Six Flags.

originally posted by: KyoZero

originally posted by: MarlinGrace


My issue has always been the same, someone driving down the frwy. big smile, steering wheel in one hand and a joint in the other, and everyone pulling along side wondering wtf. And I only say this because people can't be responsible, its your body I could care less, but when it affects me then no thats not fair. For me its the same with anything like that alcohol included.

Well congratulations. I just hit the ATS Trifecta.

Three responses to me, and every one of them kind, responsible and coherent...rare these days...myself included

I chose this paragraph because I do absolutely understand your view on this. THIS is where I wish I had an answer but admittedly do not. I have no problem with people consuming but yes when you become a danger to others then you must answer for it. I feel that if someone is high and wrecks, killing another, I have absolutely no problem throwing the book at them

But then, as you are smart enough to probably already be aware, there is one teensy problem with THC that causes problems for both police AND consumers

Let's say this guy gets high and wrecks his car and kills a passenger or pedestrian or whatever. Now, if he were drunk, a simple BAL or breathalyzer will tell us right away that this guy was DUI and should therefore be charged.

The problem is, THC stays in the system so I wonder, how can the police or agencies tell if this guy who wrecked just puffed or did it two days ago and wrecked for unrelated reasons? So Yeah I see that problem and as for your last paragraph, I agree...that becomes an issue

In CO law enforcement have been developing an "active THC test" which is different then the "inactive THC" tested in urine or blood tests.

Here is what Wiki says about active THC vs inactive THC:

"11-nor-9-Carboxy-THC, also known as 11-nor-9-carboxy-delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol, 11-nor-9-carboxy-delta-9-THC, 11-COOH-THC, THC-COOH, and THC-11-oic acid, is the main secondary metabolite of THC which is formed in the body after Cannabis is consumed.

11-COOH-THC is formed in the body by oxidation of the active metabolite 11-Hydroxy-THC (also known as 11-OH-THC) by liver enzymes. It is then metabolized further by conjugation with glucuronide,[2] forming a water-soluble congener which can be more easily excreted by the body.[3]

11-COOH-THC is not psychoactive itself, but has a long half-life in the body of up to several days (or even weeks in very heavy users),[4][5][6] making it the main metabolite tested for when blood or urine testing for cannabis use. More selective tests are able to distinguish between 11-OH-THC and 11-COOH-THC, which can help determine how recently cannabis was consumed;[7][8] if only 11-COOH-THC is present then the cannabis was used some time ago and any impairment in cognitive ability or motor function will have dissipated, whereas if both 11-OH-THC and 11-COOH-THC are present then the cannabis was consumed more recently and motor impairment may still be present."

If "active THC" is present in certain quantities then a DUI is issued, if only "inactive THC" is present no DUI is issued. Same goes for vehicular manslaughter.

a reply to: Grimpachi
It's inevitable. Colorado & Washington (just came on yesterday) and numerous med-MJ states, including CA. The scale is tipping and revenue is a big reason. I'd suppose once CA goes recreational, it will change policy federally. Our first Co. hemp crops will be harvested this year and that is exciting! When the bill came to vote here, the gas & oil boys were the largest contributers to the vote no, because we added the hemp grow portion. They didn't like cheap sustainable, competition. Good luck in your state.

a reply to: trumpet

Hemp fibers helped get our nation on the map, and we owe a huge debt of gratitude to this amazing material. To have outlawed it, while not on the same grievous scale as human slavery, is an insane affront to all humanity. We have seriously got to get our heads out of our collective ass and start living as if we are interested in some kind of positive future for humanity and the Earth at large.

a reply to: ElohimJD

wow that's wild...I wondered about that but extreme laziness kept me from researching it...guilty as charged on my part :-)

Thanks a ton for that info

yeah if they can have that active THC test I am all for having it available

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: ElectricUniverse
According to this study, you have to worry more about coffee addiction, than you do about a pot addiction lol.

Also remember, a large chunk of people that go to rehab, do so only because the "justice" system funnels a lot of business their way. They tell a person caught with drugs, hey you can go to jail, or go to rehab.

Coffee addiction is not really that bad, not to mention that coffee doesn't have 400+ toxic chemicals that are worse than cigarettes, but you don't have to worry about anything right?...

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Yeah, well. The fact is that the legalization of MJ has proven in other countries to increase the use of the drug even by minors.

Only Uruguay is known to have completely legalised cannabis, but there are internet rumours that it's legal in North Korea too. Other countries have either decriminalised in one form or another, or simply tend to be more lenient for minor offences.

Portugal decriminalised the possession, transport, and cultivation of cannabis back in 2001, and data averaged across 2003 and 2007 shows that the country still had a far lower prevalence of cannabis use by 15 and 16 year-old's than countries which prohibit the plant, including the US. (interestingly, since Portugal decriminalised the use and possession of all drugs, the number of addicts considered “problematic” has fallen by half since the early 1990s, when the figure was estimated at around 100,000 people).

nilskok.typepad.com...

Then there's Holland. A study conducted by the University of California, Berkeley, discovered several key findings;

* Dutch citizens use cannabis at more modest rates than many of their European neighbors.

* Dutch youth report high rates of availability of cannabis, but not as elevated as reported rates in the United States and several other countries.

* The Dutch “continuation” rate for using marijuana from a causal experimentation in youth to regular usage in adulthood (ages 15-34) is fairly modest by international standards

* Past-year cannabis use among Dutch 15-to-24-year-olds dropped from 14.3 to 11.4 percent between 1997 and 2005.

newscenter.berkeley.edu...

"By 2001, the proportion of under-18 users had increased 67% since the 1960's" - if this doesn't demonstrate how much of a failure cannabis prohibition has been, nothing will. It's also worth pointing out that organised crime tends not to ask for I.D., simply a twenty-note will do. By completely legalising and bringing in a system of regulation, society can help minimise access for younger people. It would also serve to split the drug market, it's also organised crime that peddles meth and heroin, "sorry Timmy, I've no pot today, but you might like some of this,......"

2013 study; The Impact of State Medical Marijuana Legislation on Adolescent Marijuana

"Results
The estimation sample was 11,703,100 students. Across years and states, past-month marijuana use was common (20.9%, 95% confidence interval 20.3–21.4). There were no statistically significant differences in marijuana use before and after policy change for any state pairing. In the regression analysis, we did not find an overall increased probability of marijuana use related to the policy change (marginal probability .007, 95% confidence interval −.007, .02).

Conclusions
This study did not find increases in adolescent marijuana use related to legalization of medical marijuana"

www.jahonline.org...(14)00107-4/abstract

Peace

a reply to: Jakal26

Ok, you guys go and stay in Colorado. I am off to Utah. Lots of fun and no need to become an addict.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

I wonder if any studies have been done to see if restaurants and grocery stores have had increase in revenue since the law was enacted.

Just curious.

a reply to: tothetenthpower

I'll tell ya what OP, the Yanks are living in exciting times. I never thought I see the day where any country would legalise, but the USA was the last country I thought would be leading the way...Yet here you are blazing the trail. Amazing stuff.

I really hope the UK start to see sense soon as I'm bored of being criminalised for buying the "medication" that helps me with my PTSD and Bipolar.

Rev

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Sorry, I'm not in Colorado and don't intend on being. I'm in VA. Not sure what the point of that comment is, to be honest.

Lots of fun and no need to become an addict.

Right.... :/
So I see that you didn't address a single thing I said.

An addict? Nah, I don't buy the "once a junkie always a junkie" ideology shoved down the throats' of "12 steppers"....
I've been there done that....went to the very bottom and back, multiple times. I have been dead because of that.....multiple times (clinically, which really isn't dead)

Guess what? NONE of that had ANYTHING to do with cannabis. None of it!
I am telling you, from experience that is VERY personal to me....cannabis is NOT addictive in the way you are trying to claim it is....it just isn't. All the academic garbage (half of it bought and paid for by the likes of big pharma giants) in the world won't change what I KNOW to be true, because I have lived it....not read about it or heard about it. I'm not using Mr. Joe Likesasmoke as an example, or someone claiming "marijuana addiction" (people love to be the victim of something)...I am talking through experience.

It need not be asked about your experience....your comments here in this thread tell me all I need to know.
I've lived around alcoholics, drug addicts, delinquents, etc etc etc....my entire life.
All you have done is post AMA articles (sell outs) and other propaganda that is NOT truth.

And nevermind the methadone and opiate claims about them being tightly "controlled", which is a real laugh when one comes from my town ("pill-ville" USA....according to Time magazine about a decade ago)...."Controlled" < pssst...yeah, umm hum, sure thing