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The Middle East...Is it time to Let it Burn ?
page: 2share:
a reply to: whyamIhere
Nobody ?
Well, when someone wishes Mecca and medina to burn and be bombed, I doubt they're talking about infrastructure.
Nobody is accusing the American people, but the whole sane world knows the US government loves bombing brown people.
Nobody said they wanted anyone to be killed so chill on the hysterics.
Nobody ?
Well, when someone wishes Mecca and medina to burn and be bombed, I doubt they're talking about infrastructure.
Nobody is accusing the American people, but the whole sane world knows the US government loves bombing brown people.
edit on 27-6-2014 by
samsamm9 because: (no reason given)
a reply to: whyamIhere
So "we" should protect Israel and let the rest of the middle-east burn?? Is that what you're saying?
I think Israel, U.K. and the U.S. are a big part of the problem there. I also know that many tribes are being pitted against each other. None of this was this bad when Saddam ruled. The M.E. is this way because it's being manipulated to be exactly what it is. Those people deserve to live in peace just like everybody else. They're humans too. You think that western culture is the only culture?
No one should be meddling in their affairs. It's all about oil and pipelines. Who owns and controls a big portion of that over there? Same as in Afghanistan. Let it burn? No. Those people are being exploited from all sides and need help.
So "we" should protect Israel and let the rest of the middle-east burn?? Is that what you're saying?
I think Israel, U.K. and the U.S. are a big part of the problem there. I also know that many tribes are being pitted against each other. None of this was this bad when Saddam ruled. The M.E. is this way because it's being manipulated to be exactly what it is. Those people deserve to live in peace just like everybody else. They're humans too. You think that western culture is the only culture?
No one should be meddling in their affairs. It's all about oil and pipelines. Who owns and controls a big portion of that over there? Same as in Afghanistan. Let it burn? No. Those people are being exploited from all sides and need help.
a reply to: whyamIhere
What is the death count in the middle east from American forces since then?
We are the ones that had 3000 innocent people killed for no reason on 911
What is the death count in the middle east from American forces since then?
"Our intervention in the middle east has done nothing but create more animosity and ultimately terrorism"
Probably Worth A Look In the interests of the people of the Middle East and the US populace it is probably better if the US stayed out of this one.
Probably Worth A Look In the interests of the people of the Middle East and the US populace it is probably better if the US stayed out of this one.
originally posted by: sosobad
originally posted by: whyamIhere
originally posted by: samsamm9
originally posted by: khnum
Yes let it burn starting with Mecca and Medina the true places of origin for terrorists.
Do you think all Muslims are terrorists and monsters ?
If so, I guess you're the reason why extremist hate you and want your destruction. You're blindly hating and wish the death of all Muslims ... Men, women , children. Just wow.. The ignorance.
Nobody said they wanted anyone to be killed so chill on the hysterics.
Your quote
Let It Burn...
You obviously mean let it burn in a sea of rainbows and cotton candy farts. You are calling for an entire region of the earth to burn but want no one killed, how does that work?
I am not calling for anything. I have no power and "Let it Burn" is a figure of speech.
I want them to stop killing each other. I don't want to see anyone die for nothing.
I really mean abandon the Region and just send food. To stay the hell out of there.
a reply to: whyamIhere
That is the thing, we do understand their customs and culture, even more so since we have been studying them seriously for a couple of decades now.
The reason they are how they are is because we have been meddling where we should not, for a terrorist state that should not be.
Let israel burn, the ones who are not terrorists will run and re integrate into other countries.
That is the thing, we do understand their customs and culture, even more so since we have been studying them seriously for a couple of decades now.
The reason they are how they are is because we have been meddling where we should not, for a terrorist state that should not be.
Let israel burn, the ones who are not terrorists will run and re integrate into other countries.
originally posted by: sosobad
a reply to: whyamIhere
We are the ones that had 3000 innocent people killed for no reason on 911
What is the death count in the middle east from American forces since then?
The death count was 4500 dead Americans. Many many more were maimed.
I am sorry I don't know how many Iraqis lost their lives. I'll bet it was a bunch.
a reply to: whyamIhere
I feel that it is necessary to refine some of the points you made.
SOME OF US have no understanding of their cultures and customs, nor any ability to accept even the smallest differences between ourselves and those who live in the Middle East. Furthermore, many people are afraid that there might be more similarities between our nations and theirs, than differences, which, far more than the differences, tend to be the reason for the conflicts between us. That's not to say that the Middle East is full of happy little Utopias, but that is not such a cut and dry issue as it might seem, since western influences have a role to play in destabilising certain aspects of life there. For example, the funding of terror organisations by western intelligence agencies is not helping matters at the moment, and has now been bought into the light, despite which IT STILL HAPPENS!
It is also true that many soldiers have died fighting wars in the Middle East, that their superiors sent them to fight. However, in the Iraq scenario, the forces that went there were sent there under false pretences, on intelligence which was sketchy at best. Yes, they fought, and died, and they did their duty as soldiers. Their families should be proud of them, and those that returned should be better looked after than they are. And yes, those cities were given back to the people from whom they were taken. However, in both the Iraq war, and the Afghanistan war, that was ALWAYS the intention. But those soldiers should never have been sent to Iraq for aforementioned reasons, or to Afghanistan because you do not fight insurgents with soldiery, you fight them with intelligence operatives, assassins, silent, small units full of cold blooded bastards who cannot be traced to any nation or government.
The Iraqis lack of effort in defending their cities is appalling, but again, if the international response to terrorism was appropriate, the organisations that the west was allegedly at war with, would have been gutted silently and without media hype, and would not have been able to re-brand and re-build themselves in this way or at this speed, or attack Iraq in this way.
The reason everything blows up in our faces when we act in the Middle East, is because of the duplicitous nature of our governments, spouting democracy but funding terror groups, terror groups which our government ends up having to fight later to save face and prevent their horrific bastard offspring from being the damnation of us all. Essentially, things over there explode in the faces of western powers, because every single thing the west does in the East is either inherently wrong, or done in a fashion which can only result in failure.
Now, ISIS, or what ever they are called this week, are a determined bunch, that is very true. But the Israelis make some of the most sophisticated weapons systems available to human kind, have one of the best funded military organisations on the planet at their disposal, not to mention one of the most dangerous and feared intelligence arms in the world. ISIS would break upon their borders like a tide of feathers against an iron hull. The Israelis would defend themselves in the most brutal, uncompromising, and violent fashion possible, because that is how they do what they do. They even do it to non combatant targets, just to keep their eye in. Nothing will ever shift that bunch, and certainly not fundamentalist Muslims. ISIS would get butchered to a man in that fight, I would lay odds on it.
As for letting it burn? Well, we did set the fire in the first place, back in the eighties, and even before that, by western powers giving money to one flavour of nutcase or another. We cannot look at this as anything but a long term arson attack, and we should not be shocked that the flame has finally caught.
I feel that it is necessary to refine some of the points you made.
SOME OF US have no understanding of their cultures and customs, nor any ability to accept even the smallest differences between ourselves and those who live in the Middle East. Furthermore, many people are afraid that there might be more similarities between our nations and theirs, than differences, which, far more than the differences, tend to be the reason for the conflicts between us. That's not to say that the Middle East is full of happy little Utopias, but that is not such a cut and dry issue as it might seem, since western influences have a role to play in destabilising certain aspects of life there. For example, the funding of terror organisations by western intelligence agencies is not helping matters at the moment, and has now been bought into the light, despite which IT STILL HAPPENS!
It is also true that many soldiers have died fighting wars in the Middle East, that their superiors sent them to fight. However, in the Iraq scenario, the forces that went there were sent there under false pretences, on intelligence which was sketchy at best. Yes, they fought, and died, and they did their duty as soldiers. Their families should be proud of them, and those that returned should be better looked after than they are. And yes, those cities were given back to the people from whom they were taken. However, in both the Iraq war, and the Afghanistan war, that was ALWAYS the intention. But those soldiers should never have been sent to Iraq for aforementioned reasons, or to Afghanistan because you do not fight insurgents with soldiery, you fight them with intelligence operatives, assassins, silent, small units full of cold blooded bastards who cannot be traced to any nation or government.
The Iraqis lack of effort in defending their cities is appalling, but again, if the international response to terrorism was appropriate, the organisations that the west was allegedly at war with, would have been gutted silently and without media hype, and would not have been able to re-brand and re-build themselves in this way or at this speed, or attack Iraq in this way.
The reason everything blows up in our faces when we act in the Middle East, is because of the duplicitous nature of our governments, spouting democracy but funding terror groups, terror groups which our government ends up having to fight later to save face and prevent their horrific bastard offspring from being the damnation of us all. Essentially, things over there explode in the faces of western powers, because every single thing the west does in the East is either inherently wrong, or done in a fashion which can only result in failure.
Now, ISIS, or what ever they are called this week, are a determined bunch, that is very true. But the Israelis make some of the most sophisticated weapons systems available to human kind, have one of the best funded military organisations on the planet at their disposal, not to mention one of the most dangerous and feared intelligence arms in the world. ISIS would break upon their borders like a tide of feathers against an iron hull. The Israelis would defend themselves in the most brutal, uncompromising, and violent fashion possible, because that is how they do what they do. They even do it to non combatant targets, just to keep their eye in. Nothing will ever shift that bunch, and certainly not fundamentalist Muslims. ISIS would get butchered to a man in that fight, I would lay odds on it.
As for letting it burn? Well, we did set the fire in the first place, back in the eighties, and even before that, by western powers giving money to one flavour of nutcase or another. We cannot look at this as anything but a long term arson attack, and we should not be shocked that the flame has finally caught.
I say leave it and quarantine it.
Until they sort there crap out and become civilized ban all immigration out of the trouble areas, close down all embassy, stop all but vital trade.
If they want to live in the dark age let them, but keep them quarantined.
Until they sort there crap out and become civilized ban all immigration out of the trouble areas, close down all embassy, stop all but vital trade.
If they want to live in the dark age let them, but keep them quarantined.
I say leave it and quarantine it.
Until they sort there crap out and become civilized ban all immigration out of the trouble areas, close down all embassy, stop all but vital trade.
If they want to live in the dark age let them, but keep them quarantined.
Until they sort there crap out and become civilized ban all immigration out of the trouble areas, close down all embassy, stop all but vital trade.
If they want to live in the dark age let them, but keep them quarantined.
originally posted by: whyamIhere
originally posted by: sosobad
a reply to: whyamIhere
We are the ones that had 3000 innocent people killed for no reason on 911
What is the death count in the middle east from American forces since then?
The death count was 4500 dead Americans. Many many more were maimed.
I am sorry I don't know how many Iraqis lost their lives. I'll bet it was a bunch.
Documented civilian deaths from violence
125,367 – 139,958
www.iraqbodycount.org...
What was Iraq's roll in 911 again? I can't seem to remember.....
No, we shouldn't just sit by and let it burn.
I understand that the situation is a complex and volatile one, but something must be done in order to halt the advancement of ISIS, and in extension, their ideologies.
In my personal opinion, i believe that the international stage should consider splitting Iraq into three states - one for the Kurds, one for the Shias and one for the Sunnis. Let's face it, Iraq is not going to retake its northern and western provinces, as they are too far gone. Right now, it is best to draw up some borders and give ISIS their state, before they advance further southwards. There's nothing saying that they won't continue to do so, but they have lost their momentum and now seem to be shifting their focus towards the west, rather than the south. Offering them their state may be just what we need to halt their land grabs. We will have to face the ideological victory they will no doubt claim, but then, at least we will have salvaged parts of Iraq. After a potential partition of Iraq, we could look at possible military advancements into the ISIS state...It may seem crazy, but it is better than going full in again, only to face the same outcome 10 years from now...
I understand that the situation is a complex and volatile one, but something must be done in order to halt the advancement of ISIS, and in extension, their ideologies.
In my personal opinion, i believe that the international stage should consider splitting Iraq into three states - one for the Kurds, one for the Shias and one for the Sunnis. Let's face it, Iraq is not going to retake its northern and western provinces, as they are too far gone. Right now, it is best to draw up some borders and give ISIS their state, before they advance further southwards. There's nothing saying that they won't continue to do so, but they have lost their momentum and now seem to be shifting their focus towards the west, rather than the south. Offering them their state may be just what we need to halt their land grabs. We will have to face the ideological victory they will no doubt claim, but then, at least we will have salvaged parts of Iraq. After a potential partition of Iraq, we could look at possible military advancements into the ISIS state...It may seem crazy, but it is better than going full in again, only to face the same outcome 10 years from now...
edit on 27-6-2014 by daaskapital because: clarification
Until we adopt an understanding of what we'd have to do to actually "win" anything in the ME, I'd say leave it all alone.
Let them fight each other.
Make a policy statement that if one westerner, or one inch of land anywhere else gets touched or damaged, we drop a nuke.
Many of the cultures in the ME look at diplomacy as weakness.
So stop trying to be "diplomatic".
Quarantine them as stated above.
They step out of line and attack a western country?
boom
Mushroom cloud.
Let them fight each other.
Make a policy statement that if one westerner, or one inch of land anywhere else gets touched or damaged, we drop a nuke.
Many of the cultures in the ME look at diplomacy as weakness.
So stop trying to be "diplomatic".
Quarantine them as stated above.
They step out of line and attack a western country?
boom
Mushroom cloud.
Remember when they said "downloading music supports terrorism". Well, it seems that buying gas does too. It seems that paying your taxes does also.
We are to believe the logical course of action given the recent events is to send $500M to "moderate" rebels in Syria?
Like these "half measures" worked so well in the past. While the economy contracts by 2.9%. More good money after bad.
If we are to any military intervention AT ALL, the only course seems to be to start at one end and carpet bomb like you're painting a wall. 3 coats. When there is nothing left, then it's fixed.
Or figure out something else besides the accelerant we get from there and watch it smolder forever without the paper tinder we keep adding to the flames. And watch it close, since the fire pops and throws burning embers on the nice carpet occasionally.
We are to believe the logical course of action given the recent events is to send $500M to "moderate" rebels in Syria?
Like these "half measures" worked so well in the past. While the economy contracts by 2.9%. More good money after bad.
If we are to any military intervention AT ALL, the only course seems to be to start at one end and carpet bomb like you're painting a wall. 3 coats. When there is nothing left, then it's fixed.
Or figure out something else besides the accelerant we get from there and watch it smolder forever without the paper tinder we keep adding to the flames. And watch it close, since the fire pops and throws burning embers on the nice carpet occasionally.
originally posted by: sosobad
originally posted by: whyamIhere
originally posted by: sosobad
a reply to: whyamIhere
We are the ones that had 3000 innocent people killed for no reason on 911
What is the death count in the middle east from American forces since then?
The death count was 4500 dead Americans. Many many more were maimed.
I am sorry I don't know how many Iraqis lost their lives. I'll bet it was a bunch.
Documented civilian deaths from violence
125,367 – 139,958
www.iraqbodycount.org...
What was Iraq's roll in 911 again? I can't seem to remember.....
We went to Iraq because Saddam tried to kill Bush's Daddy.
So, we went in and hung Saddam like a common Horse Thief.
I have no illusion Iraq had anything to do with 911.
a reply to: whyamIhere
Education, that is how to proceed, funny that not many think of this.
So we make something up when the politicians are skeered and bomb the next target..
The internet is a wonderful thing, research all angles and think for yourself what answer seems most logical.
What would I do if put in that situation.
Education, that is how to proceed, funny that not many think of this.
So we make something up when the politicians are skeered and bomb the next target..
The internet is a wonderful thing, research all angles and think for yourself what answer seems most logical.
What would I do if put in that situation.
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