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Dr. Jacques Vallee ~ The Control System
page: 80share:
Bybyots
reply to post by 1ofthe9
Drug use/ritual sex?
Are you serious? I'm really asking; if you don't want to talk about it, I understand, not everyone is interested in this stuff.
Also, we have been easily throwing UFOs, World Mythology, Folklore, and shady government black-projects together willy-nilly for some 79 pages (over 1580 posts) of this thread and you draw the line when it comes to any correlation between the occult and the CS at Honorius and Albertus Magnus.
Okay, grimoires are off the table.
P.S. C'mon 1ofthe9, you've been a strong participant in these threads, is that your final answer: drugs and ritual sex?edit on 4-3-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .
Altered states of mind seem to be one of the common factors at work. Crowley was using mescaline, the CIA ESP drug research seemed to be centered around disassociative drugs. Combine this with Enochian, and Vallee's information coordinate/remote viewing thing and maybe that is how it works.
I haven't been initiated into anything, nor do I have the means to really attempt replication of the Babylon Working or anything.
reply to post by The GUT
The only thing that I am in consensus with is that it is a well worn path to publication*.
...then the 'occult' lineage of all that we are discussing is fairly well defined and a well-worn path.
The only thing that I am in consensus with is that it is a well worn path to publication*.
edit on 4-3-2014 by Bybyots because: *Which in turn generates endless reflexive analysis. Which is interesting.
reply to post by 1ofthe9
1ofthe9,
You don't have to be initiated in to anything to realize that Crowley demands the attention that he does because he put the blood, sweat, tears, and especially the hours in to reading, writing and arithmetic, pretty much in that order.
P.S.
Take my advice and just go ahead and remove that one from your bucket-list.
1ofthe9,
You don't have to be initiated in to anything to realize that Crowley demands the attention that he does because he put the blood, sweat, tears, and especially the hours in to reading, writing and arithmetic, pretty much in that order.
P.S.
...nor do I have the means to really attempt replication of the Babylon Working or anything.
Take my advice and just go ahead and remove that one from your bucket-list.
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because:
Bybyots
reply to post by 1ofthe9
1ofthe9,
You don't have to be initiated in to anything to realize that Crowley demands the attention that he does because he put the blood, sweat, tears, and especially the hours in to reading, writing and arithmetic, pretty much in that order.
I can't mediate worth a damn.
Bybyots
The only thing that I am in consensus with is that it is a well worn path to publication*.
I mentioned conscious/subconscious so as to include just about everyone and all of my own "possibles." Unless you infer that the history of the occult/paranormal is all hoaxing and/or self delusion for profit and/or notoriety? In the last case, that would leave scientific materialism as your category.
edit on 5-3-2014 by The GUT because: (no reason given)
reply to post by The GUT
Not at all, what I am saying is that it is all writing. The best of it is writing based on a lot of reading and studying.
There are plenty of hoaxes, literary hoaxing is an art form that some types can't resit attempting, like Michael Chrichton with Eater's of The Dead and of course Levenda's Necronomicon. I have been led to believe at times that Crowley's Book of The Law was his own contribution to the tradition. *Oh, I almost forgot, all of the foundational texts of the Theosophical Society are texts that were feverishly driven to publication by whatever need it is that possesses some authors to possess the minds of their readership.
And it is competition, as much as folks don't want to hear it sometimes, author's and journalists get very competitive, and if you look at the era, Crowley was writing against literary foes, that's what drives the boutique-y little self-published limited editions: vanity and competitive drive. Not Aiwass.
But in the end it is all just a heap of writing.
Crowley cut out his chunk of the dance floor by writing it in to existence. The interface is the writing itself. That's what Tlön is about.
Unless you infer that the history of the occult/paranormal is all hoaxing and/or self delusion for profit? In the last case, that would leave scientific materialism as your category.
Not at all, what I am saying is that it is all writing. The best of it is writing based on a lot of reading and studying.
There are plenty of hoaxes, literary hoaxing is an art form that some types can't resit attempting, like Michael Chrichton with Eater's of The Dead and of course Levenda's Necronomicon. I have been led to believe at times that Crowley's Book of The Law was his own contribution to the tradition. *Oh, I almost forgot, all of the foundational texts of the Theosophical Society are texts that were feverishly driven to publication by whatever need it is that possesses some authors to possess the minds of their readership.
And it is competition, as much as folks don't want to hear it sometimes, author's and journalists get very competitive, and if you look at the era, Crowley was writing against literary foes, that's what drives the boutique-y little self-published limited editions: vanity and competitive drive. Not Aiwass.
But in the end it is all just a heap of writing.
Crowley cut out his chunk of the dance floor by writing it in to existence. The interface is the writing itself. That's what Tlön is about.
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because: *
reply to post by Bybyots
Writing (and firstly language of course) is one of the hallmarks of so-called advanced civilizations and the way we sometimes (or attempt) to make the abstract "sharable." In my thinking it goes something like consciousness begat abstract thinking which begat language which begat writing which begat collective intelligence.
I really dug the piece on Levenda and the NYC occult scene, btw, and I understand literary one-upmanship
But to get back to one of the topics: Are we alone? If not, what constitutes this other intelligence that Vallee hypothesizes attempts to rearrange our consciousness/society?
Writing (and firstly language of course) is one of the hallmarks of so-called advanced civilizations and the way we sometimes (or attempt) to make the abstract "sharable." In my thinking it goes something like consciousness begat abstract thinking which begat language which begat writing which begat collective intelligence.
I really dug the piece on Levenda and the NYC occult scene, btw, and I understand literary one-upmanship
But to get back to one of the topics: Are we alone? If not, what constitutes this other intelligence that Vallee hypothesizes attempts to rearrange our consciousness/society?
reply to post by The GUT
Something that knows how to write it's way in to our loop, which is otherwise closed.
...what constitutes this other intelligence that Vallee hypothesizes attempts to rearrange our consciousness/society?
Something that knows how to write it's way in to our loop, which is otherwise closed.
Bybyots
reply to post by The GUT
Unless you infer that the history of the occult/paranormal is all hoaxing and/or self delusion for profit? In the last case, that would leave scientific materialism as your category.
Not at all, what I am saying is that it is all writing. The best of it is writing based on a lot of reading and studying.
There are plenty of hoaxes, literary hoaxing is an art form that some types can't resit attempting, like Michael Chrichton with Eater's of The Dead and of course Levenda's Necronomicon. I have been led to believe at times that Crowley's Book of The Law was his own contribution to the tradition. *Oh, I almost forgot, all of the foundational texts of the Theosophical Society are texts that were feverishly driven to publication by whatever need it is that some possesses some authors to possess the minds of their readership.
And it is competition, as much as folks don't want to hear it sometimes, author's and journalists get very competitive, and if you look at the era, Crowley was writing against literary foes, that's what drives the boutique-y little self-published limited editions: vanity and competitive drive. Not Aiwass.
But in the end it is all just a heap of writing.
Crowley cut out his chunk of the dance floor by writing it in to existence. The interface is the writing itself. That's what Tlön is about.
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because: *
I think I grok what you mean now. Can the interface be accomplished solo, or do you have to gently induce it into the noosphere?
Also whats wrong with replication?
reply to post by 1ofthe9
No, no gentleness. Deconstruction is not gentle. We need to remove variables, not add to the complexity. Like the Simon Necronomicon: despite the pretty Path Walker blogs, we can remove the Simon Nec, all of it's derivatives and all of Grant's Qlipphotic-tunnel crap and toss the carcass right in the trash while retaining the golden nugget of whatever the heck one might learn from all that.
Unfortunately, the writers that got us to where we are have to be devoured to provide the energy to move forward. But do not pity them, it is their destiny to die in this way.
Come, Peter, do the AMA, we will be gentle.
Who wants to see a re-run. We want to kick the Pantomime CS in the nuts, not tickle it in to a replay so that we can compare notes with Bashar or the Cassiopeia crowd.
Right?
Can the interface be accomplished solo, or do you have to gently induce it into the noosphere?
No, no gentleness. Deconstruction is not gentle. We need to remove variables, not add to the complexity. Like the Simon Necronomicon: despite the pretty Path Walker blogs, we can remove the Simon Nec, all of it's derivatives and all of Grant's Qlipphotic-tunnel crap and toss the carcass right in the trash while retaining the golden nugget of whatever the heck one might learn from all that.
Unfortunately, the writers that got us to where we are have to be devoured to provide the energy to move forward. But do not pity them, it is their destiny to die in this way.
Come, Peter, do the AMA, we will be gentle.
Also whats wrong with replication?
Who wants to see a re-run. We want to kick the Pantomime CS in the nuts, not tickle it in to a replay so that we can compare notes with Bashar or the Cassiopeia crowd.
Right?
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .
Bybyots
Deconstruction is not gentle. We need to remove variables, not add to the complexity. Like the Simon Necronomicon, despite the pretty Path Walker blogs, we can remove the Simon Nec, all of it's derivatives and all of Grant's Qlipphotic-tunnel crap and toss the carcass right in the trash while retaining the golden nugget of whatever the heck one might learn from all that.
Can you dumb that down? I can't grasp what you are saying. For example: Not only what does it mean, but what are the practical steps? Further, how would that negate the direct experience of folk who have never written anything of note in their life?
Unfortunately, the writers that got us to where we are have to be devoured to provide the energy to move forward. But do not pity them, it is their destiny to die in this way...
We want to kick the Pantomime CS in the nuts, not tickle it in to a replay so that we can compare notes with Bashar or the Cassiopeia crowd.
Again: What are we talking about here? Are you saying that there isn't any sort of control system and/or non-human intelligence at work in the phenomenon---only the persuasive writings of the self-deluded and/or conmen?
Dr. Vallee also knows that he must offer up his carcass in this way, and he has willingly done so. I know that he would like to go down as
Levi-Strauss did, being devoured by Derrida while he still lived.
We cannot be Derrida, and Dr. Vallee has told us this...
So, we altogether hardly make up even a Derrida with a lobotomy. Knowing this we must realize that we are engaged in a battle of asymmetric warfare for Vallee's nuggets.
Asymmetric warfare is best waged, with the tools at hand, as information warfare.
I am going to suggest a Ghandi-like approach to information warfare.
We cannot be Derrida, and Dr. Vallee has told us this...
(7) No solution will be found by mediocre, amateurish research.
So, we altogether hardly make up even a Derrida with a lobotomy. Knowing this we must realize that we are engaged in a battle of asymmetric warfare for Vallee's nuggets.
Asymmetric warfare is best waged, with the tools at hand, as information warfare.
I am going to suggest a Ghandi-like approach to information warfare.
reply to post by The GUT
You keep asking me that, TG. Do you really think that I believe that after all this time? How could it be so cut-and-dry? Annnd, Vallee talks about folks that search for absolutes, sometimes things are just a paradox.
Deluded? Knowing what we know about the Simon Necronomicom, what would you call all of the "Path Walkers" with their colorful anecdotes? I would not, by the way, call them deluded.
If this is indeed, as I say, just a body of writing that is the interface to this whole affair, how does it become less magical? To me it becomes more magical and accessible.
Not tonight.*
*TG, Carcass=body-of-text, in other words: the body of writing that a person generates. We are already deconstructing some, as best we can under our own power, here on your thread; that's all.
Are you saying that there isn't any sort of control system and/or non-human intelligence at work in the phenomenon---only the persuasive writings of the self-deluded and/or conmen?
You keep asking me that, TG. Do you really think that I believe that after all this time? How could it be so cut-and-dry? Annnd, Vallee talks about folks that search for absolutes, sometimes things are just a paradox.
Deluded? Knowing what we know about the Simon Necronomicom, what would you call all of the "Path Walkers" with their colorful anecdotes? I would not, by the way, call them deluded.
If this is indeed, as I say, just a body of writing that is the interface to this whole affair, how does it become less magical? To me it becomes more magical and accessible.
Can you dumb that down?
Not tonight.*
*TG, Carcass=body-of-text, in other words: the body of writing that a person generates. We are already deconstructing some, as best we can under our own power, here on your thread; that's all.
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because:
For a second I thought we were getting all aghori tantra in here. I have to admit, I'm at a loss for where to go from here. Might as well try some
writing before bed though...
Also reading The 8th Sphere and I'm amused that other people are interested in Gurdijieff. Strieber says those techniques work...
I'm assuming David Lynch was on to it eh?
I'm assuming David Lynch was on to it eh?
Reply to 1ofthe9:
Dude, thanks.
Streiber. That's the word for today, for sure.
If there were ever a guy who's body of writing needed a close look, it's Whitley M.F. Streiber. I would not have thought of it but for your post.
This dude, Streiber, has apparently one really powerful experience of what any reasonable person would see as temporal lobe lability and sleep paralysis and he becomes famous for the story that it generates in him and he gets a free pass to whine about it for decades?
Sincerely!? The dude has one bad night 30 years ago and somehow Streiber gets a free pass to hand feed the Newage whatever he wants for years...
Wow, Whitley, be glad you are not me. One night of that sort of thing decades ago and you are still reeling from it? Be lucky you aren't me, you never would have made it out of adolescence. Ya big pu##y.
I'm so taken aback by this, and the realization that Streiber is so obviously anything but what he claims to be that I can hardly articulate myself right now.
As far as Gurdjieff is concerned? It looks like Scared-y-Pants-the-bad-writer wrote the piece in 2001, I don't know when it was published on the linked site, but some editor even had to break down and go in to the text and explain that Whitless Streiber is full of #...
I'm sure it didn't need all that much of a push, but Streiber's carcass goes in the can.
Thanks 1ofthe9.
Strieber says those techniques work...
Dude, thanks.
Streiber. That's the word for today, for sure.
If there were ever a guy who's body of writing needed a close look, it's Whitley M.F. Streiber. I would not have thought of it but for your post.
Christmas is coming, and with it the 17th anniversary of my close encounter experience of December 26, 1985.
digitalseance.wordpress.com...
This dude, Streiber, has apparently one really powerful experience of what any reasonable person would see as temporal lobe lability and sleep paralysis and he becomes famous for the story that it generates in him and he gets a free pass to whine about it for decades?
Sincerely!? The dude has one bad night 30 years ago and somehow Streiber gets a free pass to hand feed the Newage whatever he wants for years...
"Then came the close encounter. In January, I went to William Segal and described the experience to him. He said, “fifteen minutes with them, fifteen years of meditation.” (Me: What a load of malarcky!!) I could not have agreed with him more. Even while I was with the visitors on that night, so lost in fear that my first title for Communion was to be Body Terror, I knew from the way they moved and acted that they were, in the context of Gurdjieff’s theories, ‘awake.’"
Same link
Wow, Whitley, be glad you are not me. One night of that sort of thing decades ago and you are still reeling from it? Be lucky you aren't me, you never would have made it out of adolescence. Ya big pu##y.
I'm so taken aback by this, and the realization that Streiber is so obviously anything but what he claims to be that I can hardly articulate myself right now.
As far as Gurdjieff is concerned? It looks like Scared-y-Pants-the-bad-writer wrote the piece in 2001, I don't know when it was published on the linked site, but some editor even had to break down and go in to the text and explain that Whitless Streiber is full of #...
If you meditate in the manner prescribed by him, (Gurdjieff didn’t this as meditation. ed) dividing your attention between inner and outer life—forming what he called the ‘double arrow’ of attention—you become able to see when others are doing this as well. (This is Strieber’s assertion and distortion and not part of the Gurdjieff teaching – ed).
Same link
I'm sure it didn't need all that much of a push, but Streiber's carcass goes in the can.
Thanks 1ofthe9.
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .
reply to post by RedCairo
Holy Chao, what an awesomely epic post! Nothing to contribute here at the moment. Really need to get internets at my place of residence, but then who will feed the cat?
50+ more pages to go and I'll be done reading most of this thread...
Holy Chao, what an awesomely epic post! Nothing to contribute here at the moment. Really need to get internets at my place of residence, but then who will feed the cat?
50+ more pages to go and I'll be done reading most of this thread...
As I highlighted a few pages back, Streiber and Hoagland helped push the Hale-Bopp UFO meme along, and Streiber has some kind of weird connection with
Vallee. He also says that occult techniques can be used for 'contact'...
Now is this because there is an occult connection, or is it because that is what has been written...
Now is this because there is an occult connection, or is it because that is what has been written...
reply to post by 1ofthe9
1ofthe9:
Yeah, I think he does, it seems to have to do with Vallee thinking that Streiber's story has some inconsistencies...
I can't imagine Jacques Vallee hankerin' for the next meeting with Whitley.
This is interesting, this guy points out more inconsistencies...
As far as I am concerned, Whitley Streiber wins the award for "Guy to make the most money off of his sleep paralysis episodes"...
Right Whitley, they have to be.
Why can't it be both?
"I became entirely given over to extreme dread. The fear was so powerful that it seemed to make my personality completely evaporate... 'Whitley' ceased to exist. What was left was a body and a state of raw fear so great that it swept about me like a thick, suffocating curtain, turning paralysis into a condition that seemed close to death...I died and a wild animal appeared in my place."
-Whitley Strieber, "Communion"
1ofthe9:
...and Streiber has some kind of weird connection with Vallee.
Yeah, I think he does, it seems to have to do with Vallee thinking that Streiber's story has some inconsistencies...
"The 'medical examination' to which abductees are said to be subjected, often accompanied by sadistic sexual manipulation, is reminiscient of the medieval tales of encounters with demons. It makes no sense in a sophisticated or technical framework: any intelligent being equipped with the scientific marvels that UFOs possess would be in a position to achieve any of these alleged scientific objectives in a shorter time and with fewer risks."
-Dr. Jacques Vallee, "Confrontations"
I can't imagine Jacques Vallee hankerin' for the next meeting with Whitley.
This is interesting, this guy points out more inconsistencies...
"These entities are clever enough to make Strieber think they care about him.
Yet his torment by them never ceases. Whatever his relationship to the entities, and he increasingly concludes that their involvement with him is something 'good,' he also remains terrified of them and uncertain as to what they are."
-John Ankerberg, "The Facts on UFOs and Other Supernatural Phenomena"
As far as I am concerned, Whitley Streiber wins the award for "Guy to make the most money off of his sleep paralysis episodes"...
"I felt an absolutely indescribable sense of menace. It was hell on earth to be there in the presence of the entities, and yet I couldn't move, couldn't cry out, couldn't get away. I'd lay as still as death, suffering inner agonies.
Whatever was there seemed so monstrously ugly, so filthy and dark and sinister. Of course they were demons. They had to be. And they were here and I couldn't get away."
-Whitley Strieber, "Transformation"
Right Whitley, they have to be.
Now is this because there is an occult connection, or is it because that is what has been written...
Why can't it be both?
edit on 5-3-2014 by Bybyots because: . : .
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