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foxbarking
I actually find this very interesting because it gives me a chance to do something I haven't done before. I am not familiar at all with this story. So my comments below are only involving reliability of memory as I have observed it in studies. So I'll put my beliefs about the reliability of memory, than go back and read the thread and keep my observations consistent with what I say here. and I am not egotistical enough to think that I am "right" but it may be interesting to be forced to keep my argument consistent in this way.
While it may be distorted by perception issues, at least the Halt audio recording is not distorted by memory issues, because, it's an audio recording made live during the event.
mirageman
It is all down to whether Gerry Harris' testimony matches what you want to believe happened. He is on record from the early 1980s so he has not jumped on any bandwagon. His statements are as awkward to the de-bunkers as the lighthouse at Orfordness is to believers.
Arbitrageur
While it may be distorted by perception issues, at least the Halt audio recording is not distorted by memory issues, because, it's an audio recording made live during the event.
LT COL HALT: [13:20] You just saw a light?
LT ENGLUND: Yeah.
LT COL HALT: Where. .wai. .wai . . wait a. .slow down. Where?
LT ENGLUND: Right on this position here straight ahead in between the tre. . . .[13:27] there it is again, watch, straight ahead off my flashlight there Sir, [13:32] there it is.
LT COL HALT: Hey I see it too. What is it?
LT ENGLUND: We don't know Sir.
LT COL HALT: Yeah it's a strange small red light, looks to be out maybe a quarter to half mile, maybe further out. I'm gonna switch off...
“the frequency of the flashing phenomenon being observed exactly matches the frequency of the lighthouse“
“a red sun-like light was seen through the trees. It moved about and pulsed.”
HALT: There is no doubt about it – there’s some type of strange flashing red light ahead.
ENGLUND: Sir, it’s yellow.
Guest101
The image that emerges in your mind when you are listening to the recording is distorted by your own personal bias.
Take this tape fragment for example (time stamps between square brackets):
LT COL HALT: [13:20] You just saw a light?
LT ENGLUND: Yeah.
LT COL HALT: Where. .wai. .wai . . wait a. .slow down. Where?
LT ENGLUND: Right on this position here straight ahead in between the tre. . . .[13:27] there it is again, watch, straight ahead off my flashlight there Sir, [13:32] there it is.
LT COL HALT: Hey I see it too. What is it?
LT ENGLUND: We don't know Sir.
LT COL HALT: Yeah it's a strange small red light, looks to be out maybe a quarter to half mile, maybe further out. I'm gonna switch off...
Every lighthouse has a published interval at which it flashes. This is how sea captains are able to identify which light they're seeing. The Orfordness lighthouse has an interval of 5 seconds. Now listen to the same exchange again; I've added a beep at exactly five second intervals:
ZetaRediculian
Bias works both ways... this is important and should not be left out.
Yes it was perceived differently by people, and cameras too. There are some links regarding different colors photographed in this passage from the same link above:
HALT: There is no doubt about it – there’s some type of strange flashing red light ahead.
ENGLUND: Sir, it’s yellow.
Although several times during the tape Col. Halt calls the light red, he is contradicted by his men who say it's yellow. In photographs of the 1980 light taken before it was replaced, it did indeed look orange. Even the new light, which is mercury vapor discharge and therefore whiter and bluer than the original incandescent, appears distinctly red in photographs and video when viewed from Rendlesham forest.
12:52-12:58
12:59
12:59
13:04
A red sun-like light was seen through the trees. It moved about and pulsed. At one point it appeared to throw off glowing particles.
SkywatcherUK
It seems Andrew Pike is asking questions! Emails are going around because the book Isaac Koi has PDF'd is a fake! He is not amused and is taking it very seriously. Seems word got to him and on investigation of the souce seems it is not the first bit of dodgy doings by them in his name.
IsaacKoi
Is anyone on ATS still in touch with Andrew Pike, author of the book “The Rendlesham File : Britain’s Roswell”?
If so, could you let me have an email address or simply forward the email below and ask him to send any response to me at [email protected].
Thanks, Isaac
www.abovetopsecret.com...
[Email for Andrew Pike begins]
Hi Andrew,
I am writing to you about your book "The Rendlesham File : Britain's Roswell" which -as you know - is out of print and very difficult to obtain. Indeed, detailed information about its contents is not easy to obtain. The most detailed comments I’ve seen in relation to your book are fairly short reviews on Amazon and also UFO DATA’s review of that book in Issue 5 at page 38 at the link below:
www.ufo-data.co.uk...
I am a barrister in England with an interest in various issues relating to reports of "UFOs" and have written various items online about such issues, including the following:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
When reading through about 1,000 UFO books a few years ago, I made notes of references to discussions of various UFO events, documents and personalities which I cross-references in a 2,000 page document. The relevant list of references in relation to the Rendlesham Forest Incident(s) is available online at the link below (in a table of references to 89 relevant books, which can be sorted by title, author or date by clicking on the top of the relevant column):
www.isaackoi.com...
That table does not include a reference to your book on Rendlesham, since I do not currently own a copy of it.
I know from your posts on the old forum at Rendlesham-Incident.co.uk in a thread entitled “Bustinza phone interview,20 april 1984” and another thread entitled “May 2010 Transcript of Col Halt tape “ that you sold your book at a loss at best (and gave some copies away, including to Sacha Christie) due to the costs of self-publishing and the cost of your research. You also said that “to avoid any further smear of being a money maker on the back of this subject, I am going to withdraw rights from the publisher in an email this morning. It's dead and gone! And so am I, that's it!” - so I will not ask if you have any plans to have the second edition printed and sold commercially.
However, if you want, assuming you are the copyright holder, it would be relatively simple to make your book available as a PDF via a free file storage website.
In this way, you could make your work available to those interested without anyone having any grounds whatsoever for suggesting you are seeking to profit from your work (not that I personally see anything wrong with seeking to recover the costs you incurred or even make a profit on them).
Provided you give your permission for your book to be made for free in this way, I'm sure I can sort things out for you so you would not have to lift a finger. I recently did something similar in relation to another UFO book (Willy Smith's "On pilots and UFOs") which his widow decided she would like to make available free of charge to the UFO community - as I discussed at the thread below:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Given the time and effort you must have put into your book, it would be a shame if it continued to be unavailable to those interested in reading it.
I look forward to hearing from you.
All the best,
Isaac
Yes you can see the light house from that area. Maybe not deep in the forest but at the East gate on a clear night you can see it blinking off in the back ground, sure.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Note that the Orford Ness lighthouse cannot be seen directly from East Gate; it becomes apparent once you get further into the forest and the land begins to fall away to the east.
www.ianridpath.com...
Courtesy of Mr Ridpath's own website.
mirageman
Steve La Plume confirmed it could be seen blinking on and off earlier in the post
Yes you can see the light house from that area. Maybe not deep in the forest but at the East gate on a clear night you can see it blinking off in the back ground, sure.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
What one could see – very clearly – was the beam from the Orford Ness lighthouse. This swept in an approximate five second cycle, creating what looked like a bright white glow above the tree tops.
As the rest of the area is dark forest and the base lights are to the rear, it was impossible to miss this beam from this spot.
Penniston’s account [his original witness account] describes what the men now saw: “The object was producing red and blue light. The blue light was steady and projecting under the object. It was lighting up an area directly under extending a meter or two out.”
Could this be the lighthouse with its sweeping beam? If so, I never saw it display any colors.
It was just a small white light.
(…) the lighthouse never seemed bright enough to me to affect the retina.
1. Early in the morning of 27 Dec 80 (approximately 0300L) two USAF security police patrolmen saw unusual lights outside the back gate at RAF Woodbridge. Thinking an aircraft might have crashed or been forced down, they called for permission to go outside the gate to investigate. The on-duty flight chief responded and allowed three patrolmen to proceed on foot. The individuals reported seeing a strange glowing object in the forest. The object was described as being metallic in appearance and triangular in shape, approximately two to three meters across the base and approximately two meters high. It illuminated the entire forest with a white light. The object itself had a pulsing red light on top and a bank(s) of blue lights underneath. The object was hovering or on legs. As the patrolmen approached the object, it maneuvered through the trees and disappeared. At this time the animals on a nearby farm went into a frenzy. The object was briefly sighted approximately an hour later near the back gate.......
I see three posters that are blind to their own biased interpretation of the tape but look down on the observational skills of trained and educated USAF officers and war veterans.
Guest101
Ectoplasm8 shows he has the strongest perception bias of all, by somehow perceiving a flash that isn’t on the tape (after ‘in between the trees’).
I see three posters that are blind to their own biased interpretation of the tape but look down on the observational skills of trained and educated USAF officers and war veterans.
Like I said earlier, discussions based on these grounds are useless. This overbearing manner is not even remotely related to science and rationalism.
mirageman
reply to post by Guest101
It's a small detail but it's interesting because Halt's memo clearly states that the "object" was sighted "....an hour later near the back gate".
What exactly did Halt mean?
That the object was sighted by personnel near the back gate or that the object was physically located near the back gate when it was seen again.
Halt’s memo to the MOD mentions a sighting of the object near the back gate (East Gate) about an hour after Penniston, Burroughs, and Cabansag were send out to investigate:
“The object was briefly sighted approximately an hour later near the back gate.“ [Halt, official memo to MOD]
Jerry Valdez, who joined a team that went to East Gate to check out the situation, remembers seeing the object near the East Gate:
“I could clearly see the lights from the gate, just outside the back gate [east gate]. It was next to the road. They were intermittent lights, very bright, 15-20 feet above the ground. They were pulsating and from what I recall there were 3 lights, red green and blue. It made no noise, but it defied gravity. It was really weird and scary. We all knew what we were looking at, but no one really came out and said it.” [Valdez, James Easton interview]
SkywatcherUK
Yes. Emails have been flying around all day.