Khufu Cartouche in Great Pyramid 20,000 Years Old?

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


Couldn't those be attempt to replicate something... I do not disagree with the sequence you describe but at the same time don't see it invalidating other views, it only documents the difficulty Egyptians in that time frame had in building pyramids and how they managed to perfect it (the steps to it).

reply to post by SasquatchHunter

Text It is known that we cannot, with current technology, recreate the pyramids. This means exactly the way the Egyptians built them. Not some modern Pyramid shell, with a skeletal frame, that if left without maintenance will fall down within a few centuries

No, we figured out recently how they did it. That high vaulting gallery in the great pyramid had a hoist in it that lifted chunks of rook, and there's an area of different density showing a path pattern around the inside of it showing an infilled area.

It would just be massively expensive to build it, not impossible,

I'm curious, where do people get the idea that it couldn't be build with modern tech? I have someone who keeps telling me you can't get a credit card between the stones, but there are spots in the GP you can stick your head in between them. The Egyptians also kept accountant records of what it cost to pay the pyramid builders. There is no mystery about the pyramid's construction

Antigod
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

The archeological sequence in the Nile is pretty well dug up. 20,000 year ago the only thing in the Nile valley were a group of microlithic stone tool cultures that had just discovered how to grind wild wheat and build the first permanent housing. No ceramics, metal, solid construction etc. No civillisation, hunter gatherers. Sebilian i think.

Egypt has been dug up all over, it's one of the most excavated places on the planet. No signs of a very ancient culture. Farming appears about 7000 years ago, metal working about the 4th millenium bc at the Maadi site. There's a nice smooth progression from hunter gatherers through early neolithic to bronze age. No anomalous artefacts in the sequence.

Yet somehow were supposed to believe the Pyramids were built 10,000 years before agriculture.......

Really guys as anti points out yet another huge hurdle you have to overlook so many things to buy into these fantasies.

Scott Creighton
Here is some footage of the two "adventurers" taking the fragments of paint from the Khufu Cartouche in Campbell's Chamber of the Great Pyramid. (Sorry, the video is in German).

Removing the Paint from the Khufu Cartouche of GP

Regards,

SC

I watched the video. Do you speak German? It was very much in the style of ancient aliens.. I could have swore I even heard them say aliens...

reply to post by Scott Creighton


Thoth, a fallen angel has built the pyramids at about twenty two thousand years ago. Now if you want me to prove fallen angels were real to you well then here...

www.flickr.com...


Check out the Emerald Tablets

itsallgonenow
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

Thoth, a fallen angel has built the pyramids at about twenty two thousand years ago. Now if you want me to prove fallen angels were real to you well then here...

www.flickr.com...


Check out the Emerald Tablets

These are just the fossils of tall humans its well known that there were periods in the past when humans were significantly taller before Cities were formed and people became smaller again..

According to experts cities kind of level everyone out.

itsallgonenow
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

Thoth, a fallen angel has built the pyramids at about twenty two thousand years ago. Now if you want me to prove fallen angels were real to you well then here...

www.flickr.com...


Check out the Emerald Tablets

Hi,

From the Emerald Tablets of Thoth

Regards,

SC

SasquatchHunter
reply to post by snoopy11

 

Yet some people would have us believe that aliens hopping around the galaxy commissioned these things but somehow couldn't paint as well as Davinci.

Would you like to name 10 people ever that were as 'influential' as Da Vinci.

Da Vinci is quite literally a legend, why not compare Egyptian art to your own and see who's is better.

You see not everyone is Da Vinci or Rembrandt or Beethoven or Mozart, the reason we know these names is because they stood out, Just as the Eygptians obviously had geniuses.

Just because someone was born 4500-10,000 years ago does not mean their brains were not on our level, sure much knowledge we have they didn't acquire but humans are humans at the end of the day, they adapt and learn and pass on that knowledge.

reply to post by Scott Creighton


campbells tomb or map room what do you think scott

AliceBleachWhite



From there, we see Pharaoh Sneferu attempt to build a pyramid at Median which failed, and not to be deterred there was a second attempt that resulted in the Bent Pyramid, and finally, with success he achieved the first proper smooth sided pyramid with what's known as the Red Pyramid.

We know these things.
We have documentation and a clear line of architectural evolution.

We don't know these things at all, that is just a theory, another theory is those Pyramids are early attempts at copying the giant Pyramid that was there before them.

reply to post by Scott Creighton


I have read long ago that the so called graffiti inscription of King Khufu in the great pyramid was most likely a hoax. I was always under the impression that the Egyptian Pharaoh's have huge egos and brag about everything that they have accomplished, and they documented these things with great accuracy.Yet at the top of the great pyramid with in a small crawl space is this one bright red painted inscription that Khufu had the great pyramid built....and yet his name is not in graved or carved in stone anywhere else, but I am suppose to believe his name has been painted in the pyramid...lol, you would think that if he built the great pyramid and wanted to make an eternal impact on the world, and want the world to know it, that he would in grave his name in stone not stamp it with paint. It doesn't make sense, I find the red paint to be very suspect.

reply to post by Taggart


Your missing the point completely or purposely. Of course there are brilliant people born in different eras. The point I was making is that people are trying to make the case the builders of these pyramids weren't who we know they were by rather some distant more advanced civilization with wild claims as them being more advanced than our civilization today or possible aliens or something. Yes Davinci has left his mark on history thats why I used him as an example, and the reason is because he understand art concepts that ancient egyptians had no knowledge of. Basic concepts of composition, light and shadow, use of color, perspective, proportional figures. I think if you browse the art on the internet even art being created by students you will see truckloads being churned out daily that would have made Leonardos jaw drop.
The point being is that im using basic knowledge of one subject to dispel myths that some ancient civilation had advanced knowledge superior to what knowledge they actually had.

I don't know why the Eyptian government is so defensive about he pyramids since the Egyptians did not build them.

reply to post by Scott Creighton


The article didn't mention whether or not the pigment had been carbon dated....I'm assuming that is under way if it hasn't been done already...?? Otherwise, what would be the point of taking it?

Personally, I believe that the pyramids are far older than the accepted date. There is ample evidence all over Egypt that there was a culture there with an extremly high level of technology. Christopher Dunn has done some interesting work in that area.

greenfox86
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

I have read long ago that the so called graffiti inscription of King Khufu in the great pyramid was most likely a hoax. I was always under the impression that the Egyptian Pharaoh's have huge egos and brag about everything that they have accomplished, and they documented these things with great accuracy.Yet at the top of the great pyramid with in a small crawl space is this one bright red painted inscription that Khufu had the great pyramid built....and yet his name is not in graved or carved in stone anywhere else, but I am suppose to believe his name has been painted in the pyramid...lol, you would think that if he built the great pyramid and wanted to make an eternal impact on the world, and want the world to know it, that he would in grave his name in stone not stamp it with paint. It doesn't make sense, I find the red paint to be very suspect.

Hi Greenfox86,

These markings are not 'official' in any sense and Khufu would most likely not have known about them, given that they were placed on blocks that would never been seen. I remember removing wallpaper once only to find that the tradesman who had previously decorated the room had painted the name of his football team on the plaster under the wallpaper. I didn't know he had done that until I had the wallpaper removed years later.

I have long argued and demanded that the inscriptions in these formerly inaccessible chambers (they were first accessed since the time of their construction by Howard-Vyse in 1837 using dynamite to blast his way in) should be tested by modern science to ascertain their authenticity (or otherwise). The main reason I insist that these tests be done is the uncertainty that surround them given that there is a second-hand testimony from the great grandson of Humphries Brewer, a Mr Walter Allen of Pittsburgh. Mr Allen's great grandfather, Brewer, apparently observed Howard-Vyse's team painting markings inside the Great Pyramid. What these markings were is unclear but it creates a real atmosphere of doubt and that has to be resolved and the only way to do that is to have scientific testing of these markings. In making this demand I find it truly baffling the hostile resistance presented by advocates of conventional Egyptology to any tests being done on the markings.

Ironically, however, as a result of the clandestine action of these "adventurers" conventional Egyptology will now probably HAVE to have the markings scientifically analysed. Imagine, for example, if the 'stolen' sample is dated at ca.20,000 years old or even if these two "adventurers" lie about the age of their sample. Conventional Egyptology will, naturally, denounce the results. But the genie is out the bottle. The claim of the 20,000 year age will not go away until Egyptology makes their own tests. If they were smart conventional Egyptology should pre-empt any results that may be forthcoming from the stolen material with their own results and announce those results to the world.

But, as I have mentioned elsewhere in this thread, those tests may already have been done and perhaps were not announced because they do not agree with conventional chronology. And perhaps that is why Dr Hawass rejects the carbon dating technique.

Regards,

SC

deadcalm
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

The article didn't mention whether or not the pigment had been carbon dated....I'm assuming that is under way if it hasn't been done already...?? Otherwise, what would be the point of taking it?

Hi Deadcalm,

As I said to Greenfox (above), the clandestine removal of this material could in fact force conventional Egyptology to finally have these markings scientifically tested (if they haven't already done so). These two "students" could falsely claim their sample is 20,000 years old. What could conventional Egyptology do about that? They would (however reluctantly) have to have their own tests done and done in such a way that the result is beyond question (multiple blind samples to different labs, with independent observers and the whole thing recorded). Of course, if the age of their sample ALSO comes out at 20,000 years, we're pretty unlikely to hear about it.

Regards,

SC

Painterz
You can't do C14 dating on a scraping of pigment from a wall.

So unless they state their methology, what test they used to obtain this date, and demonstrate repeatability, I'm inclined to not believe it.

What is "methology"?

AliceBleachWhite

The vandalism itself immediately discredits any legitimacy these STUDENTS might have had to begin with.

Further, they're STUDENTS.

Additionally, we not only have records, as well as a clear line of pyramid building evolution starting with Pharaoh Djoser with his architect Imhotep building the First Step Pyramid which was really just several of the then traditional Mustaba tombs stacked one upon another.

From there, we see Pharaoh Sneferu attempt to build a pyramid at Median which failed, and not to be deterred there was a second attempt that resulted in the Bent Pyramid, and finally, with success he achieved the first proper smooth sided pyramid with what's known as the Red Pyramid.

We know these things.
We have documentation and a clear line of architectural evolution.

This "Mysteries of the Pyramids" stuff claiming them to be older than they are is the domain and product of fantasists with an agenda to push their own fantasy versions of magical myth making toward whatever purpose, or simply willful denial and rejection of well studied material examined over Generations and Generations of scientists who'd have loved to have produced amazing results counter the current findings that would have made their careers, but, all in all continue to support the established paradigm.

But aren't we all just "students"? I believe them if they provide the tests for verification. We already know they did it as the "authorities" gave them validity

Scott Creighton

deadcalm
reply to post by Scott Creighton

 

The article didn't mention whether or not the pigment had been carbon dated....I'm assuming that is under way if it hasn't been done already...?? Otherwise, what would be the point of taking it?

Hi Deadcalm,

As I said to Greenfox (above), the clandestine removal of this material could in fact force conventional Egyptology to finally have these markings scientifically tested (if they haven't already done so). These two "students" could falsely claim their sample is 20,000 years old. What could conventional Egyptology do about that? They would (however reluctantly) have to have their own tests done and done in such a way that the result is beyond question (multiple blind samples to different labs, with independent observers and the whole thing recorded). Of course, if the age of their sample ALSO comes out at 20,000 years, we're pretty unlikely to hear about it.

Regards,

SC

If these "students" provide the results of the tests, how can they be falsified? They'd need access to some similar material that is of the age they claim the paint is.

I hope they provide the evidence for review. At this point, would you accept the findings from the establishment?

reply to post by Scott Creighton


This debate can simply be settled by having another test of the red pigment. If it comes out with a 20k date then we have issues to reconsider. If it comes out with a contemporaneous date then the current theory still holds water the best. Simply test the object again.