Enoch's Dudael

a reply to: undo

He rode on a cherub and flew; he came swiftly on the wings of the wind. [ESV] Psalm 18:10

Cherubim can be piloted?

Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. [ESV] Matthew 24:30

A plane is shaped like a cross, the sign of the Son of Man, and flies through the air among the clouds.

Part of the deal with the bottomless in Bottomless Pit is literal I believe and yet another one of the old riddles obscuring the knowledge that the Earth was a globe. In theory, if you drilled a hole through the Earth from Euphrates, you would eventually end up on the other side of the planet just off the west coast of North America, and it would be a pit with literally no bottom.

And I suppose angels can be planes or pilots just like grasshoppers can be helicopters and stars can be angels or how a drunken tramp can be a church and a hydra-headed beast can be kings and royalty.....

Revelation 9:1 through 9:11 is about the Gulf War (the way I see it), a separate event from Revelation 9:13 onwards relating to WTC, al-Qaida, IS, War on Terror.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

it wasn't originally "bottomless pit". that was an english translation of the word "abyssos." i think they used a little creative license there.

a reply to: undo

Yes, in Greek mythology and elsewhere the Abyss is referred to as the bottomless pit. It's like translating Hades or Sheol into Land of the Dead.

a reply to: undo

What do you think does it mean? Give me a clue.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: undo

Yes, in Greek mythology and elsewhere the Abyss is referred to as the bottomless pit. It's like translating Hades or Sheol into Land of the Dead.

only problem is, the abyss is much older than greek mythology.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: undo

What do you think does it mean? Give me a clue.

abyss=abzu.

a reply to: undo

Oh i thought the bottom less pit as in a female.
To me it all sounds a lot like alien everything pretty much lately. Do you know Iphigene from Goethe? Was listening to that as audiobook and every second word screamed aliens! I am just going insane maybe...

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: undo

What do you think does it mean? Give me a clue.

It is the potential to experience the 'darkest night of your soul'. Would you like to peer into the abyss (enlightenment) do so with courage, because those truths to be beheld are enough to cause insanity as it is bottomless--the more you think you perceive/understand the less you know as other alternatives will continue to present themselves.

a reply to: undo

I am pretty sure that you cannot sensibly play word games with ancient names and languages, as you and a number of others seem to do, to validate your theories.

Let me explain: There are 126 discrete sounds (phonemes) that humans can make with their mouths. All human language is built on these sounds. Some of these sounds are similar to others. So languages are full of words that sound similar. That is simply the way it is.

Now, similar sounding words do not always describe the same things. Bare and bear speak of two different things. It is obvious.

Similarly, a baby is not a walled city with hanging gardens and straddling a river.

While similar words with similar meanings did occur across cultures, those words need to be referenced to the language of those cultures to establish meaning. You cannot make the assumption that similar means the same.

Perhaps you could reference one of the excellent online libraries of ancient languages (like the Electronic Text Corpus of the Sumerian Language or similar) to verify word meanings. This would more strongly support your theories and would make your posts more than fanciful stories.



Rant over, move on.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Ooooh, the long dark tea-time of the soul.
Cousin from Nirvana?

a reply to: chr0naut

thanks. i have been studying the electronic corpus of sumerian language for several years now. know who samuel noah kramer is? even he says the abzu is the abyss.

a reply to: undo
you wouldn't care to have a look here: Plato's Timaeus
and tell me what i am doing wrong? or offer some comfort? (or maybe a coffe helps...) and someone reasonables opinion, even if it is just to cool my nerves?

I'm way out of my league even commenting in this thread, but here goes.

You guys kept coming back to the locusts, and their lack of constellation representation.

What if they are a reflection of a nature of a beast and not the beast itself? What is a locust but a mindless consumer? It's nature is to consume and consume even up to the detriment of its own existence. Now these aren't described as normal locusts, but warrior locusts that sting like scorpions and so on. Would that be indicative of an army that fights for a corporate interest? Mindless drones let loose on the world to fuel a rampant consumption.

Just my thought on it. Cool thread by the way.

Boba

a reply to: chr0naut

Before you say too much, look into 'Verner's law' for the very much doctrinal consonant transformations that has happened up through history within the given language families. Our understanding of Indo-European and Proto Indo-European is based on such eh, "word games" as you put it. Verner was also an amateur and figured it all out on his own as a result of a life dedicated to what he believed in and what he knew. Language. So, not all makebelieve and folly though it may look that way at first glance.

a reply to: Bobaganoosh

A refreshing comment in a dreary locust world. These locust all end up in one place, or that's what normally happens, for locust are really not a species on their own, but any grasshopper specie that due to one or two of several scenarios that may transform these cozy leaper-flies into a swarming devouring beast. Destructive bastards too. Moving from patch to patch leaving nothing but ruin and despair. These locust can be summoned by will too. At very little effort. Same with frogs and those other things Moses had up his sleeve. Give me 1000 people and 1000 carpets, and I'll make you one of them sandstorms the Zulus beat the Commonwealth with.

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: chr0naut

thanks. i have been studying the electronic corpus of sumerian language for several years now. know who samuel noah kramer is? even he says the abzu is the abyss.

I was not referring to apsu, abussos, abyzou, abisme, abzu & abyss type transliterations which are all relevant words across their respective languages and which almost everyone agrees were speaking of the same thing.

My issue was with applying the transliterational rules in every instance (to try and extract meaning) but without reference to literal word meanings.

In the instance of "abyzou" (from the assumed Sumerian root, the feminine 'goddess name' of saltwater 'sea'), the 'alike sounding' transliteration rule breaks down when translated into: Babylonian "tiamat" (again the feminine 'goddess name' of saltwater 'sea') or 'tamtu' ('great sea') in Akkadian or Hebrew "tehom" (the great deep) despite the fact that these societies were essentially conjugate.

a reply to: chr0naut

oh i don't think they are the same exact word (tiamat and abzu). i think tiamat (the wormhole generated by the abzu gate) was originally an aspect of the abzu gate system, but was not differentiated from abzu until the time of enuma elish, when it (tiamat the wormhole) became a goddess who mated with abzu (abzu the gate), a god.

the abzu is IN the abyss, but is not the exact same thing but the texts treat it like it is, so to research it, you have to know that part.

gate of paradise (gate of eden)
anybody wanna guess what that is?

i think we also have a gate hint here:
ever read about the gate of mount mashu? (i think the epic of gilgamesh describes it)
it's guarded by 2 "scorpion" men, who won't let gilgamesh in until they ascertain if he's capable of making the journey. their claim is that no humans have been able to make the journey. it is determined that gilgamesh is 2/3rds god (meaning he's of the nephilim) and thus can enter the gate.
the whole area has a forcefield like effect over it, shimmering back and forth (remember the fiery sword of the cherubim that blocks entrance to the gate of eden?)

a reply to: undo

I think your analogy also breaks down when you consider the time-frame of the usage of the words 'abyzou' and 'tiamat'. They are separated by centuries.

You also have to consider that the technical pinnacles of the Sumerian culture, at the time that the words came into usage, were a base 60 number system (which was nearly impossible to do mathematics with) and mud brick construction.

While they may have been capable of conceiving of wormholes and stargates philosophically, they were technologically far removed from demonstrating or describing such things in any sort of rigorous or useful manner. Certainly, they had no mathematical symbol for either zero or infinity, concepts which have to progressed past to conceptualize (in a mathematical sense) gravitational singularities.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

Ooooh, the long dark tea-time of the soul.
Cousin from Nirvana?

Nirvana utopia? meaning down stepping from the 6th to 3rd miasma (cousin) know what it is; started from scratch (absolute unknowingness). Tea time starts at 4:00 GMT and *supposedly* lasts only 1- 1/4 hours, so I suppose not (but there is always the pleasure of dinner at 8:00) look forward to; longer deeper dark incoherent AND more enlightening conversations as everyone is properly drunk.