Ancient Confession Found: 'We Invented Jesus Christ'

Speculated for years, and there's just too many signs that point to this story being real. Most of it was adapted from stories that can be heard around the world. That's not to say that these stories don't mean anything or that the religion based off it doesn't mean anything. The bible is well written, full of imagery, and chalk full of useful messages. I think (if these accusations hold true) that Christianity will continue, granted with a bit of a black eye. If this does turn out to be true, then other ancient texts authenticity will be next in line.

reply to post by randyvs


randy, buddy. Say I self-style myself a historian of modern times. And I write a chapter on the war in Iraq. And I say "George W. Bush decided there were WMDs in Iraq, so the U.S. justified and instigated a pre-emptive strike."

Period.

Proof positive? Uhm....no.
It's NOT "proof positive."

ltheghost
uk.prweb.com...

Ran across this article today. Thoughts? And what are the ramifications if it is true? Or is this just sloppy research or something to discredit an entire religion?

Well, as a Christian you can guess that I think it's just bunk. For me it changes nothing because much of what Josephus wrote he got from things of his time, the accounts of people who knew, and from historical prophecy.

When I first read the misleading header on the article I expected to see signed letters by important people that they were the ones to perfectly fulfill over 2,000 prophecies, and set the proper date as was prophesied by Daniel the Prophet, the time of day, the Sanhedrin court, the kiss of Judas, the nails in the hands and the feet. The proper beating that removed the skin and flesh from His bones. and so much more. WOW! with that kind of awesome brain-work you would think the Romans would have known how to fight the barbarians.

But, since it's just another worldly attempt by Satan to diminish Christ the Lord. It a waste of time reading it at all.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


Doesn't change the fact that worshipping a grapefruit is every bit as effective as worshipping Jesus.

reply to post by DeadSeraph

2) The NT was based on a real person.

Whether or not he was a real person, or a compilation of several people named Jesus who lived at roughly the same era is what is up for discussion and were also trouble-makers and crucified, will never be proven until we find a corpse. The Shroud is pretty compelling, I'll give it that, but it only indicates he didn't die. He was bleeding after he was wrapped in it.

Okay, I'm done derailing this topic. Stubborn, frightened believers will never listen anyway.
Cheers.

reply to post by wildtimes


Can you show some better proof for Pilots existence Wild ?
I mean sincerely I'm asking is there any ? As I lean on your education for a sec.
And I'm listening.

Watching the X-tian's heads explode in real time is so much fun on threads like this.

You cross-reference your 'proof' back onto itself, cite 'scholars' who cite other 'scholars' as evidence of everything from what certain make-believe people said, what they did, and how they did it, refuse to realize that no one ever needs 'faith' and endless discussions to discover whether or not Julius Caesar was real, or Cleopatra, or Pliny; these true figures of history are never subject to long histrionic discussions of whether they lived or died...

The problem for us reality-based types is, your Bible has not one iota of information in it that can be ascribed to a god. No discussion of what lightning really is (something that no doubt terrified the people of the time); no explanation for germs or virii and how to avoid getting the more nasty diseases but instead a heartless vicious blame game that anyone so affected must have 'sinned'; certainly no physics or calculus formulae, nothing about quantum mechanics or atomic structure; none of that stuff, even though your God should have known all about that, having invented it in almost his spare time and all.

You got nothing except a bunch of people calling themselves 'scholars' to ramp up their credibility, who have wasted their lives studying a fairy tale as if it's real. And followers who don't know the difference between being fed to the lions or the 'loins'.

reply to post by randyvs


You mean Pilate? Pontius Pilate?
ancienthistory.about.com...

An archaeological find made during an excavation, led by Italian archaeologist Dr. Antonio Frova, effectively put to rest the doubt that Pilate was real. The artifact is now in the Israel Museum in Jerusalem as inventory Number AE 1963 no. 104.

There had also been literature, both Biblical and historical and even contemporary with Pilate, testifying to his existence, but it is filled with religious biases, so the 20th century find was important. Pilate appears in Latin on a 2'x3' (82 cm x 65 cm) limestone inscription found in 1961 at Caesarea Maritima that links him to the reign of the Emperor Tiberius. It refers to him as prefect (a Praefectus civitatium) rather than procurator, which is what the Roman historian Tacitus calls him.

reply to post by Fromabove


ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

It's persistently mind-bogglingly incredible how uninformed and unaware so many "educated" are in this era.

The utter uniqueness of Christianity from several perspectives seems to be hidden from them. And, I think, hidden is the very accurately operative word.

Christ alone offers Salvation as a Gift of Grace.

ALL other religions involve Salvation/Nirvana/Oneness . . . via some variation of WORKS. ALL OF THEM.

Christ is about RELATIONSHIP via Himself with THE FATHER.

That's as OPPOSED MOST FIERCELY to RELIGION.

As a RELIGION, Pretend "Christianity" can be just as deadly as any other -ism or philosophy or religion.

RELATIONSHIP takes it out of the RELIGION realm and makes it an issue of moment by moment even THOUGHT LIFE accountable to Holy Spirit, Christ, Father. It is a DANCE in God's Love. . . . being REFINED INTO HIS LIKENESS.

The decidedly brainwashed, who've never been down that road, cannot as in CANNOT KNOW the glories of that dance. It's beyond their knowledge, understanding and certainly their experience.

Former atheist Josh McDowell's NEW EVIDENCE THAT DEMANDS A VERDICT has a wealth of solid evidence for folks to deal with--IF--they are serious about fair-mindedly considering THE TRUTHS of history etc.

The New Evidence That Demands A Verdict Fully Updated To Answer The Questions Challenging Christians Today

www.amazon.com...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381332597&sr=8-1&keywords=new+evidence+t hat+demands+a+verdict

reply to post by signalfire


What is even more fun is watching the mythicists dodge the real issue of this thread, which are the claims made by Joseph Atwill. Not one person has provided a single credible shred of evidence to back up his claims, while there is a mountain of information presented in the thread to debunk them. Fairy tales, indeed.

reply to post by wildtimes

You mean Pilate? Pontius Pilate?
ancienthistory.about.com...

Ya, you know Pilatus or whom ever. I really have no excuse for the misspelling.
Just woke up awhile ago ? No ?

Thank you Wild.

reply to post by DeadSeraph

Not one person has provided a single credible shred of evidence to back up his claims, while there is a mountain of information presented in the thread to debunk them.

Wow!! Did you find a Time Musheen and travel ahead to see his lecture and the evidence he says he's going to provide?

Impressive.

A "mountain" of info presented to debunk them? Where? I didn't see any mountain. Just a bunch of apologists parroting pre-packaged apologetics. You saying you wrote a thread that satisfied the entire debate and saying you won't do so again? That's hardly a "mountain" of evidence. LOL

reply to post by randyvs


If you say you woke up a while ago, then who am I to disagree?

Did that link not satisfy you? Did a simple Google search and found that same archaeological find in 1961 is pretty much the "evidence" they have (though in my opinion it only proves someone engraved his name on a rock - doesn't mean anything else at face value).

(I'm glad you switched back to this avatar; it's how I "know" you...the others were fun variations, though.)

wildtimes
reply to post by DeadSeraph

 

Not one person has provided a single credible shred of evidence to back up his claims, while there is a mountain of information presented in the thread to debunk them.

Wow!! Did you find a Time Musheen and travel ahead to see his lecture and the evidence he says he's going to provide?

Impressive.

A "mountain" of info presented to debunk them? Where? I didn't see any mountain. Just a bunch of apologists parroting pre-packaged apologetics. You saying you wrote a thread that satisfied the entire debate and saying you won't do so again? That's hardly a "mountain" of evidence. LOL

Two of the links I presented were not written by apologists. You would know that if you had bothered to read them. They are written by published scholars, one of which maintains a neutral position on the historicity of Jesus and the other of which believes Jesus to have never existed (yet still manages to point out the incredibly obvious flaws in Atwill's theories that you are apparently incapable of seeing).

reply to post by BO XIAN



That's why when I see stuff like this I always smile and then laugh when they try to spin a fable against the Lord. I understand that they must. They are of the world and if there were no Jesus there would be no judgement and Jesus scares them because they like the world and want to stay in it.

Jesus said, "I am not of this world..." and to his people he said, "You are not of the world even as I am not of the world."

Anyone thinking the world loves Jesus or wants to believe He is real, alive and coming again is wishing in vain. No, for them there can't be a Jesus.

But, there is.

I love this thread...

People got so upset that I said "Jesus was the most documented person in History".

I love seeing the I hate Jesus crowd memorialize their hatred of a man who lived 2000 years ago.

I know, I know we are all stupid. Only you have figured out our entire faith is faked.

Why should my love for Jesus bother anyone? Why not dismiss it as delusional?

The answer...is because none of us know the truth. To the people pretending they do.

In the back of your mind you must wonder....What if they are right.

Have a blessed day.

reply to post by wildtimes


Yes Mam and I knew I was at least asking the right lady.

Thank you.

All we really need to know is right here. Would be more credible if it were released to the scientific community for scrutiny and validation. Here we have a paid Symposium created for profit.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


You just can't help continuing to prove how irrational 'faith-based' people are, can you?

It's like watching Richard Nixon declare himself 'Not a Crook!'

And with the same amount of bemusement on the part of people who have already seen through the ego driven smokescreen.

reply to post by DeadSeraph

They are written by published scholars, one of which maintains a neutral position on the historicity of Jesus and the other of which believes Jesus to have never existed (yet still manages to point out the incredibly obvious flaws in Atwill's theories that you are apparently incapable of seeing).

So, it's not that YOU believe Jesus absolutely, positively existed, just that YOU don't think his line-item comparisons hold water. But, he's going on tour, and if he is such a lame-brain, why would they host a conference for him to do so?

I don't really have a dog in this fight, DeadSeraph, because I'm not a "Christian". But it seems to me, in my 6th decade of life, that the stories in the Bible are STORIES. Historical fiction. Some names and places may have been real, but others have never been "found" and still others are suspect.

Your gripe is just with Atwill's scholarship, then. Correct?

You oughta fly to the conference and stand up and confront him then! Woot! We'll be REALLY famous if you can do that - a public debunking of this person's audacious and obscenely ridiculous claims. The GALL! Pfft!!