Just Answer One Question. "Why"?

reply to post by colbe


I only pray you to stop living with fear. I really do love you. Sacgamer

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by colbe

 

I only pray you to stop living with fear. I really do love you. Sacgamer

Confusing response to your thinking Jesus is coming back in His person for the Millennium. What?

Do you see why "private interpretation" of Scripture called "private judgment" is heresy? God did not give every person reading Scripture the authority to interpret it. He gave that "authority" to the Church who decided the Canon. The fruit of private judgment is error and division. Read the Douay-Rheims, the footnotes are a great
help. www.drbo.org...

Where does it say Jesus is literally returning in His person for the 7th Day? Just wondering...


I love you too Sac,


colbe

reply to post by colbe


Revelation 20:4

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The real question is trying to determine who exactly will be living during this Millennial Kingdom.

In Ezekiel 37, God is going to refine the Jews with fire in order to live there also, so that God's covenant with the Jews is ultimately fulfilled.

There is also the sheep and goat judgement of the nations before this reign.

reply to post by Deetermined

Revelation 20:4
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

This is Revelation, where everything is so much symbolism that John saw in visions, and are not necessarily anything that is supposed to be understood in a very literal sense. This is saying basically that those who usher in the Christian era in opposition to the existing worldly system, will share in the kingdom regardless if they in fact are not materially alive on this earth to enjoy it.

The real question is trying to determine who exactly will be living during this Millennial Kingdom.

There shouldn't be any question, where all you have to do is look around you to see who is alive, in this kingdom under God's rule. The question should be if you are actually placing yourself under that rule through faith in Jesus.

In Ezekiel 37, God is going to refine the Jews with fire in order to live there also, so that God's covenant with the Jews is ultimately fulfilled.

Ezekiel is a book, supposedly by a prophet, but is not like the famous prophets like Isaiah and Jeremiah, but someone unknown other than through this book that supposedly came from Babylon, and again supposedly by a Judean held in captivity in the so-called Babylonian exile. This was the most hotly contested book to be eventually allowed into the Jewish canon, a controversy that spanned decades, before and after the final decision was made on it. None of the prophecies in Ezekiel are supposed to be literally fulfilled, but seems to be only a collection of hopeful musings on the future eventuality of a restored Israel at the end of the captivity.

There is also the sheep and goat judgement of the nations before this reign.

There is no timeline connected to this judgement or even a surety that such a thing has to happen as specified. This is in a series of statements supposedly by Jesus in John where he is taking all these various expectations and saying he is now, or is going to fulfill them, including whatever sort of future judgment that the Jews thought was going to happen at some unspecified time.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Ezekiel is a book, supposedly by a prophet, but is not like the famous prophets like Isaiah and Jeremiah,

Dewey, Isaiah and Jeremiah both speak of the Millennial period too.

reply to post by sacgamer25


Make up your mind. Are you going to preach universalism or not? Because you seem to not understand what universalism is.

Universalism means that when Christ shed his blood on the cross he saved everyone that day, washing away the sins of the world in that one act. Now you're trying to change your tune. Make up your mind.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

Universalism means that when Christ shed his blood on the cross he saved everyone that day, washing away the sins of the world in that one act.

We should realize that of course the Bible never says that.
There is a quote of the Baptist, in the Gospel of John, that here is the lamb who takes away the sins of the world.
He is quoting Isaiah 53, about the "suffering servant", and the verb connected with that does not mean to "wash away", but to lift up.
You could also conceivably connect that to the Jesus saying in the same gospel, where Jesus says, "if I be lifted up". He was in a couple of ways, and that also goes along with the suffering servant story, where he is in a public way "punished" and later in a public way, brought up to heaven.

Also, as far as the "whole world" goes, Paul says that the act of one righteous person is not like that act by the person who "sinned", where in that one case (Adam in the garden) through that one person sin affected everyone to death, the act of Jesus does not automatically spread to affect everyone to life.

reply to post by jmdewey60


I never said the bible did say that now did i? I said thats what universalism teaches. Read my post next time.

reply to post by vethumanbeing

but I can see that one would want some kind of "Relief" from the stress of not being acknowlededged by a God Form?

This reminds me of when I was taking English 101 in college. Our first written assignment was to write a short piece from our lives that showed a little of who we saw ourselves to be.

The teacher handed out his own piece as an example. In it he described himself seeking to be a Satanist, because their deity was actually supposed to make appearances from time to time. When no appearance seemed forthcoming, he decided to be a Christian, because they at least never expected their deity to show up.

In a sense, he was an atheist, by giving up the expectation of being acknowledged.

Does one trick itself out of believing in a God, or trick oneself into BELIEVING in a God Form.

Just my opinion here:

If one wants to fit in with a group that professes participation with a certain deity, one may emotionally work oneself into a quasi belief. Stress would then manifest as never being sure if one's experience was "up to par" with the rest of the group's. Not an easy path.

If, on the other hand, one finds that a popular deity is actually a horrendous character according to his own scripture, then the task would be to debunk that deity. Stress arises from the fact that as the deity is more and more debunked by rational thought, the debunker is left with less and less of a deity, (abandonment).

That's why I find monotheism to be especially egregious; it only offers an either/or. There really are other options.

NEVER DISCUSS THE PROBLEM OF GOD ACCEPTANCE OR DENIAL TO anyone but your Priest.

That depends on your group of friends or online virtual friends I would guess.

Additional thoughts:

There was a time when escaping the notice of the gods was considered to be a virtue. The opposite was considered to be hubris. For some reason modern society has flipped that over. Perhaps more people would benefit from the old virtues.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


Speech Time (adjusts tie lol)

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE WORD is all. Is it the Emotional LOVE hormonal or is it FORCE?

Akragon is right… Lust is not love IMO

If love stems from God (which I believe it does) and seeing as you believe that you are “a God particle”…then your comment of having “No Love Quotient” cannot be correct.

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
This might hurt but true I have no idea who I am except I created you and need enlightening.

“I feel and know I am God Partical.” “I have no idea who I am”

Care to explain, why those 2 statements aren’t contradictory…? lol

And if you have no idea who you are, then how do you know you created me…? lol

The Father and Yeshua created me, and they created everything else IMO…

And as for enlightening you, I’ve been trying to do just that, in my “seek ye, first the Kingdom of Heaven”, thread.

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
Im not an atheist. I am not an Agnostic, I feel and know I am God Partical, in so much as stating this I hate my parent for being a NO SHOW.

The reason you believe your parent is a “NO Show” type of guy, is because you hate the parent, (your, concept, idea, of etc…) long before even giving Him a chance, to find/know who He really is… You’ve already decided, ahead of time…because of His apparent “NO Show”

God doesn’t force himself onto people…you have to go look, seek…knock (ask the right questions) and only then will the door be opened to you…
Try to imagine God just forcing himself into everybody’s lives, and then you will come to understand, the Wisdom in Gods approach…

Jesus specifically states that he will not leave those who believe in him, as orphans, which means, He won’t leave them, without them knowing who their creator, and Father really is…

John 14:15-21

15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

Jesus is talking about the receiving of the Holy Spirit, which is how one becomes born again, or born from above/God etc…

The reason God is a “No show” in your life right now, is because you neither see Him, nor know Him…


- JC

reply to post by pthena

There was a time when escaping the notice of the gods was considered to be a virtue. The opposite was considered to be hubris. For some reason modern society has flipped that over. Perhaps more people would benefit from the old virtues.

I wonder if the guy who says, "Lord, lord!" in Jesus' description of "that day" would have passed unnoticed if he had kept his mouth shut.

btw: I got my two volume set of The Word commentary on Jeremiah in the mail today. I bought them inexpensively used in "good" condition but they look new to me.

Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

Speech Time (adjusts tie lol)

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE WORD is all. Is it the Emotional LOVE hormonal or is it FORCE?

Akragon is right… Lust is not love IMO

If love stems from God (which I believe it does) and seeing as you believe that you are “a God particle”…then your comment of having “No Love Quotient” cannot be correct.

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
This might hurt but true I have no idea who I am except I created you and need enlightening.

“I feel and know I am God Partical.” “I have no idea who I am”

Care to explain, why those 2 statements aren’t contradictory…? lol

And if you have no idea who you are, then how do you know you created me…? lol

The Father and Yeshua created me, and they created everything else IMO…

And as for enlightening you, I’ve been trying to do just that, in my “seek ye, first the Kingdom of Heaven”, thread.

Originally posted by Vethumanbeing
Im not an atheist. I am not an Agnostic, I feel and know I am God Partical, in so much as stating this I hate my parent for being a NO SHOW.

The reason you believe your parent is a “NO Show” type of guy, is because you hate the parent, (your, concept, idea, of etc…) long before even giving Him a chance, to find/know who He really is… You’ve already decided, ahead of time…because of His apparent “NO Show”

God doesn’t force himself onto people…you have to go look, seek…knock (ask the right questions) and only then will the door be opened to you…
Try to imagine God just forcing himself into everybody’s lives, and then you will come to understand, the Wisdom in Gods approach…

Jesus specifically states that he will not leave those who believe in him, as orphans, which means, He won’t leave them, without them knowing who their creator, and Father really is…

John 14:15-21

15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

Jesus is talking about the receiving of the Holy Spirit, which is how one becomes born again, or born from above/God etc…

The reason God is a “No show” in your life right now, is because you neither see Him, nor know Him…


- JC

edit on 10-6-2013 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)

"Born Again" as Jesus explains in John, Chapter 3 is Water Baptism. There is no "water" in the Protestant
one time altar call of accepting Jesus Christ into your heart as your personal Lord and Savior. After Jesus
explains to Nicodemus, you see (read), verse 22, Jesus and the Apostles went out and baptized.

Water Baptism is a requirement. Water Baptism removes Original Sin, this is the first time your receive God's presence in your soul and the only thing that can remove His presence in your soul after Water Baptism is by committing a MORTAL sin. The reason Jesus established Confession (John 20:23). We are all sinners.

The Protestant "born again" maybe a moment of conversion. Do not ignore Jesus' meaning of "born again."

If your parents did not have you baptized. Pray about it, tell Our Lord of your desire. He will help make it happen.

John 3:5 Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Everyone is saved and will be in heaven, but some will carry shame with them in the next age. This is the message of the bible. Whether that is an earthly heaven or merely a spiritual heaven I am not certain. I like to believe in the Messianic age; merely believing that all men may achieve the state of love together brings me joy. So why believe in anything less than that which brings you joy?

You may be forgiven, and you may even accept forgiveness, but it is possible to feel shame for needing forgiveness even after you have received it.

I do not want to pass judgment on any man so I only use this for example, since most people agree Hitler was a bad dude.

What I am saying is all are saved by Christ's blood Sacrifice including Hitler. I believe it is safe to assume that he never found the spirit of love. Meaning during his life he condemned himself to be without the love of God by his actions. Hitler never found "heaven within", meaning he never had peace in his mind.

So although Hitler will finally be in heaven, he will be left to feel shame, while he himself exults those who were able to overcome that which he was unable to overcome, sin.

All will be in heaven but shame follows those who did not overcome sin; in this way their shame will remain as an everlasting reminder that love is the only path. Thus what they could not do for themselves in this life, was done for them, so that they too may enter heaven, but with a little shame.

This is the only way that I see to reconcile all scripture. There are no contradictions to what I say in scripture. The contradictions only exist because the interpretation that you have accepted contains contradictions.

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by colbe

 

I only pray you to stop living with fear. I really do love you. Sacgamer

Confusing response to your thinking Jesus is coming back in His person for the Millennium. What?

Do you see why "private interpretation" of Scripture called "private judgment" is heresy? God did not give every person reading Scripture the authority to interpret it. He gave that "authority" to the Church who decided the Canon. The fruit of private judgment is error and division. Read the Douay-Rheims, the footnotes are a great
help. www.drbo.org...

Where does it say Jesus is literally returning in His person for the 7th Day? Just wondering...


I love you too Sac,


colbe

You are correct God does not give interpretation of scripture to everyone. However, he does give it to all who obey the son, pray for interpretation, and believe they have received it. I have obeyed the son, I have prayed for interpretation, and I have received it. This is what the book you believe in says that I can do. I did it and I have received it.

To be an elected official does not give someone authority over Christ Jesus who is the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Love. No man, no church, no one ever can claim ownership of the father or the son. There is no Vicar of Christ, because there is no need for one.

Christ is alive in me as he is with all his disciples, anyone from any birthplace, from any religion, from any ethnicity, can choose to obey "The Spirit of Love" and find "Heaven within". You do not own heaven, nor do you know how to get there. You still think it possible to earn heaven on merit; you still believe that I must believe exactly what someone else believes to find God. When it should be clear that God is within all life and the Spirit of Love is a free gift to anyone who would choose love.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by colbe

 

Revelation 20:4

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The real question is trying to determine who exactly will be living during this Millennial Kingdom.

In Ezekiel 37, God is going to refine the Jews with fire in order to live there also, so that God's covenant with the Jews is ultimately fulfilled.

There is also the sheep and goat judgement of the nations before this reign.

Christ is "The Spirit of Love", the Holy Spirit. So he may reign in body or spirit, or possibly both, I'm not sure if the bible is definitive on this. I think the verses are open for interpretation.

Originally posted by pthena
reply to post by vethumanbeing

but I can see that one would want some kind of "Relief" from the stress of not being acknowlededged by a God Form?

pthena
This reminds me of when I was taking English 101 in college. Our first written assignment was to write a short piece from our lives that showed a little of who we saw ourselves to be.The teacher handed out his own piece as an example. In it he described himself seeking to be a Satanist, because their deity was actually supposed to make appearances from time to time. When no appearance seemed forthcoming, he decided to be a Christian, because they at least never expected their deity to show up.In a sense, he was an atheist, by giving up the expectation of being acknowledged.

Whoa, God hasnt shown up either unless you believe yourself a particulate of (then if so God is existing IN MASS FORM EVERYWHERE cooking up bar-be-que). So Satan gave up as it cannot control soul groups, or ANYTHING AT ALL. No appearance insead of expecting one was the better bet. Satan will show up (not knowing when, GOD WILL NEVER SHOW). Why take the odds on God? More or less likely to show, OH IT WAS PROMISED AS THE SECOND COMING.

vethumanbeing Does one trick itself out of believing in a God, or trick oneself into BELIEVING in a God Form.

Pthena
Just my opinion here: If, on the other hand, one finds that a popular deity is actually a horrendous character according to his own scripture, then the task would be to debunk that deity. Stress arises from the fact that as the deity is more and more debunked by rational thought, the debunker is left with less and less of a deity, (abandonment) That's why I find monotheism to be especially egregious; it only offers an either/or. There really are other options.

Monothesism is tantimount to believing your parents are your bearer bonds into life eternal. The debunker starts at a disadvantage, IT HAS NO IDEA whom its adversary is (not rational not physical) just an ideaform it cannot sympathetically with compassion UNDERSTAND. Don Quixote is presented with windmills AGAIN.

vethumanbeingNEVER DISCUSS THE PROBLEM OF GOD ACCEPTANCE OR DENIAL TO anyone but your Priest.

Yes, as you noted PERFECTLY to escape Gods notice was to SAVE YOUR LIFE. Hubris would have been interpreted as COMPLIANCE. Old virtues? No idea of what they may have exemplified. Purity, TAXES paid on time Get the HEAD TAX done remove yourselves from Jeruselem RUN backwards to the netherlands AND NO WHINING.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


The bible says God is Love

You are trying to say love has never shown up in your life? Not even once?

1 John 4:8 Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.

1 John 4:16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

The bible says God is Love
You are trying to say love has never shown up in your life? Not even once?
1 John 4:8 Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.
1 John 4:16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.

sacgamer25, I know this I just do not know how to experience it. I am a rational being that cannot distinguish Love Force from Love Hormonal. They are the same to me. God is Love, As I am God why am I not feeling the Good times, I misunderstand myself OBVIOUSLY. I am not open I am not forgiving, and not unjust just am not merciful (taking the Soap Box position "IF YOU WERE GOD" whats your idea regarding Love construct).

reply to post by vethumanbeing


This may sound crazy and way too simple but "just do it".

You see just go out and do something loving. Give away your last $5, really anything. After you do so think about that feeling. If the feeling is love go do it again. If the feeling is not, don't do it, try something else until you find what brings you joy.

Pick a music playlist that puts you in the mood to love, when it gets tired update it with new songs. Anything that directs your spirit to a positive state of mind. This can be a great way to meditate as well.

The only advice is stay away from what you call physical love, sexuality, when searching for this love. Because the love you are looking for is not physical.

If you can learn how to accept love into your life by doing loving things, then you will begin to "see" that you have all the power you need within.

I cannot give you an easier guide book than this, you must "do" love to feel love. The words I love you are often meaningless when not used properly as a verb.

Originally posted by sacgamer25

Originally posted by colbe

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by colbe

 

I only pray you to stop living with fear. I really do love you. Sacgamer

Confusing response to your thinking Jesus is coming back in His person for the Millennium. What?

Do you see why "private interpretation" of Scripture called "private judgment" is heresy? God did not give every person reading Scripture the authority to interpret it. He gave that "authority" to the Church who decided the Canon. The fruit of private judgment is error and division. Read the Douay-Rheims, the footnotes are a great
help. www.drbo.org...

Where does it say Jesus is literally returning in His person for the 7th Day? Just wondering...


I love you too Sac,


colbe

You are correct God does not give interpretation of scripture to everyone. However, he does give it to all who obey the son, pray for interpretation, and believe they have received it. I have obeyed the son, I have prayed for interpretation, and I have received it. This is what the book you believe in says that I can do. I did it and I have received it.

To be an elected official does not give someone authority over Christ Jesus who is the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Love. No man, no church, no one ever can claim ownership of the father or the son. There is no Vicar of Christ, because there is no need for one.

Christ is alive in me as he is with all his disciples, anyone from any birthplace, from any religion, from any ethnicity, can choose to obey "The Spirit of Love" and find "Heaven within". You do not own heaven, nor do you know how to get there. You still think it possible to earn heaven on merit; you still believe that I must believe exactly what someone else believes to find God. When it should be clear that God is within all life and the Spirit of Love is a free gift to anyone who would choose love.

Hey,

I never said I own Heaven, oh my, turn it to the personal.

You believe in the heresy of "private judgment." I am sharing Sac, it is not of God. God did not give every
person reading Scripture the authority to interpret it. The short discussion here proves it. Man's pride,
everyone would say their interpretation is correct.

You say "no man, no church"....

Excuse me, one man by the authority given him by God compiled the Canon. Pope Damasus in 382 A.D.
Pope Damasus, leader of the Roman Catholic Church. Read a Catholic Bible, the footnotes will help you.
God gave the authority to interpret Scripture to the Church. Not one verse in the Bible conflicts when you
accept Church teaching on it. www.drbo.org...

It is fact, many, many Protestant ministers have converted to the faith seeing the minister down the
street preaching something completely different! How is that possible? Eph 4:5 says there is one Lord, one faith, one Baptism. These ministers by a grace came to realize they had no authority.

The fruit of "private judgment" is error and division. How many Protestant communities are there to date?
You have traditional Protestantism and their break aways, denominations and their break aways, non-denominations and their break aways, home churches.

God wants you to become Catholic so remember okay? He wants you to believe in His presence in the
Eucharist.