Gay Colorado couple sues bakery for allegedly refusing them wedding cake

Originally posted by esdad71
Common Sense Post -
This bakery seems to be, as stated in the article, well known for not doing same sex marriage cakes. So, why would you go there as a gay couple? To start trouble. Bottom line. There are 100's of other bakeries, and in Colorado, I am sure there are 'gay' friendly bakeries, so why not go there and support someone who also supports the rights you feel you are entitled to. Real simple.

edit on 7-6-2013 by esdad71 because: (no reason given)

I was just going to type the same. Since this is ATS, IMO this bakery and its owner were purposefully targetted by LGBT and/or local Liberal Politicos

Originally posted by esdad71
BTW - I believe gay people have every right to get married, divorced, pay alimony, etc just like everyone else. It is time though to stop bringing this to the forefront and honestly, wasting the time of the American tax payer when it could be used to help children be adopted or hundreds of other cases that could have an impact on the nation.

edit on 7-6-2013 by esdad71 because: (no reason given)

Well thats one piece of the pie they're after Tax payer's money for the welfare and benefits for LGBT couples. Government wants people to rely upon them and LGBT wants representation. What better way.

Just for the kicks and for the sake of arguement, do you believe in marriage of humans and animals? I'm sure the folks into Beastiality would love to see a marriage law passed for them And while we're at it, lets for the sake of arguement also legalize child marriage or arranged marriage as practiced in other countries or make polygamy legal

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by esdad71
BTW - I believe gay people have every right to get married, divorced, pay alimony, etc just like everyone else. It is time though to stop bringing this to the forefront and honestly, wasting the time of the American tax payer when it could be used to help children be adopted or hundreds of other cases that could have an impact on the nation.

edit on 7-6-2013 by esdad71 because: (no reason given)

Well thats one piece of the pie they're after

Tax payer's money for the welfare and benefits for LGBT couples. Government wants people to rely upon them and LGBT wants representation. What better way.

Just for the kicks and for the sake of arguement, do you believe in marriage of humans and animals? I'm sure the folks into the Beastiality would love to see a marriage law passed for them

And while we're at it, lets for the sake of arguement also legalize child marriage or arranged marriage as practiced in other countries or make polygamy legal

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

If you can prove to me that animals and/or children can sign and understand a marriage contract, I'll be all for it. Consenting adults, dude.

And polygamy is in the Bible as an okay thing, so why should anyone have a problem with that? I don't know why we don't bring slavery back - God is fine with that. And we should start stoning disobedient children to death again - it's what God told us to do. Oh yeah, I forgot -- Jesus said that whole stoning thing was a big mistake.

I think I was wrong about the bakery owner's right to refuse service because of sexual orientation in Colorado:

Effective May 29, 2008, the Colorado Anti-Discrimination Act was expanded to include sexual orientation, inclusive of transgender status, to the list of protected classes for public accommodations. Colorado now prohibits discrimination against individuals because they are straight, lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender in establishments like restaurants, hotels, retail stores, and hospitals.
...
A public accommodation is any place of business engaged in offering sales or services of any kind to the public, as well as any place offering facilities, privileges, advantages or other accommodations to the public.

Colorado Anti-Discrimination Act

According to that, the gay couple have a great case.

reply to post by TheRedneck

Originally posted by TheRedneck
but here we have someone who wishes to avoid an action which would condone gay marriage, citing religious objections, and he is being sued for following his religious objection.

Making a cake for someone does not "condone" their marriage. It's making a cake. Making a cake for gay people does NOT violate any religious belief. If the baker makes cakes for atheists, fornicators and divorced people, they "violate his religion" just as much as gay people do... and therefore, he's singling out gay people to discriminate against.

If someone is going to have a business in Colorado, then they had better be prepared to offer their services to everyone. If they can't refuse service because of race, then they can't refuse service because of sexual orientation.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by esdad71
BTW - I believe gay people have every right to get married, divorced, pay alimony, etc just like everyone else. It is time though to stop bringing this to the forefront and honestly, wasting the time of the American tax payer when it could be used to help children be adopted or hundreds of other cases that could have an impact on the nation.

edit on 7-6-2013 by esdad71 because: (no reason given)

Well thats one piece of the pie they're after

Tax payer's money for the welfare and benefits for LGBT couples. Government wants people to rely upon them and LGBT wants representation. What better way.

Just for the kicks and for the sake of arguement, do you believe in marriage of humans and animals? I'm sure the folks into the Beastiality would love to see a marriage law passed for them

And while we're at it, lets for the sake of arguement also legalize child marriage or arranged marriage as practiced in other countries or make polygamy legal

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-6-2013 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)

If you can prove to me that animals and/or children can sign and understand a marriage contract, I'll be all for it. Consenting adults, dude.

And polygamy is in the Bible as an okay thing, so why should anyone have a problem with that? I don't know why we don't bring slavery back - God is fine with that. And we should start stoning disobedient children to death again - it's what God told us to do. Oh yeah, I forgot -- Jesus said that whole stoning thing was a big mistake.

Thats our belief system. Why ask for proof when its been part of a society and that the society is happy with it with child marriage or arranged marriage or polygamy ? Who are we to judge them? (Just the way the LGBT feels about their rights). Why does the age of consent has to be 18? (I am strictly in favor for 18 btw). I see many consenting adults behave much much worst than a child and many refuse to grow up

Polygamy is in the bible then why is it illegal then ? I think we should fight for Polygamy just like LGBT

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Good catch!! The bakery owner will probably still use religious freedom as his defense, and claim that he never "knowingly" sold a cake to an atheist, fornicator, etc. We'll see what happens, but this is good news for the gay community.

Originally posted by hp1229

Polygamy is in the bible then why is it illegal then ?

I think we should fight for Polygamy just like LGBT

And I'll fight right along beside you. It's not my thing, but I'm not gay either.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
Don't forget that same sex marriage law was legalized sometime on May 1st 2013 The case is going back to July of 2012. Moreoever nobody has presented the statements made by the store owner during the potential sales transaction as per why he refused. Its more of he sed he/he sed Unless they secretly recorded a cell phone footage or convo. Did he refuse because they were both gays or he just doesn't believe in gay marriage? Two different things. So they might not have a case as there were no legal same sex marriage law passed in Colorado in 2012 IMO.

DENVERThe first same-sex couple granted a civil union in Colorado said their vows before hundreds of people early Wednesday morning at a downtown Denver municipal building where couples and members of the public gathered.

The new law legalizing civil unions took effect at 12:01 a.m. Wednesday, and both Denver and Boulder began issuing licenses immediately.

Colorado_Same_Sex_Legal

I'd just like to address another issue...

reply to post by Nucleardiver

Originally posted by Nucleardiver
The way I feel about this is that if the owner of this bakery didn't want to make a cake for the couple then they could have and should have simply found another bakery.

So, if one bakery can refuse them service, then another one can and another. If they were Jewish, would you feel the same? If a restaurant told a Jewish couple, "I'm sorry. We're not going to offer you services because you're Jewish and we don't condone that religion," would you say they should just go to another restaurant?

IMO a person that is engaged in private commerce has the right to refuse service to anyone for whatever reason they want.

That may be your opinion, but it differs from the law.

The ACLU spokesman in the article even states that religious freedom is a fundamental right that they champion and stand up for everyday.

Religious freedom is the right to practice one's religion - go to church, pray, worship, etc,. It is NOT the right to discriminate against those who do not practice YOUR religion. You can have your religious beliefs and practice your religion, but if you have a business, you do not have the right to refuse services to people because their lifestyle disagrees with your religion. See the difference?

The baker's right to religious freedoms are NOT being violated. He just has a mistaken idea about what his "religious freedom" includes. He's free to feel how he feels and believe what he believes, but he does not have the right to refuse service because someone doesn't share his beliefs.

reply to post by hp1229


That's civil union, not marriage. But I think it's coming.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by hp1229
Polygamy is in the bible then why is it illegal then ?

I think we should fight for Polygamy just like LGBT

And I'll fight right along beside you. It's not my thing, but I'm not gay either.

me neither. I love my wife and kids. One is enough for me (sheesh..I dont know how the polygamists handle multiple wives ) My point is that there are many aspects of the social/religious/legal laws/practices/taboos/rituals that we can challenge and legalize. Where does one draw the line? Might as well have a lawless society?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by hp1229

 

That's civil union, not marriage.

But I think it's coming.

Thanks. You're correct. Its a starter Main chaos remains challenged.

Originally posted by Telos
Oh now is: Whether you accept us or we sue you?

Wth is going on with our society...

Yep, nothing like taking away rights of some, to give to someone else.

reply to post by macman

Originally posted by macman
Yep, nothing like taking away rights of some, to give to someone else.

What rights does the baker have taken away?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by macman

 

Originally posted by macman
Yep, nothing like taking away rights of some, to give to someone else.

What rights does the baker have taken away?

Couldn't resist. Right to a fruitcake..err a wedding cake?

It's a catch 22. On one hand you have free business. ANd fair play to that. As a gay man, I also have free trade, and as a gay man, I have decided to never use their serives to make a gay wedding cake.

that is my choice, that was theres. IMO, it is a bit of a non issue. If folk in a business want to cut out a portion of their profits, then who am I to tell them not to, There will always be someone in business who isn't Hitler, and they will get my money first. So who suffers in the end? nazi scum, that's who. And F***'em. They deserve misery.

Privately owned establishments have or at least did have the right to refuse service as they see fit.

This couple knew that this bakery would refuse them which is why they went there specifically. They targeted this bakery on purpose. They even said so themselves. People like them need to be stopped, and no i'm not talking about gay people i'm talking about people who force their opinions/beliefs on others. This society must not allow this, the courts must not allow this.

There are plenty of bakery's that would be happy to bake this couples cake but they don't really want a cake, they want fame and money for nothing. Shame on them!

Kind of amusing that a couple of people claiming that their rights aren't meant seek only to take away the rights of others. Hypocrites!

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by hp1229
Polygamy is in the bible then why is it illegal then ?

I think we should fight for Polygamy just like LGBT

And I'll fight right along beside you. It's not my thing, but I'm not gay either.

me neither. I love my wife and kids. One is enough for me (sheesh..I dont know how the polygamists handle multiple wives

) My point is that there are many aspects of the social/religious/legal laws/practices/taboos/rituals that we can challenge and legalize. Where does one draw the line? Might as well have a lawless society?

I think one can draw the line at consenting adults where there are no victims.

Originally posted by brandiwine14
Privately owned establishments have or at least did have the right to refuse service as they see fit.

This couple knew that this bakery would refuse them which is why they went there specifically. They targeted this bakery on purpose. They even said so themselves. People like them need to be stopped, and no i'm not talking about gay people i'm talking about people who force their opinions/beliefs on others. This society must not allow this, the courts must not allow this.

There are plenty of bakery's that would be happy to bake this couples cake but they don't really want a cake, they want fame and money for nothing. Shame on them!

Kind of amusing that a couple of people claiming that their rights aren't meant seek only to take away the rights of others. Hypocrites!

There are laws against discrimination. People who discriminate need to be stopped.

I find it hypocritical that the bakery owner most likely has not interviewed all his customers to make sure that they follow all his religious beliefs before he sells them anything.

NO shirt NO shoes NO service. So, when are we going to sue so we can eat naked next? Do not tell me it is not the same thing because it is. It is my right to do it. Make it happen. Especially if I am Wiccan...hmmm....sounds strange then right? It is accepted in religion but not restaurants. I would be protected under this law also.

Folks, this is not a move forward for gay rights. It is a step back because the 'majority' will see this as a targeted lawsuit. These guys could have gone somewhere else. Instead, now this man, who has every right to refuse service to anyone no matter what the law says about 'equality', because it is his business, is going to incur legal fees.

If he had said he was too busy would it be a case still. No, it is because it is a 'known' place that did not bake gay cakes and is being targeted which will cost the tax payer money. 10's of thousands by the time it is done and there is already a law in place. So boycott this baker and make another a gay marriage accepting baker a rich man. There is nothing wrong with that. Nothing.

All this over a cake??? This is not about gay marriage...it is about a cake but it is being used as a platform when it should not be to push an agenda. Sad really.