Illinois illegally seizes bees resistant to Monsanto's Roundup; Kills remaining Queens

How do we know that this (Paenibacillus larvae that cause foulbrood); is not a new anti-bacterium to protect hives/bees from monsanto and their conquest to monopolize everything that has anything to do with profit?

reply to post by WanderingThe3rd


I had already admitted my mistake at the very outset.

If it's a problem, lock it, dock me points, and may the Lord have mercy on my soul.

Does a mod have to keep returning here to wipe yours, this, and any other off-topic posts or can we give them a break?

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Yep. A quarantined, confiscated sample is just a disaster waiting to happen and must be totally destroyed to ensure the safety of public health.

In my 10 years on the force I always made it a habit to destroy any evidence I collected at crime scenes, everyone just took my word for it and that was the end of the matter.

How often was your evidence a biological hazard capable of destroying an entire industry over several counties?

Once it had been tested and verified and not contested there is no need to keep it.

the guy had 4 months to contest the issue and never tried to do so until after the bees were destroyed.

If he ACTUALLY had to supposed proof why did he not make it available in the 4 months before they were destroyed??

Everyone seems to be dodging the fact that once it was removed and quarantined the danger ceased to exist

Rubbish - the risk is lessened, but it remains.

and there really was no reason whatsoever to completely destroy any and all evidence prior to the hearing.

the hearing is a red herring - he could have presented his supposed evidence in the 4 months between the disease being found and his hives destroyed, and he failed to do so..

I am a pragmatist. Had I been the official in this case, and the guy was truly a nutjob screaming bloody murder about nonsense you can BET I would hold on to every little bit of evidence I could to flat out prove that nothing shady was going on.

Seems to me this did not happen.

Let's just hide behind the idea that it was done "by the book" and all is well and good and move on, so when things like this happen again, and again, it won't look suspicious in the slightest.

no - let's not hide behind the fact that the required level of evidence to destroy the bees WAS available and the decision WAS made on that evidence, and this guy did NOT contest that at the time by presenting any contrary evidence - which he was certainly entitled to do.

He is the one with the credibility problem - not the officials.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


If there is such a flagrant risk that warrants outright destruction then perhaps they should improve their handling techniques? I'm not saying they had to keep the entirety of the lot, here - just some samples to present. We're not talking about Ebola, here.

They should have given the guy all the rope necessary to hang himself with and yet they didn't - they just had to up and destroy it all prior to the hearing and give the guy a reason to mouth off. Why wouldn't they want to do this?

It's pretty stupid, breaking the chain of evidence, and the practice allows for all kinds of abuses.

For their own good in the future, perhaps they should consider a change in policy in regards to how they handle their evidence. As it stands now the way it was done is insufficient to sway me that they were acting 100% on the up and up.

So what's protecting beekeepers hives from natural hives that have foulbrood? I guess we have to search every nook and cranny and check every hollow tree all across America now as there is a potential threat. What a crock of BS!! Bee's know how to take care of themselves!

reply to post by sean


I don't know sean - it seems some of us are incessantly obsessed with controlling every aspect of existence. The slant I am getting from the naysayers is that this guy who is obviously passionate about bees was secretly out to spread disease and harm/eradicate them.

reply to post by Power_Semi


Greetings, as per my first post in this thread, I recommend reading the other thread discussing this subject as it contains a plethora of information. Including the information about the person involved in the confiscation of the infected bees, someone you described so vividly:

Honestly some people are so utterly stupid, and sadly they seem to be the ones with the clipboards and the power, maybe it's a necessary trait so that they'll follow orders without thinking.

Here's a snippet:

Susan Kivikko with the Northern Beekeepers says that honey bees cover a large area, but there are simple steps beekeepers can take to protect their honeybees and therefore their investment.

Hives can be covered with netting, which will prevent any bees from leaving and those returning from being able to unload their nectar. Beekeepers can bait their yards in advance so the honeybees won't seek forage into the spray area or they can even move a hive. All of these things take a little time to be effective. This is why pesticide applicators should give beekeepers ample notice of their applications.

Kivikko also says that honeybees gather water in the morning and nectar in the afternoon. Since an adult honeybee does not ingest pollen but brings it back as a protein source for the developing brood, spraying later in the day will allow pesticides to dry or dissipate before it would be brought back to the hive. In addition, the further a honeybee travels from the hive, the less likely she will be to leave after 6pm.

With this information in mind, pesticide applicators should follow these three simple steps:

1. Display the informational poster.

2. Notify at least 24 hours in advance. (48 hours is better.)

3. Spray as late in the day as possible.

In doing so, you will help maximize a beekeeper's potential to help the honeybee industry survive. The IllinoisBees initiative was developed to provide the agricultural industry with the tools necessary for a successful year for all.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I don't know about you my friend, but this doesn't sound like a stupid person who doesn't think, does it?

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


They should have given the guy all the rope necessary to hang himself with and yet they didn't.... .

????

He had 4 months to contest the findings and failed to do so - how much more rope is actually required?

The officials are not the ones going to court to prove something - he is. So the onus is on him to provide the evidence to support HIS accusation. They have already proved theirs to the level required by law.

reply to post by KyrieEleison


This story brought back a memory of a scene from the X-Files movie of bees , corn and gov secrets

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


They destroyed evidence before the hearing. In my former circles that is a taboo.

I respect your position and everything but when it comes to this we'll just have to agree to disagree.

America is not the only super power, the people can't change a thing. Sorry but they are to unorganized and the numbers aren't there. Just like people say America has a responsibility to the world by being a super power when it comes to global terrorism, America is now acting the terrorist against nature and all of us so its time another superpower step in to the debate and show responsibility on this subject. I'm thinking most leaders are in bed together and the rest is rhetoric so it won't happen. Maybe a large underground civilian security firm could be set up, but it would take a long time to get the revolt numbers, before then we'd be found out and called terrorists. Whats the answer?

reply to post by kickstart


Well, I know in this case the answer is proper procedures for the handling of evidence.

The effect is twofold:

1) It protects the public from having their rights arbitrarily stepped on, by whomever, for whatever reason,

and

2) It protects those handling the evidence from false claims that they are corrupt and/or have ulterior motives.

It's a win-win situation for all parties involved. In criminal cases the chain of evidence is preserved and, while mistakes are known to happen, the overall effect is that the system as a whole maintains at least some semblance of integrity. It's hard to justify why one would not want to do this. If it's deemed such a dire emergency that it needs to be seized, it can be preserved until the case runs its course.

I've said my piece on this, you may agree or disagree however I've seen it in action and it works.

reply to post by KyrieEleison


I agree whole heartily with the theory. I'm probably over paranoid with to much self indulgence here lol but i don't see with big players involved how the evidence will be preserved. We have reached a point with a lot of tech bio and electric where we have to have a stand still and grow as people before we jump in. You only have to look at venter experiments to see where on a very prudent path. If i gave you a free energy device tomorrow so wank brain would destroy the world with it. We need to take a step back and grow up.

reply to post by KyrieEleison


I'm not just disgusted, I'm really pissed off about this

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by sean

 

I don't know sean - it seems some of us are incessantly obsessed with controlling every aspect of existence. The slant I am getting from the naysayers is that this guy who is obviously passionate about bees was secretly out to spread disease and harm/eradicate them.

This guy has been profiting as a beekeeper for 30 years. Till that is before they ransacked his place.

reply to post by PtolemyII

I agree.

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Yep. A quarantined, confiscated sample is just a disaster waiting to happen and must be totally destroyed to ensure the safety of public health.

In my 10 years on the force I always made it a habit to destroy any evidence I collected at crime scenes, everyone just took my word for it and that was the end of the matter.

Everyone seems to be dodging the fact that once it was removed and quarantined the danger ceased to exist and there really was no reason whatsoever to completely destroy any and all evidence prior to the hearing.

I am a pragmatist. Had I been the official in this case, and the guy was truly a nutjob screaming bloody murder about nonsense you can BET I would hold on to every little bit of evidence I could to flat out prove that nothing shady was going on.

Seems to me this did not happen.

Let's just hide behind the idea that it was done "by the book" and all is well and good and move on, so when things like this happen again, and again, it won't look suspicious in the slightest.

There is the possibility that this will be removed as OT, but I think it is in context because of the involvement of the big "M" and a small producer.

The big "M" has deep pockets and an amazing ability to tweak what makes it out to John Q. Public as news. Very, very few of the folks I've talked to right here in Indiana know that the 70 something Hoosier farmer DID NOT save big "M" soybeans for a second planting. He bought what was considered junk seed from a local mill in order to try to salvage a bad season. There may or may not have been some of their seed mixed in. I don't think the lawyers in the case were even clear on that.

This whole "intellectual property" thing is getting out of control. If you sign that deal with the Devil, for THREE YEARS after the end of your contract they have the legal right to send their food police to your farm 24/7/365 any time day or night and demand your phone records, customer list, bank records and can go anywhere on your property and inspect your equipment and buildings for evidence against you.

The elderly beekeeper may have been in the wrong to some extent, but the ham handed actions of the other side shows you what the little guy can expect in the future.

reply to post by Glassbender777


It's an act of war against mother nature.


and is known for what it is.


Europe has just (mostly, except spain, portugal and someone else) said no to monsanto; Australia should too.

What they are doing is dangerous. Very dangerous. without honey bees, we could all stave - mass global starvation; ...and some independently funded studies say gmo crops cause cancer and reproductive difficulties in rats i think it was....

people need to raise more awareness about monsanto because already bee numbers are falling dramatically in the USA. this affects all of us.

I live in australia, and we dont have bees out on our rural bushland property anymore these days. can't recall when i last saw a bee.

we have plenty of wasps tho.

it isn't good. and i miss the bees. something just doesn't feel right without them.

funny how people are wondering what's killing the honey bees.'

well, they just have all these herbicides and gmo plants to deal with which they never had before in the history of our race, and now they 're all dying off.

GEE, i WONDER what could be kiling them???

couldn't be our fault, could it????

could we get any stupider?