Police respond to 'serious incident' in Woolwich

reply to post by Kram09


Thank you very much for that post, which struck a chord in me.

reply to post by OneManArmy


People are a product of their environment. IE if someone is crazy , so is their environment.

This man was a British solider and was trained to kill

Originally posted by LiveForever8
There is always a bigger picture - it consists of a boot stamping on a human face - forever.

Now that is exactly what I fear. I have been studying alternative media since I got a feeling something wasnt quite right about 911. Ive been studying this sort of thing for years, you are preaching to the choir there.< pun intended.

reply to post by whatzshaken


When he is saying " Dont trust your government" I believe at this point he is speaking directly to muslims in those countries of whom British troops are going into.

I dont think hes referring to the UK.

reply to post by bigyin

Seems strange to me that the security forces would know about potential terrorists and yet do nothing about them, just let them wander about. What are they waiting for, something bad to happen and then act.

That is a fair point that has been raised several times

However,

Even if they did know about them we don’t know to what extent, would be interesting to see if they showed up in the 2007 investigation into a similar plot.

We also know that one of them was well known for distributing radical propaganda something that can fall under the Terrorism act 2006 as a terrorist offense so it may be that they were investigating that type of thing.

For all we know they might have known them because they came up once in another investigation or because they had them under watch 24/7 we just dont know

But even if they knew of them there is very little they could probably have done to have stopped this attack. The Security services in the UK do a very good job at foiling attacks one was bound to slip through eventually.

I think it would be just as difficult for MI5/SO15 as it would be for the police to prevent any other act of premeditated murder.

The Government committee on security and intelligence is investigating what MI5 knew.

Originally posted by Kram09
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Yes indeed, very surreal, and its disturbing me greatly. I fear where this will take us as a nation.

You should remember that as disturbing as yesterday's event was, such things are incredibly rare. They are not the norm.

However I feel that such groups such as the EDL or BNP will try to use this tragic event to their own advantage.

Not only the right wing parties, EVERY PARTY will make political capital out of this and they are.

ladies and gentlemen I encourage all of you to stop arguing if he was an african or a brit, if he is naturalized due to a passport or if he's a dual citizen. This does not matter, it's distracting us from the moral of this incident and it's causing tension between people for no good reason. This my friends is why I frown upon these man-made organized religions as they only cause giant rift between decent people who think they have the blessing of their immortal god while everyone else is in the dark and an ignorant daydreamer.

At the end of the day yet another life was lost and all we can do is argue about insignificant details..Then of course we have those not-so-correct-but-ever-so-entitled-people saying it wasnt a terror act, it was simply a murder. I'm sorry but when you invoke your god and you butcher a man in the street because of his choice of job (soldier) and the actions of his boss (government) against suspects "people" as he called them (Muslims?) and promise we will not stop yeaaaaaah nothing terror related, just a run of the mill murder.

Originally posted by FreedomEntered
reply to post by whatzshaken

 

When he is saying " Dont trust your government" I believe at this point he is speaking directly to muslims in those countries of whom British troops are going into.

I dont think hes referring to the UK.

No I beg to differ, he was talking to the citizens of the UK. And he was right about government, his whole rant was correct, but yet the way he went about delivering it is insanity.
I have heard of lot of radical countermeasures being bandied around today on radio....
"Arm All Police Officers"
"Give the Intelligence services more money"
"Censor the internet"
to name a few.

Good to see that I'm not the only one here who looks at this as a horrific murder rather than a terror attack.
If Jodi Aries was a Muslim and her boyfriend was a solider, would it have been treated as a terror attack or would she have needed to scream out Allah while butchering him ?
I guess if you think about it, every attack can be labeled a terror attack because you are in fact attacking someone(s) and there is a degree of terror ... it's kinda like labeling an AR-15 and assault riffle while not so on a hand gun when they both in general, are and do the same thing ... shoot a bullet.

This was murder. Not a terrorist attack.

Originally posted by SMR
Good to see that I'm not the only one here who looks at this as a horrific murder rather than a terror attack.
If Jodi Aries was a Muslim and her boyfriend was a solider, would it have been treated as a terror attack or would she have needed to scream out Allah while butchering him ?
I guess if you think about it, every attack can be labeled a terror attack because you are in fact attacking someone(s) and there is a degree of terror ... it's kinda like labeling an AR-15 and assault riffle while not so on a hand gun when they both in general, are and do the same thing ... shoot a bullet.

This was murder. Not a terrorist attack.

Under the UK legal definition of terrorism as set out under the Terrorism Act 2000, this was an act of terrorism as the perpetrators of the crime have expressed a political motivation in his rant on the TV.

Yes it is murder but it is also an act of terrorism.

reply to post by SMR


Clearly you havent seen the videos.

It was a terror attack meant to put terror into people. It has done just that.

He is not another Ted Bundy. He has an ideology behind his actions.


Last time I reply to someone who isnt even reading whats accuring. And has happened.

reply to post by ThinkYouSpeak


It matters from where he is, thats his reaction to what soldiers are doing to children and women.

Okay I give up lol...with this. Seriously.... duhhhh!

For the people that want some additional info turns out the victim was a 25 year old soldier named '' Lee Rigby ''
a father with a 2 year old.Rigby joined the army in 2006 and he was used most of the time for security of royal buildings.He had been to Afghanistan in 2009 and returned later to work a administrative job.The reason his name
didnt got announced yesterday was because of the family request to keep it secret.

Originally posted by SMR


This was murder. Not a terrorist attack.

Definition terorism in UK

serious violence against a person;
serious damage to a property;
a threat to a person's life;
a serious risk to the health and safety of the public; or
serious interference with or disruption to an electronic system.

www.mi5.gov.uk...

reply to post by xavi1000


As opposed to:

Not very serious violence against a person;
Not very serious damage to a property

Oh lord, how I hate definitions of this kind.

reply to post by Dutcheagle


I actually mentioned two posts ago that his name was Lee Rigby.

At least we know his name unlike so many Afghanistan and Iraq who have been reduced to faceless "militants."

Sad.

Originally posted by LiveForever8
reply to post by xavi1000

 

As opposed to:

Not very serious violence against a person;
Not very serious damage to a property

Oh lord, how I hate definitions of this kind.

Butchering in broad day light is very serious violence against a person not some casual murder on London streets.
I hate definitions also but it is what it is

Originally posted by Kram09
reply to post by Dutcheagle

 

I actually mentioned two posts ago that his name was Lee Rigby.

At least we know his name unlike so many Afghanistan and Iraq who have been reduced to faceless "militants."

Sad.

Sorry for that must have looked over it cause i thought no one posted that yet.
But true that.

Originally posted by SMR
Good to see that I'm not the only one here who looks at this as a horrific murder rather than a terror attack.
If Jodi Aries was a Muslim and her boyfriend was a solider, would it have been treated as a terror attack or would she have needed to scream out Allah while butchering him ?
I guess if you think about it, every attack can be labeled a terror attack because you are in fact attacking someone(s) and there is a degree of terror ... it's kinda like labeling an AR-15 and assault riffle while not so on a hand gun when they both in general, are and do the same thing ... shoot a bullet.

This was murder. Not a terrorist attack.

I know of someone in my own locality who has drove their car into a crowd of people, killing one of them, because they were annoyed at losing a mobile phone. I know another who savagely stabbed a man because he bumped into him, and there's also that clown who shot a student in the head, just to see what it was like. Our home-grown, supposedly indigenous thugs don't need religious fanaticism to carry out their acts of brutality, it's a leisure activity for them.

Originally posted by SMR
Good to see that I'm not the only one here who looks at this as a horrific murder rather than a terror attack.
If Jodi Aries was a Muslim and her boyfriend was a solider, would it have been treated as a terror attack or would she have needed to scream out Allah while butchering him ?
I guess if you think about it, every attack can be labeled a terror attack because you are in fact attacking someone(s) and there is a degree of terror ... it's kinda like labeling an AR-15 and assault riffle while not so on a hand gun when they both in general, are and do the same thing ... shoot a bullet.

This was murder. Not a terrorist attack.

yawn. If jodi invoked Allah's name before and after killing that man, and blamed him for the deaths and injustices done to people from her non-existant muslim country then yes that would be a terror attack. I'm not sure what you don't comprehend here. Why even bother with this "what if" scenario, as it stands that jodi girl was a victim of sexual abuse and in a relationship with what most people call a pedophile.


16 year old girl abused by 40 year old man who finally kills him -- Murder
Gang members firing shots at another gang member -- Murder
Throwing acid in the face of a young girl on her way to school -- Terrorism
Running over, hacking-stabbing and bludgeoning a soldier out for a walk because of his "guilt" in murdering muslims -- Terrorism
Extremist groups who want to save the rainforest throwing firebombs at tractors demolishing trees - political terrorism
John Q public and John R public get in a lethal brawl at a bar over which football team is best, one dies -- Murder
Ahmed and John get into an argument because Ahmed feels John shouldn't be able to drink alcohol in Ahmed's neighborhood so he stabs him in the neck - Political/religious insinuated terrorism


Hopefully this helps