God loves me.

Originally posted by Philodemus
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

Question: Did your Jesus..

My Jesus?

Oh how you bless me!!!, but I in turn I hereby bestow as many as I received for that back to you, my friend.

All the best and God Bless (it's already happening anyway but it's still nice to say it),

NAM

reply to post by sacgamer25

Are we not at a point that we can stop worrying about whose God and at least agree there is only one.

For the sake of discussion, and the remainder of it, I want us to do something. Let's work under the assumption God is real, and there is only one God.

I imagine you don't take issue here?

This is necessary because neither of you understand the nature of my questions.

God is real. One God. That's not in question for this time. Okay?

What is in question, is whether The Bible is the 'Word of God' or not. What reason do you have to believe it is? Can you transcend circular reasoning to show this? You realize when you use the Bible to prove the Bible is true that constitutes circular logic and is fallacious?

What reason do you have to believe the One God doesn't view The Book of Mormon as the holiest of books??

Why shouldn't I believe that One True God's name is Seth and he strongly dislikes the color orange? I am dead serious. Why?

Outside of direct communion with God, this would have to be a faith-based belief. I am asking you to be honest. Are you a prophet, or do you believe the Bible represents god's thoughts and wishes because you have faith and not reason.

As for Jesus. What do you want me to say that I have not already? He was, it seems, very moral for his time. People then would have no doubt benefited from his teachings. Many of which are as relevant today as they were then. If following his teachings makes you a better person, and helps your fellow man then that's wonderful

That 1) doesn't prove the Bible is the Word of God. 2) doesn't negate how absolutely immoral and wicked the god in the Bible is.

The OP is not about God loving me. Because it's not about God to begin with. It's about Christianity's definition of god and assertion it knows god's mind. Just like every other religion.

I see no reason to believe your version of the others. And no they are not compatible just because there is 'One God'....

We cannot allow our own contempt and religious bias or intolerance by either of us to stand in the way of the love of God. There's nothing and no one to attack?

Just my two cents.. carry on /

There's a certain logos (who's root is logic) and reason of love, which Jesus placed his whole heart and soul on, like a law of love and goodness, and happiness and joy (amid the sorrow and suffering), identifying himself with that one spiritual principal of an indespensible I-thou relationship with God the Absolute and intelligent and intentional first/last cause in eternity i.e.: for the sake of a shared mutual experience of love between a beloved and beloved other. ".. love them as you loved me from before the foundation of the world".

This same principal is still alive today, in the same spirit, but fully informed in regards to the human experience at all levels including the low points and the high points, the sorrow and suffering and despair (pressure), to the highest heights of glory and mutual glorification in God as a shared koinonia.

Secured, the treasure secured in God's righteousness, truth, justice, love and mercy, all of it expressed in and through human form - what does this make us then as children of a loving God as well?

Is there not a smile to be had here in the triumphant liberation and new life and new creation shared, even at the expense of all the sorrows and suffering of the vicissitudes of life, enough to willingly endure them anyway as a meaningful suffering a suffering of value because it's for the sake of love and everything that's worthwhile in life, and at the "shrinking devil's" expense.., with the strong man bound by the limitless love of God in and through whom the son became transparent and vice versa, as a perfect reflection - just like the moon is to the sun who together govern both day AND night in perfect harmony.
Factoid: The moon even "chases" the sun on a monthly basis such that, annaully, it sets on the horizon to the same degree due East/West of North at opposite solstices believe it or not).

"Better a dinner of herbs, where love is, than a roast ox and hatred therewith"-Proverbs ch15 v17

Who said the Bible no longer had anything of any value to say?

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

"Better a dinner of herbs, where love is, than a roast ox and hatred therewith"-Proverbs ch15 v17

Who said the Bible no longer had anything of any value to say?

Proverbs?

The Old Testament has much importance. I agree

It shows us a great many things about the religion and its god.

and its "love"....

"If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the Lord gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the Lord your God in violation of his covenant, and contrary to my command has worshipped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars in the sky, and this has been brought to your attention, then you must investigate it thoroughly. If it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death."~Deuteronomy 17:2-5

FYI. You're supposed to kill me No WAIT! New Covenant. Phew. You don't have to kill me any more.

and how human god is...

Do not clip your hair at the temples, nor trim the edges of your beard. ~Leviticus 19:27

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


I was trying to be playful and funny, but you just couldn't resist..

reply to post by NewAgeMan


You can hide behind 'humour and funny' all day long but I have the discernment of mind to see through your guise.

Stop asking me questions, when you barely answer mine. It's rude.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


I didn't ask you anything and I wasn't being rude.. I know rude when I see it. If I was rude it would be obvious, and you're right that it's pretty easy to see through people reading between the lines, the reader is fairly astute which is something that I count on when writing/sharing.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

I didn't ask you anything and I wasn't being rude..

Excusing the questions you never answered prior, since I said I was 'leaving the thread' you have asked me 4 questions.

I repeat. Stop asking me questions if you are unwillingly to answer mine. That's not a discussion. That's you wanting people to listen to you without questions.

It's interesting how people keep mentioning Jesus as if it were a FACT that he existed when the evidence is leaning in the other direction.

Most likely, there was no Jesus. It is a retelling of ancient mythology. In fact, the way the story about Jesus is written in the bible, follows the pattern of a hero's epic (Foreshadowing, Secrecy of Godhood, Miracles, written in the 3rd person seeming to know things even when the supposed person writing the story was asleep or at another place, etc.) .

If I see Jesus I would probably walk the other way, because it is a great way for a negative entity to disguise itself since and control since everyone just assume that Jesus's existence was fact.

As for god loving the original poster, and loving all of us, If there is a creator-god that made us then it makes sense that he loves us since he created us, otherwise he has some internal issues where he can not accept himself and therefore his creation..

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


Let me try to explain this in simple terms. I believe that 100% of the bible is from God, creation, young earth all of it. I was considered a genius as a child, something that runs in our family. I only state this to eliminate from anyone's mind that I blindly came to this realization.

I have researched every scientific claim against the bible; I fully understand all of the evidence and claims made by science. The truth is nothing about origins, speciation, or the age of the earth, can be considered scientific fact. And the assumptions build on themselves. To believe in the claims of science has to be taken with at least as much faith as believing in God.

After spending more than a year simply studying the science in the bible it came clear to me that much of the bible speaks of scientific things that we claim was unknown to man at the time the bible was written. Which gives more credence to the bible than to science. Seeing that when clear irrefutable science is used to match up the bible the two actually agree. It is only when one dabbles in the scientific world of assumption that one can dispute the bible's scientific accuracy.

Once I understood that the premises of Genesis could be true I began to contemplate the bigger issues. Now that I could accept the possibility of the how I looked for the why. And no matter where you look, no matter what religion that you look to, the message of love always rises to the top.

Plain and simple Jesus teaches man to love in its simplest most basic truth. "Turn the other Cheek" Failure to do this is the root of all sin. Simply "turn the other cheek" to your enemy at all time. Your enemy being sin. If sin is in front of you turn away. If your brother strikes you turn the other cheek. It's not that he said love your neighbor, because they all said that. It is not so much "turn the other cheek" because others have said that. The problem is Buddha only imagined a highly enlightened person was capable of grasping this concept.

Christ is the only one to teach that we are all capable of understanding. He teaches that all wisdom comes from God and that anyone that would "turn the other cheek" to sin at all times would receive a helper. The Holy Spirit.

Up to this point I've shared the condensed version of my path. Here is where the proof, and the fact come in. I have been baptized by Christ, the spirit of the lord lives in me, speaks understandable words to me, gives me instruction, answers all of my questions about love. But does so in such a loving and slow revealing manor to not overwhelm me with the burden of my sin. So rather than facing punishment, which I expected, I received Grace. Instead of suffering I received knowledge to understand the lies behind our sin.

This is why I can't give you the PROOF you are looking for. You either take me at my word that I found God and love within the pages of the bible. For me this has become the only truth that matters to me. So whether I am delusional or the promise in the bible is true doesn't really matter anymore, because the truth is simple God loves me and no one can convince me otherwise.

What you are looking for I can't directly give you. All I can give you is my testimony to how I found the truth. But understand this what I am saying that I have found is exactly what Jesus promised I would find if I continued to seek after him earnestly.

The problem is you are debating 2 people who in essence cannot be debated. If a man/woman has an authentic experience with God, whatever way he had this experience will be truth for him. The only thing to discern is which spirit is speaking to you. But Christ made this simple; a nation divided against itself cannot stand. Since I know that everything in my being now cries out for love, than I know that I am following the right spirit.

I don't know if this helps. I can explain more about why I believe 100% of the bible to be the truth if you are open to the possibility?

reply to post by sacgamer25


Well then, please post all of your research for peer review instead of asking us to take your word for it.

I did read your reply. Thank you for taking such time to formulate your speculations. It is an interesting hypothesis even if it uses many common fallacies. I wish you luck with the rest of the thread and with your religion.

May I suggest "Breaking The Spell" by Daniel Dannett as well as, "Atheist Universe" by David Mills if you haven't read them yet.

reply to post by sacgamer25

Hey sacgamer25,

In regards to origins and a first/last cause, I would like you to consider the idea that both creation and evolution are true by taking a close look at this post I made proving a Creative Agency.

If you are a genius level person then you are always open to new ideas and new information.

reply to post by arpgme

The earliest historians of the time didn't think that Jesus wasn't a real person and historical figure, and some of them, given their own personal bias, would have had every reason to disprove the existence of Jesus if it was true that there was no such person.

Originally posted by Philodemus
I did read your reply. Thank you for taking such time to formulate your speculations. It is an interesting hypothesis even if it uses many common fallacies. I wish you luck with the rest of the thread and with your religion.

May I suggest "Breaking The Spell" by Daniel Dannett as well as, "Atheist Universe" by David Mills if you haven't read them yet.

I didn't see where I was speculating, and it would be helpful to know the "many common fallacies" you feel I was using in putting forward that information. I would also be curious to know in what areas and to what degree you would reduce the stature of the human being in the creation i.e.: as nothing but animals, or "things", etc. Thanks.

Also I'm not talking about "religion" but an authentic spiritual experience founded on the same logical premise that Jesus clearly made use of in his evaluation as to our relationship to the Absolute Godhead, and to one another.

"Religion (and anti-religion) is a defense against having an authentic spiritual experience." (Carl Jung, parentheses added by me)

Best Regards,

NAM

reply to post by NewAgeMan


It would be hard to prove that something did not exist, it is easier to show evidence that it most likely didn't by showing inaccuracies of said person's existence.

Josephus and others writing about "Christ", well, many were called "Christ//messiah" around that time. As for mentions of "Jesus" per Josephus, he said that a group of his followers CLAIMED that he raised from the dead, not that he actually seen this , plus, he lived way after Jesus's supposed life, so the evidence is leaning towards no.

Maybe there was a Jesus, but most likely no. Or if there was, we no nothing about him as Roman Empire compiled what THEY wanted people to believe about him into a Canon (The Bible) and killed whomever did not believe.

At any rate, I love the vibe of your original post. Much better spread love than hatred, or to say only "I" deserve love and give off vibes or narcissism, so you have done well with giving/sharing/appreciating/sending loving vibes.

reply to post by sacgamer25

I have researched every scientific claim

You make some very bold claims about science. If you're as well researched and confident as you say, you should start a new thread demonstrating all this. Truly. You should be able to back it up scientifically, and you would likely get converts to your faith. Win win for you

I believe that 100% of the bible is from God

See this is why I was not accepting of this love. The source of it is wicked. If you don't think so you either have a very different view on morality than I, or you haven't read the Bible. You said you have read it, so that only leaves the one. Sorry friend, I don't agree with this version of love.

This is why I can't give you the PROOF you are looking for. You either take me at my word that I found God and love within the pages of the bible.

Right. Faith. Not reason, but faith. Okay thank you for answering my question.

I can explain more about why I believe 100% of the bible to be the truth if you are open to the possibility?

I think I am definitely open to possibilities.

The problem is you are debating 2 people who in essence cannot be debated.

But it doesn't sound like you are.

reply to post by arpgme

Here's some more as I wasn't just referring to Josephus



P.S. Thank you for your feedback and sentiment re: the rational basis for a universal love within the framework of the brotherhood of man, which is a vibe of love and a love in action that is synonymous with Christian love, whether it was reported in the Gospels of the Bible or not.