Does God love everyone? Westboro says NO

reply to post by logical7

you are assuming my belief.

No... im going by what you've previously told me...

Can God tolerate injustice?

Take a look at the state of our world....

And ask me that question again...

reply to post by NOTurTypical

I'm so tired of reading this argument. Its a false one. The Hebrew term used there which centuries ago got translated to "evil", means "calamity". I.e. earthquakes, hurricanes, et cetra.

Your post following the one I took this quote from, outlines the specifics of your point. Among the definitions was the word "woe". He brings both peace and woe. A purely loving deity could never inflict woe without experiencing the same itself. And a purely loving deity could never inflict woe through death without a piece of itself dying along with. Considering how many lives have been lost to "God", he must be mostly dead by now. Or at the very least, he's 'died' enough times, and blamed himself for such, to be uncaring and unfeeling. His psyche would be reeling from such destruction, and he would be virtually useless because he'd rather delude himself than face his actions.

This would make a lot more sense than what we've been told.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

God doesn't "send" anyone to Hell, that's a consequence of our sin.

Sorry, but you need to reread the Bible. Whether or not people choose to push "God", "God" makes the final decision.

Revelation 20:11-13 says the wicked are judged by their works and cast into the lake of fire.

Rev 11:18 God is thanked for his wrath on the workers of lawlessness. Clearly God is the one pouring out wrath and they suffer it not out of choice but because they "deserve" it.

Matthew 10:28; we are told to fear him who is able to throw both soul and body in hell.

You know, for someone who doesn't send anyone to hell, "God" sure has a lot of say in the matter. In fact, it looks like he's the only one who does. Because in every description of condemned souls, not a single soul takes delight in its predicament. Not a single soul enjoys the journey. This says that the only choice they made was to exercise their free will, and "God" didn't like it. That's why I say free will is a myth in Christianity, because you only have free will if you obey "God". Obviously, "God" only wants one type of choice from his followers. This essentially eliminates the other choice. That's not free will. You assume he wants the best, but "God" is the only one talking trash and giving orders.

In my country, we would kick his ass to the curb. But for some reason, our standards are drastically lowered in the afterlife. Hmm...now that is curious...

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Simple analogy. A state has a mandatory sentence of 5 years for armed robbery and the judge sentences a man to jail for 5 years. Is the judge to blame or the person who committed armed robbery?

That person sent themselves to jail for 5 years by their choices. Sin separates us from God, God doesn't tempt anyone to sin.

Yeah he didn't want to break your legs but you didn't pay him the extortion money, you didn't give him any choice....

Such a 'god' is worthy of only contempt, almost as much as those who praise and attempt to justify such abhorrent behaviour.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Simple analogy. A state has a mandatory sentence of 5 years for armed robbery and the judge sentences a man to jail for 5 years. Is the judge to blame or the person who committed armed robbery?

Simple response. In order for that analogy to be accurate, I'll take the liberty of adding a few details: That judge is no ordinary judge. He knew the man intimately from birth to death long before he was born, and in fact designed every second of his life ahead of time. Meaning he knew exactly when, why, and how that man would appear in his courtroom. Furthermore, at any time during the process, he had the full capability of changing any and all variables he chose, giving him the power to prevent or allow that man's crime even before he had the opportunity to commit it. But it doesn't end there! He had a hand in designing this man's character, so even the man's desire to commit the crime has its roots in the judge's own being. If the judge had decided to make the man a righteous person, or even just a decent human being, the man would never have broken the law. So if he has all of these options available to him, but in fact chose to give him all the temptations, weaknesses, and resources necessary to commit the crime, then what about the judge?

The man committed the crime. But the judge engineered it. Who, in the minds of the ATS jury, is more guilty?

"Those who have the privilege to know, have the duty to act." - Albert Einstein

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Simple analogy. A state has a mandatory sentence of 5 years for armed robbery and the judge sentences a man to jail for 5 years. Is the judge to blame or the person who committed armed robbery?

Simple response. In order for that analogy to be accurate, I'll take the liberty of adding a few details: That judge is no ordinary judge. He knew the man intimately from birth to death long before he was born, and in fact designed every second of his life ahead of time. Meaning he knew exactly when, why, and how that man would appear in his courtroom. Furthermore, at any time during the process, he had the full capability of changing any and all variables he chose, giving him the power to prevent or allow that man's crime even before he had the opportunity to commit it. But it doesn't end there! He had a hand in designing this man's character, so even the man's desire to commit the crime has its roots in the judge's own being. If the judge had decided to make the man a righteous person, or even just a decent human being, the man would never have broken the law. So if he has all of these options available to him, but in fact chose to give him all the temptations, weaknesses, and resources necessary to commit the crime, then what about the judge?

The man committed the crime. But the judge engineered it. Who, in the minds of the ATS jury, is more guilty?

"Those who have the privilege to know, have the duty to act." - Albert Einstein

The Co-conspiritor; their mutual CREATOR.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Are you criticising me for not doing something you likewise haven't done?

If so, that's special pleading.

That's a good point. Very well, I will prove that evil is a creation, and that "God" created it. Assuming the Bible is a true authority, of course.

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. - Isaiah 45:7

I'm so tired of reading this argument. Its a false one. The Hebrew term used there which centuries ago got translated to "evil", means "calamity". I.e. earthquakes, hurricanes, et cetra.

What you must know about English is that it's a very very lazy language. Hebrew and Greek are extremelly precise and colorful. Examples, there are 5 different Greek words for "love", all with different meanings. And in Hebrew, there are 7 different types of praise, all different, that in English just appear as "praise".

edit on 12-2-2013 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

So by your arguement the Inuit should have written the Bible as they have 17 words for love (or more flowerly: expressions). English lazy? Tell that to Dickens or Austen, (idiots should have written those novels in early or later Greek alphabet/language).

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by logical7

 

you are assuming my belief.

No... im going by what you've previously told me...

Can God tolerate injustice?

Take a look at the state of our world....

And ask me that question again...

the world situation equally denies your idea of LOVING God.
I meant ultimately, but again you dont believe in Judgement day. Ok lets just say God is completely Just. He would pay the karma to all, so what about the excesses done against Him?
You do know Jesus pbuh talked about some being 'lowest in kingdom of Heaven' why? If God loves everyone equally?
The idea was for ones who broke the least commandments, the 1st is One God and then no images and so on, and he was talking jewish commandments not just the 10 however thats not the point.
So God will judge.
I can also exclaim "how can God be partial to some children!!!"?
And this was for breaking 'least' commandment?
What about The greatest one? Also Jesus warned of eternal damnation for blasphemy against Holy Ghost.
The parables by him of burning the trees that dont give fruits.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


English is a very lazy language compared. Greek is absurdly rigid and precise. Heck, verbs alone need to meet 5 conditions to be used in a sentence.

That's why exegesis matters.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


In that analogy, the judge IS the creator. The one judging. I don't think I could have been clearer in my explanation using your analogy. The judge is just as guilty as the criminal.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

English is a very lazy language compared. Greek is absurdly rigid and precise. Heck, verbs alone need to meet 5 conditions to be used in a sentence.

That's why exegesis matters.

No wonder the Greeks have ooh oh so fallen out of their original state of democracy diplomacy, philosophy and architectural know how. What the heck happenned, they tampooned their own economy are a totally bankrupt society. No thing more to add there to further along the human race. Xerxes should have overthrown when the chance was available. Perhaps the Greeks used their secret weapon: bombing invading army with absurdly rigid and precise verbs (using the super secret 5 conditions). Always wondered why the Spartans won.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


Non sequitur.

The collapse of the Greek economy had nothing to do with unfunded social programs, it had nothing at all to do with the nuances and intricacies of Koine Greek.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

Non sequitur.

The collapse of the Greek economy had nothing to do with unfunded social programs, it had nothing at all to do with the nuances and intricacies of Koine Greek.

It was all the fault of the crafty Kronos/Crete islanders.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


Please address my previous post.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

In that analogy, the judge IS the creator. The one judging. I don't think I could have been clearer in my explanation using your analogy. The judge is just as guilty as the criminal.

edit on 12-2-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

No the creator of the Judge and the criminal is the villian. The Judge and the criminal were afterthoughts, they were the biochemical devices set in motion to elicit emotion, create drama within the world they existed in. Think about it, another hanging Judge, Hangs a criminal. Big specktiCal, all the folks bored and near town come driving the horse and buggy to witness a carnival event. The Hangman is God standing on the scaffold wearing the hood and holding the rope.

He will get the Judge later playing poker accusing "YOU SIR CHEAT" a single shot PP3 Walther from future times under the table to the belly. The Judge and Judged are the nulified parts of an elaborate equation, by their Creator God this new creation: distraction.

reply to post by logical7


A parent who is partial to just one child is a poor parent. I dare you to find me anyone who says otherwise. Your post is completely illogical because I've seen that kind of "love"...those parents usually got their kids removed and put in better homes.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


You didn't address my response to your analogy. Are you tired of being outwitted, or do you still have an ace up your sleeve?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You didn't address my response to your analogy. Are you tired of being outwitted, or do you still have an ace up your sleeve?

You didn't address mine. You invented your own version of mine and then proceeded to criticise the version you invented and attributed to me.

reply to post by logical7


I hope English isn't your first language... and its not that you have horrible grammar... I have serious issues understanding you sometimes... but i'll try my best

the world situation equally denies your idea of LOVING God.

This world has a God and he/she/it is not on our side... nor is he/she/it the Father of Creation

I meant ultimately, but again you dont believe in Judgement day.

Perhaps you shouldn't assume.... because your assumptions are just as bad as your grammar...

Judgement comes for everyone...

Ok lets just say God is completely Just. He would pay the karma to all, so what about the excesses done against Him?
You do know Jesus pbuh talked about some being 'lowest in kingdom of Heaven' why? If God loves everyone equally?

Just because God loves all his children equally... does not mean all of them are equal in their actions... or lack there of...

The idea was for ones who broke the least commandments, the 1st is One God and then no images and so on, and he was talking jewish commandments not just the 10 however thats not the point.
So God will judge.

Whaaaaaat??!?!? :bnghd:

I can also exclaim "how can God be partial to some children!!!"?
And this was for breaking 'least' commandment?

Sorry man... You have to use English when you talk to me... I don't even know what that was...

What about The greatest one? Also Jesus warned of eternal damnation for blasphemy against Holy Ghost.

According to NuT we can't blaspheme the holy spirit... which I disagree with... Perhaps you might take that up with him... trying to understand your typing is starting to hurt my eyes

The parables by him of burning the trees that dont give fruits.

Right... those are parables...

And by the way.... when Jesus spoke of the greatest and the least in the kingdom, he was speaking of people that are selfish and selfless

Think on that for a while