Doctors kill 2,450% more Americans than all gun-related deaths combined

Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by 2manyquestions

 

Guns can and do save lives as well. That's why you see cops carrying guns.

NO you have cops carrying them because of your culture. Here in the UK most cops do not carry them yet they save lifes.. Really there are other ways to make yourselves feel manly if you need to. We manage just fine over here in the UK without guns..

That's your take on it and you're entitled to your opinions. Nobody is forcing guns on you, we'd just like to keep ours over here.

reply to post by 2manyquestions


Luckily your politicians do not see it that way...

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by 2manyquestions

 

My argument is that people are outraged by the number of gun deaths, but don't even realize that what's really killing them receives no attention, because it doesn't meet a political agenda.

I think they are outraged because violence committed with guns involves an intent to harm, maim, or kill. They go to see the Dr. on their own accord, and do so by choice knowing the Dr isn't intending to harm, maim, or kill them. There is a giant chasm of difference here.

They should be outraged about the violence, but their energies need to be redirected elsewhere. Gun violence is the result of failed education, corruption, economic policies and sometimes bad prescriptions, not of gun ownership. Gun ownership and the 2nd amendment is precisely in place to protect us from people who would do us harm with those same weapons.

But like you said, this spin on a dire issue into one of gun control is a political agenda.

If the author's argument was to shed light on an atrocity committed by the medical profession, he could of presented his facts and proved his argument, but "because it doesn't meet a political agenda," he didn't, and instead chose to add unnecessary fuel to an unnecessary fire. And people buy it.

How this is a gun-control issue or equates to guns in any way is beyond comprehension. Why aren't we talking about the very real issue of how ridiculous and dangerous American healthcare is? Do you think the author would go that route with the facts he just presented?

What the author wants to argue and how he/she presents that argument is up to him/her. I'm simply making mine.

Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by 2manyquestions

 

Luckily your politicians do not see it that way...

What do you think we need the guns for? Precisely to protect us from these individuals. Why do you think they want to take them away?

reply to post by 2manyquestions


Thank you for your reply and I think I can understand your thinking. How are guns going to protect you from the likes of Obama and his military machine. They can kill you with the push of a button. What good is a gun against a missle or a drone or something.

Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by 2manyquestions

 

Thank you for your reply and I think I can understand your thinking. How are guns going to protect you from the likes of Obama and his military machine. They can kill you with the push of a button. What good is a gun against a missle or a drone or something.

A gun is better than nothing. I guess I could throw rocks at them, but I'd prefer a gun. If such a time were to come, I'd like to take a few of my enemies with me rather than die without a fight. The 2nd amendment wanted the people to have the ability to fight off tyrannical Governments. I don't think they could have ever dreamed of the type of weapons our Government possesses these days. Despite being outgunned, if every citizen of age were to rise up against the Government with a simple rifle, I don't think anything would save them short of blowing the entire country to bits.

this new's doesn't surprise me one bit.
this is why i wait till i think im gonna die before i go to a doctor...cause if i do die then i wont hold a afterlife death grudge on the doctor

Something to think about is this.
When someone points a gun in my direction, I expect them to kill me.
When I go to my doctor, I expect seven years and countless hours practicing would make them the opposite.

My Mother in law went her doctor for 8 months complaining about problems. The doc kept saying it was stress, began giving her pills etc.

When she began showing symptoms like she had a stroke, we took her to another doc. In 30 seconds she diagnosed a brain tumor.

90 days later she was dead. If the first doctor had looked instead of shunting her off, she would still be here.

Death by apathy

Bang...she's dead.

Originally posted by winterkill
90 days later she was dead. If the first doctor had looked instead of shunting her off, she would still be here.

You don't know this. Your just assuming it to bolster your argument.

The doctor who operated on her said that if she had been properly diagnose at the beginning it could have been removed.

Is that good enough.

reply to post by winterkill


What you bring up is a serious problem that and one that is being looked in to. Just like with any job, doctors experience burnout. There is no malice on the doctor's part. It is simply the product of going into the same job year after year. It can be even worse for doctors since they may experience tragedy on a regular basis. After a while they can stop caring. In fact if doctors had the same work ethic of your average office worker we'd probably see many more mistakes on their part. There are plenty of researchers trying to find a way to counter burnout but at the same time it almost seems like we demand the impossible from our health care workers.

reply to post by winterkill

Why would you take the word of another killer?

That is how the OP comes off and now your saying they can be taken at their word. That is the problem with the thread. It isn't black or white.

Originally posted by fnpmitchreturns
reply to post by daskakik

 

I wish that were true ...... It is not one in millions either ... I have seen 5-6 other cases even without looking ..... keep telling yourself that ..... you sound like the head nurse we tried to have fired ... she dealt with people so long she treated them like a bag of potatoes ....... I could also talk about my grandmother ......

FACT ... in 1999 between 44000 and 92000 were killed in medical mistakes ......

www.thecommonwealthfund.com... 30_Bleich_errors%20pdf.pdf

edit on 5-2-2013 by fnpmitchreturns because: non working link

How many were saved due to good medicine?

Have you performed the experiment I presented on page 2 of this thread, I suspect that you haven't. Please perform the experiment, and report back with your results. If time is of the essence, then shorten the experiment to 10 doctor visit/self-inflicted gunshot wounds.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
Will more people live if no one ever went to the Dr.? ........

Actually, there is considerable evidence that the answer to this question is a resounding yes...

www.jonbarron.org...

From the above linked article:

"Total up all the above numbers and add them to the aforementioned "official" count and you find that deaths from adverse reactions to drugs may number as high as 700,000 a year. (Actually, former FDA Commissioner David Kessler estimated in a speech given in 1993 that fewer than 1 percent of all doctors report injuries and deaths following the administration of prescription drugs -- which, if true, would make 700,000 an incredibly conservative estimate.) Now, combine those 700,000 deaths with the number of people who die from misdiagnosis, inappropriate treatment, secondary infections received in hospitals, or just plain physician error, and the startling fact you're left with is that modern medicine, despite all the great things it may have accomplished, is arguably the single leading cause of death in the United States."

So, according to the former FDA commissioner, the numbers on the NaturalNews article are extremely low - the single largest number on the article was dealing directly with 'adverse reactions to drugs', and the former FDA commissioner said that "fewer than 1% of all doctors report injuries and deaths following the administration of prescription drugs", which means the estimated 700,000 a year figure (which itself is 7 TIMES the number quoted in the OP article) is actually probably considerably higher, possibly by even an order of magnitude or more.

There is also a reference to the few cases that have been documented where doctors actually went on strike, and death rates plummeted. Since this happens only rarely, it is difficult to point to any of the few cases where it did happen as authoritative, but using a little logic based on the facts that are incontrovertible (as above), yes, more people would live (longer and better) lives if they didn't go to the average modern doctor (brainwashed by the pharmaceutical/industrial complex).

On the other hand, a really good doctor who educates himself in natural methods of healing will actually save lives and dramatically increase the quality of life for their patients.

Modern medicine is good for one thing, and one thing only: TRAUMA treatment. There is nowhere I'd rather be than a modern emergency room if I suffer some kind of physical damage/trauma.

Personally, I do think it is a bit silly to compare death by modern medicine to guns - just as silly (and disingenuous) as citing the number of 'gun deaths per year' statistic without clarifying that in general, 2/3 of those are suicides, and a large percentage of the rest are gang-on-gang related.

These threads are so moronic. Why do gun owners not see that comparing guns, to cars, doctors and other such crap does not make them equal.

Cars and Doctors are usually 99% an accident ...guns on the other hand...when being used...the outcome is what was intended...DEATH.

SEE THE DIFFERENCE.

Omg, every year there is a thread on the exact same topic.


Medicine always has a risk, and the risk is higher for sick people. So if you're already bound for death or something close to death, it's often difficult to attribute it to doctors

I have a strange feeling that this information will not be in the mainstream news.

great point, but we wouldnt get rid of all doctors because of this.

Quack science. Quack research. It's all so silly trying to tie guns in with medicine. Doctors tend to sew people up as a result of guns. The medical profession deal with the consequences of the gun culture.

I would love to see the peer reviewed research that indicates that doctors kill 783,936 people a year (in the USA) – that’s perhaps 30% of the total number of deaths in the US.

My alarm bells started going off when the author started blabbering on “vaccines, chemotherapy and pharmaceuticals”, like drugs and modern medicine is designed to kill people. Perhaps the author would just prefer homeopathy and faith as the cure-all or that we return to medicine of the early 20th century when (a) people did not live as long (b) there was higher rates of infant mortality (c) the leading cause of death was pneumonia or influenza, followed by tuberculosis.

Lucky for the TB vaccine!

Regards

The information your posting about doctors killing people is that through misdiagnosis? Or just dying at surgery are you implying these people would be ok but the doctor has specifically done something which has resulted in a death? It's not clear. In Britain there are minimal deaths from guns our police do not even have guns! Well specially trained officers do but you can go a lifetime without seeing one. There are far more avoidable gun related deaths in America and citizens do not need guns it's as simple as that! Problem is American citizens will never be disarmed now as they feel they need them for 'protection' which in a sense is true I don't have a gun in the uk even though I could own one but if I moved to America first thing I'd do is buy a gun if I could because so many people have access to guns even mentally unsound people by the sound of it. Why do American citizens oppose gun control? Here if I wanted a gun I have to keep it padlocked in a cabinet so it's secure, it must not be loaded and ammunition must be kept a safe distance away from the weapon also the police inspect your property every few months and it takes literally years for you to be approved of a license even after all this you can only posses a shotgun lol. Nobody in their right mind in America needs automatic weapons. Surely gun control equals safer America? Less avoidable deaths and being able to sleep knowing the chance of being shot is dramatically lower or is this a too simplistic idea? Any thoughts would be welcome as I'm intrigued to know