Yahweh = Satan. They have you worshiping evil.

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


However, The Planet Earth IS round, approximately, close to an ideal sphaire, isn't it?



www.nasa.gov...

reply to post by BlowinSmoke


So Yahweh is the only possible god there can be and since we don't believe in him we believe there is no god? Way to assume.

Or we could just accept the fact that it's nothing more than a story, and it's not even a good story.

Originally posted by ezwip
Or we could just accept the fact that it's nothing more than a story, and it's not even a good story.

Story or not, its true, if you bother to do the research.

Wow... this is quite the mind f*ck. Very interesting from OP!

Maybe this is one of the reasons Freemasons worship Lucifer. They say Lucifer is light, that's what I've heard. But I hear a lot of things, and usually they completly contradict eachother.

Anyway thanks for some food for my mind.

It's threads like these that are a true tell tell sign how confusing and contradicting the bible is. The question is, why would the bible be written in such a way as to cause so many different interpretations. People use it to justify killing, judge others. and control the masses. Why would God want to confuse his followers? It has done exactly that. Just look at how many different religions have spawned because of it.

I personally believe in a supreme being, but I question why he would want to cause such divisions among different faiths. I really don't think you can believe God created the earth in 7 days when it has been proven there are billions of planets and stars out there. It seems that we are rather conceited to think God only focused his creation on the earth when there is absolute proof he didn't.

Nobody knows anything, and it's all based upon faith in stories that were written thousands of years ago. When man has even edited the bible to his liking also speaks volumes. You have to wonder if the truth was really known, would the world collapse around the people who put so much faith and time into their religion? Than again, would they even acknowledge it?

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


I believe your interpretation of Genesis is flawed. The story is allegorical to the agricultural revolution which occurred around 12,000 years ago. Written from the perspective of the "hunter gatherer" who were being driven out of their traditional grazing lands by farmers.

The nomadic herders saw static agriculture as defying the natural laws of God. Eating from the tree of knowledge is allegorical to man's fall from grace when he took up farming. Farming requires that all competition for food sources be eliminated. In other words, after eating from the tree of knowledge, man was now deciding what lives and what dies based upon his own needs. This new philosophy of waging war on nature survives to this day and is ingrained into our current mythos. Most aren't aware of it because it saturates modern society.

Man is the only creature that seeks to eliminate all competition for resources; this directly violates the laws of nature and therefore violates God's laws. God didn't become "angry" with humans. On the contrary, humans were allowed free will to defy God's laws; God allowed this as honoring His promise of free will; like a parent allowing their children to make mistakes on their own in order to learn the lesson.

On a personal note to the OP:

Be careful what you proclaim. There are consequences for every action.

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


Another conspiracy solved by a poster on ATS. Thank god for this site.

I have a question for you then, if god is the Devil, what do you consider the illuminati?

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


Another conspiracy solved by a poster on ATS. Thank god for this site.

I have a question for you then, if god is the Devil, what do you consider the illuminati?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

John 10

8 All who ever came before me were thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not listen to them.

Notice how he says that ALL who came before him. All includes Yahweh, which is why he never mentioned him by name.

Or will you spin it a certain way to where "all" only means "some"?

I think Jesus was referring to the same ones that Yahweh was referring to in these scriptures...

Isaiah 1:23-26

23 Thy princes are rebellious, and companions of thieves: every one loveth gifts, and followeth after rewards: they judge not the fatherless, neither doth the cause of the widow come unto them.

24 Therefore saith the Lord, the Lord of hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Ah, I will ease me of mine adversaries, and avenge me of mine enemies:

25 And I will turn my hand upon thee, and purely purge away thy dross, and take away all thy tin:

26 And I will restore thy judges as at the first, and thy counsellors as at the beginning: afterward thou shalt be called, The city of righteousness, the faithful city.

Yahweh said that Jesus would be in control of the next government once all of his "enemies" are avenged.

Isaiah 9:6-7

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

The Bible is one of the most hypocritical pieces of literature I have ever read.... Don't get me wrong, there are beautiful pieces to it, but it really speaks out of both ends.

I mean, for example you have 1 Corinthians 13:4-5 that says
"Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs."
And we are told that God is love...

But then we are told that God is a jealous God, and He is keeping track of all our sins... And we will be judged by those sins one day.
Joshua 24:19 Joshua said to the people, "You are not able to serve the LORD. He is a holy God; he is a jealous God. He will not forgive your rebellion and your sins

Pick one... Is He patient, kind, and keep no record of wrongs? Or is he a jealous God ready to cast us into the thunderous flames of hell and keeping tabs on EVERY sin we commit?

And yes, I know, I'm quoting the Old Testament and then Jesus died for our sins... So now God is massochistic as well..? Committing sacrifice like the old pagan belief systems that Christianity so blatantly preaches against.

I REALLY think the OP could be on to something here...

So much ignorant fools.
OP says "Yahwe is Satan" and provides one sided proofs, while the proofs wich doesn't add up to his story are ignored.

OP claims how Lucifer "illuminated" Adam and Eve, once they "ate" "the forbidden fruit". However, he does not mentiones how Adam and Eve felt after becoming "illuminated by Lucifer" in the next sentence in the Bible.
They felt ashamed for their intimate sections of body (they covered themselves with leaves), they felt Fear aswell.
Is this how illuminated ones should feel? Ashamed and afraid? Fools and bunch of kids...

Originally posted by salainen

Yeah. Well, I myself have similar thoughts every now and then. eg. there may be a higher power than God, or that satan is trying to do the right thing (or more precisely, what he believes is the right thing). But saying that God in the bible is actually satan...

How does that work? In my opinion the OP posted some weird ideas, and started discussing it with people who made silly comments, he never actually replied to a post that would, in my opinion, have contributed to the discussion.

I will respond to this, to clarify my position as there seems to be some confusion among those who disagree with me. Fair enough, I did not specify this before, but will do so now.
7
Im not looking for an argument or a heated debate on whose opinion and personal interpretation of the events of the bible are correct. I respect your opinions, and have simply chosen not to attack them, even though I disagree with them and think they are illogical and flawed, as some of you certainly will see mine.

The things I did respond to were more general comments that did not pertain much to the content of the thread, and were potentially going to get way off topic. As youll see from my responses, things like someone trying to play the victim card, another who tried to associate a chosen few capitalized words out of many, with an ulterior motive, etc.

This subject is tricky, because people are simply not open to alternate ideas coming into the discussion. Thats another reason Im not getting into debates and logomachys. They are futile.

What I am looking for is a thread to express my ideas to others for them to consider, which I think many have done. What they do with those ideas, is there personal choice. If they like it, cool. If they dont, thats OK too. But I just dont feel I need to try to prove anything. There is no such thing as objective proof, anyway, thus it all comes down to a choice. That being, we will all believe what we WANT to believe, and NOTHING else; there is no certainty, and all our beliefs are just our subjective guesses to approximate the objective reality that we cannot see.

But that is a completely different thread which the premise of would be aggressively rejected by many people anyway

Anyway, the OP is my personal interpretation of the real bible story, taking into account that history is written by the victors, everything Ive learned that really goes on in the world, and logic.

So theres my response to all your refutations

-

ETA: I do appreciate everyones responses though, and if asked to clarify anything or my thoughts regarding some aspect of the OP, Ill gladly respond for your further consideration.

tl;dr: Im just not looking to get into arguments. Id rather just exchange ideas with those receptive.

I fully agree with the OP in his/her opinion. There is no point in even discussing religion with some people. They are beleiving something because "THEY WANT TO", not because they have seen something or it was proven to them, its simply that they WANT to beleive that stuff and no proof of plageurism or anything else will change their minds. Yes, it kinda sucks being around so many people posessed bye a lie, but they WANT to be lied to because they WANT to beleive those lies. Thats my take on it. I also stay away from uber religious people that say things like "i dont beleive that" when you show them fact but totally
"beleive" something that lacks any evidence at all except stories. "SUCKER" is the word I use for those people. Also lots of people have different ideas about life and how it began, I have mine and it includes another after life consciousness that is valued on intent and merit. I dont beleive any book has anything to do with that. Maybe some of the stuff in the Bibles are true such as historical events, but when they say GOD showed up, I find it absurd that an ALMIGHTY CREATOR of EVERYTHING would actually show up is absurd. The idea of that happening if ya think about it is ridiculous, and WHY is it OK for someone to claim to be GOD over 2000 years ago but the current to be GOD claimers are INSANE. Why was it ok then but not now?

Before Lucifer's "ILLUMINATION"

And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.

After Lucifer's "ILLUMINATION"

And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. 9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? 10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.

OP, is this how Illumination looks like?

reply to post by christina-66


Ya! I know.. But to understand the implications for Moses. He who pushed God to give him something that the Hebrew culture required in order to give credibility to the message Moses was sent to deliver. It was Moses' way of asking God what his attitude was towards his people. As 'YHWH' can also be interpreted as "I make to be whatever comes to be", it defines Him as the Creator of all. This second definition bares more sense for the Isrealites of that era than the common 'I Am'. It affirms what they actually believed was the nature of God as the all powerfull and that, through His promise to Moses, He would always be present with His peoples.


Now I ask again, re-read Exodus 3, 1-15, where God shares his name which humanity for the first time. Now, in light of what I shared above and the following note, tell me again how YHWH is 'Satan'.

As suggested reading please refer to John Murray's 'The Problem of God', Yale University Press. This publication, although dated in the 1960s, is still a great source for those questionning the who, what, where and how of Gods presence amongst us in this post-modern, secular age.

Originally posted by jazztrance
I fully agree with the OP in his/her opinion, except I dont beleive any of those humanized dieties exist so kinda take a different stance, but I agree with what was posted.

So you think that God from the Bible is Satan?

Can you explain then, why did the actuall God (masked in serpent), according too you and OP's theory made Adam and Eve feel ashamed and afraid?

I'm looking forward to your reply

reply to post by CaticusMaximus


What if the Devil's greatest trick was playing God.

Awesome thread friend, indeed you have connected with a lot of people through your words. No doubt a sensitive question/subject that has lingered in the human psyche for ages.

Originally posted by Fichorka

Can you explain then, why did the actuall God (masked in serpent), according too you and OP's theory made Adam and Eve feel ashamed and afraid?

Isn't that one of God's main rules? To FEAR HIM?

reply to post by Josephus


Well said! A Star for you...