The titles of Allah and the Bible.

reply to post by logical7

We will disagree on the theological differences in christianity and islam.
Do you believe we have the same One God?

NO!

Christians believe Jesus is God. They worship a creation (Jesus) instead of the Creator.

Thx for you work scorpion. You've gotten yourself my awsome super-awesome superstar for your OP.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
Christians believe Jesus is God. They worship a creation (Jesus) instead of the Creator.

:shk: Wrong (as usual)

John 1:1 "In the beginning was The Word, and The Word was with God, and The Word was God.

John 1:3 - Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

Colassians 1:16 - For everything was created by Him, in heaven and on earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him

John 1:10 - He was in the world and though the world was made by Him, it knew Him not.

1 Corinthians 8:6 - yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.


Jesus is God and therefore Jesus is creator.
Christians worship Jesus and therefore they worship the creator.

Originally posted by logical7
Do you believe we have the same One God?

Definately not.

Muslims have their Allah.
Jews have their 'I Am' - but refuse to acknowledge that Jesus said 'I am'
Christians have their Trinity - Father, Son and Holy Spirit ... all three are aspects of 'I Am'



And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. Exodus 3:14

Jesus said unto them, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM". John 8:58


Jesus .. who said He came down from Heaven and who said that he existed even before Abraham .. claimed the name of God ... 'I AM'

reply to post by FlyersFan


John 1:1, 1:3, 1:10 - Thats not Jesus speaking. Nobody even knows who wrote the "Gospel according to John"

Colassians 1:16 & 1 Corinthians 8:6 - Those are the words of a man who never met Jesus.

So... no. Jesus never said he was God as you believe.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. Exodus 3:14

Jesus said unto them, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM". John 8:58

Jesus said he came down from heaven and he gave his name as the same as Gods name - IAM. It's there. Learn to deal with it. Your choice - cling to the contradicting stories made up by Muhammad 600+ years after the events ... or accept the first hand eyewitness historical accounts written by people who were actually there (the Christian Gospels).

Whatever. :shk:

reply to post by FlyersFan

Jesus said unto them, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM". John 8:58

Jesus also said

"Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except for one—God "

'I'm ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God."

The Lords prayer that he taught was addressed to "The Father in heaven", not to himself.

I can go on and on and show how Jesus made it clear that God was a separate entity.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


He made it clear that the Father was a separate entity. He likewise rebuked satan and told him that God alone should he worshipped, yet accepted worship from numerous people without rebuking them. Psalms says God alone knows the heart of a man, yet Jesus displayed several times that He knew what a person was thinking without them speaking it. He healed the sick, raised the dead commanded angels and demons, walked on water, as well as commanding raging violent storms to be still and the forces of nature immediately obeyed. When the temple guard and the security forces for the high priest came to arrest Him they asked if He was Jesus, when He announced "I AM" all 3-400 men fell back on the ground and were pinned not being able to stand until Christ allowed it.

He was the Son of God. Man and Deity in the flesh.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

Colassians 1:16 & 1 Corinthians 8:6 - Those are the words of a man who never met Jesus.

Read Acts 9.

Acts 9:5-6

5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

John 1:1, 1:3, 1:10 - Thats not Jesus speaking. Nobody even knows who wrote the "Gospel according to John"

Colassians 1:16 & 1 Corinthians 8:6 - Those are the words of a man who never met Jesus.

So... no. Jesus never said he was God as you believe.

The Gospel according to John was written...

by John.



Total shocker I know.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

So... no. Jesus never said he was God as you believe.

I'll give you the same answer every time I see you make this same comment.

Read John 14.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

He made it clear that the Father was a separate entity.

So, what is your explanation for "the Word WAS God" in John 1:1?

Jesus was the "angel of the Lord" in the Old Testament.

He was the one who SPOKE for God in the burning bush and everywhere else that God spoke to the people.

It was through Jesus that God was able to communicate with people at all.

This is why Jesus told everyone that he did not speak "of myself" in John 14. God spoke through him, even when he was here on earth as a human.

John 14:10

10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


The names you provided are actually titles. Like I am a "Miss" or "Ms." or "Mam" or "Mother" or "Sister" or "Friend"...well you get the point, but those are only titles and not my actually "given name". As far as I understand the God of the Bible has many titles to include "God" but also an original name. And Allah is just a title which translates "God". So Allah as far as I understand does NOT have a name.

There are too many vital contradictions between Quran and Bible for Allah to be the same God of both.

reply to post by HoneyBe

And Allah is just a title which translates "God". So Allah as far as I understand does NOT have a name.

thats wrong. Allah is the name of God. The word for god in arabic is ilah.
As you can see in the shahada(testimony of faith)
La ilah illALLAH(no god except Allah)
also the ones you call titles are attributes of Allah. Describing Him, and only Allah deserves them. Thats the reason when someone is named after one of the attributes he is called Abd(servant of) before it.
Allah is Ar-Raheem (Most Merciful)
a man named after it would be Adur-Raheem (servant of Most Merciful)

reply to post by Deetermined

Jesus was the "angel of the Lord" in the Old Testament.

Nope.
You are concocting your own theology because Jesus said nothing about him being the angel of the Lord.
We read in Exodus 23:21...

Pay attention to him and listen to what he says. Do not rebel against him; he will not forgive your rebellion, since my Name is in him.


The Angel of the Lord was a very, very strict angel.
While Jesus was extremely patient with people.... and teaching folks to turn the other cheek and loving the enemy.

Originally posted by logical7
reply to post by HoneyBe

 

And Allah is just a title which translates "God". So Allah as far as I understand does NOT have a name.

thats wrong. Allah is the name of God. The word for god in arabic is ilah.
As you can see in the shahada(testimony of faith)
La ilah illALLAH(no god except Allah)
also the ones you call titles are attributes of Allah. Describing Him, and only Allah deserves them. Thats the reason when someone is named after one of the attributes he is called Abd(servant of) before it.
Allah is Ar-Raheem (Most Merciful)
a man named after it would be Adur-Raheem (servant of Most Merciful)

No. It is correct. La Ilah illAllah is translated as "No god except God"

Nowhere online, in books, Hadith or Quran is it ever stated what the actual name of "Allah" (God) is. In Islam, He has no name, only Titles. If you can find me proof though, I will gladly change my mind.

Hey, I have the solution! uhn?

Jesus often talked about "He who sent" me, he said. Then he was talking about God. Hahahaha, would I say to myself, go there, and then do what I told myself, like really commanding myself to do something, and then obeying myself, like in that way? aahaahahaha

One should understand by now..

reply to post by Angle


There's was a "veil" between heaven and earth.

The human side of God (Jesus) was limited without the Godhead working through him.

The same reason that Jesus said that the Holy Spirit wasn't capable of coming down to earth until he (Jesus) had ascended to heaven.

Only one aspect of himself was capable of being on earth at any one given time and the one that was on earth was given direction by the other aspects.

As a human on earth, Jesus did not know ALL things. They had to be given to him from the Godhead while he was on earth.

ETA: I'm going to have to research this answer again. The Holy Spirit obviously descended on Jesus after his baptism, and all three may have been present for that particular moment. I'll have to go back and research the possibilities as to why Jesus told his disciples (before his ascension) that the "Comforter" could only come to them if he ascended back to heaven.

reply to post by Deetermined

The same reason that Jesus said that the Holy Spirit wasn't capable of coming down to earth until he (Jesus) had ascended to heaven.

what came upon Mary and later she concieved and what descended on Jesus pbuh like a dove?
EDIT: i read you edit and had to edit, yes do research it and what about the "comforter" being the next prophet.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Yep ... and scripture clearly states that THE ANGELS FROM HEAVEN worshipped Jesus as God Incarnate. Jesus .. true God and true man.