The Dachau Massacre. The Slaughter of Nazis in Death Camps During WW2.

Riddle me this, kids... Is it possible to have a discussion about an apparent US war crime at a liberated nazi concentration camp without the left-wingers bleating about it being a pro-nazi thread or the right-wingers countering with a good dash of their ridiculous holocaust denial?

Let me succinctly summarise both viewpoints:

Left wing -

"Cool, let's make this a political thread... You're a fascist pig because you're attempting to garner sympathy for nazi soldiers who not only murdered millions of Jews, but made lampshades out of their skins, soap from their rendered body fat and also stole the gold out of their teeth. You're a bad person."

Right wing -

"Cool, let's make this a political thread... The Holocaust is all just a Zionist PSYOP designed to make you feel sorry for the Jews while they rob you blind. If you don't believe what I'm saying you're an idiot."

Events like the one in the original post will be forgotten, overshadowed by the wider issues if we are not careful.

It's a morality play. Pop quiz, hotshots - Did the German soldiers in question deserve POW status? Does the horror witnessed by the liberating US soldiers excuse these extrajudicial executions? What would you have done if you were in the US soldiers' place?

Originally posted by chishuppu
reply to post by anton74

 

Tell me about this "HATE", is it one of those things where its ok to say what you will about Muslims aka BAD GUYS, but nothing bad about Americans/NATO aka the GOOD GUYS?

"Like a religious person who can say what he wants about God or Satan and no one will question because God is all that is good and Satan is all that is bad."

I think you hit the mark right there, good and evil distorted to fit one's needs. You're either for us or against us, but who is "US"? Neither side should preach hate.

Originally posted by anton74

Originally posted by chishuppu
reply to post by anton74

 

Tell me about this "HATE", is it one of those things where its ok to say what you will about Muslims aka BAD GUYS, but nothing bad about Americans/NATO aka the GOOD GUYS?

"Like a religious person who can say what he wants about God or Satan and no one will question because God is all that is good and Satan is all that is bad."

I think you hit the mark right there, good and evil distorted to fit one's needs. You're either for us or against us, but who is "US"? Neither side should preach hate.

Its kind of hard because a lot of people take things to the heart, and we know what happens when emotions come to play, logic is thrown out the door. I just had a argument with my woman, so I know that logic and emotion don't mix.

About 4 monthes into my tour in Vietnam, I was enroute to Quang Tri from PhuBai when we came across what had apparently been an RPG attack on a small supply convoy. One US truck had been destroyed with the driver and assistant both wounded, and one attacker had been killed. His body was just a few feet off the roadway and we passed very close to it as the MPs moved us along. It looked like his head was lying in a hole filled with blood. One of the other guys asked one of the MPs what had happened and was told that the attacker had been hit by a .50cal round fired from an escort vehicle. The entire back of his head was blown out, there was no hole nor was there any of the back of his head there.
I was 19. Small town, farm boy who had seen nothing worse than a chicken beheaded or wild game dressed. I have never quite shaken that feeling of fear/fascination/disgust.
And that was NOTHING compared to what those soldiers, both German and American, the prisoners and even the local peoples had endured for YEARS leading up to this incident. I excuse no one. I blame no one. I pity all.
Thank you, DaasKapital. History should never have a veil over it. It should be there for all to see.
It is our last, best hope; to learn from the past and to use the knowledge gained to build a better, safer future.

Originally posted by chishuppu

I don't know what to think about you.

Holocaust denial is illegal in a lot of Western nations, the court can't even talk about what the case is except that you violated the law, there is no said discussion. Student scientists have debunked the whole Ziklon B thing, but got arrested and imprisoned for holocaust denial because there work showed minimal signs of ziklon b residue in the "gas chambers" so that would mean no mass gassing aka holocaust denial. He is not ignorant because he has videos and documentation of interviews with key Nazi staff back in the 70s, as well as documents from Nazi offices showing orders given to commanders.

You sir will not defeat me in this because you know nothing of the topic, give it up.

No, the "Zyklon B thing" has not been debunked. If you're referring to the Leuchter Report, that was revealed to be a farce long ago. I don't know what you mean by your comments about Irving and his videos, as all that showed was that Irving got far too close to his source material, which is a serious no-no for any trained historian. Which Irving isn't. He was shown up in a court of law as being a liar and a bad historian. His own witnesses destroyed his own case. He is not an expert. He is a fraud.

Originally posted by chishuppu

Originally posted by anton74

Originally posted by chishuppu
reply to post by anton74

 

Tell me about this "HATE", is it one of those things where its ok to say what you will about Muslims aka BAD GUYS, but nothing bad about Americans/NATO aka the GOOD GUYS?

"Like a religious person who can say what he wants about God or Satan and no one will question because God is all that is good and Satan is all that is bad."

I think you hit the mark right there, good and evil distorted to fit one's needs. You're either for us or against us, but who is "US"? Neither side should preach hate.

Its kind of hard because a lot of people take things to the heart, and we know what happens when emotions come to play, logic is thrown out the door. I just had a argument with my woman, so I know that logic and emotion don't mix.

Exactly, now is the time to subject you to propaganda. That is how it all starts.

reply to post by anton74


Emotion and ignorance, the perfect propaganda tool. I tell a lot of Americans that, for the people by the people, only the people can stop the American govt so keep them uniformed and emotional.

Neo-nazis posting on the ATS forum, trying to find ways to excuse the slaughter of 30 million victims in the concentration camps by making us feel sorry for these thugs and psychopathic animals being executed by russian and american troops.

reply to post by johncarter


Good old revisionism; the British don't exist, and extra 20 million victims for good measure. Pathetic.

Originally posted by chishuppu
how does one debunk the holocaust in a place where holocaust research is prohibited?

Where is holocaust research prohibited? care to show the exact law that prohibits it?

Originally posted by chishuppu
how does one become a "trained" historians, time machine?

Tell me sir, how does one debunk the holocaust in a place where holocaust research is prohibited?

You go to University and you get a degree. Simples!
Secondly, given the amount of evidence - eyewitness reports, aerial photographs, the evidence on the ground, the documentation, etc, etc, etc - studying the Holocaust leads to just one conclusion. That it happened. If you set out from the start to debunk it that means that you have come armed with an agenda and you are not being objective.

Originally posted by hellobruce
Where is holocaust research prohibited? care to show the exact law that prohibits it?

There's obviously a sooper seekrit conspiracy to do so. It's made up of every single reputable historian in the world and it's probably led by the Queen. That or Lord Lucan.

Originally posted by chishuppu
The David Irving trials would have told you it was a farce

The libel trial showed Irving was a farce - remember what the Judge said about irving....

Irving has for his own ideological reasons persistently and deliberately misrepresented and manipulated historical evidence; that for the same reasons he has portrayed Hitler in an unwarrantedly favourable light, principally in relation to his attitude towards and responsibility for the treatment of the Jews; that he is an active Holocaust denier; that he is anti-Semitic and racist, and that he associates with right-wing extremists who promote neo-Nazism.[

This thread, like the op's others, is just another hate the USA thread

reply to post by nottelling


Thank you!

reply to post by daaskapital


S&F What a fantastic thread and thank you for sharing it with us
There seems to be a lot of this when you start looking into it. Parts of history that not many seem to know about
I mean and and I have found many other such gems in my search, well done, its funny how truth upsets some people isnt it and I imagine you will get called some nasty names for it
oh well aye

Originally posted by MrRobertson
reply to post by daaskapital

 

S&F What a fantastic thread and thank you for sharing it with us

Thanks heaps for the kind words!

There seems to be a lot of this when you start looking into it. Parts of history that not many seem to know about

Indeed! As the saying goes; history is written by the victor. Not many people hear of these things, even though i feel that they should be taught.

I mean and and I have found many other such gems in my search, well done, its funny how truth upsets some people isnt it and I imagine you will get called some nasty names for it
oh well aye

Many people do not enjoy hearing both sides of a story...even though both sides should be taught.

Ah yes, i have been called plenty of names...not only for this thread, but others too. It doesn't worry me all to much, but to be honest it does get quite tiring seeing the same comment over and over again when you are only trying to expand people's knowledge.

Thanks again for the nice words!

Originally posted by salainen
reply to post by intrptr

 

I've never understood holocaust denial, it clearly happened, so why do they try to deny it? I don't see the point and I don't see how they can believe it.

Blog made by such people must be mostly complete rubbish.

Actually it does show the mass execution of about (apparently) 60 Dachau camp guards by American soldiers with a machine gun. That is something I didn't know. American history books don't cover stuff like that either. That interests me from a historical perspective.

I agree with you though generally. The death of millions at the hands of the Third Reich surely happened. And war sucks.

Look more closely at the photograph.
There are at least 4 soldiers laying in the ground looking up and towards the American Soldiers.
The one standing German soldier in the middle is very relaxed for someone that's about to be shot.
So does it look like an execution or just a bunch of soldiers laying around?

Originally posted by mash3d
Look more closely at the photograph.
There are at least 4 soldiers laying in the ground looking up and towards the American Soldiers.
The one standing German soldier in the middle is very relaxed for someone that's about to be shot.
So does it look like an execution or just a bunch of soldiers laying around?

looks like germans standing around or lying around being guarded.