Breaking News - Shooting at Newtown, Connecticut elementary school.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

Lanza had entered the school heavily armed. He had three guns -- two handguns and the Bushmaster .223-caliber assault rifle that he used to force his way in and kill most of his victims -- along with hundreds of bullets, at least 30 magazines per gun and extra ammunition, police said. Lanza ultimately used a handgun to kill himself, state police said, and the three guns, the rifle, a Glock 10 mm and a Sig Sauer 9 mm, were found by his body. A fourth gun, a shotgun, was found in Lanza's car outside the school, police said.

www.newsday.com...

30 mags per gun? So he was carrying 90 mags? And now the long gun in the vehicle is a shotgun? My head is starting to spin.....

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

Just providing updates at this point to see if facts start matching from here on out.

Here is the latest videodelivery.msnbc.msn.com... 64ffca7b9106/4dda96b9-290c-4e01-a645-f71f9a790cfb/0/0/95/2029753757/tdy_1_pwi_presserinfo_12121.mp4
no AR-15 in the school and 4 handguns.

This is the problem. So he put the murder weapon back in the car and carried 4 handgiuns he never used?

Originally posted by RickKilgannon

Originally posted by happyhomemaker29

Originally posted by RickKilgannon

Originally posted by happyhomemaker29
Flight/Flee Autistic?

He recalled meeting with school guidance counselors, administrators and with the boy's mother, Nancy Lanza, to understand his problems and find ways to ensure his safety. But there were other crises only a mother could solve. "He would have an episode, and she'd have to return or come to the high school and deal with it," Novia said, describing how the young man would sometimes withdraw completely "from whatever he was supposed to be doing," whether it was sitting in class or reading a book. Adam Lanza "could take flight, which I think was the big issue, and it wasn't a rebellious or defiant thing," Novia said. "It was withdrawal."

My daughter had the VERY same issues and is also a flight/flee autistic. This is looking more and more like he was autistic/aspergers and not just run of the mill shooter. I can recall numerous times where I'd be called almost 20 minutes after school started to come pick up my daughter because she tried to run away again. Or because she threw a crayon in class and was being disrupted. Schools are NOT equipped to deal with autistic kids and YET school board insist on mainstreaming them into regular schools but special classes. I'm going to say this once here and once only. Every district needs to have a special autistic school. EVERY. To meet the needs of these children. They cannot deal with special ed classrooms all the time, the teachers are not always prepared to deal with them, and the other children in the class are the ones left to deal with the damage. If you place them in a special school where the teachers are more prepared to handle them, the children have a better environment to learn. When my daughter finally entered one, she thrived like nothing else. Every district needs one.

I agree about a special school for special needs children. When I was in 10th grade in gym class, I was playing basketball & went up for a rebound & got my legs taken out from under me & landed on my head. I was knocked out for about 5 mintues & no one could find the teacher to get help because she had left the class unattended to have to deal with a special needs student. I ended up having a concussion & missed a week of school. I guess I was lucky that there was nothing else wrong.

For mild needs, I have no problem integrating them. But for moderate to severe needs, when even a doctor is telling a school they need to be separated, listen. Don't ignore, until it's too late. Sometimes, in these cases, the doctor does know best.

Glad you were eventually ok. My daughter almost seriously hurt a child, scarred him actually, over her imaginary friend. But being special needs, she's also been on the receiving end as well. She's been told don't come back to school or we'll cut your head off, principal did nothing. No punishment. Apparently that's ok to do in school. She was scared to death and I was p'od. Needless to say I threatened to sue if they didn't put her on a new bus or remove him from hers and suspend him from school. Ugh.

edit on 12/16/2012 by happyhomemaker29 because: (no reason given)

I myself dont blame the special needs kid or the teacher at all. The kid cant help it & the teacher was just trying to handle the situation. Since that happend in the school I went to any gym class that had a special needs child in it also has 2 teachers in it, in case one has to handle any type of situation. The school was afraid of a lawsuit from my parents, I think, because even though missing those days of school made me over the limit of missing 3 days making me have to take finals, they waved that & did not make me take any finals.

That was good of them to do.

Now, most schools, special ed classes have a teacher, and two teacher assistants, probably in case something like this happens the assistants can handle the class while the teacher handles the students. Also some kids have a one on one, like my daughter did most of the time. So that would make 4 adults, and usually it would be about 12 kids to a special ed class. Very small ratio, which makes it easier to handle now, I'm sure.

reply to post by happyhomemaker29


No problem.

By the way, isn't Asperger's somehow genetically linked? That's what my research seemed to indicate. I'm guessing that's why Christopher Krumm thought he developed Aspergers through his father.

See the problem? The # changed again...
Now there was no Rifle/Assullt rifle/Long gun/ BB Gun/ Painball gun anywhere inside the school. It was four handguns.

So what will change by morning?

reply to post by DarKPenguiN


I couldn't get the link to work, even after I tried copying and pasting it.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

I couldn't get the link to work, even after I tried copying and pasting it.

Weird. I will try again video.today.msnbc.msn.com...
EDIT: Hope the link worked.
Summary: Federal and State Officials have now said 4 handguns were the ONLY weapons taken inside the school and an Ar-15 found in the car- Which completely destroys the medical Examiner saying the killings were done with a Rifle- Until, they change it again tomorrow,

WTH??!!

But Lt. Paul Vance of the Connecticut State Police said Sunday that there is no timeline for the motive to be revealed, and authorities still have an "immense" number of witnesses to interview.

Read more: www.foxnews.com...

Originally posted by happyhomemaker29

Originally posted by RickKilgannon

Originally posted by happyhomemaker29

Originally posted by RickKilgannon

Originally posted by happyhomemaker29
Flight/Flee Autistic?

He recalled meeting with school guidance counselors, administrators and with the boy's mother, Nancy Lanza, to understand his problems and find ways to ensure his safety. But there were other crises only a mother could solve. "He would have an episode, and she'd have to return or come to the high school and deal with it," Novia said, describing how the young man would sometimes withdraw completely "from whatever he was supposed to be doing," whether it was sitting in class or reading a book. Adam Lanza "could take flight, which I think was the big issue, and it wasn't a rebellious or defiant thing," Novia said. "It was withdrawal."

My daughter had the VERY same issues and is also a flight/flee autistic. This is looking more and more like he was autistic/aspergers and not just run of the mill shooter. I can recall numerous times where I'd be called almost 20 minutes after school started to come pick up my daughter because she tried to run away again. Or because she threw a crayon in class and was being disrupted. Schools are NOT equipped to deal with autistic kids and YET school board insist on mainstreaming them into regular schools but special classes. I'm going to say this once here and once only. Every district needs to have a special autistic school. EVERY. To meet the needs of these children. They cannot deal with special ed classrooms all the time, the teachers are not always prepared to deal with them, and the other children in the class are the ones left to deal with the damage. If you place them in a special school where the teachers are more prepared to handle them, the children have a better environment to learn. When my daughter finally entered one, she thrived like nothing else. Every district needs one.

I agree about a special school for special needs children. When I was in 10th grade in gym class, I was playing basketball & went up for a rebound & got my legs taken out from under me & landed on my head. I was knocked out for about 5 mintues & no one could find the teacher to get help because she had left the class unattended to have to deal with a special needs student. I ended up having a concussion & missed a week of school. I guess I was lucky that there was nothing else wrong.

For mild needs, I have no problem integrating them. But for moderate to severe needs, when even a doctor is telling a school they need to be separated, listen. Don't ignore, until it's too late. Sometimes, in these cases, the doctor does know best.

Glad you were eventually ok. My daughter almost seriously hurt a child, scarred him actually, over her imaginary friend. But being special needs, she's also been on the receiving end as well. She's been told don't come back to school or we'll cut your head off, principal did nothing. No punishment. Apparently that's ok to do in school. She was scared to death and I was p'od. Needless to say I threatened to sue if they didn't put her on a new bus or remove him from hers and suspend him from school. Ugh.

edit on 12/16/2012 by happyhomemaker29 because: (no reason given)

I myself dont blame the special needs kid or the teacher at all. The kid cant help it & the teacher was just trying to handle the situation. Since that happend in the school I went to any gym class that had a special needs child in it also has 2 teachers in it, in case one has to handle any type of situation. The school was afraid of a lawsuit from my parents, I think, because even though missing those days of school made me over the limit of missing 3 days making me have to take finals, they waved that & did not make me take any finals.

That was good of them to do.

Now, most schools, special ed classes have a teacher, and two teacher assistants, probably in case something like this happens the assistants can handle the class while the teacher handles the students. Also some kids have a one on one, like my daughter did most of the time. So that would make 4 adults, and usually it would be about 12 kids to a special ed class. Very small ratio, which makes it easier to handle now, I'm sure.

Yeah Im sure it is easier now ... This happend to me back in 1995 & in my area they were just starting to put special needs kids into regular classes, I even had a couple of shop classes that had special needs kids in them. We would do all of the cutting for them & then they would sand & paint their items. It was actually pretty fun.

WOW ATS!! Great to see such an awesome active discussion about such an important tragedy!

This thread is massive! The size of this thread prevents me from reading the entire thing in my spare time. I am about to mention somrthing that may have been covered already, maybe even within several posts before mine.

If that is the case, then I do apologize for redundancy.

Also, because the enormity of this thread and a few other threads on the same topic, I am not sure which thread mentioned the 4chan posts. The post/s, authored before the attacks, claimed the shooter wrote of the subsequent massacre.

It was quickly broken by the outstanding membership here at ATS, showing why the assertions could not be real.

Like many of you, I was disgusted by the fact someone would have the nerve to write such things, as a joke or hoax, in the face of this horrifying tragedy. I thought the authors, responsible for the posts/s, should be identified and prosecuted to the full extent of the law, relative to each charge that could be pinned on them.

I am not sure how long ago the authorities addressed the issue, but I only recently heard the warning:

___-Anyone caught creating and/or providing blatant lies, in regard to varying matters linked to the terrible tragedy, would be arrested and prosecuted with the maximum punishment allowed for each criminal charge.-___

It was great to see this from law enforement, the announcement warning of potential arrest.
Maybe some people will see this and realize now is no time to be pulling pranks on the traumatized families and communites directly and indirectly effected by this massacre.

I wish they would do this to those guilty in every tragedy where morons are found trying to pull pranks and create a HOAX. Spending 6 months to 11/29 (11 months, 29 days) in jail would probably disuade many from following through with such dispicable actions.

reply to post by DarKPenguiN


MSNBC didn't list who their source was that I can tell.

The source I listed, said the information came from the state police.

From now on, if someone doesn't say specifically where they received their information, I'd take it with a grain of salt.

However, on the very first day, I read one report and one report only that said Lanza possibly had 6 guns in his possession of which 4 were registered to his mother and 2 were registered to his father.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by happyhomemaker29

 

No problem.

By the way, isn't Asperger's somehow genetically linked? That's what my research seemed to indicate. I'm guessing that's why Christopher Krumm thought he developed Aspergers through his father.

I'm not sure. In all my research into autism, would you believe that was the one of the few things I never looked into? Let me look now.

Asperger's and Genetics

Genetics as a principal cause of Asperger Syndrome Asperger described common symptoms among his patients' family members, especially fathers, and research supports this observation and suggests a genetic contribution to Asperger syndrome. Although no specific gene has yet been identified, multiple factors are believed to play a role in the expression of autism, given the phenotypic variability seen in this group of children.[1][24] Evidence for a genetic link is the tendency for Aspergers syndrome to run in families and an observed higher incidence of family members who have behavioral symptoms similar to Aspergers syndrome but in a more limited form (for example, slight difficulties with social interaction, language, or reading).[4] Most research suggests that all Autism Spectrum Disorders have shared genetic mechanisms, but Aspergers syndrome may have a stronger genetic component than autism.[1] There is probably a common group of genes where particular alleles render an individual vulnerable to developing Aspergers syndrome; if this is the case, the particular combination of alleles would determine the severity and symptoms for each individual with Aspergers syndrome.[4] Click here to read more about Genetics as a cause of Asperger's syndrome.

Maybe he read into stuff like this and starting thinking that this is where he got his asperger's and who knows, it's possible he's right.

You know what's funny. Not funny haha, but funny weird. We had our daughter genetically tested for a blood clotting disorder, breast cancer, you name it. It showed that of the 5 blood clotting disorders that ran in her father's family, she genetically tested negative for 3 out of the 5 they could test for. As for the breast cancer, they could only test for some of them, and the ones they could test for she again tested negative, but we still have to be on our guard, but you know what did NOT pop up, autism. How funny. We found out 3 years later. And we found out she was missing a chunk of her brain a year and a half later. In today's science, what we can test for and what we can't, there are still things that will pop up and surprise us. And in those surprises, are miracles, because according to doctors, my daughter's very lucky, some children are born missing the part of the brain, and will have febrile seizures, and will never walk, talk, and have to have a feeding tube the rest of their life. My daughter is healthy, and like any teenager, sometimes a pain in the rear whom I love dearly.

Stories like this just make me want to pull her close. Just like any parent though.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

MSNBC didn't list who their source was that I can tell.

The source I listed, said the information came from the state police.

From now on, if someone doesn't say specifically where they received their information, I'd take it with a grain of salt.

However, on the very first day, I read one report and one report only that said Lanza possibly had 6 guns in his possession of which 4 were registered to his mother and 2 were registered to his father.

I remember that report- It was within hours of his name being released.

Originally posted by DarKPenguiN

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

I couldn't get the link to work, even after I tried copying and pasting it.

Weird. I will try again video.today.msnbc.msn.com...
EDIT: Hope the link worked.
Summary: Federal and State Officials have now said 4 handguns were the ONLY weapons taken inside the school and an Ar-15 found in the car- Which completely destroys the medical Examiner saying the killings were done with a Rifle- Until, they change it again tomorrow,

edit on 16-12-2012 by DarKPenguiN because: (no reason given)

the gun in the car on the video does not look like an AR-15.

it is not a shotgun either, you can see a (i think even several) brass cartridge(s) (maybe a .223) being ejected when the cop unloads the gun.

so in conclusion its a bolt action rifle OR maybe a Mini14. but i didnt see a magazine in it.

A screenshot from everyone favorite movie, "The Dark Knight Rises"

Left side of the map says "Sandy Hook":



What an interesting coincidence.

Originally posted by DarKPenguiN
See the problem? The # changed again...
Now there was no Rifle/Assullt rifle/Long gun/ BB Gun/ Painball gun anywhere inside the school. It was four handguns.

So what will change by morning?

That there where no guns, it was ninja stars? No seriously, I understand the frustration. It seems every news media, every report being put out, has a different story. I sympathize with the parents.

James Mattioli, 6, his grandparents live near my adopted hometown. They left last night to be with their family to help deal with this tragedy and I'm sorry all these conflicting reports I'm sure help these parents deal.

List of Names

-- James Mattioli, Male, 03-22-06

The upstate New York town of Sherrill is thinking of Cindy Mattioli, who grew up there and lost her son James in the school shooting in Connecticut. "It's a terrible tragedy, and we're a tight community," Mayor William Vineall told the Utica Observer-Dispatch. "Everybody will be there for them, and our thoughts and prayers are there for them." James' grandparents, Jack and Kathy Radley, still live in the city, the newspaper reported.

Read more: www.foxnews.com...

Utica Observer

“We do believe that despite tragedy, something good will come of this,” Rev. William Mesmer said about people’s faith. “Time heals, and from tragedy always comes brightness. From tragedy will come a new day, and that’s what we live on.”

Originally posted by RickKilgannon


I myself dont blame the special needs kid or the teacher at all. The kid cant help it & the teacher was just trying to handle the situation. Since that happend in the school I went to any gym class that had a special needs child in it also has 2 teachers in it, in case one has to handle any type of situation. The school was afraid of a lawsuit from my parents, I think, because even though missing those days of school made me over the limit of missing 3 days making me have to take finals, they waved that & did not make me take any finals.

That was good of them to do.

Now, most schools, special ed classes have a teacher, and two teacher assistants, probably in case something like this happens the assistants can handle the class while the teacher handles the students. Also some kids have a one on one, like my daughter did most of the time. So that would make 4 adults, and usually it would be about 12 kids to a special ed class. Very small ratio, which makes it easier to handle now, I'm sure.

Yeah Im sure it is easier now ... This happend to me back in 1995 & in my area they were just starting to put special needs kids into regular classes, I even had a couple of shop classes that had special needs kids in them. We would do all of the cutting for them & then they would sand & paint their items. It was actually pretty fun.

Funny you mention that, my daughter in what she calls wood class. She LOVES it! She was surprised when I told her that back when I was in school only boys could do that, no girls allowed. LOL Girls had to do cooking and typing school. She thought that was funny. When I told her about stenographry, she asked what was THAT! I said it was a special secretary school for girls with a secret code in squiggly lines! As soon as I said code, now she wants me to teach it to her. Until I told her I can't even remember my name let alone the squiggly lines. LOL She's a funny one. She loves cooking class, sewing class, and wood class. Those are her favorites. She's 17 with severe MR of 50. Between the autism and missing part of her brain, she's closer to about 7 on a good day 5 on a bad.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

MSNBC didn't list who their source was that I can tell.

The source I listed, said the information came from the state police.

From now on, if someone doesn't say specifically where they received their information, I'd take it with a grain of salt.

However, on the very first day, I read one report and one report only that said Lanza possibly had 6 guns in his possession of which 4 were registered to his mother and 2 were registered to his father.

Were they all stored at mom's and did MSM say anything about them being locked away safely? Just curious. I didn't see anything about and was wondering if anyone else had.

Originally posted by Flow101
The two things I got from this devastating incident:
1) There's something that NEEDS to be done about the guns, USA is just too gun crazy and sht like this will continue to happen if guns are so easy to get.

Wrong. Criminals do not follow gun laws NOW. You will only succeed in disarming law abiding people creating more helpless victims.

ok after watching the video more, i have decided the long gun in the car is an autoloading shotgun. looks kinda like a Mossberg 930 special purpose. something like this.

www.mossberg.com...

which is what the police just said on CNN, (a shotgun in the car)

www.cnn.com...#/video/us/2012/12/16/ct-shooting-350p-presser-shooter-id-weapon-info.cnn