Hamas Can Never be a Peace Partner

The key to fighting your enemies lay in understanding them - their motivations, sources, etc.

Meshaal is a product of his age, a brainwashed automaton fed with lies and experiences to justify his hatred of jews since young.

As an impressionable youth, he did not have an easy life, living in the war torn state that was the British Mandate Palestine and later arab soldiers from neigbouring states fighting in that war torned land, and being displaced by them in what was supposed safe areas in arab refugees camps but were only deathtraps were all hope ends with no society progress improvements such as education, health, etc.

The idleness only breed hatred against whomever that the refugee camp folks and authority fed them with - naturally the jews.

Hating and killing jews is the only thing that keeps him alive till now. If he could, he would have grab a rifle or bomb and head to Tel Aviv this moment to do his task today as he had done while in his youth, but he knows that alone, he fights a lost cause.

Thus he needs more crazed and hashish drug addicts to join his quest, and looking broader, to get the sympathy of naive innocent palestinians and worldwide arabs to join his quest to genocide all jews.

He has no god in his heart, for hatred only burns in that place, and have no compulsion to horrendously make use of Islam - a religion of peace - to gain followers to his selfish course, mis - interpretating the Koran where it suits his purpose.

He cares not if any of his followers, or innocent palestinians dies. He cares not if Palestine becomes a state or lay in ruins. His hatred gives the ability to produce crocodile tears on demands, or words of misinterpretated religious pithys meaningless mouthed to fool the innocents.

Lying comes naturally to him, for he is no longer a human being, but a cunning animal hell bent on the destruction of jews which he believes was the cause of his sufferings and his reason to live.

He, the leader of a terrorist organisation, represents what Hamas truly is.

'Thou shalt not kill' & 'vengence is mine', said God. His words carry far-sighted wisdom, for he knew what would have happened if mankind takes the law unto their own hands instead of the society's leader - an eye for an eye will only leave the world blind.

The bloodshed must end at some point and now. Vengence solves nothing, and does not bring the dead back to life, or return one's life back to the past. We cannot change the past, but we can still change the future. The living must be allowed to live in peace.

May muslims and innocent palestinians know who they are voting for, working with and supporting.

Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by snapperski

 

Agreed Hamas is loathsome, but so is Netanyahu Likud party. Both have right wing extremist Idologies.

Don't you think it's Hamas' extremism and the likelihood of them winning a majority in a new Palestinian state that motivates Likud's refusal to stop building settlements?

Think of it from both sides. This isn't a game. If Israel plays by Hamas' rules, that could turn into a second holocaust for them.

The holocaust card has been played enough don't you think? And Israel really has no right to cry it when it is acting like the country that caused it.

It's the theft of land that keeps the settlements building not Hamas.

Israeli supposed 'theft' of land for settlement building is just another pathetic excuse by Hamas and genocidal supporters to kill all jews.

That few kilometres of landspace will not make Israel any bigger. The bigger issue one should ask is why would Israel do such a thing?

As long as the palestinian REFUSED to sit down, negotiate for peace and end their policy of death to jews, the west bank and gaza is still technically the land owned by Israel when the foolish palestinians who abandoned their lands for believing that their arab brothers will kick all jews into the sea during those wars.

It never happened. The arabs instead were dealt with decisive routing and ending up with palestinian refugees on their hands, which they mistreated and pushed blame onto the jews for the cause.

However, Israel had already given back both west bank and gaza to the palestinian for SELF RULE in return for a lasting peace treaty which never happened, as Hamas insisted on the precondition of death to all jews before they would even consider sitting down negotiations.

Hamas meant their words, and continue with their genocide of BOTH jews and palestinians even though given self rule, insisting on war instead of healing and building up Gaza with social infrastructure.

Thus the reason for blockades and trade restrictions, as Hamas had proven that instead of using world's aid donation to build up social infrastructure, it spent on ammunitions, weapons of war, troops and funding of suicide bombers.

So long as Hamas and their supporters continue to act as spoilt brats, refusing to come to realities, demanding for genocide of both innocent jews and palestinians, that land still belongs to Israel who will equally be brutal if fight is what Hamas wants.

May Hamas and their supporters grow up, sit down for negotiations, end the death to jews policy, sign a lasting peace treaty and independence for Palestine will come, which will not only be voted by the whole world, but by even Israel.

Continue with fights and mischief, so too will Israel. It's high time the stupidity ends. Only innocents on both sides and worldwide suffers.

reply to post by sonnny1


If you really back what you said here then by all rights you should feel the same way about Israel as well because they have committed terrorist attacks and then later rewarded the terrorist for it.

Lavon Affair

In March 2005, Israel publicly honored the surviving operatives, and President Moshe Katsav presented each with a certificate of appreciation for their efforts on behalf of the state, ending decades of official denial by Israel

Avraham Stern

Menachem Begin

Yitzhak Shamir

It's funny how Israel complains about terrorist but has no problem voting them into office.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Israeli supposed 'theft' of land for settlement building is just another pathetic excuse by Hamas and genocidal supporters to kill all jews.

Oh sure the people that have lived there for generations just decided to Israel bulldoze their homes and give the land away. And Hamas really wants to kill all Jews that's why their rockets don't carry explosive warheads.

That few kilometres of landspace will not make Israel any bigger. The bigger issue one should ask is why would Israel do such a thing?

A few kilometers bigger = bigger it's simple math and still equals theft of land. Like Benny said they want to regain their "biblical homeland".

As long as the palestinian REFUSED to sit down, negotiate for peace and end their policy of death to jews, the west bank and gaza is still technically the land owned by Israel when the foolish palestinians who abandoned their lands for believing that their arab brothers will kick all jews into the sea during those wars.

Israel has walked away from the peace table more than Palestine has and Clinton says they are the ones that killed the peace process.
Bill Clinton: Netanyahu killed the peace process
Also annexing land by force is illegal under international law. So no it's technically not Israel's land.

However, Israel had already given back both west bank and gaza to the palestinian for SELF RULE in return for a lasting peace treaty which never happened, as Hamas insisted on the precondition of death to all jews before they would even consider sitting down negotiations.

Israel broke this treaty as soon as they signed because they never honored it. They never withdrew from occupied lands like they were supposed to.

Thus the reason for blockades and trade restrictions, as Hamas had proven that instead of using world's aid donation to build up social infrastructure, it spent on ammunitions, weapons of war, troops and funding of suicide bombers.

Israel targets the infrastructure so it can control Gaza better. And in case you haven't noticed Israel has been stealing money from Palestine also. Looks like all the billions Israel receives just isn't enough for them.

So long as Hamas and their supporters continue to act as spoilt brats, refusing to come to realities, demanding for genocide of both innocent jews and palestinians, that land still belongs to Israel who will equally be brutal if fight is what Hamas wants.

Israel is demanding something that doesn't belong to them so who is acting like the spoiled brat? Looks like you need a dose of reality as well.

May Hamas and their supporters grow up, sit down for negotiations, end the death to jews policy, sign a lasting peace treaty and independence for Palestine will come, which will not only be voted by the whole world, but by even Israel.

Israel could use your advice as well.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Both the rulling government in Israel as well as in Palestine must be removed and replaced with proper moderate governments that actually represent the people of both nations.

Israel should work with the opposition party in Palestine to strenghten it's position that's the only thing I can see that would help them.

~Tenth

Yeah, we see how well that's working in Syria and Egypt right now.

As long as there are Muslim extremists, it doesn't matter what kind of moderate government you try to put into place.

Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
reply to post by dontreally

 

This thread is dedicated to those credulous believers who think Hamas has "evolved" into a potential peace partner.

well, i certainly am not one of them, and actually agree with the TITLE of the OP
not the spin you're giving it.

because:

Hamas is a Creation of Mossad
globalresearch.ca...

How Israel Helped to Spawn Hamas -
online.wsj.com...


Ron Paul - Israel Created Hamas 01-09-09 - YouTube
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb3vF6Vcjr0


Mossad Created Hamas”A Story You Must Read, with photos”
[ Just like the CIA Created Al-Qaeda, the Mossad Created Hamas]
______beforeitsnews/israel/2012/07/mossad-created-hamasa-story-you-must-read-with-photos-2387777.html


enjoyingthejourney.blogspot.com...

By the way, who "spawned" all of those terrorist organizations that we see in Syria right now?

Are you going to blame that on Israel too?

When are some of you going to wake up to the history between the Sunnis versus the Shiites?

reply to post by buster2010


I can easily take apart every phrase you used in your justification for the genocide upon jews, equally with one liners.

But what purpose would that have serve? Nothing.

As long as you refuse to accept realities, see issues only upon one side and attempt to cast any israeli act as justifications for the slaughter of jews, only innocents on both sides will die..

Step back, calm your mind, study indepth and think issues rationally ON BOTH sides, and truths will dawn upon you, as long as you still posses a moral compass and fear not the pain that truths often brings.

I do not seek to change your mind. It's only your life and no one else can live it except you. Delusions are comfortating, so too blind hatreds a fuel to live by, but realities are truths that one will have to eventually face one day. Better the pain now so as to be ablet to help change events, or face deep sorrow and regrets when events goes beyond all control.

If Arab / Muslim nations really wanted to "wipe Israel off the map," here's how I think they should go about it:

1. Immediately renounce and denounce all violence against Israel. Make it clear to their people that any attacks against Israel will result in the offenders being turned over to the Israeli authorities. If necessary, give Israel a few scapegoats if the real perpetrators can't be found. Let the scapegoats know that they are martyrs for the cause. Do not give Israel an excuse to use their military. Let Israel spend their money on their military with no return for their investment. Regularly mention the possiblility of an Israeli false flag attempt to keep it in the minds of the world. If Israel is constantly suspected of planning a false flag attack, it will be harder for them to execute one.

2. Arab nations should pool their resources to create a wall around Israel. Think Berlin Wall or Great Wall of China. Behind that wall should be land mines and barb wire, like the Korean border. No gates, no way to cross the borders. The idea is to prevent Israel from seizing more land, and elimate any trade from taking place over land. Do not allow any commercial or cargo flights to or from Israel in Arab airspace. This would force Israel to conduct all trade by sea, which would mean they would have to maintain a commercial fleet and a navy. Navies are expensive.

3. Infiltrate the US government with dual citizens the way Israel has. Use their oil wealth to get pro-Arab candidates elected and appointed. When you have enough dual citizens the the US government, lobby to eliminate the foreign aid that the US gives to Israel.

The lack of foreign aid, combined with the increased cost and difficulty of importing foreign goods, and the inability to expand their territory should tank the Israeli economy. Then the Arab countries could just sit back and watch Israel implode. It's a long term plan, but I think it would have a better chance of success than occasionaly lobbing rockets into Israel.

reply to post by sheepslayer247

From what I understand, that is not true. Hamas believes in retaining what land was given to the Palestinians after the UN booted them in the 40's.

Did you even read the original post?

Do you need additional sources?

"Palestine is our land and nation from the [Mediterranean] sea to the [Jordan] river, from north to south, and we cannot cede an inch or any part of it," he said.

"We fight Zionists, not Jews. We fight whoever occupied our land, regardless of religion ... Statehood will be the fruit of resistance, not negotiations," Meshaal told cheering fans.

www.aljazeera.com...

Edit to add: Oh yeah, spoken by the same guy who said that he agreed upon the borders that Abbas was proposing right before the U.N. vote and then turns around days later and says otherwise. You can't believe a word they say and Mashaal just made Abbas look like an a$$, since Abbas just came out and asked for a sit down meeting and a truce with Hamas just a couple of days ago.

reply to post by VictorVonDoom


A good plan. I hope the arabs would do as you say.

It will work....BUT only back in the 1920s, when arabs were denied of education and kept stupid.

But not today. There is no way you can brainwash an entire people with lies and hatred. Humans are not robots and had never been. And furthermore, each arab nation isn't exactly living in estacy with each other.

What one side can do, so too the other. Intelligence isn't exclusive to just one ethnic group.

Better would be mankind to learn to live in peace to progress and evolve upon common grounds despite differences. Live and let live, not live and let die. No man can fortell the future with accuracy, but the boomerang is always true to its path - what goes around, comes around in the end.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

As long as the palestinian REFUSED to sit down, negotiate for peace and end their policy of death to jews, the west bank and gaza is still technically the land owned by Israel when the foolish palestinians who abandoned their lands for believing that their arab brothers will kick all jews into the sea during those wars.

Seeking the truth is definitely not what you are doing, whatever it is, get your facts first then you can distort them as you please.

'Whatever the reasoning and attitude of the Arab states' leaders, I have found no contemporary evidence to show that either the leaders of the Arab states or the Mufti [Hajj Amin al-Husseini] ordered or directly encouraged the mass exodus during April [1948].

It may be worth noting that for decades the policy of the Palestinian Arab leaders had been to hold fast to the soil of Palestine and to resist the eviction and displacement of Arab communities'.

Benny Morris

"The story which Jewish publicity at first persuaded the world to accept , that the [Palestinian] Arab refugees left voluntarily, is not true. Voluntary emigrants do not leave their homes with only the clothes they stand in. People who decided to leave house do not do so in such a hurry that they lose other members of their family -- husband losing sight of his wife, or parents of their children.

The fact is that the majority left in panic flight, to escape massacre. They were in fact helped on their way by the occasional massacres--not of very many at a time, but just enough to keep them running."

Denied Inheritance & Bitter Harvest

When Adolf Eichmann was tried in Israel for the crimes he commited as a Nazi leader, it included charges of forcible expulsion (ethnic cleansing), which were classified as war crimes and crimes against humanity.
He was found guilty by an Israeli court and sentenced to death.

Similar scenarios were enacted, as Morris shows, in central Galilee, Upper Galilee and the northern Negev, as well as in the post-war expulsion of the Palestinians of Al Majdal (Ashkelon). Most of these operations (with the exception of the latter) were marked by atrocities - a fact which led Aharon Zisling, the minister of agriculture, to tell the Israeli cabinet on 17 November 1948:

"I couldn't sleep all night. I felt that things that were going on were hurting my soul, the soul of my family and all of us here (...) Now Jews too have behaved like Nazis and my entire being has been shaken ."

source

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101


There is one point you may have overlooked. The plan I outlined might work, it might not. But terrorist attacks definately will not work. They only play right into Israel's main strength. It allows Israel to use its military to kill more Arabs, acquire more land, and gain sympathy worldwide. I don't think it's that hard to see, so why use terrorism when it only serves Israel's purposes? Who's side are the terrorists on?

reply to post by dontreally

well just my viewpoint ! first Israel can return to 1948 borders and let the exiled Palestinians return. then who knows maybe if Israelis and Palestinians become more open minded there would be a government with a share for all parties and or religions !! and name that country Ignorancedeniers !!!

reply to post by talklikeapirat


You really don't want peace.

Not only have you failed to respond to the topic of this thread, but you routinely avoid any conversation of what Hamas is all about, and how it's "death to Israel" attitude fuels Israeli policy in the west bank.

That Avatar is a neat pic. Unfortunately, I think it's meant as a propaganda tactic.

Natanyahu commented on Mashaals speech in cabinet today

Netanyahu told the Cabinet, "Has no intention of ever reaching a compromise with us. They want to destroy Israel. The State of Israel will overcome this enemy, but it was interesting to see how Abu Mazen (Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas) didn't condemn the statements calling for Israel's destruction – just like he never condemns rocket fire.


"Unfortunately he is striving for unity with Hamas, which as we know is backed by Iran."

The Israeli government, he added, "Has no illusions. We want true peace with our neighbors but we are not oblivious to reality. We won't make another mistake like a unilateral withdrawal – the kind that has landed Hamas in power in Gaza.


"I'm always astounded by other people's illusions that say that they are willing to continue this process and call it 'peace.' Giving these people any control of Judea and Samaria will have only one result – Gaza on the outskirts of Tel Aviv, Hadera and Kfar Saba.



"This is why we have to stand up to international pressure, and that's what the Israeli leadership should be – devoid of illusions and protective of Israel's interests."

Link

I completely agree with Natanyahu's reasonable assessment. How anyone could expect Israel to make concessions when the other side speaks these sort of words, is beyond me. And keep in mind - Fatah seeks unity with Hamas. Fatah never condemns Hamas' rocket attacks. Fatah never condemns speeches like the one just given by Hamas. It is THIS - this lack of sincerity towards peace with Israel, which fully justifies Israel's "occupation" activities in the west bank.

How Palestine even managed to get an upgrade at the UN, despite it's leaders refusal to condemn Hamas, nay, to actually seek reunification with Hamas, is dumbfounding. Obviously, there's political considerations here. But if you're own base wouldn't support a unilateral condemnation of Hamas, how can peace ever happen?

Not only does the Hamas charter promote a religious hatred of Jews, not only does Hamas' Al Quds TV (which is a state propaganda device) train its citizens to hate Jews

But it's OK to use the Jerusalem Post to do the same though?

reply to post by VictorVonDoom


I'm sorry, but who sympathizes with Israel? Almost every person I met who had a comment on Israel's pillar of defense had something negative to say about Israel. It seems their terror tactics are quite successful.

reply to post by intrepid


So you're making an equivalence between the Jerusalem Post and Al Quds Tv?

Come on. You've seen the threads on here which show whats on Gaza TV. Even Hillary Clinton has condemned Hamas' propaganda.



If Jerusalem post is in the same category of "state propaganda" as the former, then so is virtually everything else. You've broken down all distinctions. CNN, Foxnews, BBC, everything can be seen as a "propaganda device". As if there were no difference between a Free Press (which is what the Jerusalem Post is) and the crap seen on Al Quds TV.

Originally posted by dontreally
If Jerusalem post is in the same category of "state propaganda" as the former, then so is virtually everything else. You've broken down all distinctions. CNN, Foxnews, BBC, everything can be seen as a "propaganda device".

Exactly. So why would one use a state propaganda devise to promote ones own agenda? Those that don't fall for that crap call BS every time.